Like it says, lets here all the different views on the swap. Should we stay with the KA and turbo it, or go with the SR20DET. Lets try to keep things factual if possible...thx for all the input.
WD
KA vs. SR could get ugly
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TrunkMonkey
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If you go out and buy a turbo kit for your KA, then everyone will give you a pat on the back. If you go all out by getting an SR20DET, then you will be a hometown hero. I could say the obvious; the sr20 was built for being turbocharged, and can put up with it. But let's talk about the emotions involved this time. With the KA, you'll most likely have an engine with 100k plus miles, and have to do a major overhaul to prepare for going turbo. When you get an SR from say Daunt, he guarantees under 35k, freshly new for a Nissan. A lot of people say that they would prefer the extra 400cc advantage of the KA, but does that really matter? There just seem to be endless possibilities with an sr20 because of the huge aftermarket support in recent years. I want to get involved with this argument really bad, but I'm tired and I'll just get on in the morning, and none of this paragraph really flowed together or made sense.
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Redline240
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WDRacing
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Actually, for the sake of argument. Lets assume that both engines were properly driven and maintained. Both engines will have say 50,000 miles. Just to keep the scenerio fair.
Personally I love the RB26, have for years. But I'm really interested to see valid points about which engine is better and for what reasons. Meaning the SR or KA, we all know they don't compare to the RB26.
I'm also not really interested in what engine is rare, or I would use an RB30DET from Australia. Just simply a heads up competition between the SR and KA. Assuming the KA is turbo'd of course.
Thx WD
Personally I love the RB26, have for years. But I'm really interested to see valid points about which engine is better and for what reasons. Meaning the SR or KA, we all know they don't compare to the RB26.
I'm also not really interested in what engine is rare, or I would use an RB30DET from Australia. Just simply a heads up competition between the SR and KA. Assuming the KA is turbo'd of course.
Thx WD
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Redline240
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sapix @ RHIT
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Either engine will respond well when modified. I think this comes down to the same thing the SR vs CA or the CA vs KA comes down to. Its all about preference. KAs got more displacement and more torque. The SR revs higher and smoother. When properly cared for they can both put down some very impressive numbers. The KA is usually considered weak, you hear all kinds of stories about them breaking when boosted, but this is only because of poor fuel management. The KA being NA from the factory I suppose requires a little closer watch on the fuel management department but the SR needs the same thing.
Personally I prefer the KA, like they say, no replacement for displacement. My second choice in engines would be a CA. Nothing against the SR, but its not my brand of vodka. Just my opinion.
Personally I prefer the KA, like they say, no replacement for displacement. My second choice in engines would be a CA. Nothing against the SR, but its not my brand of vodka. Just my opinion.
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float_6969
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Well lets start from the bottom up. (the way that every motor should be built) You of course have the cast iron vs. aluminium issue. At no point in the building of the motor will you have to consider resleeving the KA motor. (not that there are any sleeves, but thats my point) The SR on the otherhand will have to be resleeved to create high HP #'s. Ofcourse, the chances that you will be putting that much HP down is slim to none but for the sake of argument, lets just say the skys the limit. Now ofcourse you would have to rebuild the KA bottom end to get any decent numbers from it, but if you want big #'s from an SR, you'll have to do the same. We also have to look at the bore/stroke. SR-square motor, revs nicely, alright torque, good horsepower. KA-way overstroked, revs slowly, gobs of torqe, moderate horespower. We could get into the TQ vs. HP debate, but there's not room for that. Otherwise they have the same technologies. Crank girdle and piston oil squirters. So as we set, we'll have to do more work to the SR to get the bottom end ready. (remember, $ not an issue)Now lets move up to the head. Here is where I feel much of the dilema lies (and my bias twords the CA) In one hand we have the SR wich was designed as a high flow turbo motor. On the other we have the KA wich was designed to be a NA torquey bastard. Now eariler we were speaking of the reving capabilites of the SR, yet if we look at the infamous valve train, we'll see it's poorly designed for these conditions. The KA on the otherhand has a well designed head for high revs, but has a contradictory bottom end. Also, there would have to be major porting and valve work done so that it would match the SR design. So here we are at a stalemate. As for the intake, they are basically the same design, so no real advantages. The fuel systems are slightly different, but if the motor was being built up, the fuel rail would be replaced anyway, so there is no advantage again. As for engine management, we have no price limit, so that is of no concern again. So where does this put us. Well, when money is of no concern it comes down to displacement in this particular battle, and as we all have hear, there is no replacent for displacement. But as we all know, money is ALWAYS of some concern and I think that this battle can only bedecied if a buget is set. Ofcourse if you want a superiour design with the best of both worlds there is always our unsung hero, the CA.......
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themadscientist
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WDRacing
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KS_Honda_Killer...very nicely put. Basically my sentiments exactly, accept for the CA part. Nice motor, great design but lacks the cubic inches. Really to bad Nissan didn't take the CA and make it a bit bigger. That would be a real head turner, right up there with the RB26 IMHO.
I figured this thread would explode with nasty posts, but when all things are actually considered, both motors are decent platforms. Highly dependent on preference towards torque or revs.
WD
I figured this thread would explode with nasty posts, but when all things are actually considered, both motors are decent platforms. Highly dependent on preference towards torque or revs.
WD
KS_Honda_Killer wrote:Well lets start from the bottom up. (the way that every motor should be built) You of course have the cast iron vs. aluminium issue. At no point in the building of the motor will you have to consider resleeving the KA motor. (not that there are any sleeves, but thats my point) The SR on the otherhand will have to be resleeved to create high HP #'s. Ofcourse, the chances that you will be putting that much HP down is slim to none but for the sake of argument, lets just say the skys the limit. Now ofcourse you would have to rebuild the KA bottom end to get any decent numbers from it, but if you want big #'s from an SR, you'll have to do the same. We also have to look at the bore/stroke. SR-square motor, revs nicely, alright torque, good horsepower. KA-way overstroked, revs slowly, gobs of torqe, moderate horespower. We could get into the TQ vs. HP debate, but there's not room for that. Otherwise they have the same technologies. Crank girdle and piston oil squirters. So as we set, we'll have to do more work to the SR to get the bottom end ready. (remember, $ not an issue)Now lets move up to the head. Here is where I feel much of the dilema lies (and my bias twords the CA) In one hand we have the SR wich was designed as a high flow turbo motor. On the other we have the KA wich was designed to be a NA torquey bastard. Now eariler we were speaking of the reving capabilites of the SR, yet if we look at the infamous valve train, we'll see it's poorly designed for these conditions. The KA on the otherhand has a well designed head for high revs, but has a contradictory bottom end. Also, there would have to be major porting and valve work done so that it would match the SR design. So here we are at a stalemate. As for the intake, they are basically the same design, so no real advantages. The fuel systems are slightly different, but if the motor was being built up, the fuel rail would be replaced anyway, so there is no advantage again. As for engine management, we have no price limit, so that is of no concern again. So where does this put us. Well, when money is of no concern it comes down to displacement in this particular battle, and as we all have hear, there is no replacent for displacement. But as we all know, money is ALWAYS of some concern and I think that this battle can only bedecied if a buget is set. Ofcourse if you want a superiour design with the best of both worlds there is always our unsung hero, the CA.......
True but if money is no object I will go with the 22sr20 stroker kit. I think if you plan on rebuliding go with the ka and a kit. As opposed to spending 2000 plus on a motor then rebuilding and then a turbo kit. Remember that small t25 and piping and intercooler will not make max hp.
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DonDonati88
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You want a set budget ok. Imagine a KA-T that just got turb'd AND NOW 4k to play with, (for arguments sake let's say all both cars have is intake, exhaust, FMIC, fuel pump, dp and boost controller). Now the SR with the aforementioned mods AND 4k. Tell tell me which engine is faster vs. more reliable as well.
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Redline240
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I think the best way to look at it on a budget would be to set it as most of us are.....we have a 240 with the KA in it, do we bulid it or swap for the SR. So lets say we have a generous 10 grand to spend, what do we do? and remember you have to include the price of the SR, cause non of us get them for free...
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BuudWeizErr
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The problem with what KS_Honda_Killers points are the fact that 99% of tuners do not have the unlimited budget that would allow them to reach high numbers with either engine. For those on a budget, the SR is going to be the better option. I got into an argument with somebody on garageTUNERS about this same thing. The entry price for an SR20DET is $2200. The entry price for a turbo kit on a high mileage KA is at least $3000. Plus if your engine is high mileage, you're going to want at least a minor rebuild and probably a major rebuild with some decent internals if you want good numbers out of a KA. The same does not ring true with the SR. Sure, the SR will need a rebuild to put down 600HP. I think most engines would. If someone had $4000 to put down, they could get an SR, and if they do it right, they can get an intercooler and boost controller and be making 250HP. With a KA, if you're going to do it right, you need a rebuild, like I said.
Also, back to the iron vs aluminum, aluminum dissipates heat better than iron does, and we are all aware that power is lost through heat. But truthfully, thats neither here nor there.
Personally, I don't like the KA, and I won't recommend a KA. But that's my opinion, others may choose as you feel, doesn't affect me. Maybe that's because mine was a KA-E, but I doubt it.
If I was given unlimited funds, I could convert a FWD GA16DE from a 200SX to RWD, put it in my 240 and make it put down 500HP. That doesn't mean it's the best or smartest way for it to be done.
Also, back to the iron vs aluminum, aluminum dissipates heat better than iron does, and we are all aware that power is lost through heat. But truthfully, thats neither here nor there.
Personally, I don't like the KA, and I won't recommend a KA. But that's my opinion, others may choose as you feel, doesn't affect me. Maybe that's because mine was a KA-E, but I doubt it.
If I was given unlimited funds, I could convert a FWD GA16DE from a 200SX to RWD, put it in my 240 and make it put down 500HP. That doesn't mean it's the best or smartest way for it to be done.
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I H8 UR DSM
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DonDonati88
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I own a KA24DE Turbocharget 91 240sx with a built bottom end and 9.0:1 custom Wiseco pistons. I run about 10PSI.I have driven a SR20 RedTop S14. Stock as far as I know.I'll take the KA over the SR any day. Yes the SR is smoother and revs higher. Who cares. The KA is WAAAAAY more fun on the street. Fix the weakest link of the KA (the pistons) and you are good for 300HP with no worries. Change the rods and go for 400-450. With gobs of torque that no SR can match.
erich
erich
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DonDonati88
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:bsflag :youwonerich wrote:I own a KA24DE Turbocharget 91 240sx with a built bottom end and 9.0:1 custom Wiseco pistons. I run about 10PSI.I have driven a SR20 RedTop S14. Stock as far as I know.I'll take the KA over the SR any day. Yes the SR is smoother and revs higher. Who cares. The KA is WAAAAAY more fun on the street. Fix the weakest link of the KA (the pistons) and you are good for 300HP with no worries. Change the rods and go for 400-450. With gobs of torque that no SR can match.
erich
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I H8 UR DSM
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DonDonati88
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I H8 UR DSM
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DonDonati88
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trpower7 wrote:Can we say parts?? Can we say, the KA is about one of the most ubiquitous engines here in the US? I can get SR parts for cheap......where??? And who has an SR? Everyone.
oh damn another one...go back to the NA forum..where u boast about 17 sec quarter miles and homemade intakes...:peace
everyone knows that with proper tuning an SR has more potential to :spank a ka-t
Do any race cars run the KA24DE?I could name a few race cars in Japan that run the sr20det.
- The aftermarket for the sr20det BLOWS away the aftermarket for the KA24DE.
- It is incredibly easy to swap an sr20det into a 240sx and it is relativly cheap.
- The sr20det was designed from the FACTORY to take boost, the KA is not.
No offense... I just dont understand why you would go with a KA24DE. Blinded by pride??? I dunno...
n
- The aftermarket for the sr20det BLOWS away the aftermarket for the KA24DE.
- It is incredibly easy to swap an sr20det into a 240sx and it is relativly cheap.
- The sr20det was designed from the FACTORY to take boost, the KA is not.
No offense... I just dont understand why you would go with a KA24DE. Blinded by pride??? I dunno...
n