What would you pay for a Supercharger kit?

[roplusbee]

I feel you. If I remain indecisive for a while, I may actually get to add this one to my list of boost possiblilities. Hahaa

[7anshin]

Thanks, I appreciate that. I just wish money wasnt holding me back as much. But i guess it gives me time to double check and triple check....

I would rather buy a kit that someone took the time on to get it done right, the first time around. Sorry to hear about the money problems holding you back. Know your not the only one!

Also, have you gotten far enough into the design to test fit anything on an s14 yet? I was just curious if you got the hood clearance issue from earlier in the post figured out or not.

Thank for all your hard work, I think it will pay off if everything is clean and reliable.

[240Knightrider]

Hey 7anshin: I think im going to make two designs. The kit that you dont have to cut the hood is more complex due to all the extra stuff where its located.. And sell the kit to cut the hood at a cheaper rate, its easier and less complex. Just need to make a small cowl type raise to the hood.

[roplusbee]

Does the complicated one keep the AC? Also, I planned on getting a vented hood. I don't like the idea of a cowl on my hood. I know gotta be difficult right?

[7anshin]

Does the complicated one keep the AC? Also, I planned on getting a vented hood. I don't like the idea of a cowl on my hood. I know gotta be difficult right?

Good questions. Same on this end. I have to keep my a/c it gets hot here in the sunny florida summers, and I also hate the idea of a cowl on my hood. Some people dig that and that is cool for them, but I just don't know if I could stand that with the lines of the s14... or s13 for that matter.

[240Knightrider]

I love my A/c to much to get ride of it

[240Knightrider]

Good questions. Same on this end. I have to keep my a/c it gets hot here in the sunny florida summers, and I also hate the idea of a cowl on my hood. Some people dig that and that is cool for them, but I just don't know if I could stand that with the lines of the s14... or s13 for that matter.

I agree with the lines deal.. Thats why I knew I couldnt make it be the only way.

[Edub1]

Man, this thread is going nowhere. When do you plan on offering these for sale?

And what's with all the cloke and dagger? You're making a bracket. It's not an invention or anything unique. It's a bracket and maybe a pully or two. A million 240 owners have already considered making one but haven't bothered. Big deal. Why don't you show us some progress instead of trying to act like you are developing some new unheard of technology? Believe me, you'll never be able to protect a collection of mounting hardware. You can't patent a "design" which is nothing more than a certain shape of bracket because no matter the shape, it's just a bracket.

It's begining to seem like you are pulling everyone's leg here. What blower are you using? Surley you don't think you can patent someone elses product, do you?

Unless I see pictures, I am calling BS on this one.

[240Knightrider]

We get one once a month...

you mr edub1 are this months.

Read the whole thread and you will read the type of blower. You will also see that the project is on hold because of getting laid of. So get off your high horse and go elsewhere. You BS calling isnt worth much here.Im not getting into another patent arguement....you dont seem to know much about it so its not worth my time.

[paintballpro69]

not trusting someone making a supercharger kit and calling it a intercooler..

[240Knightrider]

who called a supercharger an intercooler?

[BadMojo]

who called a supercharger an intercooler?

I think he's saying that the term "aftercooler" is usually used with supercharged applications. Technically, an intercooler would be between two turbochargers or a supercharger and a turbo (hence the "inter") and an aftercooler would be after the supercharger or turbo.

Anyway, calling the heat exchanger an intercooler isn't a huge deal but you may want to say "air to water aftercooler" to make it a little more clear. Unless, of course, it's an air-air system which would be odd for a roots type blower but not impossible I guess.

[240Knightrider]

What are you talking about.... An intercooler does not go between two turbochargers or whatever. That would defeat the purpose of it.

[BadMojo]

What are you talking about.... An intercooler does not go between two turbochargers or whatever. That would defeat the purpose of it.

Oh crap, someone better tell Vortech their White Paper is wrong!!!

http://www.vortechsupercharger...r.pdf

Allison and Merlin engines in WWII fighter planes used intercoolers and aftercoolers between compressors. Where do you think supercharger technology was first used? WWI aircraft engines.

Anyway, I was actually defending your use of the term "intercooler" in your explanation. Good luck with the kit.

[paintballpro69]

turbo=intercoolersuper=aftercooler end of story..

[BadMojo]

turbo=intercoolersuper=aftercooler end of story..

I've seen the term intercooler used for both turbo and supercharged applications. GM says that the Cobalt SS/Ion Redline has a supercharged intercooled Ecotec engine. Eaton uses the term on their website and they actually make the things.

Anyway, I'm interested to see something, anything that looks even a little bit like a supercharger kit for the KA24DE.

[paintballpro69]

you can use a intercooler as a aftercooler. depends what applcation on what its doing on what its called..

Anyway.. im suprised they can turn a question like does washers spacing the back of my hood up cool the engine into a 2 plus page arguement getting all technical with detailed explanations and noone can budge into this. makes me sad.. id be interested to know the scientific bob saget explanation on this one.

[babowc]

i understood your first two sentences and lost you after that.so, whats that you were saying?

[paintballpro69]

thats what i get for beingtired. I tried editing it for you..

[babowc]

ohgo :howthingswork.com

lol thats all the info i know

[scotttak]

im calling bs on the supercharger kit...

(maybe people calling it bs will make 240knightrider work harder on it so i can get one faster...tee hee hee my plan is perfect! )

[240Knightrider]

Intercooler-air used to cool heat Aftercooler-water used to cool heat

As for Vortech Thats their Opinion. Roots Style was the first made. Do your research.

http://www.superchargersonline.com

[240Knightrider]

im calling bs on the supercharger kit...

(maybe people calling it bs will make 240knightrider work harder on it so i can get one faster...tee hee hee my plan is perfect! )

lol, I wish. Christmas time

[Edub1]

Call BS because he is acting like he has some new secret develpment when it it obvious what he is doing.

Nightrider, ou ought to do a little research on patents. I have read the thread and I offered sources for you to research.

A utility patent must be unique and non-obvious to those skilled in the trade. Furthermore, a shape or measure is not elidgable. Etc...

It can also be an improvement to an existing product. But not simply a way to bolt that product to something. That is not an improvement.

We have all thought of mounting a supercharger. The type is not relivant and you fitting it to a 240sx or a lawnmower or whatever is not relivant. It is assumed by all that supercharging any motor will increase power. Therefore, it is not unique or non-obvious.

Fabricating a special bracket to do so is simply an obvious way of doing something obvious. Dude, you need to read up an understand the use of the term "design" with regard to patents. It doesn't mean what you think it means. It means "design" as a unique and non-obvious improvement over existing designs. Not simply a funky shape you are calling a "design." You think you could make a hammer with a funky shape and patent it as a design?

Is there something about your "design" that is particularly unique? If so, explain how your "design" is superior to one that anybody else would make?

Or are you thinking that you just fab a piece of metal and pattent the shape as being a "design"?

Either you have something unique and you can explain at least why it is unique or you are simply chasing a pipe dream and blowing smoke up everyone's butt.

I'm beginning to suspect the latter.

Anyway, offer some explaination or I have to raise the BS flag again.

[Edub1]

Here is some info for you. Perhaps you can explain how fabricating a bracket is non-obvious.

"Non-obviousness" is the term used in US patent law to describe one of the three requirements that an invention must meet to qualify for patentability. One of the main requirements of patentability is that the invention being patented is not obvious, meaning that a "person having ordinary skill in the art" would not know how to solve the problem at which the invention is directed by using exactly the same mechanism. The Graham Factor, shown below, are used by a Court to determine if the claimed invention is nonobvious.

For example, in a recent case, Smuckers attempted to patent peanut butter and jelly sandwiches with crimped edges instead of crusts. This invention was challenged in court, and the court ruled that the crimping method, which was essentially the same as that used for ravioli, was an obvious means of protecting the contents of the sandwich. The patent was therefore voided for failing the nonobviousness test. Ordinary food and drink recipes cannot be patented because they are considered obvious.

Further, the combination of previously known elements can be considered obvious. As stated by Winner Int'l Royalty Corp. v. Wang, 202 F.3d. 1340, 1348 (Fed. Cir., 2000), there must be a suggestion or teaching in the prior art to combine elements shown in the prior art in order to find a patent obvious. Thus, in general the critical inquiry is whether there is something in the prior art to suggest the desirability, and thus the nonobvious nature, of the combination of previously known elements.

[edit]Graham factorsThe factors a Court will look at when determining obviousness and non-obviousness in the United States were outlined by the Supreme Court in Graham et al. v. John Deere Co. of Kansas City et al., 383 U.S. 1 (1966) and are commonly referred to as the "Graham factors". The Court held that obviousness should be determined by looking at

the scope and content of the prior art; the level of ordinary skill in the prior art; the differences between the claimed invention and the prior art; and objective evidence of nonobviousness. In addition, the Court outlined factors that show "objective evidence of nonobviousness". They are:

commercial success; long-felt but unsolved needs; and failure of others. Other courts have considered additional factors as well. See Environmental Designs, Ltd. v. Union Oil Co. of Cal., 713 F.2d 693, 697-98, 218 USPQ 865, 869 (Fed. Cir. 1983) (considering skepticism or disbelief before the invention as an indicator of nonobviousness); Allen Archery, Inc. v. Browning Mfg. Co., 819 F.2d 1087, 1092, 2 USPQ2d 1490, 1493 (Fed. Cir. 1987) (considering copying, praise, unexpected results, and industry acceptance as indicators of nonobviousness); Diversitech Corp. v. Century Steps, Inc., 850 F.2d 675, 679, 7 USPQ2d 1315, 1319 (Fed. Cir. 1988) (considering copying as an indicator of nonobviousness).

[One_Love]

i didnt read through the whole thread but looks like knight started this in december, bro you still didnt finish

[BadMojo]

Intercooler-air used to cool heat Aftercooler-water used to cool heat

As for Vortech Thats their Opinion. Roots Style was the first made. Do your research.

So, you're going to be using an air-air uhh, "heat exchanger"?

[240Knightrider]

Ok, you are working way to hard to try to prove your point.

Like I said your BS isnt worth much here. There is a design that has to be made with the kit. Im not talking about just the mounting hardware. Im not going to explain to you the details of it. You either care about it or you don't.

You telling me to go research superchargers and like calling the kettle black. It took you a couple of days to do the reasearch on a patents. Go through patents and see what all is out there. You will see many like designs.

I didnt say I was going to patent it just due to the mounting hardware. There is more involved. So continue with your rant, have at it.

One_love: if you read through it you would have read about how I got laid off. It does cost money to do this. Right now bills are more important.

[One_Love]

my bad

[240Knightrider]

its cool