Apple did it again - iPhone 4

[MinisterofDOOM]

A little change of subject here, but which is better? The new Apple A4 processor, or the Droid Snapdragon? I'm hearing very good things about the new A4 processor.

There's a little more to it than that.
Apple's "A4" is not just a CPU, it's what's known as a "system on a chip." The Snapdragon is a CPU chipset. So you can't compare the two straight across. The A4 includes a GPU, while the Snapdragon must be paired with a separate GPU. There are upsides to both formats (SoC is compact, simple, and ideal for mass production for a single configuration, while separate components means they can be repackaged as-needed for a variety of configurations.

As far as performance goes, the two are similar architecturally. Both use similar ARM standards, hardware configurations, and support more or less the same standards.

I have seen some benchmarking comparisons that put the A4 ahead of the Snapdragon, so it's definitely a hot little chip. The problem with the benchmarks I've seen is that they have the chips running separate OSs, which means it's not really a good analysis of raw processing power. Someone really needs to benchmark Froyo on an iPhone4 and then on, say, an EVO or Droid, to really get a half-decent look at processing prowess. Comparing performance under one OS to performance under another is hardly definitive. Hardware-wise, the A4 has the potential to outperform certain Snapdragon chipsets in certain circumstances, though. It's all down to which chipset and which GPU it's up against, and what tasks you're performing.

The thing to remember is that since Snapdragon is a chipset, (actually, a line of chipsets) there can be variation between "Snapdragon" powered devices. And since the GPU is not part of that chipset, there's another potential variable. For instance, the Nexus-One uses the Snapdragon chipset itself to process 3D graphics, while the Droid's newer Snapdragon chipset has a separate dedicated GPU.

Qualcomm has actually just launched their new dual-core 1.2GHz snapdragon, which is friggin' awesome.

You completely missed the point. It's all about how widespread the technology will become, not how new it is. I guess I'll just keep repeating it for those who haven't read the posts.

Exactly. So, like I said: the revolution is in the marketing, not the product.

[Empty V]

I have the technology built into my MacBook. Wanna know how often I use it? Almost never. It's amusing to d!ck around with once in a while, but it looses it's charm FAST.

That's you. Just like my friends, colleagues, clients etc. use it all the time.

[ADDirishboy]

I think we all know it's not just a phone. I wouldn't have control over my FTP server with it (amongst other things) if it was just a phone. If it was just a phone it would look like this:

Yes, it can do fancy things. Just like my Droid. But I'm not jizzing my pants over the release of the iPhone 4g, kinda like I didn't go insane when they released the Droid. Quit making it sound like it's the pinnacle of technology, cause it's just not.

[Empty V]

Yes, it can do fancy things. Just like my Droid. But I'm not jizzing my pants over the release of the iPhone 4g, kinda like I didn't go insane when they released the Droid. Quit making it sound like it's the pinnacle of technology, cause it's just not.

First it's just a phone, now it's a phone that can do "fancy things." READ THE POSTS. I'm not saying it's "the pinnacle of technology" I'm speculating on how widespread the technology will become. BTW it does more then "fancy things," it does practical things that should have been available a long time ago. I had a feeling this was going to turn into a "we hate apple" thread but you've got to gamble.

[MinisterofDOOM]

Dude...reality check time. Time for the rundown:

A: NO ONE IS HATING ON APPLE.
B: You can't say "check your hate at the door" and then end the SAME SENTENCE WITH "this product is revolutionary and you can't deny it." Doesn't work.
C: No on is hating on apple.

[Empty V]

Dude...reality check time. Time for the rundown:

A: NO ONE IS HATING ON APPLE.
B: You can't say "check your hate at the door" and then end the SAME SENTENCE WITH "this product is revolutionary and you can't deny it." Doesn't work.
C: No on is hating on apple.

Now you're misquoting me. Do you work for the local news? Go back and read my very first post which I think is what your referencing.

[ADDirishboy]

I had a feeling this was going to turn into a "we hate apple" thread but you've got to gamble.

Actually, in my first post I started with how much I love Apple. Nice try though.

This is why I'm moving away from Apple products though. The second anyone says something remotely bad about an Apple product you get labeled by the douchebag fanbois as a "hater". I own plenty on Mac products and love them all. I'm allowed to say I don't like or don't get why something on an Apple product was put there without being a hater.

[initial_jc]

im glad there is major changes, i want to see what is going to happen with the carriers, since jobs himself said carriers as in plural.

android meh

[MinisterofDOOM]

Exactly. I certainly don't exclusively bash Apple or the iPhone.

I'll throw out some other criticism just to balance the scales. Even though it won't make any difference because fanbois don't think logically.

Why is so much Android hardware so poorly matched to the OS? Why the Hell does the G1 have such a tiny ROM partition? Did we completely fail to think ahead AT ALL? And where the hell did our trackballs and trackpads go? EVO? Incredible? XT720? Hello? I need non-capacitive Face buttons please! Buttons I can use with gloves on.

And The Motorola Backflip is a tween-texting-focused bucket of shat, but boy is it popular. Everything about the phone reeks of suck. From the form-factor to the tiny screen to the pathetically underpowered processing hardware to the insinuation that I want everyone to know everything I'm doing all the time and vice versa to the locking-down of app options and weird pre-installed software choices. That phone is EVIL incarnate. Anyone who owns one should find the nearest cliff and jump. THERE is a phone I hate.

Palm's WebOS bizarrely excludes an on-screen keyboard due to the presence of hardware keyboards on all models. Why can't we have both? Appeal to more people, win more sales...simple.

Windows Phone 7 is going to suck, because it's going to take the Xbox 360/Windows Live approach (which is similar to the Apple approach but even more douchey).

[IBCoupe]

It would make sense that everyone who hates the iPhone doesn't own one. Why would they own something they hate. Unless you meant, "has never owned one." I hate that crappy brick-of-a-Kyocera I had five years ago, but I don't own it anymore because I hate it.

So when a poster writes something like that, I'm forced to ask, "Yeah, and?"

I had a feeling this was going to turn into a "we hate apple" thread but you've got to gamble.

This thread seems to be more about whether or not people are hating apple, more than it is actually about hating apple. I think your diagnosis was a bit premature, there, skippy.

[flohtingPoint]

Please explain what a business oriented phone is because I do business form my phone every single day and it works perfectly fine.

I'm not sure what business you're in but the industry I'm in (entertainment) is DOMINATED by the iPhone. Maybe you should step outside of your bubble and look around, it's an amazing world out here.

Two different worlds my friend, I'm an engineer on contract to the Department of Defense. I do business with the leadership of our military, I need something purposeful and practical with the choice of any cell carrier my given contract pays for.

[Ozzie]

blah blah blah....

My Nokia 3210 romps all of the above.



I can play snake on it, AND make calls!

Edit: I can text too!

[IBCoupe]

Two different worlds my friend, I'm an engineer on contract to the Department of Defense. I do business with the leadership of our military, I need something purposeful and practical with the choice of any cell carrier my given contract pays for.

Plus the iPhone doesn't come without a camera, and depending on how flohtingPoint works with the DoD, that might be absolutely impractical. I only recently upgraded to a web-enabled phone, but I still can't bring it into work because I'm a designer for a Navy contractor, it's a Defense plant, and the phone's got a camera.

No iPhones allowed here. On the other hand, Blackberry currently makes four models without cameras, and that'll be my next upgrade.

[MinisterofDOOM]

I might switch to Droid if my office ever moves off AT&T, but so long as they're buying the phones and the plans, I'll probably stick with it. I'll have them pick me up an iPhone 4 once it's been out for a little bit and I've read impressions.

Small nitpick:
"Droid" is a Verison re-brand for various Android-powered smartphones, like the Motorola Milestone and HTC Incredible.
"Android" is a mobile operating system on which many phones, including the Droid lineup, run.

Function is actually why I'm waiting until later for Android.

Definitely don't give up on Android thanks to the Hero. Unless you used the Hero very recently (last month or so) it was running Android 1.5, which is LONG obsolete. It was one of the last devices stuck on 1.5. It's a bottom-end phone, and doesn't begin to compare to the phones released this year (which will all get upgrades to 2.2 sooner or later). The difference between 1.5/1.6 and 2.1/2.2 is enormous.
And if the GUI feel was the biggest issue, keep in mind there are TONS of alternatives to the stock Android "Home" (desktop) most of which are free, and the GUI also varies from one manufacturer or carrier to the next, so there may well be another Android-powered phone out there that suits your needs better.

There's a lot more variation from device to device in the Android world than you'll find in the Blackberry world. And Google and the Open Handset Alliance are pretty well aware that most Android users want more Blackberry-caliber business functionality from the operating system, so the last couple of revisions have made that one of the biggest areas of change.

The Android crowd considers a "power user" someone who downloads movies in HDTV or plays 3D games.

Nah, that's very much an average Android user. Power users are rooted and running custom OS ROMs. Still, it's more non-communication usage than the kind of stuff RIM devotees spend their time on.

blah blah blah....

My Nokia 3210 romps all of the above.



I can play snake on it, AND make calls!

Edit: I can text too!

I had that phone when I was in high school. Then I switched carriers and got stuck with some horrible POS Ericsson monstrosity that was about 30% screen and keys and 60% blue plastic case. I've never hated an electronic device more than I hated that phone.

[flohtingPoint]

I had that phone when I was in high school. Then I switched carriers and got stuck with some horrible POS Ericsson monstrosity that was about 30% screen and keys and 60% blue plastic case. I've never hated an electronic device more than I hated that phone.

LOL! I had an Ericsson on T-Punkt's service (T-Mobile in Germany). I concur, I had massive hate for it.

[marlin29311]

This just in - Empty V posts iPhone 4 super thread, gets butthurt after being told off by various users.

News at 11.


Apple is nothing but a marketing machine, no more/less better than compaines like BOSE or Monster Cable. I bet 90% of the people that believe that the iPhone 4 is the next best thing since sliced bread believe they need a $200 HDMI cable to utilize 120HZ on their HDTV's, and need speaker wire risers to make sure that the floor doesn't generate interference in their electrical signals.

Apple did a great job in making a dumb smartphone. Anyone can use the iPhone, which makes it amazing. But quite honestly, all of the stuff that's being put in now is - a, late to the party ( "multitasking?"), and b, redundant. Do you know who the vast majority of the video conferencer's are going to be? 15 year old girls calling each other to talk about how they think Johnny from english class is hot. What do I do when I need to video conference? I don't pick up my Blackberry...I walk down the hall to the video-conference room.

There is such a thing as too much....most people don't use 75% of what's on their phones anyway, so just jamming more crap in doesn't really make it any better.

[numbnuts240]

talk about how they think Johnny from english class is hot.

he is pretty dreamy...

[Jesda]

We need to get a few things right. Apple has not invented video conferencing for cell phones, not even in a mass-market fashion. The HTC Evo for Sprint, which came out three days ago, has an application called Qik that allows for video conferencing over the cellular network. Apple's Facetime application is restricted to wifi. I'm sure Apple wanted video to work over the cellular network, but was concerned about the quality of service through AT&T. Apple would rather not have a feature at all than have one that performed poorly, which makes sense.

As for the HTC Hero, I did put 2.1 on it and that helped quite a bit, but it still wasn't mature enough for daily use. Too many common functions were buried in submenus and required use of the touch screen to navigate. I prefer to just hit a button and jump to where I need to be. The Hero's touch screen was terribly inaccurate too. I'm looking forward to trying Android again in a year, especially if RIM doesn't improve the Blackberry's multimedia functions. I could wish for a CDMA iPhone, but I know that won't happen anytime soon.

[AppleBonker]

You completely missed the point. It's all about how widespread the technology will become, not how new it is. I guess I'll just keep repeating it for those who haven't read the posts.

Here is my problem with this thinking. The technology has been around and is relatively common. Where it will become widespread is in the install base. Now, the best nut-swingers in the world have attached themselves to old Jobsie so the install base will be large. And with that large adoption, there will be a number of people using this technology. But, it's WiFi only. Having been on AT&T for a while, I fully understand this isn't a fault of the phone but rather a major performance flaw in the network. I will gladly be switching to Verizon in the very near future to rid myself of the cancer that is the big orange's network. It sucks. iPhone users hate it. Someone at the WWDC yesterday even took it upon themselves to voice this opinion when the iPhone 4 demo was having network issues (even though it was running on WiFi). Put this phone on Verizon, and I bet the install-base will be even larger.

Now, on to my other concern. I sincerely hope I don't start seeing more people video chatting on their phones. Why? Because it's available only on WiFi. If I walk into a coffee shop and I see some douche video calling, I'm going to be pissed. This is not the venue for that type of activity. Hell, I don't even like people who are on the phone in places like this. So Suzy thinks Timmy is awesome and they're going to the movies tonight? I don't give a sh*t. Keep that to yourself. With a phone mic near your mouth, you can keep the conversation relatively quite. I doubt this will happen with video calling. Now, if I were to use some video chat program and it would only work in a location with WiFi, I'll be using my netbook or laptop. Not a phone. Plus, a very small number of my friends actually have iPhones, so even if they all upgrade (which they wont) I'd have less than 10 people I could use Face Time with. Now, allow Skype to use this and it might be a bigger deal.

The only benefit I see to video calling on a cell phone is the elimination of the need for sexting. The phone sex will be better.

[HashiriyaS14]

^^
You're getting belligerent. It's just a phone, it isn't your child. People are allowed to not like it. If someone doesn't care for the phone, that doesn't make them a "hater".

I have one, I like it a lot, and I'll get the iPhone 4 right when it's released. Granted, it helps that I get it all for free from work.


It DOES work fine for business purposes (I have a normal 16GB 3G), seeing as how that's what I use mine for. I can edit Excel docs, do anything I need to do with Outlook, view PDF's, etc. There might be better phones for this, but it's definitely better than any of my previous Blackberry products ever were (I had an 8330, 8900 Curve, and Bold).

Like any other gadget, it has its upsides and downsides. It WOULD be better if it were an open system, but it's still very good hardware.

[numbnuts240]

The only benefit I see to video calling on a cell phone is the elimination of the need for sexting. The phone sex will be better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1203clOZt4

[Jesda]

I go to coffee shops only to mooch off wifi when I travel. I get free starbucks access as an ATT home customer. Generally, I dont hang out or stick around.

[HashiriyaS14]

I just noticed this on the sidebar, does this math seem off to anyone else?



(1-0.85) * 500 = $75, not $24.73

[sentrastace]

meh...i'm gonna stick with my 3g iphone. i had a classic and ran out and bought the 3g and then a couple months later, the 3gS came out. now the 4g is here? i'm tired of buying f*** $400 phones.

[RobPaulson]

I used to support apple products... but not recently. talk about big brother. so limited it hurts.

[rc1honda]

I hope this iphone can do simple things well. Like picture messaging. This is one of my biggest pet peeves with the iphone. I can't send pictures through a text message and if i recieve one i have to use the AT&T website to view it. PITA a $300 that i can't picture message with.

[takethewall]

iPhone 4 = absolutely sexy packaging, simple great OS, and a new fashion accessory for the next season of Jersey Shore (white of course).

Video conference calling that is limited to iPhone 4 users only, and limited to wifi is hardly something to become widespread. Multitasking is long overdue. Blackberry has been doing combined message boxes for years. Folders for apps, revolutionary? Please. So really, I don't see what is so revolutionary about this new phone and OS.

The EVO 4G in the US and Nokia N8 in Europe both have front facing cameras. And I don't know about the N8, but with the EVO, video calls can be made over the network, and not just to other EVO users. You can even make calls to Skype users. Hopefully Skype and other similar programs will come to the iPhone for video calling, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

And don't think this post is coming from an Apple hater, I own a MacBook Pro and this post is coming from my own iPad, which I love. I realize it's limitations. It's not this magical device that changes the way I live my life. It's simply a fun and easy to use device that I like to use for simple computing. People need to realize the same thing about the iPhone.

The way I see it, the iPhone has been revolutionary in 2 ways. One, It started this all touch screen phone tech race, and two, the convenient distribution of applications for the iDevices.

[takethewall]

I hope this iphone can do simple things well. Like picture messaging. This is one of my biggest pet peeves with the iphone. I can't send pictures through a text message and if i recieve one i have to use the AT&T website to view it. PITA a $300 that i can't picture message with.

It's been a year or so since picture messaging was added to the iPhone... FYI.

[Jesda]

I think the idea of the iPhone being limited is blown out of proportion. Apple's control of the operating environment hasn't really restricted any functions or features. Flash really is poorly implemented on mobile phones, and p0rn... well, you can view a lot of that in HTML5 now. If you're going to choose your phone based on the ability to play flash games and watch YouJizz, then you probably want a netbook rather than a dedicated communications device.

And while the walled garden business model is good for profits, its also good for quality control and security. Note that the only recent mobile phone virus affected jailbroken iPhones, not standard configurations. I guess the question is whether you're willing the give up 5% of your functionality over that issue. Most would say no, but I'd understand if someone objected to iPhone because of it.



Really though, Android's role in the market is to keep people from abandoning their carriers for AT&T.

Verizon Wireless: 91.2 million (added 2.2 million)
AT&T Inc.: 85.1 million (added 2.7 million)
Sprint Nextel Corp: 48.1 million (lost 148,000)
T-Mobile USA: 33.8 million (added 371,000)

http://blog.taragana.com/index.php/arch ... d-of-2009/

[Empty V]

Two different worlds my friend, I'm an engineer on contract to the Department of Defense. I do business with the leadership of our military, I need something purposeful and practical with the choice of any cell carrier my given contract pays for.

So a "business oriented phone" is one that's available on multiple carriers? I'm not sure how that's a function of the phone opposed to the manufactures' carrier choice. I do business with the leadership of our military as well and haven't had any issues with my iPhone. Yes I have to leave it in my car if I'm going into certain rooms but they make everyone do that.