one of the benefits of having a messy garage and no memory

[float_6969]

Math AND Searching pwn Mike.

[r34 gtr]

I'm curious, what exactly is the reason for going with anything other than the CA20 block? Did you guys not get it in japland?

[themadscientist]

CA20 block is weak.

[r34 gtr]

Fair enough. I really havnt read into the CA20 much. I just know it sucked pretty hard. Whats the reason with not just getting a custom full counter weight crank made and getting some 84mm pistons? To rub it in my face? haha. (which coincidentally is more than enough reason to do damn near anything)

[themadscientist]

Make one? why make one when I can go to a junkyard and get one? I would like 84mm pistons but the bore is already bigger than that so unless i want to sleeve it I have no choice.

[r34 gtr]

With all this work you are doing I expect some badass horsepower figures. Nothing less than 500hp will suffice.

[themadscientist]

This is the first full engine overhaul I have done and with all the stangeness of the project I would be happy if it doesn't blow up immediately.Somebody buy my turbo kit so I can get my f-in rods!

[r34 gtr]

Seriously? The first one? Man, Ive had to rebuild my CA three times now. With the other engines Ive rebuilt the total comes to something like a baker's dozen - and I'm only 21!

[themadscientist]

I've been lucky. In all the years of beating on engines and racing around I have never had a catastophic failure, just two blown head gaskets.

[r34 gtr]

You lucky devil you. I am willing to bet my car sees more abuse on a regular basis than yours though. I have also rebuilt my engine a few times when it didnt really need it, but I felt like I owed it to it.

[themadscientist]

These days yes but as a young fella I lived on the road from 10pm till 1AM most nights and I wasn't drinking tea and chatting about the weather.

I try to be very conservative with my tuning and the two failures can be directly traced to going to far and not listening to myself. I blew a 14-year old L20 pushing 21psi on the factory turbo and fuel system. The CA popped again with the factory fuel system and too much boost.

When this current motor is fired up I will be turning up the wick painfully slow because if I grenade a couple of grand in parts and labor I might have to be put on suicide watch.

[r34 gtr]

Ha! Mine has blown from running out of oil, and being overheated, and owner negligence. I can explain every one, but its not worth the time. You mind telling me what the bore/stroke is going to be on this beast? at least in theory? You know youll have to run a much bigger turbo with this or I will sneak into your home and smother you.

[themadscientist]

there is a 50/50 chance I will need two oil supply lines. It will depend on how much clearance I have.

[r34 gtr]

Awesome! Using the oil pump from the new block I presume? I hope its up to the task. You could always have a custom pan made and go dry sump. Oh how that would rule.

[themadscientist]

I really should put up a pic of the oil pan, it's indescribable. I will be pounding out a pan with as much extra capacity as I can via kickouts, with reversion baffles and a skidplate. The oil pump shoud be fine, it's not a weak link like RBs and turbos don't really need that much oil anyway. Just a T in the block supply hole, two lines and two drainbacks in the pan that is already getting worked over.Extremely tenative but the manifold and limited space would really be the only thing holding me back. I have a pair of turbos that would work, not so sure about the 8cm housings, they use those on RB26s.

[r34 gtr]

My friend is running a 20g with the 8cm housing on his wrx and its spooled all the way by about 3500rpm. You'll be fine. Which manifold are you having space issues with? You have no room to complain about exhaust manifold room, leave that for us LHD kids.

[themadscientist]

yeah but I am talking about two 8cm housings. Clearance for one turbo is easy, two will be difficult especially if I retain the power steering and AC which i intend to do. I will drop the stripped block and head in if it doesn't rain tomorrow and see if there is enough space for these bishez.zerofile/27622/x4.jpghttp://forums.nico ... 620/x8.jpg

[r34 gtr]

Uhm, really bada$s, but why? Its only a 2l...

[themadscientist]

because I can.

Seriously, I think twins from a performance standpoint make absolutely no sense on a four cylinder. Something like this is doable for only two reasons; 1. I have them already and my FJ project is backburnered for at least five years and my other mystery motor evan longer.2. The "holy ****!" factor. I like strange things and this motor from pan to cover is definately that. Why not an odd turbo system?

I am trying to sell the turbos locally to RB26 users for scratch but if nobody bites I might as well use them.

Like I said it's 50/50. I have two viable single turbos I could use instead which are infinately more logical choices but compared to this would be pedestrian. besides why should the SR guys have all the fun!

[themadscientist]

better pics of the set I have languishing on the shelf.

Here the nighmare oil pan that was bolted to the block I will be using. Freaky ain't it?

I will probably hack it up for bits to make the kickouts on the new pan.

[r34 gtr]

Wow, you werent kidding, that is one freaky oil pan. What about the manifold though, will it bolt up to the euro ca18 head or are you going to have to re-flange it or something? I assume its at least close to fitting or you wouldnt be using it.

I think one could argue the use of twins on a four cylinder, but only on a STI 2.5l four (or porsche or something), where youve got two separate banks of cylinders. On an inline four its just kind of ridiculous.

I would love to take one of those 18g's off your hands, but alas I have no money. Maybe later on this year when ive pulled in some serious paychecks I can afford one...

[themadscientist]

One would be an awesome turbo for a CA18 but I won't split the pair. I am hoping a local GT-R owner will buy them and save me from myself.

[r34 gtr]

Haha, theres no way I could justify buying a turbo off you even if I had the money. Theres so much else my car needs first, especially seeing as the turbo thats on there is in top form. And why would you need saving from yourself? Youve done a up to par job so far! Ahahaha! Seriously though, hurry up and finish this engine so I can laugh when it sends a piston through the head.

[themadscientist]

well. I stuck the block and head in to see if there is enough clearance for the turbos. There is even with the AC and power steering pumps in place!



I would slide them back further if I did it. They are sitting on a cinder block and I can't position them perfect.



This will be a 2 liter when I am done, 1997ccs. That will help but all the twin turbo SRs and FJs I have seen are 2.2 liters. If it works but is peaky and not bringing the compressors up to speed I can always step down to the 6cm housings when I get the cash. Greddy uses 8cm housings on the RB26 kit but I don't know what kind of response it has.



I have two other full kits I could use if it doesn't works so it would be fun to try. The turbo setup I go with will not affect any of the decisions and work I do to the engine so no harm no foul. Back to work though, I'll get some cardboard and mock up the pan kickouts now.

[r34 gtr]

1997cc, that is one proper two liter! pooh looks a little rusty in places, you need to go take care of that while the engine is out. Cinderblock powa!!

[themadscientist]

big sump mock up done. As you can see this should add close to a full quart of additional oil capacity.



There was virtually no space, scratch that, no space on the hot side of the motor for an expanded sump.

I have lost no ground clearance and if I choose I can take the roof of the sump higher up the side of the pan.

Regarding the interchangeability of manifolds between the 8-port and 4-port heads the exhaust manifold bolts to both. The intake requires the appropriate injector and thermostat housing but the plenum will bolt to either.

[r34 gtr]

Whoa, whoa, WHOA. Do I see the words "Awesome Carboy" in the rear deck of that r30? Correct me if I am wrong, but thats how she looks. The oil pan looks good, but are you going to extend the oil pickup to make use of the extra volume? I would hope so. Or does the new oil pump poke down farther? And are yuo going to be running two sets of injectors still?

[themadscientist]

"lonesome carboy" It was there when I got the car. I don't know, the Japanese put some stupid English on their cars. Kind of like guys with kanji all over their civics.

I will fad the sump, cut the pan and get it welded on. Then I will look at where the pickup is and if it is good leave it, if not fab one that locates in a better spot. I will then build baffles in the sump with one-way trap doors around the pickup to make sure it is always submerged.

No subs this time. I will use four 1600cc main injectors.

[r34 gtr]

Haha, so long as it included the word "Carboy" its fine with me. 1600cc/min injectors are pretty huge man, this isnt an rx-7. I hope you will use that fuel, and not scale it back a whole lot. I'll send you a gigantic holset turbo if itll help.

[themadscientist]

1200s are what I can reasonably use but the 1600s are only a few dollars more. My freind is running four 1600s on his FC and it purrs like kitten; a 700hp kitten with tubs and a turbo the size of a basketball! He also has an Electromotive and a hell of a lot more skill than me. I could see breaking the motor in with 550s and very low boost and when it is ready and the maps are fully worked dropping in the big firehoses and actually allowing whatever turbo(s) I have start to crank up and just adjust the established maps to compensate. I still think twins are stupid but the more I research it the more I see people really kicking people in the teeth for even suggesting it. The more I think about it the more I want to do it for all those dreamers who didn't have the money or resources to try. If I could make it work even slightly well I would consider it a victory and when someone asks again rather than speculation and theory I can tell them from experience what the pitfalls are and what they can expect. I expect a lot of hours of phasing cams and staring at my laptop trying to see positive manifold pressure but that's fine, I am out to have fun not be the fastest. The only thing I do not want to deal with is cracking manifolds, that pisses me off. If I do this I will use thick tubing and have a talented TIG guy put it together in a seriously stiff jig with lots of bracing and the downpipes with have flex couplers. I'll pull and rebuild blown turbos but yanking a manifold one a month for rewelding is bull****.