Q45 Oil Pan R&R advice
There are labor rate sheets you can get off of ebay. They come from large books insurance companies use to estimate damages. They're not entirely comprehensive, but pretty good. Easy also to spend 2 minutes to call up Pep Boys for a labor time quote. Books vary, but are pretty close. There is a large overlap between removing the oil pan and removing the motor mounts. Seems once the crossmember is off, you can remove the oil pan or the mounts.
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maxnix
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1995 Infiniti Q45t
2000 Infiniti Q45
While there is a lot of overlap, there is a little bit of unbolting and rebolting the addtional parts. Book time for replacing the oil pan, plus a small (if any) labor add-on should be negotiated up front.
If they are slamming you with book time for each part, time to look somewhere else. Once they realizing they are not talking to a unkowledgeable person, you should have the upper hand in the negotiation. Tell them once the engine is lifted, you will be glad to remove the worn parts and bolt-up the new ones if costs them too much time.
If they are slamming you with book time for each part, time to look somewhere else. Once they realizing they are not talking to a unkowledgeable person, you should have the upper hand in the negotiation. Tell them once the engine is lifted, you will be glad to remove the worn parts and bolt-up the new ones if costs them too much time.
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elwesso
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I really think that if you tried hard enough you **might** be able to pull the pan without pulling the cross member....
IIRC the only thing prohibiting it is the cross memeber gets in the way of the rearest bolts, and again IIRC a couple of them are accessable through the holes in the cross member.
If you had the right tools, it might be able to be done, but it wouldnt be the first time I was wrong, THe hardest part would be getting it back on and torquing it up right....
IIRC the only thing prohibiting it is the cross memeber gets in the way of the rearest bolts, and again IIRC a couple of them are accessable through the holes in the cross member.
If you had the right tools, it might be able to be done, but it wouldnt be the first time I was wrong, THe hardest part would be getting it back on and torquing it up right....
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elwesso
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Oh thats right, isnt there like a "plate" (baffle, maybe???) that goes around the oil pickup, so you couldnt just move it foreward, I forgot about that, as I thought it was literally a "pan", a deep dish!! 
Maybe you could twist it around, so the rear end would be off to the side then drop it out...... But probably not, just thinking out loud.!!!!
Maybe you could twist it around, so the rear end would be off to the side then drop it out...... But probably not, just thinking out loud.!!!!
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elwesso
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Even at worse you could hike up the engine just a little bit with a hoist....
Removing the hood (for easy access to the engine lift points) and having to say align the pan for 2 hours or so, make its EASILY worthwhile to take that into consideration....
With all that removing of the suspension member and all that stuff, as opposed to have to fight the oil pan to get a good RTV seal I say as far as labor its a wash..... Probably best if a professional did it the real way, but trying to fish it out like that certailny makes it more DIY-able.
I can tell you I could mess with fighting the oil pan for hours than I could hours of removal of the suspension member and having to lift the engine (with tools that may not be well suited enough....
IIRC there shouldnt be much if ANY removal needed to get the oil pan out if you dont move the suspension member... I dont think anything runs in the way....
THe only thing I see problematic is in the FSM they mention the use of a tool to break the bond between the pan and the block, and since you couldnt get the tool on the rear you might warp the pan a little..... Im not sure how that would work but its another thing to consider...
However not a consideration if your replacing the pan....
Removing the hood (for easy access to the engine lift points) and having to say align the pan for 2 hours or so, make its EASILY worthwhile to take that into consideration....
With all that removing of the suspension member and all that stuff, as opposed to have to fight the oil pan to get a good RTV seal I say as far as labor its a wash..... Probably best if a professional did it the real way, but trying to fish it out like that certailny makes it more DIY-able.
I can tell you I could mess with fighting the oil pan for hours than I could hours of removal of the suspension member and having to lift the engine (with tools that may not be well suited enough....
IIRC there shouldnt be much if ANY removal needed to get the oil pan out if you dont move the suspension member... I dont think anything runs in the way....
THe only thing I see problematic is in the FSM they mention the use of a tool to break the bond between the pan and the block, and since you couldnt get the tool on the rear you might warp the pan a little..... Im not sure how that would work but its another thing to consider...
However not a consideration if your replacing the pan....
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elwesso
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However, I think that if you completely broke the seal between the 3 sides that are easily accessible, I see no reason why it would make any difference....
And even the RTV shouldnt be too bad, I wouldnt see how it would be much worse without the suspension member off...
Im going to put the Q on the lift and Ill snap a few pictures before I leave..
And even the RTV shouldnt be too bad, I wouldnt see how it would be much worse without the suspension member off...
Im going to put the Q on the lift and Ill snap a few pictures before I leave..
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psychic_mechanic
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If there was a way to save time and still do a good quality repair, a tech would have already found it.:pface
If there was a way to save time and make a half-a$$ed repair, a thief posing as a mechanic would have figured it out.
Feel free to experiment though, one of my most hated expressions is "But this is the way we've always done it!"
If there was a way to save time and make a half-a$$ed repair, a thief posing as a mechanic would have figured it out.
Feel free to experiment though, one of my most hated expressions is "But this is the way we've always done it!"
I would love if there was an alternative method to just remove the pan (somehow) without a day's labor (probably weeks if I attempt the task). This is America. A better or alternative solution isn't always in the factory shop manual. Joe's 1990 Infiniti Q45 oilpan & special sealant should arrive any day now (I ordered it before the suggestion for mounts & brackets).
For example, the Nico suggested testing & resoldering of the number #4 ground connection in the otherwise usable four hundred dollar Q45 fuel pump control unit has saved a lot of us already. And a few of us have even benefited from the Nico alternative of tapping threads onto the aluminium sunvisor mount instead of throwing the 250 dollar otherwise perfectly good sun visors in the trash. None of that was in the FSM. But all is explained on Nico.
For example, the Nico suggested testing & resoldering of the number #4 ground connection in the otherwise usable four hundred dollar Q45 fuel pump control unit has saved a lot of us already. And a few of us have even benefited from the Nico alternative of tapping threads onto the aluminium sunvisor mount instead of throwing the 250 dollar otherwise perfectly good sun visors in the trash. None of that was in the FSM. But all is explained on Nico.
Woohoo! An 11 pound black steel 1990 Q45 oilpan arrived today from Scottsdale Joe (see photo below). It sure looks asymetrically wierd, with three concentric semicircular baffles (to prevent sloshing?) & four tubes welded down the sides (alignment or drain guides?) & two funny-looking inch-long threaded posts sticking out a side compartment (connected to what?).
I dug out my 1990 Q45 factory shop manual (which was buried in the moving boxes). Somehow, it was in a box marked "kitchen" (I must've been reading it at the table when the five brawny movers arrived to rudely but efficiently pack me up).
Page EM-11 of the '90 FSM describes the Q45 oil pan removal process for the VH45DE 274 cubic inch engine:Can experienced folks add detail to the edited description below for me and our (users') benefit?. Please? I've guessed wildly at the detail for a lot of the steps, so feel free to correct my mistakes & especially my goofy time estimates.Especially where does all that 7.1 to 7.5 hours of time get spent anyway?
0. Obtain all parts from Joe:a) PAN ASSY OIL (INF #11110-60U10)b) GASKET SILICONE LIQUID (INF #999MP-A7007P)c) 7 Quarts 10W40 SL oil & NISSAN OIL FILTER d) ALTERNATOR BELT (GoodYear 4040372-4PK0945 or equivalent)e) POWER STEERING BELT (GoodYear 4040505-4PK1285 or equivalent)f) AIR CONDITIONER BELT (GoodYear 4060380-6PK0965 or equivalent)g) FAN BLADE ASSBY (if needed)
Time = 0 hours, 0 minutes1. After placing chocks behind the rear wheels, using a garage jack centered on the 1990 Q45 front crossmember (see GI-21, diagram SG1623, "Garage Jack & Safety Stand Placement Points"), lift the 1990 Q45 & place two two safety stands under the frame (at about the flywheel location along the Q45 sidelines).Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 10 minutes
2. Remove the black plastic engine undercover. Remove the topside oil filler cap & drain engine oil completely (6.8 quarts) by removing the oil pan drain bolt and then the oil filter (I think you must use an end-cap oil-filter wrench as nothing else seems to work for me).Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 30 minutes
3. From the underside of the Q45 (?) remove (what looks like) four nuts holding on the fan coupling (with fan). See diagram SLC358A. (Do I jam a prybar or three-foot pipe in to keep the fan from rotating while I spin out the four nuts?)Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 45 minutes
4. Remove alternator pulley drive belt (does it just pull off once the fan coupline with fan is removed?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 0 minutes
5. Remove power steering oil pump & water pump pully drive belt (again, does it just pull off without loosening something??).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 5 minutes
6. Remove air conditioning compressor drive belt (see diagram SMA189C on page MA-11 of the 1990 FSM).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 10 minutes
7. Remove alternator (what are the steps?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 15 minutes
8. Remove air compressor (is this the air conditioner pulley mechanism?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 30 minutes
9. Remove engine gusset (what is that)?Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 35 minutes
10. Remove steering lower joint.Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 0 minutes
11. Support the RE4R03-A 4-speed automatic transmission (do I try to place a small garage jack under the bell housing to just support the transmission w/o lifting the car?).Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 5 minutes
12. Support the Q45 engine with an engine slinger. (Is there any alternative to the engine slinger? Is there a way to support the engine from below somehow?).Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 30 minutes
13. Remove suspension cross member assembly.Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 45 minutes
14. Remove 18 oil pan bolts in the order shown in the 90 FSM diagram SEM892C. Basically the two in the rear, the two in front, the two rear corners, the two front corners, the two just fore the rear corners, on either side, the two just aft the front corners, on either side, the next two on either side just fore the remaining rears, then the two just aft the reminaing fronts ... moving inward, side by side, until the 18th bolt has been removed. In case they are different sizes, tape them into 18 labelled paper water cups.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 0 minutes
15. The FSM doesn't say it, but there must be something attached to the two bolts sticking out of the drivers' side of the oil pan. So, whatever that is, remove it.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 5 minutes
16. Insert a thin three-inch-wide putty knive or similar wedge of metal (or Nissan tool #KV10111100) into the oil pan to engine gap and slide horizontally by tapping with a plastic mallet to break the seal between the steel oilpan and the aluminum engine block. Do not use anything less than three inches (like a screwdriver). If you don't have a three-inch metal wedge to break the suction seal, just pound like crazy and the oil pan might fall off into your hands anyway. It may help to have the oil filler cap off at all times (dunno).Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 15 minutes
17. Pull down oil pan & inspect for damage to the oil pickup mechanism.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 15 minutes
18. Gently scrape the engine mating surface free of old liquid gasket material to create a smooth surface.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 30 minutes
19. Note that you have (apparently) only five minutes of time between squeezing the liquid gasket material out and attaching the oil pan to the engine so, read ahead to get everything prepared to go.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 35 minutes
20. Attach the nozzle (supplied) to a 150 gram (5.25 ounces) tube of liquid gasket (Nissan part number 999MP-A7007 "1207C Silicone Gasket"), cut the tip at a 40 degree angle at the second concentric ridge (I think), wipe off moisture, oil, and foreign matter from the oil pan & engine oilpan mating surfaces with a shop towel (moistened with brakleen perhaps), and then apply a continuous 3.5mm to 4.5mm uniformly wide bead of this Nissan silicone gasket material first to the engine mating surface. Take care NOT to get the special Nissan Silicone gasket material into the bolt holes in the engine block. (Do I then smush that bead down with a spatula to get it uniform or do I leave it as a bead?). Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 40 minutes
21. Once the engine block is smeared, apply the Silicone Gasket to the oil pan sealing surface taking care to not only fill the depressions between bolts supplied for the purpose, but also to go around the bolt holes on the INNER SIDE only! (Why?) (Again, do I smush this bead or leave it as an intact bead?)Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 45 minutes
22. Push the 1990 Q45 oilpan up against the gasketed engine block mating surface and install the 18 bolts in the reverse order of removal (i.e., the two midline bolts, then move outward bolt by bolt, first fore, then aft of the midline bolts, ending with the two bolts furthest apart on each end toward the bow and stern).Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 0 minutes
23. When done, expel all air out of the Silicone Gasket tube to prevent hardening of the remaining contents.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 5 minutes
24. Wait at least 30 minutes before adding engine oil; so, in the meantime, replace the suspension cross member assembly.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 30 minutes
25. Remove transmission jack.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 35 minutes
26. Remove engine hoist.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 55 minutes
27. Replace steering lower joint.Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 15 minutes
28. Replace engine gusset (whatever that is).Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 20 minutes
29. Replace air compressor.Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 45 minutes
30. Replace alternator.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 0 minutes
31. Replace the air conditioner compressor drive belt (what order is the best order?) and torque to about 22 pounds (10kg, 98 newtons) so that the deflection at the topside midline of a new belt is about 7.5 to 8.5 mm.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 15 minutes
32. Replace the power steering oil pump & water pump pulley drive belt (does the order matter?) and adjust deflection at the underside midline (opposite the idler pulley) of the new belt to 8 to 9 mm.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 30 minutes
33. Replace the alternator pulley drive belt and adjust deflection of the new belt at the topside midline to about 7.5 to 8.5 mm.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 0 minutes
34. Replace the fan coupling and fan unit (replace if the fan is cracked like mine is).Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 15 minutes
35. Wipe a drop of new motor oil onto the oil filter gasket and screw the new oil filter on by hand until it mates & then turn two thirds of a turn extra to seat tightly.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 20 minutes
36. Add 6.8 U.S. quarts of 10W30 or 10W40 SL (any brand will do just fine as long as the API service is SL or better) and check for leaks.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 25 minutes
37. Run the engine & check for oil leaks.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 30 minutes
38. Avoid parking lot crosswalk curbs at all times.
I dug out my 1990 Q45 factory shop manual (which was buried in the moving boxes). Somehow, it was in a box marked "kitchen" (I must've been reading it at the table when the five brawny movers arrived to rudely but efficiently pack me up).
Page EM-11 of the '90 FSM describes the Q45 oil pan removal process for the VH45DE 274 cubic inch engine:Can experienced folks add detail to the edited description below for me and our (users') benefit?. Please? I've guessed wildly at the detail for a lot of the steps, so feel free to correct my mistakes & especially my goofy time estimates.Especially where does all that 7.1 to 7.5 hours of time get spent anyway?
0. Obtain all parts from Joe:a) PAN ASSY OIL (INF #11110-60U10)b) GASKET SILICONE LIQUID (INF #999MP-A7007P)c) 7 Quarts 10W40 SL oil & NISSAN OIL FILTER d) ALTERNATOR BELT (GoodYear 4040372-4PK0945 or equivalent)e) POWER STEERING BELT (GoodYear 4040505-4PK1285 or equivalent)f) AIR CONDITIONER BELT (GoodYear 4060380-6PK0965 or equivalent)g) FAN BLADE ASSBY (if needed)
Time = 0 hours, 0 minutes1. After placing chocks behind the rear wheels, using a garage jack centered on the 1990 Q45 front crossmember (see GI-21, diagram SG1623, "Garage Jack & Safety Stand Placement Points"), lift the 1990 Q45 & place two two safety stands under the frame (at about the flywheel location along the Q45 sidelines).Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 10 minutes
2. Remove the black plastic engine undercover. Remove the topside oil filler cap & drain engine oil completely (6.8 quarts) by removing the oil pan drain bolt and then the oil filter (I think you must use an end-cap oil-filter wrench as nothing else seems to work for me).Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 30 minutes
3. From the underside of the Q45 (?) remove (what looks like) four nuts holding on the fan coupling (with fan). See diagram SLC358A. (Do I jam a prybar or three-foot pipe in to keep the fan from rotating while I spin out the four nuts?)Estimated wall clock = 0 hours 45 minutes
4. Remove alternator pulley drive belt (does it just pull off once the fan coupline with fan is removed?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 0 minutes
5. Remove power steering oil pump & water pump pully drive belt (again, does it just pull off without loosening something??).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 5 minutes
6. Remove air conditioning compressor drive belt (see diagram SMA189C on page MA-11 of the 1990 FSM).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 10 minutes
7. Remove alternator (what are the steps?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 15 minutes
8. Remove air compressor (is this the air conditioner pulley mechanism?).Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 30 minutes
9. Remove engine gusset (what is that)?Estimated wall clock = 1 hour 35 minutes
10. Remove steering lower joint.Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 0 minutes
11. Support the RE4R03-A 4-speed automatic transmission (do I try to place a small garage jack under the bell housing to just support the transmission w/o lifting the car?).Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 5 minutes
12. Support the Q45 engine with an engine slinger. (Is there any alternative to the engine slinger? Is there a way to support the engine from below somehow?).Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 30 minutes
13. Remove suspension cross member assembly.Estimated wall clock = 2 hours 45 minutes
14. Remove 18 oil pan bolts in the order shown in the 90 FSM diagram SEM892C. Basically the two in the rear, the two in front, the two rear corners, the two front corners, the two just fore the rear corners, on either side, the two just aft the front corners, on either side, the next two on either side just fore the remaining rears, then the two just aft the reminaing fronts ... moving inward, side by side, until the 18th bolt has been removed. In case they are different sizes, tape them into 18 labelled paper water cups.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 0 minutes
15. The FSM doesn't say it, but there must be something attached to the two bolts sticking out of the drivers' side of the oil pan. So, whatever that is, remove it.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 5 minutes
16. Insert a thin three-inch-wide putty knive or similar wedge of metal (or Nissan tool #KV10111100) into the oil pan to engine gap and slide horizontally by tapping with a plastic mallet to break the seal between the steel oilpan and the aluminum engine block. Do not use anything less than three inches (like a screwdriver). If you don't have a three-inch metal wedge to break the suction seal, just pound like crazy and the oil pan might fall off into your hands anyway. It may help to have the oil filler cap off at all times (dunno).Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 15 minutes
17. Pull down oil pan & inspect for damage to the oil pickup mechanism.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 15 minutes
18. Gently scrape the engine mating surface free of old liquid gasket material to create a smooth surface.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 30 minutes
19. Note that you have (apparently) only five minutes of time between squeezing the liquid gasket material out and attaching the oil pan to the engine so, read ahead to get everything prepared to go.Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 35 minutes
20. Attach the nozzle (supplied) to a 150 gram (5.25 ounces) tube of liquid gasket (Nissan part number 999MP-A7007 "1207C Silicone Gasket"), cut the tip at a 40 degree angle at the second concentric ridge (I think), wipe off moisture, oil, and foreign matter from the oil pan & engine oilpan mating surfaces with a shop towel (moistened with brakleen perhaps), and then apply a continuous 3.5mm to 4.5mm uniformly wide bead of this Nissan silicone gasket material first to the engine mating surface. Take care NOT to get the special Nissan Silicone gasket material into the bolt holes in the engine block. (Do I then smush that bead down with a spatula to get it uniform or do I leave it as a bead?). Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 40 minutes
21. Once the engine block is smeared, apply the Silicone Gasket to the oil pan sealing surface taking care to not only fill the depressions between bolts supplied for the purpose, but also to go around the bolt holes on the INNER SIDE only! (Why?) (Again, do I smush this bead or leave it as an intact bead?)Estimated wall clock = 3 hours 45 minutes
22. Push the 1990 Q45 oilpan up against the gasketed engine block mating surface and install the 18 bolts in the reverse order of removal (i.e., the two midline bolts, then move outward bolt by bolt, first fore, then aft of the midline bolts, ending with the two bolts furthest apart on each end toward the bow and stern).Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 0 minutes
23. When done, expel all air out of the Silicone Gasket tube to prevent hardening of the remaining contents.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 5 minutes
24. Wait at least 30 minutes before adding engine oil; so, in the meantime, replace the suspension cross member assembly.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 30 minutes
25. Remove transmission jack.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 35 minutes
26. Remove engine hoist.Estimated wall clock = 4 hours 55 minutes
27. Replace steering lower joint.Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 15 minutes
28. Replace engine gusset (whatever that is).Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 20 minutes
29. Replace air compressor.Estimated wall clock = 5 hours 45 minutes
30. Replace alternator.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 0 minutes
31. Replace the air conditioner compressor drive belt (what order is the best order?) and torque to about 22 pounds (10kg, 98 newtons) so that the deflection at the topside midline of a new belt is about 7.5 to 8.5 mm.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 15 minutes
32. Replace the power steering oil pump & water pump pulley drive belt (does the order matter?) and adjust deflection at the underside midline (opposite the idler pulley) of the new belt to 8 to 9 mm.Estimated wall clock = 6 hours 30 minutes
33. Replace the alternator pulley drive belt and adjust deflection of the new belt at the topside midline to about 7.5 to 8.5 mm.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 0 minutes
34. Replace the fan coupling and fan unit (replace if the fan is cracked like mine is).Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 15 minutes
35. Wipe a drop of new motor oil onto the oil filter gasket and screw the new oil filter on by hand until it mates & then turn two thirds of a turn extra to seat tightly.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 20 minutes
36. Add 6.8 U.S. quarts of 10W30 or 10W40 SL (any brand will do just fine as long as the API service is SL or better) and check for leaks.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 25 minutes
37. Run the engine & check for oil leaks.Estimated wall clock = 7 hours 30 minutes
38. Avoid parking lot crosswalk curbs at all times.
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squeefoo
- Posts: 1053
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- Car: 1990 Infiniti Q45
1994 Nissan Maxima SE
1999 Infiniti I30
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2012 Infiniti G37x S
I can't imagine there are any questions anymore. This sounds exactly like what I would've done. Will you marry me??????? I'm almost not kidding. I make alot of money. I'll PDF my 1099 if you like, live on 32 acres, 100 miles N. of Chicago; aside from my posts, (believe it or not) I'm rather easy to get along with... do you want children?... I don't (too much to enjoy)...6'0" 185# muscular (but no 6 pack) brown on blue. Read alot, rather conservative, no tattoos, short hair, mustache, play keyboards and mainly drums... you know the type. Hubba, hubba. Real Man candy. Take a chance. (you never know) - Anyone else , blah,blah,blah, whatever.
Use a lot of brakleen on both mating surfaces before applying the RTV. Almost as critical as (38) to prevent future leaks. It will be easier to remove the AC compressor before the alternator, though I'm surprised they have to come out at all, unless the "gusset" is the mounting bracket for these 2 items and it has to be removed. Don't disconnect the refrigerant lines from the compressor. Support it in place with some stout line.
That joke got me laughing. I'm no longer depressed now that I have an action plan and friends to help me through it. I'm sorry to say I'm weak in that respect, but, I'm glad help is only an Internet away.
My biggest remaining questions at this point are:
a) What (pray tell) is an ENGINE GUSSET?b) Can I possibly do this oilpan R&R w/o a winch?c) If I get a winch, will a general purpose one fit the bill?d) Will my small (old) 2.5 ton garage jack fit under the transmission? Or do I have to buy a flat headed transmission jack?e) Why (oh why) does the alternator, air compressor, and belts have to come off?f) What the heck is an "air compressor" (is that the A/C Freon-like-liquid compressor thingey)?g) What on earth is connected to those two threaded rods sticking out of the oil pan?h) What is the steering lower joint anyway? Is it a ball joint? Do I need pickle forks to remove it?i) Do smear the silicone schmutz or leave it alone, all rolled up in a bead.
And the most important one, should I do this job myself (I'd rather put the money into tools that are reusable than into mechanics which can only be used once)?
My biggest remaining questions at this point are:
a) What (pray tell) is an ENGINE GUSSET?b) Can I possibly do this oilpan R&R w/o a winch?c) If I get a winch, will a general purpose one fit the bill?d) Will my small (old) 2.5 ton garage jack fit under the transmission? Or do I have to buy a flat headed transmission jack?e) Why (oh why) does the alternator, air compressor, and belts have to come off?f) What the heck is an "air compressor" (is that the A/C Freon-like-liquid compressor thingey)?g) What on earth is connected to those two threaded rods sticking out of the oil pan?h) What is the steering lower joint anyway? Is it a ball joint? Do I need pickle forks to remove it?i) Do smear the silicone schmutz or leave it alone, all rolled up in a bead.
And the most important one, should I do this job myself (I'd rather put the money into tools that are reusable than into mechanics which can only be used once)?
I was looking under the car this evening. I am not convinced you need to remove the alternator, a/c compressor or the bracket they're attached to. I recommend you do those items last. By the time everything else is off, you'll know whether you'll need to or not. I think removing the a/c belt tensioner will give enough clearance to the oil pan bolts if you have a 1/4" 10mm flex socket.
I was wondering what happened to the missing posts. My suppositions (picturing a reputed "ENGINE GUSSET" for example) dissappeared, along with helpful advice from you (DAEDALUS) explaining the A/C compressor was probably the "air conditioning compressor" in Japanese disguise. (there is nothing that compresses air in the base 90 Q45 as far as I know). Maybe the CIA saw my comments about Bush & Kerry & decided to snuff out the evidence.
The suggestion for the two 'taser' bolts sticking out of the driver-side oil pan sidewall also vanished just like it did from the 90 FSM diagrams (notice in the FSM there is NO MENTION OR DIAGRAM which shows these taser bolts, e.g., they are whited out of diagram SEM877C on page EM-43, which is perhaps the best diagram of the oil-pan surroundings in the 90 FSM). It's like a Russion diplomat who fell from grace where only the shoes are left remaining in the photo. In this case, only the tell-tale bulge in the driver-side oil pan sidewall is left in the diagrams (EM-21 SEM868C & SEM869C, EM-13 SEM870C). However, as shown in the circled area of the photo below, these bolts merely hold two hoses and are of little consequence to this oil pan removal task.
Of greater consequence is the sheer magnitude of removal that the 1990 Infiniti FSM suggests be performed.
I agree that we'd rather not remove the alternator, air-conditioning compressor, & the triangular steel bracket (gusset?) they're attached to, if for nothing else, just removing the alternator is a lot of work as seemingly described in the 90FSM on page EL-26 as:a) Remove radiator shroud & cooling fanb) Drain 1 liter of coolant & remove radiator upper hosec) Remove alternator upper bracket (aka the gusset?)d) Remove air conditioner pipe mounting brackete) Remove idler pulley; then remove alternator beltf) Remove two power steering cooler pipe mounting screwsg) Remove alternator mounting bolt (aka, the thru bolt)
Also apparently vanquished was my reference to an oil pan removal NICO post which explained the pros and cons of using an engine sling vs supporting the engine with a jack stand under the crankshaft pulley. Another idea I found in my Internet searches on supporting engines was to put a one-foot section of 2x4 on each front shock upper bolt & then place a strong 6 foot long two-inch on a side angle iron transverse across the top of the engine, pointy side up, on those wood blocks. then hang the engine from this poor-mans' engine slinger. I might try that angle-iron approach (depending on the cost & availability of an appropriate cross-legged engine slinger which I'll check out today if I can).
Another vanished suggestion from DAEDALUS was the mysterious "steering lower joint". It might be the u-joint on the steering shaft, or just a lower control-arm steering ball joint (see 1990 FSM ST-15 diagram SST783A titled "Detach tie-rod outer sockets from knuckle arms with Tool" noting on the next page the knuckle arm is the top arm, the tie-rod being on the bottom of the ball joint. Yet, mysteriously, page EM-41 of the 90 FSM shows diagram SEM866C titled "Remove steering lower joint", but, for the life of me, I can't figure out what they are diagramming. What they purport to show is some kind of in-line lengthwise-splined rod coupling??? What is that?
Abolished as well was the suggestion to schmush the bead on both the Q45 engine block and the oil pan BEFORE mating the two; plus an exhoration to torque the oil pan bolts (but no torque value supplied). I found the torque value in the cylinder block section of the 90FSM, on page EM-43 diagram SEM877C 6.3 to 8.3 newton meters or, in plain English, 4.6 to 6.1 pound feet, in plainer English, about 5 foot pounds.
That answers (for now) most of the questions (I'm sure more will crop up as the progress proceeds). I still have the biggie in my mind, which is ... Who am I to think I can do this? If it takes a real mechanic all day, it will take me, w/o experience, air tools, & special tools, ???
The suggestion for the two 'taser' bolts sticking out of the driver-side oil pan sidewall also vanished just like it did from the 90 FSM diagrams (notice in the FSM there is NO MENTION OR DIAGRAM which shows these taser bolts, e.g., they are whited out of diagram SEM877C on page EM-43, which is perhaps the best diagram of the oil-pan surroundings in the 90 FSM). It's like a Russion diplomat who fell from grace where only the shoes are left remaining in the photo. In this case, only the tell-tale bulge in the driver-side oil pan sidewall is left in the diagrams (EM-21 SEM868C & SEM869C, EM-13 SEM870C). However, as shown in the circled area of the photo below, these bolts merely hold two hoses and are of little consequence to this oil pan removal task.
Of greater consequence is the sheer magnitude of removal that the 1990 Infiniti FSM suggests be performed.
I agree that we'd rather not remove the alternator, air-conditioning compressor, & the triangular steel bracket (gusset?) they're attached to, if for nothing else, just removing the alternator is a lot of work as seemingly described in the 90FSM on page EL-26 as:a) Remove radiator shroud & cooling fanb) Drain 1 liter of coolant & remove radiator upper hosec) Remove alternator upper bracket (aka the gusset?)d) Remove air conditioner pipe mounting brackete) Remove idler pulley; then remove alternator beltf) Remove two power steering cooler pipe mounting screwsg) Remove alternator mounting bolt (aka, the thru bolt)
Also apparently vanquished was my reference to an oil pan removal NICO post which explained the pros and cons of using an engine sling vs supporting the engine with a jack stand under the crankshaft pulley. Another idea I found in my Internet searches on supporting engines was to put a one-foot section of 2x4 on each front shock upper bolt & then place a strong 6 foot long two-inch on a side angle iron transverse across the top of the engine, pointy side up, on those wood blocks. then hang the engine from this poor-mans' engine slinger. I might try that angle-iron approach (depending on the cost & availability of an appropriate cross-legged engine slinger which I'll check out today if I can).
Another vanished suggestion from DAEDALUS was the mysterious "steering lower joint". It might be the u-joint on the steering shaft, or just a lower control-arm steering ball joint (see 1990 FSM ST-15 diagram SST783A titled "Detach tie-rod outer sockets from knuckle arms with Tool" noting on the next page the knuckle arm is the top arm, the tie-rod being on the bottom of the ball joint. Yet, mysteriously, page EM-41 of the 90 FSM shows diagram SEM866C titled "Remove steering lower joint", but, for the life of me, I can't figure out what they are diagramming. What they purport to show is some kind of in-line lengthwise-splined rod coupling??? What is that?
Abolished as well was the suggestion to schmush the bead on both the Q45 engine block and the oil pan BEFORE mating the two; plus an exhoration to torque the oil pan bolts (but no torque value supplied). I found the torque value in the cylinder block section of the 90FSM, on page EM-43 diagram SEM877C 6.3 to 8.3 newton meters or, in plain English, 4.6 to 6.1 pound feet, in plainer English, about 5 foot pounds.
That answers (for now) most of the questions (I'm sure more will crop up as the progress proceeds). I still have the biggie in my mind, which is ... Who am I to think I can do this? If it takes a real mechanic all day, it will take me, w/o experience, air tools, & special tools, ???
BTW, a photo of the likely suspect to be an "engine gusset" was removed from this thread due to the hacker from Florida & the fast-response IT backup not covering all our posts that day.
Here, for the next poor soul who has to perform an Infiniti Q45 oil pan repair with the factory shop manual in hand, is what I think is the so-called "engine gusset".
Here, for the next poor soul who has to perform an Infiniti Q45 oil pan repair with the factory shop manual in hand, is what I think is the so-called "engine gusset".
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psychic_mechanic
- Posts: 296
- Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 6:45 am
- Car: the world's ugliest civic
My bad luck today. I was at a friend's pool party (I know ... I should have been working on my oil pan) ... when I guess I got a bit too tipsy and ended up tripping on the stairs coming out of the pool.
Boom. Bounce. Rebound. (sound familiar?). I really torqued up my wrist something fierce. Even with all the ice, I can't move it in the backward direction past horizontal.
I guess that means I'll just have to buy an air compressor if I want to do this oilpan job myself ...
P.S. I'm really good at justifying buying tools as long as I can find any reasonable (or available) justification ...
Back to the gusset ... I'll keep both suggestions in mind when/if I attempt the job and let you know (so the next poor sap doesn't have to wonder like we are).
Boom. Bounce. Rebound. (sound familiar?). I really torqued up my wrist something fierce. Even with all the ice, I can't move it in the backward direction past horizontal.
I guess that means I'll just have to buy an air compressor if I want to do this oilpan job myself ...
P.S. I'm really good at justifying buying tools as long as I can find any reasonable (or available) justification ...
Back to the gusset ... I'll keep both suggestions in mind when/if I attempt the job and let you know (so the next poor sap doesn't have to wonder like we are).
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Q45tech
- Moderator
- Posts: 14296
- Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2002 3:19 am
- Car: 1990 Q45 342,400 miles 22 years ownership with original engine
1995 G20t 5 speed 334,000 miles 16" 2002 wheels - 205/50/16 Sr20ve vvl
I keep waiting in anticipation of the WAKE and pictures of the internment.........one of the few jobs that can kill a member without a SHOP lift and jacks and custom engine support stands.........well the transmission might do it also.
Byron swapped a Q engine in 7 hours with lunch, but the replacement was all preconfigured/rehabed [100%] no swapping anything but fluids, belts, and AC recharge.
Byron swapped a Q engine in 7 hours with lunch, but the replacement was all preconfigured/rehabed [100%] no swapping anything but fluids, belts, and AC recharge.
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zgendron
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Sat Sep 27, 2003 10:32 am
- Car: 02 Maxima SE 6spd - 09 Nissan Versa SL CVT
Re: (Q45tech)
Hi,
Looks like we're in a similar situation. My Dad just hit a rock in his 94 Q45 and punctured the oil pan. It needs to be replaced. I'd love to see what you did, and times involved.
Thanks, Zack
Looks like we're in a similar situation. My Dad just hit a rock in his 94 Q45 and punctured the oil pan. It needs to be replaced. I'd love to see what you did, and times involved.
Thanks, Zack
Re: (zgendron)
That makes at least three of us (I think DAEDALUS is in the same oilpan repair basket as we are)
My 1990 Q45 oil pan remove & replace job is, unfortunately, on hold (see my last post on this topic) until my wrist can take the strain of the wrenches on strong bolts. So, I wish I could help others out more, but ...
Maybe this oilpan remove and replace is my latest excuse to buy an air compressor. I always wanted one of those but never had enough of a justification.
I'd supply a useful & informative image for this post but, for the life of me, I just can not figure out how to attach an image from disk anymore. If I hit the image button in the "Text Editor Toolbar", it wants the image to already be on a web server somewhere.
Images take ten times more time for me to edit than text but they convey sooooooo very much better information.
My 1990 Q45 oil pan remove & replace job is, unfortunately, on hold (see my last post on this topic) until my wrist can take the strain of the wrenches on strong bolts. So, I wish I could help others out more, but ...
Maybe this oilpan remove and replace is my latest excuse to buy an air compressor. I always wanted one of those but never had enough of a justification.
I'd supply a useful & informative image for this post but, for the life of me, I just can not figure out how to attach an image from disk anymore. If I hit the image button in the "Text Editor Toolbar", it wants the image to already be on a web server somewhere.
Images take ten times more time for me to edit than text but they convey sooooooo very much better information.
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maxnix
- Posts: 22627
- Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2002 8:11 pm
- Car: 1995 Infiniti Q45
1995 Infiniti Q45t
2000 Infiniti Q45
1,000 pictures
Why not try posting in member's rides and linking to here from there? The old Rex trick (see his signature).tangalora wrote:How does one attach local images on my disk to NICO nowadays?