Dude sweet.. KA supercharger kit!!

[Malac0da13]

is it feasible to have the SC not mounted directly to the intake rather having it mounted on the opposite side then have it routed across the front thru an intercooler then into the intake mani...or am i jus retarded for thinking it?

[ShionS14]

its feasible but you would need a centrifugal supercharger and not the eaton style that SCMASTER has developed

[Malac0da13]

y?

[Malac0da13]

my reason for thinkin it would work is the ford tbird eaton supercharger...its the size bigger then what scmaster is using but its basically the same...and well heres a link to what it looks like it doesnt mount right to the intake...heres one with the intake pipes attached but without an intercooler...

Inter cooledhttp://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...QrdZ1

Togetherhttp://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...QrdZ1

i havent found a picture of the SC on the car but with it together it doesnt look like it would b mounted like SCmaster mounted his and most ive seen

[Chezedik]

Yes, it would be similar. But be sure to understand that this is an M90. This means that with every revolution, .9L of air is displaced. So if the engine can't take it in per revolution, it becomes boost. If boost gets too high, there will be reversion, and major losses due to heat, since it will basically just be a heat pump. This is because boost is developed a bit differently in a blower, it is caused by air backing up in the intake. In a centrigual device or turbo, it is created internally, and so it is pressurized BEFORE it reaches the mani. At the speeds they turn there is less chance of reversion (although possible, and called surge). Basically, it is just too big unless you had more motor, or pulled all of the all-motor tricks before install. You would have to have a huge exhaust, massive intake mani, huge cams, wicked port job, bigger valves, then maybe this would be usable (it would also make HUGE power).

[Malac0da13]

when i was lookin at SC the 2.4l was at the high end of the m62 and low end of the m90...i think that was on a SC retail site they didnt sell kits jus the SCs...never mind...it was on magnusons site...and im wrong m90 is for like 3.0 to 5.0 and m62 is 2.5 to 4.0...but my rationalaztion still stand with intercooling it and not having it mounted right to the intake manifold

[Chezedik]

And that is an option. It has long been the belief that this is how it would have to be done if you did not modify the mani, and I guess nothing has changed.

[ShionS14]

with the fab work you would have to do to make your own brackets and all that you could do it but a centrifugal would be better because they are more compact then the eaton. with an eaton being as long as it is i see problems with it being on the exhaust side. now with an eaton you do have the benefit of only having to utilize the engines rpm where as a centrifugal you have gears that amplify it to like 60,000 rpm and it requires you to plumb it in to the oil lines

[Chezedik]

It's a lazy turbo...

[ShionS14]

basically with out all the heat

[SCMASTER]

Mr.Knight how will your super chargers compete against FI turbo systems that use larger than T28's. From the majority of your results they carry well in comparison with a great torque range.After about 2500RPM it seems that turbo chargers can infact make more power after low 2500RPM range.Scooter (RBS14) is using 660cc injectors, ITB's, t36 turbo, and a haltech on an all stock block, this testing was at 7PSI..How do you plan on competing with much larger and effecient turbo's on the market, at the price you are selling your super chargers for and what type of upgrading would you have in developement to compete with turbo's of this nature. Last turbo charger I had seen on a KA didn't break 250WHP. As well noted you showed me your calculations on degerdation losses, how does that matter to such an open market with turbo's that have more effecient A/R's than your typical super charger.

THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF A QUESTION I TRULY APPRECIATE. WE CAN SEE THE PEAK HP IS EXTREMELY HIGH ON THE DYNO SHEET. TORQUE IS CONSIDERABLY LESS. USING THE SIMPLE FORMULA OF BOOSTED HP DIVIDED BY STOCK HP WITH THE HP GAIN COMPARED TO THE PRESSURE RATIO WE SEE:270/135 = 100% GAIN ON THIS EXAMPLE. OUR HIGHEST RUN HAS BEEN 212/135 = 57% GAIN. SO WE NOW ACCEPT THAT 7 PSI IS A 1.5 (50% INCREASE) PRESSURE RATIO (7.4 + 14.7 /14.7 = 1.5). THAT MEANS OUR KIT IS SHOWING MORE THAN A 100% EFFICIENCY IN THE POWER GAINED, WHILE THE TURBO IS CLOSER TO 200%. I AM SURE THERE ARE OTHER THINGS DONE TO THIS EXAMPLE (270 WHEEL HP IS EXTREMELY HIGH ON A TOTALLY STOCK ENGINE WITH NOTHING BUT A TURBO KIT AT 7 PSI), BUT OUR GOAL IS TO BE AT 250 WHEEL HP AND 250TQ @ 7 PSI WITHIN A MONTH BY INSTALLING A PORTED BLOWER AND MANIFOLD, LARGER TBODY, WATER/ALCOHOL GASSEOUS INTERCOOLER, AND LARGER MASS AIR. WHEN BLOWING THROUGH A TBODY THERE IS LITTLE PRESSURE LOSS ON A 60MM UNIT. WHEN DRAWING THROUGH A 60MM, THERE IS A PRESSURE DROP. THE STOCK MAF IS TERRIBLE. I WONDER IF THE TURBO SHOWN WOULD BE OVER 250WHEEL HP WITH A STOCK ECU AND MAF. WE WILL SOON HAVE MORE COMPARATIVE NUMBERS. BTW, HOW MUCH DID THAT TURBO KIT COST TO PUT TOGETHER INCLUDING THE HALTECH--$6000?

[SCMASTER]

Are this argumentative about things in real life, too?

I can appreciate good discussion but get the hell off the guy's nuts already; he doesn't need to defend every single whimsical criticism. Moreover, he doesn't need to. Potnetial customers know about big turbos, some of them don't want one and would prefer a supercharged engine and response; negating acceptable efficiency losses at higher revs.

P.S. - Mr.Knight, how about something for the RB series? I'm probably just daydreaming but the thoughts of a twin charged RB20 make the pants tight.

HMMM--WE HAVE AB RB20-240 AND A RB25-240 AT SPEEDLAB. MARK OWNS THE RB25. I COULD MAKE A KIT JUST FOR THE FUN OF IT. I ACTUALLY WANTED TO DO A TRIPPLE CHARGED VERSION WITH AN EATON AND TWIN T-2-SMALLS IN A SEQUENTIAL MODE FOR FULL BOOST FROM 1200RPM TO 8000RPM--JUST TO SHOW IT COULD BE DONE :-) FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO QUESTION HOW LONG TWINCHARGING HAS GONE ON, MERCEDES DID IT IN 1939 WITH DUAL ROOTS TWO STAGES @ 24 PSI WITH THE PIPES HAVING FINS ON THEM FOR INTERCOOLING. THEN LANCIA DESTROYED THE RALLY WORLD COMPETITION IN '83 WITH THE DELTA S4, A TWINCHARGED 2 LITER ROOTS/TURBO DUAL INTERCOOLED 585HP 4WD THAT WON 8 OUT OF THE FIRST 10 RACES TILL THE DRIVER WAS KILLED :-( ANYWAY, IF THERE APPEARS TO BE ENOUGH INTEREST IN AN RB KIT WE WILL DO ONE FOR SURE.

[Malac0da13]

can you gimme sum feed back SCMASTER on my idea if its feasable...you said about making your kit intercooled...how is that gonna be done...is the SC remain on the same side and have the intercooler shaped like a sideways "U"

[SCMASTER]

can you gimme sum feed back SCMASTER on my idea if its feasable...you said about making your kit intercooled...how is that gonna be done...is the SC remain on the same side and have the intercooler shaped like a sideways "U"

WE WILL MAKE A CUSTOM UPPER INTAKE MANIFOLD THAT HAS DUAL PLENUMS--ONE WILL CARRY THE EATON DISCHARGE TO A FMIC, WHILE THE OTHER CARRIES THE MIX FROM THE FMIC TO THE RUNNERS. THE BLOWER WILL REMAIN IN THE STOCK LOCATION.

[SCMASTER]

DO ANY OF YOU KNOW IF THE INTAKE MANIFOLDS ARE IDENTICAL FOR THE RB20 & RB25 JDM ENGINES? THIS WOULD BE FOR AN EATON KIT THAT FIT BOTH ENGINES. IT WOULD BE MUCH BETTER IF THEY HAD THE SAME BOLT PATTERN.

[SCMASTER]

Mr.Knight how will your super chargers compete against FI turbo systems that use larger than T28's. From the majority of your results they carry well in comparison with a great torque range.After about 2500RPM it seems that turbo chargers can infact make more power after low 2500RPM range.Scooter (RBS14) is using 660cc injectors, ITB's, t36 turbo, and a haltech on an all stock block, this testing was at 7PSI.

LOOK AT THE HP NUMBERS AGAIN ON BOTH DYNO RUNS. AT 2500 RPM THE EATON MAKES 95HP AND 185 FT/LB TORQUE. THE TURBO MAKES 85HP AND 120 FT/LB. AT 3K IT IS SC-115 HP AND 197 TQ WHILE THE TURBO MAKES 115 HP AND 150TQ. AT 3500 IT IS 140/200 VS 140/165, AND AT 4K IT IS 155/201 VS 180/175, AT THIS POINT THE HP RISES MORE AT A GREATER RATE WITH THE TURBO, WHILE OURS KEEP THE TORQUE HIGHER. NOW ON OUR 212/217 RUN, WE SEE GREATER NUMBERS ALL ACROSS, BUT JUST TO COMPARE THE TWO POSTED GRAPHS, WE MAKE MORE TORQUE AT EVERY POINT ACROSS THE BOARD. MOST PEOPLE DONT KNOW THAT HP AND TQ FIGURES ARE IDENTICAL FORMULAS WITH THE TQ BEING NUMBERS UNDER 5250 RPM, WHILE HP IS IDEALLY ABOVE 5250 RPM. WHEN IT COMES TO RESPONSE, TORQUE IS KING. HP NUMBERS ARE RATED AT PEAK. SO WHILE THE 271 NUMBERS ARE HIGH FOR 7 PSI, AND I AM MORE THAN EVER CERTAIN IT IS NOT STOCK CAMS AND STOCK HEAD, IT IS NONE-THE-LESS VERY HIGH. ONE THING--IF ANY OF YOU HAVE DYNO RUNS MADE, MAKE SURE THE GRAPH NUMBERS ARE BALANCED. WHAT I MEAN IS THAT THE COLUMN ON BOTH SIDES HAS IDENTICAL TOP NUMBERS AS I SET OURS UP FOR. THIS WILL MAKE THE TQ AND HP ALWAYS CROSS AT 5250 RPM AND WILL GIVE AN ACCURATE POWER CURVE. WHAT IS MISSING FROM THE 271 GRAPH IS THE OBVIOUS LOSS OF TORQUE. IF WE GO BY TRUE MEASUREMENTS, WE SHOULD DO BOTH HP AND TORUE INCREASES FOR A TRUE COMPARISON. OUR HP AND TQ BOTH INCREASE 50-57%. THE TURBO HP INCREASES 100% WHILE THE TQ INCREASES ONLY 20% (FROM 142 TO 170 FT LB). THIS USUALLY INDICATES CAMS, PORTING, LARGE THROTTLE BODY, ETC WHICH ALL CAUSE TORQUE TO BE LOST WHILE RAISING HP. ALSO, THE ELIMINATION OF THE MAF WITH A HALTECH IS WORTH CONSIDERABLE POWER. IF WE DO THE SAME THING THE HP GAINS WILL BE HIGH AND THE TORQUE WILL BE GREATER. WE WILL SOON SEE. I WILL POST OUR LATEST RUNS THIS EVENING.

[obby]

Not to mention, BigVinnie, while you pointed out the dyno came from a car with individual throttle bodies, other aspects of the setup are unknown(intercooler?).

Also, if I recall correctly, the owner of that setup never got to drive it, as it blew up before he got it(my condolences to scooter).

[SeVa-S13]

DO ANY OF YOU KNOW IF THE INTAKE MANIFOLDS ARE IDENTICAL FOR THE RB20 & RB25 JDM ENGINES? THIS WOULD BE FOR AN EATON KIT THAT FIT BOTH ENGINES. IT WOULD BE MUCH BETTER IF THEY HAD THE SAME BOLT PATTERN.

They are not, as far as I know; otherwise you'd see tons of GReddy intakes on RB20's, but instead we all go quality race stuff from overseas ($$$$$) or some domestic/eBay hacks (I have an Unstable-Hybrids knock-off and it's laughable).

Exhaust manifold bolt patterns are the same for the 20/25 though, but not the RB26.

Edit: If you were to develop an RB20 setup, I'd try to take out a loan if necessary, ha.

[SCMASTER]

So bottom line, when will it be ready, and what kind of power will it make, for how much?

AS I HAVE STATED BEFORE, THIS IS A DISCUSSION AREA FOR THE EATON KIT. IF YOU LOOK FARTHER BACK IN THE THREAD THE DOLLAR FIGURES ARE THERE. AS FOR AVAILABILITY, THEY ARE READY TO ORDER NOW. THE BEST RESULYS SO FAR ON A COMPLETELY STOCK ENGINE @ 7 PSI WITH STOCK TBODY AND MAF IS 212 HP /217 TQ. THE TEST VEHICLE HAS 550CC INJECTORS, A DAUGHTERBOARD, AND HEADERS. WE SAW 3.5" VACUUM LOSS ACROSS THE MAF, SO THAT WILL KEEP US FROM 220/220. IF YOU SET A GOAL OF 220/220 @ 7 PSI AND GET 230-240, YOU WILL BE PLEASED. WE TRY TO ANTICIPATE INCORRECT TUNING, ETC. THE COMPLETE SYSTEMS WILL BE PORTED AS WELL ADDING EVEN MORE HP/TQ. THE REASON WE STAYED WITH A STOCK EATON WAS TO SHOW THAT THE ADAPTERS PURCHASED SEPERATELY WITH A USED NISSAN SUPERCHARGER WOULD OUTPERFORM AN SR20DET SWAP FOR HALF THE COST OF PAYING SOMEONE TO INSTALL THE SR20. THE EATON INSTALLATION CAN BE DONE BY A GROUP OF FRIENDS IN A LONG AFTERNOON. ALSO, ANYONE WHO WANTS TO DRIFT A 240 WILL NEVER FIND A BETTER SYSTEM OTHER THAN A V8 SWAP. THAT CAN NOT BE ARGUED WITH.

[Bigvinnie]

BTW, HOW MUCH DID THAT TURBO KIT COST TO PUT TOGETHER INCLUDING THE HALTECH--$6000?

Scott is one of the lucky ones. Haltech Sponsors him and the turbo and parts were all kick backs. I believe that whole kit not including the ITB's is around $4000, not including taxes, shipping charges. Suzuki GSXR ITB's any one can piece together for under $200......This particular piece together kit can be cheaper for people using a biki rom other than the haltech.You can go MAffless with the haltech though, biki still doesn't have the program setup for half the features that the Halteh has to offer.

[Bigvinnie]

THE 271 NUMBERS ARE HIGH FOR 7 PSI, AND I AM MORE THAN EVER CERTAIN IT IS NOT STOCK CAMS AND STOCK HEAD, IT IS NONE-THE-LESS VERY HIGH.

Actually they are stocker cams and a stocker head no porting was done.It was more to the method of using the individual TB's which alone will drop massive torque numbers since there is less swirl taking place at lower RPM's. The KA is known for massive torque output numbers using the long runner design that it has on it's stock plenum design. I do study fluid dynamics, and from my knowledge the stock set up is great for low end and kills the high end making a sever power drop at valve overlap (making the engine anemic).This is one of the reasons that people go with the ITB setup, it may drop torque, but it will extend the powerband very near and closer to 7000RPM as you can see in the dyno I posted.

Also, if I recall correctly, the owner of that setup never got to drive it, as it blew up before he got it(my condolences to scooter).

Actually it was driven and during the dyno run cylinder 4 had blown from starvation issues. (Causing 4 to run leaner than the other cylinders from the plenum design (or so that is my opinion)). It was a straight through plenum and not a tapered plenum such as the ones that Ivan (turbo240.com) uses.Scooter doesn't care though he will get his hands on another stock block, and if all fails with starvation to 4, more than likely go with a tapered plenum as I suggested.

[SCMASTER]

AFTER FURTHER INVESTIGATION I HAVE CONCLUDED THE 271 HP DYNO SHEET IS A FRAUD, OR THE DYNAMOMETER IS BROKEN AND GIVING FALSE NUMBERS. HOW CAN I MAKE THAT CLAIM? SOMETHING WAS NOT ADDING UP. THE TORQUE NUMBERS WERE SIMPLY TOO LOW AND THE HP TOO HIGH. THEN IT DAWNED ON ME. THE FORMULAS FOR HP AND TQ ARE INTERCHANGABLE WITH THE ABOVE AND BELOW 5250 RPM FACTOR ALWAYS RESULTING IN IDENTICAL NUMBERS. WHAT WE SEE IN OUR DYNO RUN AND EVERY RUN I HAVE EVER DONE--HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS, ARE THAT THE FIGURES WILL STILL BE THE SAME AT 5250 RPM. EVEN WITH STAGGERED COLUMNS THE NUMBERS WILL STILL BE THE SAME AT 5250--ALWAYS. WHAT I SEE WITH THIS INACCURATE DYNO IS TQ MEASURING APPROX 168 FT/LB @ 5250RPM, AND APPROX 250HP @ 5250 RPM. THIS IS PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE BY THE ENGINEERING LAWS WE MUST USE TO GET ACCURATE AND FAIR COMPARISONS. UNTIL I SEE A CORROLATED AND ACCURATE DYNO SHEET THIS IS A JOKE AND ADDING MORE B.S. TO THIS THREAD.

[emperor_lunchbox]

So, I was genuinely interested in theis super charger kit. But This thread is just so long and nothing really about the kit in it. I dont feel like reading thru 7 pages to see if this is answered so I'm just gonna ask.

What is the price if the kit right now?Is it missing anything, or do I bolt in an go?Does the kit include installation instructions?Is a/c and cruise affected?

[Bigvinnie]

AFTER FURTHER INVESTIGATION I HAVE CONCLUDED THE 271 HP DYNO SHEET IS A FRAUD, OR THE DYNAMOMETER IS BROKEN AND GIVING FALSE NUMBERS. HOW CAN I MAKE THAT CLAIM? SOMETHING WAS NOT ADDING UP. THE TORQUE NUMBERS WERE SIMPLY TOO LOW AND THE HP TOO HIGH. THEN IT DAWNED ON ME. THE FORMULAS FOR HP AND TQ ARE INTERCHANGABLE WITH THE ABOVE AND BELOW 5250 RPM FACTOR ALWAYS RESULTING IN IDENTICAL NUMBERS. WHAT WE SEE IN OUR DYNO RUN AND EVERY RUN I HAVE EVER DONE--HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS, ARE THAT THE FIGURES WILL STILL BE THE SAME AT 5250 RPM. EVEN WITH STAGGERED COLUMNS THE NUMBERS WILL STILL BE THE SAME AT 5250--ALWAYS. WHAT I SEE WITH THIS INACCURATE DYNO IS TQ MEASURING APPROX 168 FT/LB @ 5250RPM, AND APPROX 250HP @ 5250 RPM. THIS IS PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE BY THE ENGINEERING LAWS WE MUST USE TO GET ACCURATE AND FAIR COMPARISONS. UNTIL I SEE A CORROLATED AND ACCURATE DYNO SHEET THIS IS A JOKE AND ADDING MORE B.S. TO THIS THREAD.

Well I think you should watch those kinds of words you may piss off alot of the people in Northern Cali that know Scooter. It may just piss Haltech off as well, I don't believe fraud is the word that you want to use it is very offensive especially for those that put alot of thought and pride into there vehicle...This happens to be Scooters work.for the amount of work that is put into it I would highly doubt that for a $150 dyno tune it would be fraudulent.Edit: I also fubared he is using a GT32 not a GT36 as I stated earlier.
Modified by Bigvinnie at 6:20 PM 7/29/2006

[Malac0da13]

btw...that is a nice lookin setup even if it isnt tapered like u said and blew up...but it looks nice

[aaronsnocker1]

I don't want to come off as a d!ck but can you type in lower case letters please. All the capitals are hurting my eyes.

[scruffy63]

he's not gonna type in lowercase. He says its easier to read LIKE THIS.

[SCMASTER]

LOOK AT WHAT I SAID. IT IS FRAUD OR THE DYNO IS BROKEN. ANOTHER OPTION IS THAT IT SHOWS CORRECTED WHEEL-TO-FLYWHEEL CONVERTED HP LIKE ALL THE UK DYNO'S DO. TAKE 271 AND SUBTRACT THE DRIVETRAIN LOSSES OF 22% AND YOU HAVE 271-60 HP, OR 211 WHEEL HP. THAT COULD EASILY COINCIDE WITH THE 5250 TQ/HP CURVE. WHAT I STATED WAS IF I POSTED A DYNO SHEET LIKE THAT IN MY WORLD THE ENGINEERING COMMUNITY WOULD ALL CALL ME A FRAUD--AND DESERVEDLY SO. THE CASE FOR SHORTER RUNNERS DOES NOT WORK--SHORTER RUNNERS MOVE THE HP/TQ CURVE UP, RESULTING IN LESS LOW RPM TQ, BUT HIGHER TQ PEAK, ESPECIALLY WITH STOCK CAMS. ALSO, THE REMAINING PART OF THE ORIGINAL INTAKE MANIFOLD, COMBINED WITH THE TBODY AND VELOCITY STACK GIVES A RAM-AIR RUNNER LENGTH OF AT LEAST 12" FROM THE VS TO THE INTAKE VALVES, WHICH IS PLENTY LENGTH FOR SOME LOW, MIDRANGE, AND HIGH RPM TORQUE. YOU MUST UNDERSTAND THAT I AM ONLY STATING FACTS--AGAIN--WHICH IS ALL I EVER DO. I DONT HAVE TO ARGUE WHEN FACTS ARE CLEARLY ON MY SIDE AS THEY USUALLY ARE. THE BASIC DESIGN OF SCOOTER'S LOOKS GREAT--I NEVER CRITICIZE A GOOD IDEA, OR EVEN THE EXECUTION OF A GOOD IDEA. IT IS TOO BAD THE MOTOR LEANED OUT. THERE IS NO APPERANT REASON FOR A LEANER CYLINDER AS THE PLENUM VOLUME IS MORE THAN ADEQUATE TO SLOW THE RAM AIR SO ACCUMULATION DOES NOT OCCUR ONLY IN THE FAR CYLINDER. POSSIBLY A BAD INJECTOR OR TOO ADVANCED IGNITION, BUT 7 PSI INTERCOOLED WITH AN FMIC WOULD GIVE DELTA RISE TEMPS OF + 15 WORST CASE SCENARIO, WHICH WOULD MAKE IT ALMOST IMPOSSIBLE TO TOAST THE ENGINE. COULD HAVE BEEN A PREVIOUSLY DAMAGED BAD PISTON THAT LET LOOSE. B-V, LOOK AT THINGS FROM MY SIDE FOR A SEC. IF YOU READ DYNO'S ALL DAY, AND THEN SAW THAT I POSTED THE ONE YOU DID, YOU AND EVERY OTHER TECH WHO KNEW IT IS AN IMPOSSIBLE RESULT WOULD SCREAM. I AM SIMPLY SEARCHING FOR AN EXPLANATION.

[aaronsnocker1]

Mr. Knight, thank you for developing this kit for the KA community. You seem to be the real deal and by that I mean a stinking genius wow I am in awe. I will be ordering one of these as soon as I can. Thank you

[SCMASTER]

THANKS FOR THE KIND WORDS. MY I.Q. IS ONLY 145-155, DEPENDING ON WHEN I WAS TESTED. CLOSE TO GENIUS, BUT NO CIGAR. KIND OF LIKE WILEY COYOTE, EXCEPT I DONT USE ACME PRODUCTS :-) I AM INCLUDING THE FINAL DYNO WE DID WITH NON-PORTED EATON AND COMPONENTS. YOU WILL NOTICE SEVERAL THINGS. I TRIED TO GET THE POINT LINE EXACTLY AT 5250RPM, AND COULD ONLY GET 5245 RPM--VERY CLOSE. YOU WILL NOTICE THE NUMBERS ARE VIRTUALLY IDENTICAL. FOR FUTURE REFERENCE, ALWAYS LOOK FOR THE CROSSOVER AT 5250 IN ANY DYNO RUN YOU SEE. IF IT DOES NOT OCCUR, THE RUN IS SUSPECT. THE SECOND POINT--ESPECIALLY FOR YOU DRIFTERS AND AUTO TRANS GUYS--LOOK AT THE TQ NUMBERS--2700-5700 ARE AT OR OVER 200 FT.LB. YOU WILL ALSO NOTE WE CUT THE DYNO RUN AT 5700 RPM BECAUSE THE SMALL MAF WAS READING ALMOST 4" OF VACUUM, MEANING IT WAS SO RESTRICTIVE THE EATON WAS STARVING FOR AIR. EACH PSI BOOST = 2 IN/VAC, SO WE WOULD HAVE SEEN AT LEAST 1.5 PSI HIGHER BOOST AS RPM INCREASED HIGHER. THAT WOULD BE AT LEAST 17HP (10-15HP PER PSI). WHEN DID THE MAF BECOME RESTRICTIVE? AT ABOUT 3700 RPM WHEN THE TQ STARTED TO DROP AND THE HP GRAPH BECAME LESS AGRESSIVE. LOOK AT THE DYNO SHEET CAREFULLY, AND YOU WILL SEE AN UPWARD SPIKE STARTING TO OCCUR AT 3700, AND IT FLATTENS OUT IMMEDIATELY. THAT SHOULD BE AT A GREATER ANGLE, BUT AS RPM WAS INCREASING TQ AND HP WERE DROPPING SLOWLY. OUR CUSTOMER NEEDS HIS CAR BACK (WE DID TEST IT A TON :-), SO WE ARE BUILDING A BEATER TO PUSH A STOCK BLOCK TO IT'S LIMIT. WE WILL NEVER RECOMMEND MORE THAN 7 PSI ON A STOCK ENGINE, BUT LET'S SEE WHERE IT GETS TOASTED. I WONT BE SURPRISED AT 350-400 WHEEL HP BEFORE A ROD OR PISTON LETS LOOSE, AND WE WONT CRY A SECOND ABOUT IT. HERE IS OUR PLAN: INSTALL A USED ENGINE WITH STOCK LONGBLOCK. PORT EVERYTHING IN SIGHT (EVEN THE SHIFTER IF IT MAKES MORE POWER--HE-HE), ADD 65MM FORD 4.6 TBODY, Q45 MAF, PORT MATCHED UPPER MANIFOLD ADAPTER, RACE PORTED EATON, 4 EXTRA INJECTORS, WATER/ALCOHOL INJECTION, HEADERS, AND START AT 7 PSI. THEN GO 9, 12, 15 PSI, ETC TILL SOMETHING BAD HAPPENS. SHOULD BE FUN :-) IT WILL BE A FEW WEEKS. FOR NOW, ANYONE WHO NEEDS A KIT CAN KNOW THE MINIMUM NUMBERS THEY WILL SEE.