how to set up s14 for road racing

[Ls1pwr]

95 s14 just got it, but i plan to strip it and set it up for some road course work. i eventually plan to have an ls1 thrown in here. i'm coming from an F-body so i know nothing about the 240 suspension other then it has alot of potentiali want to run 275's all around and use the car on the weekends. so can anyone reccomend some coilovers or whatever else i'd need to be competitive with corvettes porsche's etc ???

[sr20goofus]

275's with teh right offset and spacing can fit and be completely useable with no issues as long as you run fender flares or wide body panels. I plan to run this setup, but not until the 225's i ahve now arnt enough. Dont jump right into a super wide tire with major grip if you dont know how to use a smaller setup good enough on track.

Suspension, anycoilover is a HUGE upgrade over stock, Buddy Club Racing Spec dampeners are my preferred choice and they get great track reviews from all the track guys i know with them.

The Ls1 would be a great choice, low end torque lots of power, just be sure to mount it all correctly, and i think your rear tires are goin to have to be in the 315 range to handle the power from the LS1. Overall you have the right idea for what ya want, but take it one or two mods at a time. This way you get alot of track experienc and you know what teh car can handle and your experience grows with the cars setup. This is the exact reason i have only run Falken Azenis and a since upgraded spring and shock setup with 250whp at all my trck events till this year, so i could get used to teh car and eventually NEED the upgraded tires i have now (Hoosier S04's 225/45R15), suspension over the winter break then i just need to play with camber setups.

good idea thow ith teh grip racing , most people dont even know what they are missing out on, especially once you start passing EVO's, Porsche's, Vett's, and WRX's.

[Ls1pwr]

i have a done a few track events in a c5 zo6 with 295's out back and 275's up front, so i am used to cars that grip pretty good and i dont think i'll have to much trouble adjusting to a 240, i dont know why more ppl dont road race these beasts, they are almost 50/50 they weight sub 2800 lbs when prepped, and they have a huge engine bay. sounds like great place to start oh and they are cheap and abundant. i'm loving this car more and more!! so 275's all around with fender flares, i dont give a **** what it looks like as long as it runs like a raped ape, buddyclub coilovers, how is the chassis rigidity in these cars when run on sticky tires? swaybars? anti roll bars? what is needed to create a track beast?

[sr20goofus]

i have a done a few track events in a c5 zo6 with 295's out back and 275's up front, so i am used to cars that grip pretty good and i dont think i'll have to much trouble adjusting to a 240, i dont know why more ppl dont road race these beasts, they are almost 50/50 they weight sub 2800 lbs when prepped, and they have a huge engine bay. sounds like great place to start oh and they are cheap and abundant. i'm loving this car more and more!! so 275's all around with fender flares, i dont give a **** what it looks like as long as it runs like a raped ape, buddyclub coilovers, how is the chassis rigidity in these cars when run on sticky tires? swaybars? anti roll bars? what is needed to create a track beast?

Prepped 240's will weight sub 2400 lbs if built correctly, the fender flare idea was so that your wheels are covered just to be a legal car. With a 6pnt cage the chasis rigidity is very good especially with a decent ront strut bar and upgraded sway bars. The coilovers are driver choice, Buddy Clubs are because they have been in road racing for a long time with great results. Adjustable suspension links should be used to dial in proper camber settings. With R-comps teh 240 does very well, not many are raced with alot of power, none competatively actually. They can run very quick track times tho with the right power and grip to match it. 240's are really light when prepped right, so with a corvette engine there will be lots of torque same as teh vett, just a mugh lighter car so more tire will be needed,

[DanS]

This is just the sort of stuff that I am looking for.

I sold my last car due to it simply not having the DNA that I want in a driver that I can track and beat upon in brutal ways. To these ends I am strongly considering an S14 due to its geometry, light weight and decent aftermarket support.

I am blessed to have access to a great many folks who know their craft and would be willing to talk to the chasis guy from the rally team I work with and get him to disect the S14 geometry and come up with some thoughts on putting together a killer track setup.

From what I know now, I think that the quality of the tire will have a great deal more to do with track ability than the cross section of the tire. A set of R compound 225s will eat a set of performance 275s and we may or may not be able to find wider tires in the perfect sizes.

I also tend to think that balance is a huge part of going fast. Getting the tires to work with the brakes to work with the dampers to work with the chasis to work with the transmission to work with the power is what its all about. Don't forget fun items like wicked fast steering racks and keeping the whole thing from melting down in the 19th min of your 5th 20 min session on a hot July day either.

I know that while my last car was just a ton of fun and wonderful in its way, I want something more. mAybe by putting our heads together we can do some wild things on a budget and turn some heads at the same time... thoughts?

[corey240]

definatly upgrade the sway bars i just took the rear one off my 96 and its stock and is like a quarter the size of the ones on my 98 which are whitelines.

[kognition]

Just finished my first Redline Time Attack at B.W. this weekend. This car had been a 2 year project, as i had to buy a house first which took priority. I loved itand it really ignites a spark in you to improve the car even more. It has incredible potential obviously. The JIC S15 again took all the wins this weekend with nearly a 10 second lead over the next fastest car! I am stock internals, Tomei exhaust mani and down pipe, Braille battery, the simple things i could do for quick results. 6 point cage, RUCA's, control arms etc. Hoosier R-1's , Gram Lites and a stripped out cabin save for my custom 2lb carbon composite dash. Made the sunroof delete to get rid of the sunroof track system (25lb's there). Made the carbon doors (5lbs ea.) which replaced the 60lb stock door. That took 110 lb's off the car right there. Speed glass all around, 4lb carbon trunk lid. Lots of potential as i said. And i am seriously considering getting a roof clip to make a mold for a carbon roof to take probably another 100 to 150lb's off the car. Since i have a nic 6 point cage, that wouldn't be much of a safety issue.

[sr20goofus]

POST MORE CAGE PICS!!!!

or general build pics please

[sensibleS13driver]

beautiful car

[Joe]

275's with teh right offset and spacing can fit and be completely useable with no issues as long as you run fender flares or wide body panels. I plan to run this setup, but not until the 225's i ahve now arnt enough. Dont jump right into a super wide tire with major grip if you dont know how to use a smaller setup good enough on track.

you can squeeze a 275 under a S14 without having to do more than a little pulling of the fenders.

no overfenders or widebody needed.

and the S chassis is an amazing platform for road racing. i have a friend who consistently has nearly the fastest times at any time attack he has entered. its just a bland 300whp SR and a GREAT setup and GREAT driver.

[sr20goofus]

i know the S14's have alot more room than the S13's for big tires....

and ive seen two S14's apparently both owned by the same guy on the west coast that does alot of TA's, look sgood, and ive heard nothign but good news about his driving also.

for the S13's we need overfenders or aftermarket flares to fit the wide tires, we can get 275 up front with aftermarket flares...and a 305 out back as well with the right sizing of wheels, its a tuffy tho.

[DuckyD]

Quote »you can squeeze a 275 under a S14 without having to do more than a little pulling of the fenders.[/quote]I had 18x9.5 +35, spring/strut combo, running 275's and I didn't have to pull the fenders, I just hard to roll the "tab" on the inside of the fender. I was also running 3* negative camber though.

As far as time attacks go, your best bet is seat time. Too many people spend $1000's on their car before even going to a track. The Full-Race time attack car is a good example of doing more with less. They have a pretty mildly tuned SR w/ GT28RS and stock suspension arms.

[Joe]

thats my buddy i was talking about

his name is brady. people fear him

[Bubba1]

POST MORE CAGE PICS!!!!

or general build pics please

I was thinking the same thing. Nice looking ride.

[a_ahmed]

Keep this thread updated, i hope for more people to get involved with time attack with the s chassis, especially s13 since i have an s13 hehe. Can't wait till spring, its snowing like crazy in canada still

[Shift_Kouki]

My biggest problem with getting into road racing right now with my S 14 is that there seems to be no real series for it like the American Iron and Honda Challenge series'. Without a group to run in... Its all on our own dime, and any sponsorship is all but out of the question. Or at least thats the general story i get from my buddies who actually have gotten out to road race and have dedicated track cars.

Of course, I am only starting to get into this (stock autox for now) and have not done any HPDE things yet, although its high on the goals i have with the car.

[sr20goofus]

My biggest problem with getting into road racing right now with my S 14 is that there seems to be no real series for it like the American Iron and Honda Challenge series'. Without a group to run in... Its all on our own dime, and any sponsorship is all but out of the question. Or at least thats the general story i get from my buddies who actually have gotten out to road race and have dedicated track cars.

Of course, I am only starting to get into this (stock autox for now) and have not done any HPDE things yet, although its high on the goals i have with the car.

there used to be SE-R Cup where 240's could roll with sentras and G20's with stock KA, then there was SE-R CUp SRX which is where 240's with SR's and turbo sentras and such would roll, both of those classes are now rolled into PT (Performance Touring) and ST (Super Touring) build your car to fit in a class you want to run in, these new classes means you run with everything from Neon's to Porsche's, depending who else qualifys for your class.

you dont have tp aim for w2w to do road racing, many people get to instructor level and just go with that, just a much track time, just no competition.

As for money, NONE of these series pay you back even close to what you spendo n track time, car maintenance, tires, brake pads, etc....if they even pay money back for podium finishes at all. If you want sponsores, go get them, they are not going to find you at a NASA event or anythign of the sort, if you can get their name out there, they will agree to some small compinsation im sure, btu it wont be much...pennies by comparison.

[belowme MI]

275 all around is STUPID!!!! Unless you drive a hummer. I'm using 225-front & 245-rear (azenis ST-615) love'em I autocross & track me full weight S14 240sx.that full race car is nice....But that car suits him. What's good for one may not be good for another. I have fully done my suspension. I started with the nismo power brace...Then Tein coil-overs (you get what you pay for) I guess it all depends. I have a little more done to my car then the full race S14. The only thing that is holding me back is that I live in Michigan!

[Joe]

275 all around is STUPID!!!! Unless you drive a hummer. I'm using 225-front & 245-rear (azenis ST-615) love'em I autocross & track me full weight S14 240sx.that full race car is nice....But that car suits him. What's good for one may not be good for another. I have fully done my suspension. I started with the nismo power brace...Then Tein coil-overs (you get what you pay for) I guess it all depends. I have a little more done to my car then the full race S14. The only thing that is holding me back is that I live in Michigan!

um why is it stupid?

please tell me why more tire (width) is a bad thing.

p.s. his car is in the newest issue of Dsport go check it out because somehow i doubt your car "has a little more done" than his.

[belowme MI]

WELL.....I like 225's for turning angle! Blah,blah,blah I have the issuse of DsportI know what I have more then that. And I don't care to argue with you!!!I have better things to do....So think what ever you want to!

[Joe]

more turning angle? the only way tire size would have any affect on angle is if the tires rub.

im just curious where you are pulling this stuff from.

[belowme MI]

The 225's dont rub on my inner fenders (front)

[Joe]

and neither do 275s!

thats my point!

[DuckyD]

belowme MI is a moron. Plain and simple.

Just for the record, he does have flared front fenders to accomodate his 275's. I imagine that he can go lock-to-lock with no rubbing issues. And don't blame your lack of road-racing on your location. I could see that being the case if you lived in Alaska... but not Michigan, you would just have to do a little bit of traveling. Finally, a power-brace and Tein coilovers (didn't mention which) doesn't mean your suspension is "fully done".

I think that too many 240sx owners want to have a "time attack" car, without ever actually putting their car on a single track. Your best money spent will be seat-time, which they even say over on the Fresh-Alloy thread. Their driver has been doing time attacks and track events for years.

Edit: For the record, I have 245 tires on a set of 350Z rims (+30 offset) and I have no rubbing issues either. That's even with Tein tie-rods with spacers.

[BMAR240SX]

for the S13's we need overfenders or aftermarket flares to fit the wide tires, we can get 275 up front with aftermarket flares...and a 305 out back as well with the right sizing of wheels, its a tuffy tho.

Whats the best size to be able to go with out having to do little to no fender pull?

[sr20goofus]

Whats the best size to be able to go with out having to do little to no fender pull?

with a wide fender i knoe 255 up front are pushing you luck, thats on a NASA SRX race car i work on. It is possible to pull front fenders and still fit a 245 up front with some negative camber i believe, havnt done it personally tho. Your best bet for this info is over on nicoclub.com, do some searching over there, all the info you will ever need is there without even asking anyone.

As far as this other conversation going on goes, if you think 275 series all around is stupid, and a 225 up front for "turning angle" is better you obvisouly havnt been on track and actually push a car before, im sure teh reasoning behind having 275 on all 4 corners is for ease of rotating tires to make them all last longer. And because the 275 race tires the Full Race guy uses are extreamly grippy, wider = better as long as you have the power to push the extra weight and the brakes to slow them down properly.

A "fully done" suspension would be good coilovers, not Tein, all suspension arms and bushings upgraded and the suspension tuned (Camber, caster, toe, height, corner balanced), not just installed. I have traveled up to 8 hours to get to a HPDE before, location shouldnt matter for anything, if you really wanted to do track events you would drive to them im sure others from michigan make the effort the only place for the blame is on the owner of the car not the location of the tracks.

For the record the S14 Full Race TA car only has a Full Race manifold, gt2871r turbo, coilovers, 17x9 wheels, 275 Slicks, cage and seats, hardly anything else done, very basic and very competative with the right driver. You could have TONS more mods then that car and probobly do nothing on track except watch it pull away form you because mosd dont make the car go fast, the driver does.

Now everybody stop arguing and go to the track already, i know thats where i go to see what my car is capable of, not the forums to brag about how it sits around lookin pretty with its cool bolt on parts.

[DuckyD]

In the thread, he mentions that he used 275's because that's what he had laying around, no other reason

[sr20goofus]

In the thread, he mentions that he used 275's because that's what he had laying around, no other reason

that will work also... , the only reason i buy used 16" hoosiers is because i have 2 free sets of 16x8 wheels....

[autox615]

just to let you know from personal expeierence. The rear strut bar makes a way bigger differerence than the front and makes the car feel totally different. I would highly reccomend you get one if your concerned about chassis ridigty.

[sr20goofus]

the sway bar issues have been beat to death all over these forums.

rumor from an old ITA 240sx KA racer was that less rear sway helped keep traction in the rear, when you make the car (chassis+susp.) too stiff it looses ability to grip. He went the cheap rout at first and removed the rear sway bar and kept front stock. Then he upgraded the front to a larger aftermarket one, and added the stock rear. This method of modification leads you to get used to the car good grip, then once you add the rear and upgrade the front you adjust to that setup inturn inhancing you learnign curve with the car.