The matrix has you...

[240_Keyy]

slw240sx: Hook a brutha UP!!!

( I have access to a DVD burner )

[team23rulz]

i thought it was pretty good...but I really need to see it again so I can pick up on what I missed!

[slw240sx]

soon as i get the DVD back and i can convert it to MPG ill put it up some where!

[[Zero-S]]

Good man. Or you can encode it in DivX.

[Ajax]

I don't like the idea of neo as a jesus figure. besides that role was already replayed when we discovered darth vader was born of a virgin- I disturbed the whole theatre with my laughter when I saw that piece of crap.And about the rpg thing, I think that if you're decisions were being made for you by an outside force, you're mind would probably tend to force itself to believe it made the "choice." Perhaps that's why neo is different- he truly rejects that idea.

[Nathan]

Well, why dont you like the idea of neo as a jesus figure Ajax? It just seems to me to be what the Wachowski brothers were going for.

[C-Kwik]

C-kwik...the other Neo's chose to save humanity but this Neo chose to save Trinity...before the other Neo's have just had a strong love for humanity but this one chose someone "outside" the matrix to fall in love with which changes everything. EVERYONE should check out: http://www.corporatemofo.com/s...x.htm it has more on the Neo as a Jesus figure thing. I still think he is, there are too many correlations for it to be an accident.

But how do you know that? All I am saying is that it is possible that the previous Neo's made that very same choice. But by telling him otherwise, he was manipulated into making that choice. You are still stuck on what they are telling you. Try to think about what they are not telling you. Now I'm not saying my theory on this aspect is right. Just a thought to consider.

I really think the movie will probably end with a very starnge twist. And Neo will ultimately save the humans. But where the turning point is, was, or will be is not quite clear. I think we will have these answers in the 3rd movie. But I'm thinking a lot of things will be answered in the final moments.

[C-Kwik]

Yeah you got it. Like put yourself in the position of an rpg character, while someone else is controlling you.I can apply this to the matrix (I'm having weird random thoughts right now..so I'm pretty sure I can pull this off). Think of the matrix as a game. Now think of the people in the matrix as characters in the game. What if (woo my weird train of thought again) there was an outside force controlling the people in the matrix--making them do what the outside force wants them to do. (Of course this wouldn't work for those not hardlined to the system)EDIT: And at first it had nothing to do with the matrix, I was just asking.

I thought that might be some sick twisted thing, but, I honest to God hope it isn't otherwise I will take back everything I have to say good about the W brothers.

[TrueSlide]

Well it sorta is like that, the outside force are the ppl plugged into the machine, they control their "character" through their mind, they just dont realize that the matrix is not the real world. Remember in the first movie, he said something about how u look in the matrix is a mental perceptation of what u would look like in the real world.

[C-Kwik]

From her position as a part of the matrix, she could guide Neo to the French guy, who was controlling/holding the Key guy(coolest guy ever, having a Ducati 996 key handy). Was the oracle unable to tell neo where to find the key maker? Or was it part of her programming to put Neo in a position to fight (and maybe lose??)with the various bad guys under the control of the French guy?? Or did she send him to the French guy for a purpose that I'm missing?? Could she not, from her position in the Matrix, give the location of the key maker?

I am also questioning the real world if it is also another matrix, and the couselor guy(not the KFC guy) was explaining to neo the need for humans to depend on machines. And also the choice necessary to stop the machines, and how the counselor denounced Neo's idea of shutting down the machines, then the life in Zion would die(no heat, water, air). His example of how he doesn't understand how the water filtration system works, but he is certain it is necessary to sustain life is a good example to me of how he is another code in the matrix designed to guide neo's choices.

The Oracle did guide Neo. I think if the Oracle gave him all the answers, he wouldn't accept it. Someone who knows too much can be suspicious. There is self satisfaction in discovering somethings for yourself. Helps to justify your existence. But if the answers were given to Neo from the beginning, would he have made the choices he did. I really focus on what the oracle said about the vase in the first Matrix. It's really the first hint to the fact that Neo is manipulated. Though she led him to believe he was making the choice.

As far as Religious undertones(not that it was commented on in your comment SmithSR) both movies have them. I really think they intended it that way. In the Christian faith, you are aware that you have the ability to make a choice, but at the same time God knows what choices you are going to make. So perhaps the W brothers feel manipulated by religion to some extent. Could that be their message? Who knows.

I am probably overanalyzing, but...I love this movie because it is the type of movie that promotes that. Nothing wrong with some good brain stimulation.

"There is no spoon"

[Eklectrick]

Well, why dont you like the idea of neo as a jesus figure Ajax? It just seems to me to be what the Wachowski brothers were going for.

I don't think he's a jesus figure at all. that is to say that the W bros intended no paralells between neo and Jesus. that would be too easy and is done to death in lots of movies. I think they are smarter than that. However, because of what he is, it is hard to avoid him being a savior figure to all those people, like jesus. Neo unlike jesus is not trying to expose these people to a new philosophy, or way of life, or teach them anything. Also, Jesus was very non violence while Neo will kick your a$$ if you get in his way. Finally, there are plenty of other "saviors" present in religion that you could easily point out similarities with.

[Nathan]

Eh, those are good points eklectrick...I guess I didnt think it through very well...and another website said he was!!! I have to stop believing everything I read.

Edit: grrr, I didnt think about the fact that the architect was the one that said they saved humanity and it might be a manipulation. I can not wait for the 3rd one!!

[slw240sx]

its kinda handy to have this movie on DVD, although i think i have decided not to pass this out! quailty isnt up to it, its not bad but i dont want to distribute it ! although soon as the movie is over ill try and fill in some good things youve been missing on i just got to watch it a few more times and do some rewind action to explain my view on it all!!!

[Eklectrick]

do you have the japanese digicam in a theater version. my buddy has that on VCD. I chose not to borrow it since I hate watching a good quality movie on a low quality medium when there are better versions available.

[SmithSR]

Sorry for cutting back to the movie plot...

Was it me, or when Neo was visiting the Architect, the old guy would ask him a question or propose a scenario, and then all the tv's would show different reactions from Neo. Then the camera zooms in on one of the tv screens, bringing their conversation into the new room(although identical, of course) that neo had made a certain reaction...and then their conversation continues from there. This happes twice? i believe? What in the hell does this mean? Or was this just fancy film making with no real interpretable meaning?

[slw240sx]

ok, ill try my take on things! i havent seen the first one in a long time, i think it is an important key to understanding the second one, ill be watching it again then reloaded again to make sure i pick up every detail!

lets go back to the begining, what is the "matrix", its a computer generated dream world. humans are fed a reality to live and operate in while they serve a purose for the machines, the matrix is a program.

Neo, neo is the one, the one is an anomoly (sp?) in that program, a glitch in the mathimatical equation that makes it a non perfect perfect equation, thus creation a repeating cycle, the cycle of "life". Neo is human, there is no double matrix, at least at this time i dont believe so, maybe ill change my mind, but Neo isnt an ordinary human, he is a prodigy if you will, when they freed his mind and put him back into the matrix, via the connecting him to the operator, he was at first unable to even complete the jump sequence, but he learnd very fast, why? when morpheus told him about when the time come you wont have to doge the bullits. why wont he? why because hes not only human hes a program ! his mind is at a level far beyond anyother human, he is a program now a part of tha matrix, thats why he can control the code in the matrix hes simply writing "code" to suit him neo is a program just like the agent only he is a superior program now. but he doesnt fully know it yet make any sense ? hes becoming more aware all the time and i think when he stopped the squidy he had just come to that realization, but you ask how unless they are in a maxtrix out side of the matrix? well its quite simple, via wireless communication!! i dont know why its never been brought up but if the squidys are following some sort of commands they got to get it some how , now neo is found out that he nolonger needs a hard line or operator to connect him, hes found a way to patch in with his own mind, that will explain the comma(sp?), as they are in commas when inside the matrix! only he doesnt need to be hooked up! make any sense, im not done with that theory its rough i know, but maybe itll make some more thought into that part of the plot!

edited i just rememberd this part : saving of trinity, neo doesnt know how to use the doorways yet, so he took the longway, the operator was seeing strange things happening to the code, neo was causing that to happen then he saved her! he changed the code, then she flat lines, she was supposed to die there as per the aritecht, he knew that was the choice neo would make ! but neo found a way to rewrite things and to put trinity back to normal, he can control the code therefore is imortal in the matrix and has supreme control over anything in the matrix

now onto SMITH , smith is also a program, yes i think hes a virus. but when neo enterd him, he didnt totally destroy him, but only particaly deleted him, now smith has taken form again and took some info from neo when that happend,he has found out how to replicate himself, and how to download himself into the human mind to be transported into reality ! thus the person who set off the EMP, and lead to the slaugher of the 5 ships, that was a version of smith, the one who also tried to kill neo upon entering the elevator when the kid stoped him, i think that kid has a part in the next movie, remeber how they keep saying the kid found him neo didnt find the kid !! thus would lead you to belive that he was a program sent to watch out for neo some how ! (wow confusing !) any how smith still has me a pretty dumbfounded,

and the guy laying opposite of NEO in the very last flicker is ... i got this freeze frames on my tv so im gttin a good.....

its Cypher from the first movie, the one who betrayed them all. that should make you all wonder !!

[slw240sx]

no i have an actual screener version in DVD format kinda fuzzy and alot of it looks cartoonish but its pretty decent for a bootleg widescreen version too

[slw240sx]

it meant somthing SmithSr.when neo enterd the source, neo didnt enter as a human! he entered and turned into code turned into his program self, those are all the differant actions or reactions he makes, all at once all his thoghts are let out .

i just thougth somting else up, far fetched but, if it is cypher on the table in the end, opposite of neo, what if smith is cypher, and is in a wireless state, like neo now could be, stuck in the matrix but doesnt need a connection other then his mind

[Nathan]

It's Cypher???? I was 100% convinced it was Smith in the real world!

[slw240sx]

nathan you maybe right, cypher is smith, smith in the real world is cypher!

i had it frozen on the TV for 20mins looking at it upside down and im almost a 100% positve its cypher! thats why that flashes by so qwik, your not supposed to really find out till the DVD comes out ??

[Nathan]

No no...I didnt mean Cypher is Smith...I meant I thought it was that other guy that Smith came back into the real world through when he copied himself and came in over the phone. Is it that guy or actually Cypher? They look a little similarish

[slw240sx]

the guy on the table i think is cypher, which i think is the guy who came back over the phone. let me stare at the movie some more

[SmithSR]

Yes, this cypher theory is interesting, because didn't people notice that the number of dead bodies(from the first film, near the end) was incorrect and Cypher could still be alive, but i'm convinced the guy who tried to sneak up and kill neo with the knife is the guy that smith inhabited. And that is also the only survivor that was laying across from Neo. Also, so... Zion has been completely destroyed? For some reason, i think it was the fat chick sitting in front of me that was trying to get out of her seat to go take a leak or something tripped and spilled popcorn everywhere and then got into an arguement with some other people, that really broke my concentration, so i could not fully focus on what was happening or if they mentioned if zion was eliminated totally. I heard the guy say it was a slaughter, but were they saying all the people of zion were killed?

BTW, who the hell gets up to use the toilet at damn near the very end of a movie?

[slw240sx]

never mind its not cypher, at least not the same actor, but he looks too much alike him for some reason they look almost the same! kinda like a aged and decrepid version of him!

[JESTER]

Dude, that didn't look a thing like Cypher. Not one bit. That is the guy that Smith infected, and was going to try and kill Neo with the knife.

[slw240sx]

you havent paused the movie and sat upside down and looked at the guy for very long have you

[slw240sx]

it is the guy from the knife scene, its smith on the table, im almost sure of that, smiths mind was freed, smith doesnt need to connect like the others to get into the matrix, he can go into the coma state and enter, like neo maybe has done

does that theoy make any sense?

[JESTER]

No. I didn't need to, to see it was the guy with the knife.

That was the problem. You sat upside down to long. All your blood ran to your head.

You know whats fun? Get drunk and do that. See how long it takes you to pass out.

[SmithSR]

Were the people of Zion destroyed or not!!??!! As i already stated, there was a FAT CHICK RUINING THE END OF THE MOVIE FOR ME.

[slw240sx]

lol, not for another 24hrs will they be destroyed