scc s13 lays down 274 hp

[pampadori]

So apparently you know more than the guy who designed the t04e family of turbos.I'm sure when a manufacturer decides to use a turbo they anre not just picking from the range of BS compressor maps you and I have access to.I understand what compressor maps are for, thanks though, believe it or not, it's a FACT that they are bs.

how old is this guy that invented the to4e? the family is to4, the e is just 4 or 5 different wheels. i ask how old he is because that turbo was around when mosses built the arc!......i gotcha! mosses didn't build the arc! noah did.:0)

shaun

[60dash1]

your thinking of the to4b, and the t04e is a family.50 trim,54 trim etc, etc.

[CrabSpirits]

Do you really think a company like (hypothetical) dodge is going to buy tens of thousands of turbos without knowing their characteristics? Of course not.

No. They don't. They probly use that data as a vague description and then try about 20 different turbos till they find the right one to fit their VERY specific needs.

[miteymax86]

sarcasm is funny

[60dash1]

so is ignorance.

[pampadori]

your thinking of the to4b, and the t04e is a family.50 trim,54 trim etc, etc.

But they are still in the same family. they use to4 turbines...the same for to4b and to4e. s trim p trim.....i got 2 to4e turbos off ford diesel trucks that were made in the early 70's. its a very old turbo....and yes they are to4e. on was a 46 trim and the other a 57 i believe.

i think dodge probably just asked them for a turbo to fit their needs. then garrett just built them a t28 (it is a t28 right?) and dodge said it was good.

60-1, i like your screen name, i just now put it together.....i don't think i would be very well liked if i changed mine to "kkk". stupid german turbo.......shaun

[60dash1]

ha, you should see the reaction this name got me on freshalloy.Don't worry about it, I'm sure they're is another klu klux klan member with a 240 somewhere.

[Dori Dori]

Buddy, you are blowing this way out of proportion. To say that most compressor maps are bs is stupid. To say that some might be fudged may be true. They are a guideline like everything else. Your entire arguement is based off of something you say you heard from a former engineer at Garrett. Oooh, wow. Read Maximum Boost by Corky Bell. There's a engineer that continuously emphasises on the importance of proper turbo selection by means of turbo compressor maps (and other things of course).

And I'd still like you to answer my question...how can so many secrets exist on an item that is readily available to ANYONE? I mean seriously, trying not to sound like a broken record, but anyone could buy any turbo, take it apart or perform their own flow tests and learn everything they wanted to off of them. Besides, I never posted one compressor map or anything about them, so I really don't know why you even brought it up. I posted specs.

[60dash1]

Actually, bring up Maximum Boost on freshalloy.They will tell you that book is full of inacuracies.Because thats the truth, but I suppose your going to tell me that's acurate too.And my original reply wasn't directed at you,but you took it that way anyway.

[achilles0t]

damn all u people are being totally asses. i kinda agree with 60dash1.here's the questionhow fast do you wanna go?im not gonna tell you guys what kinda turbo u guys should get. but it amazes me that all these people wanna spend all their money on turbo's from HKS,Greddy,even the disco patato.there's a guy i know running an 11.90 with a big 16gand u know how much he paid for it. 29.95 from a mitsubishi fuso truck in the JUNK YARD. he yanked it out threw it on his car. this thread almost makes me wanna sell my 240.

its all about how u use what u got.this guys i know spent 10,000 on building up an sr20det he went with a t66 turbo and all kinds of ****. the car still only ran a 12.8 the reason why was he happened to buy the turbo from a guy with an rx-7 and the rear a/r of the turbo was in the 100's and only trucks and rx-7' can spool that kinda a/r so he wouldnt hit full boost till 5500 when it did hit pulled hard as hell though. so he took the turbo and had it rebuilt with a new rear wheel and housing ended up with a 58 rear a/r and ran a 10.6 with full boost at 3600. some of u should spend more time learning about turbo's before u make statements

[Dori Dori]

damn all u people are being totally asses. i kinda agree with 60dash1.here's the questionhow fast do you wanna go?im not gonna tell you guys what kinda turbo u guys should get. but it amazes me that all these people wanna spend all their money on turbo's from HKS,Greddy,even the disco patato.there's a guy i know running an 11.90 with a big 16gand u know how much he paid for it. 29.95 from a mitsubishi fuso truck in the JUNK YARD. he yanked it out threw it on his car. this thread almost makes me wanna sell my 240.

The only one disagreeing with 60dash1 is me and that's on the importance or lack of, turbo compressor maps. So you are calling me a total ***...but you really lost me in what you are saying or why you even said it. Did you even read the thread? Anyway, go ahead and sell your car because you are a jagass.

[Dori Dori]

Actually, bring up Maximum Boost on freshalloy.They will tell you that book is full of inacuracies.Because thats the truth, but I suppose your going to tell me that's acurate too.And my original reply wasn't directed at you,but you took it that way anyway.

Yes, one of the most respected people in turbocharging is an idiot b/c freshalloy, an internet forum, thinks his book is inaccurate.

[60dash1]

Actually I never said he was an idiot, some of his stuff is quite informative.The only problem is too many of his theries and equations are inaccurate, dated or just plain false.Find a real engineer and he will concur, might be a lillte over the head of some internet mechanics tho.

[machinehead]

Did you guys read the article or just look at the hp #? although not practical for most of us, the potato is a nice little turbo. I am dissappointed that SCC went overboard on everything. the exhaust was the worst thing they did. how are you gonna spend more on exhaust then the engine lol. and how the heck did they get an sr for 1200? i would have liked to have seen the orgininal turbo with all the mods and the new turbo with all the mods against eachother. I just dont think it was a fair comparison. I like seeing 240's in mags, but dont drop the ball plz.

[Dori Dori]

Well, they bought the SR before the SR boom happened. Actually, they probably had a lot to do with the SR boom. To give you an idea; in the current issue of scc, the state of tune of the 240 was from last summer. God only knows what the car's like now.

[Dori Dori]

From a Garrett engineer explaining the GT25R, GT28R, and GT28RS (Disco Potato) to me. Hope this ends the dispute as to the quality/performance of the DP. Enjoy.

Quote »Here are maps for the GT25R, the GT28R, and the GT28RS (disco potato). *Obviously not showing them -Dorix2* These are turbos that support a progression of HP from about 250 max (GT25R), to 300 max (GT28R), to 360 max (disco potato). Depends upon what other modifications have been done to the engine to obtain those horsepower levels. The immediate availability of the GT25R is very good, the GT28R is marginal, and the GT28RS (Disco Potato) is not yet in production, if that affects the decision. As a general rule, the smaller turbos will spool quicker, but choke on the top end. Part numbers are as follows:> GT25R....471171-0003> GT28R....466541-0001> GT28RS...739548-5001[/quote]

[CrabSpirits]

Thank you. I wanted to e-mail them about it, but could not find an address on their site. So basically, the SCC car is missing that much power due to not using the turbo to it's full potential?

[Dori Dori]

You can't email Garrett unless you know somebody there or have a friend that does.

My guess on the SCC car is the poor engine management (remember, they are using a KA ECU and I have my doubts about that being a good thing, even though JWT can 'tune it'). I bet a large power gain would be realized with some very mild cams and an EMS. We'll just have to wait and see what they do.

[I H8 UR DSM]

from what i have seen over the years in that magazine has led me to believe that SCC and JWT have some sort of relationship...or maybe its just coincidence, i dunno

[Dori Dori]

Without a doubt.

Also, recently Jic and SCC have seemed to team up as well.

I often wonder if it's just editor's preferances that cause them to do that or if the favored companies are simply coughing up the highest bids...or a little of both.

[mattback]

GT25 R flows 44lb / minute

GT28R flows less than 44lb / minute

so which one will make more horsepoew//

come on idiots..

and yes, the 60-1 makes more power because it flows more, and high rpms let the engine flow more.

not hard to figure that out.

[60dash1]

What are you talkin about mattback?

[Tai Mai Shu]

... if the GT25R flows more than the disco potatoe, obvioulsy it will give you more HP!!! size doesnt always matter. Thats what he is talking about.

[60dash1]

I understand that, I wasn't aware there were people that didn't.

[jmillheiser]

yes but what efficiency range is the 25 flowing 44lb/min. could be at or near the choke point of the turbo

[pampadori]

how come most places that sell the gt25r and 28r say to4s compressor? isn't the whole thing with the gt series about their new wheel and housing designs being completely different? and are there only one part number for each of these? no options on compressors?shaun

[pampadori]

if the gt25r flows 44lbs/min, why does the post above say 250hp? that seems low.

can someone please list the following in order of most capable in terms of power, and also supply part numbersgt28, gt25r, gt28r, hks gt2835.....i think this would be helpful to a few of us.

also, the gt2x are available with .64 or .86 ar on the exhaust housing... what are the different part numbers to give for each ar when ordering?shaun

[Dori Dori]

Come on Mattback, tell us first, what experiance do you have with either turbo? And where are you getting your numbers?

I got my info straigt from Garrett. Take it for what you will, but considering my source; to me, you sound like the idiot here.

[pampadori]

after some research, i found out some info on the gt25r...the part number listed above for the gt25r and gt28r are for the baby turbo gt25 and gt28 models.

they are only good to those hp claims mentioned in the same post.

but garrett also makes the gt25r with the much larger to4s compressor housing and wheels to fit them. these wheels flow the 44lbs/min mattback was mentioning. these are alo more expensive.

this gt25r is rated at 380-400hp....705330-0001this gt25r is rated at 400-440hp....705330-0002

the only difference is that 0002 has a .86 a/r on the turbine side. the 0001 is a .64 a/r. the wheels are identical, as is the compressor housing. (to4s. wheel flow 44lbs/min) c.h.r.a. is the same aswell.

btw, the to4s housing will probably not fit on the stock manifold. it will more then likely hit the manifold on the cyl1 and 2 runners.the exhaust side inlet flange is a t2. but the outlet may or may not be the same. the pics i saw did show a internal gate with a 5 bolt outlet. suggesting that this will be the same, or very very close.

i hope i helped some people out. the gt25r seems to be the name of many different turbos. so i suggest if anyone gets on of these, they order it and research it by part number.shaun

[Nils]

good info.. thx!

n