Dont kick me off here, but......

[FrEaK]

lol nah i'm still in a relatively good mood

[GEOFF]

That is a nice looking 300z pcbootlegger has there. I found that my '83 280zx was quicker than first gen 300z. Also top end on '83 280z was nearly 140 mph and 125 for the '85 300. My '80 280zx was quicker than my '83, but topped out at 125 mph. The '87 300zx turbo was an absolute rocket. OK, enough Nissan talk here.

[nlzmo400r]

i dont want to ever hear that last sentence out of your mouth again young man!!< haha, never enough nissan talk bro, but yes, i hear the old turbo's were absolute rockets, i want to drive a new 35o!!

[Aztek72]

As quoted from Road and Track:

"However, at the track we discovered that the Lexus leaves the line more efficiently than the Infiniti, the latter launching with slightly less engine speed. Still, the fact that the LS outran the Q to the 60-mph mark, albeit by only a tenth of a second (6.4 and 6.5, respectively), caught us by surprise. Why? Because not only is the Q45 about 80 lb. lighter than the LS 430, its 32-valve 4.5-liter V-8 — equipped with Nissan’s version of variable valve timing — is more powerful than the Lexus’ 32-valve 4.3-liter VVTi-equipped V-8. The Infiniti produces 340 bhp at 6400 rpm and 333 lb.-ft. of torque at 4000, while the Lexus generates 290 bhp at 5600 rpm and 320 lb.-ft. of torque at 3400. So what gives? We can only deduce that the LS 430’s more aggressive launch character and its sportier gear ratios were making up for the differences in weight and power."

Numbers don't lie.

[Aztek72]

The point is, even after regearing the car is more than a half second slower than the originally claimed. You'd expect a corporation of Nissan's ilk to fully test and give the public, potential buyers, the correct numbers and specs before doling out their flagship sedan.

I still stand by my original statements that the original Infiniti press releases touted the car as being capable of 5.2 seconds.

My opinion doesn't matter anyway. The public has spoken, the verdict is in and just looking at the numbers alone, the LS400 wipes its arse with the new Q.

My first impulse is to accuse some of you guys here for blatant fanboyism, but I do recognize that this is an Infiniti forum, so it figures.

Don't think I'm a Nissan basher by any means, I'm a huge supporter of the company. I just feel that I'm entitled to criticize when I see wrong.

[PalmerWMD]

I am curious you quote that R7T write-up, because it's consistent with what I wrote, and it most certainly is not "optimistic getting hi 6's", therefore not consistent with what you wrote, thanks for helping me out.

Fred...

[nlzmo400r]

ill let fred handle this one, as he knows more about the Qs and such than i do, but u do have good points, however as far as o-6o times alone, there could have been many varialbes, tire types, tire pressure, gear rations, suspension set up etc

[Aztek72]

Ahem,You may wish to refresh your memory then..

In other words: If you dont know what your talking about, I rather have you <not> post, rather than make stuff up, just to support your "arguement"!

Our standards, are a bit higher than that, here.

Fred..

Seems your a bit sensitive to seeing Infiniti get criticized for 'lying' to the public?

Look buddy, I don't know so try not letting a stranger get under your skin so much, it's not personal (did I even do anything wrong?).

I was a member of the old Yahoo forum since LS400 founded the site and have introduced other friends ie Sopdadope, GeeQ and Billyjeanz2001 but hey, they're no longer members of these boards and neither am I. Chou folks!

[PalmerWMD]

1)The point is, even after regearing the car is more than a half second slower than the originally claimed. You'd expect a corporation of Nissan's ilk to fully test and give the public, potential buyers, the correct numbers and specs before doling out their flagship sedan.

2)I still stand by my original statements that the original Infiniti press releases touted the car as being capable of 5.2 seconds.

3)My opinion doesn't matter anyway. The public has spoken, the verdict is in and just looking at the numbers alone, the LS400 wipes its arse with the new Q.

4)My first impulse is to accuse some of you guys here for blatant fanboyism, but I do recognize that this is an Infiniti forum, so it figures.

5)Don't think I'm a Nissan basher by any means, I'm a huge supporter of the company. I just feel that I'm entitled to criticize when I see wrong.

1) ALL the testnumbers quoted were for the 2k2.The higher rear diff, wasnt used until 2k3 model year, a fact clealry evident to all that stay informed of such things.2) Your' wrong, I cant believe your not backpedaling from that one.3) It is a fallacy to infer that a car that sells better" wipes its arse" with, another that doesn't.4) Just sticking to fact+ cvommon sense5) Your're not, your just playing fast and loose w/ numbers to save face.

Fred....:rolleyes

[garyb]

The best summary of the difference between an Infiniti and a Lexus that I ever heard is this, "you drive an Infiniti while you ride in a Lexus". My 1992 Q45 with all the Stillen goodies bears that out.

[PalmerWMD]

1)Seems your a bit sensitive to seeing Infiniti get criticized for 'lying' to the public? 2)Look buddy, I don't know so try not letting a stranger get under your skin so much, it's not personal (did I even do anything wrong?). I was a member of the old Yahoo forum since LS400

1) They are not the ones, doing the misrepresentations aztek72....

2) You're not a stranger, I remember your screenname very well from the old yahooclub, and the memories are not fond ones..

Fred....

[nlzmo400r]

The best summary of the difference between an Infiniti and a Lexus that I ever heard is this, "you drive an Infiniti while you ride in a Lexus". My 1992 Q45 with all the Stillen goodies bears that out.

wel didnt u just pick the wrong forum to walk into, haha, welcome to NICO man, i hope u find everyone here very informative and helpful, as u can see, fred knows pretty much anyhitng aobut Qs, so if u have a question, ask him and he'll probalby give u 3 answers, hope u enjoy it here, and stick around

edit: sorry for the lil argument on this particular thread, it isnt usually like this

[maxnix]

Well, for the record, I have never seen that 5.2 seconds to 60 mph claim in the last 14 years of reading a lot of automotive publications. I think the most optimistic was sub six seconds, which can be done on the right surface, temperature and altitude.

I have followed 2002 Q45s, and they are quite quick, especially for a naturally aspirated 2 ton car.

[SmithSR]

My first impulse is to accuse some of you guys here for blatant fanboyism, but I do recognize that this is an Infiniti forum, so it figures.

I'm guilty of "fanboyism"

I've been lucky enough to see two new Q's in two days. A rare bird in these parts if I may say so. A beautiful machine. Numbers are often slanted to sell product/bring publicity. IF this was the case, even though Fred has shown why you are wrong, would this be any different than nearly ANY car maker looking to generate some buzz about a model they want to push?

Just a novice opinion from a Q "fanboy"

[Chally]

Hey, did someone see a pacifier (dummy) fly past??? (we call them dummies in Australia) Good spit Aztec!

Aztek, if you're still around, I have been reading as much info on the Q's as possible, & I have never seen the figure 5.2secs. It's always been 5.9! Why don't you scan the figures & post them here, then others would have no argument...

As for Road & Track, & another magazine, we have to believe what the got. If the guy didn't like the Q, he wouldn't have tried his hardest to get the best figure. I know that sounds a bit crazy, be we had a certain mag in Australia, that consistently had Toyota's beating ANY Nissan at any time, but, when you lined them up on the street, the Nissan ALWAYS flogged the Toyota. We always suspected there was some incentive for the writers to make the Toyota look better, so the public would buy their products.

One Glaring load of crap, was where a V8 Magazine tested the Best Holden V8 (GM) against the new Turbo 3L six Holden, (RB30ET) that had the Nissan engine, & according to them, the V8 beat the 6 turbo at every turn. Well, I worked for Holden, at the time, & we could keep up or beat the V8 in a NON turbo 6, especially at higher speeds, but when you got in the Turbo, the V8 had no idea where you went. The Turbo 6 ended up being the Pursuit Vehicles for the State Police.

So to just believe one magazine & build your argument around it, is less than sensible.

We argue strongly for our Q's, because we have found them superior in many ways, than the Lex, consistently, but we do use the Average figures, when talking sensibly, or use the Best figures when we are boasting. We like to Boast, occasionally.

[Aztek72]

1) They are not the ones, doing the misrepresentations aztek72.

2) You're not a stranger, I remember your screenname very well from the old yahooclub, and the memories are not fond ones.

Fred....

I was just going to throw in the white flag but if you want to drag this out, I'm all for it!

1. Misinterpretations? You know as well as I know Infiniti claimed the 2002 Q45 to be much faster than it really was. 5.9 and even 5.7 60 from a dead dig were originally claimed. I AM still sticking to my guns that Infiniti was shooting for a 5.2 sec 0-60. If I'm wrong, so what? That car was still more THAN HALF A SECOND slower than it was supposed to be.

If anyone follows Car and Drivers test practices, they would know that all acceleration tests are performed on a stretch of road that degrades ever so slightly. Now would that make a world of difference probably not, but I don't have the scientific equipment to prove it. Is it enough to taint the over numbers, sure as hell is. Just look at all acceleration tests and examine how they're 0-60 and 1/4 mile times are always slightly faster than Road and Track and Automobile mag.

Those Car and Driver numbers are the cream of the crop, other magazines results varied, some were as high 6.9 seconds.

Still the point is, Infiniti claimed 5.9 seconds and they couldn't backpedal, claiming it was a tb problem, valves, engine not being broken in, etc.

The fact is Nissan didn't fulfill its promise of offering the Q as a quantum leap over its competitors in terms of performance yet is outmuscled and outcornered by the LS430, a car that never even claimed sportiness as a strong suit. EVEN Q45Tech would agree with me.

If GM claimed the Z06 was capable of 0-60 in 4.7, it had better not be 5.7 or 5.1 one year and gear changes later. It might not be a big deal to some, by to me, that's an outrage. Business practices such as these have gotten Infiniti into hotwater as it did another once beloved, japanese giant= SEGA. Customers and loyal supporters were tired of buying product that wasn't quite capable of what it claimed, getting shafted by the lack of product support which therein lead to horrible resale values, etc.

If you were to ask me to produce a totally unbiased opinion regarding to which was a better car= LS430 or Q45. The answer is simple, the LS is a much better car in almost every aspect: it's quicker, more sporty, has better build quality and doesn't have any gimmicky electronics. Styling is boring but Lexus stuck to what's tried and true and didn't try anything bold only to fall on its face. Many Infiniti folks such as myself think the Q is flat-out ugly.

Another area in which Lexus WIPES ITS *** with Infiniti- customer service. I originally bought my '91 Q45 in 1994. Going against the grain, popular opinion and advice of all my friends, I was determined to buy the deal of decade= a BMW like sedan with Japanese realibility. I faced staunch opposition and felt as though it were my duty to educate people on what a Q was and what it was capable of. I loved my Q and didn't give a damn what people thought. Years after years of taking it into the shop for service taxed my wallet and me. Not only was I legally robbed trying to upkeep the car but spit on, spat on by customer service. In those years, I had went to a total of EIGHT dealerships and received UNsatisfactory service at each and everyone. Once, we I contacted a dealership in CT giving them a list of things I needed to BUY to convert the active suspension system I was basically LAUGHED out of the dealership, with one of the techs scoffing "like YOU can *****ing do that, you *****ing loser" in front of MYSELF AND MY DAUGHTER!!!! These guys humiliated me in front of my five year old daughter!!!!!!!! Calls and letters to Infiniti corporate have done little as others consistently complain about the bad service.

I know many of you have felt the same way, shelling out big bucks and basically getting walked all over by Infiniti dealers. There are more bad dealerships than there are decent ones. Its easy to see why so many people do their own work on their cars.

It's almost heartbraking to know that even to this day I love my Q and still support the corporation that has left me to dry.

I've taken the wife's LS400 to the Lexus dealers in NH and it was refreshing to be treated like I mattered to them. This Q45 is THE last infiniti I will ever own.

So again, back to the topic. Lexus vs. Infiniti. You already know what my choice is.

[Aztek72]

By the way Fred, it's good to see old faces and I like what you've done here but as I said, I don't have buddies here anymore so, wish granted, you won't be seeing me anymore.

[PalmerWMD]

I was probably a bit too harsh, which is usually not how I operate.I assumed the worst when it was probably just an honest mistake on your part..To be honest, i still have some hard feelings left over from that one incident, back in the yahoo days.....Hence the take no prisoners 'tude.

Fred..

Anyone who still loves his Q after all that deserves respect.

[nlzmo400r]

well i still dont see how u say 'im AM stillsticking to my guns and saying that Infiniti was 'SHOOTING' for 5.2 sec. o-6o', i thought u said Infiniti SAID it WILL DO O-6O IN 5.2 SECONDS??

[Aztek72]

well i still dont see how u say 'im AM stillsticking to my guns and saying that Infiniti was 'SHOOTING' for 5.2 sec. o-6o', i thought u said Infiniti SAID it WILL DO O-6O IN 5.2 SECONDS??

What difference does it make? I know, Sopdadope knows and others know that the car was claimed to run 5.7seconds (officially)and earlier on, 5.2 seconds which I know I still have to generate evidence for.

This argument is null and void, I've stated why I think Lexus is the better of the two.

Fred, don't feel too bad. I've made some really good friends over at Yahoo and I know had we talked more, we'd be good buddies. You're an awesome guy and you're just doing what you have to do, making sure this site and the members are in check. About the past yahoo club incidents, I have a feeling I know what it is. I just have two things to say about that- 1) you're very passionate about some things and I just hope you understand not everyone will always agree with you BUT just the fact that you've made your opinions and feelings clear is winning half the battle. Again, you're a good guy. I just have a strong love/true hatred for Infiniti sometimes, I don't have anything positive to say about the company. Tom....OUT.

[nlzmo400r]

well you've made your point, and for the most part its opinion, but i understand your perspective, but im a big numbers guy, and i didnt see proof of htis 5.2 stuff, so i was very skeptical, didnt mean to offend you or anything tho man

[Chally]

I must agree with Aztec as to how Nissan in general treats customers. It seems like a world-wide problem. Here, down under, you could always expect crap from the big bosses in Nissan. I rang head office once, & I should have rang day care, I would have got better service.

That aside, the 94 Q is built as good as, if not better, than the 94 Lex. This is what the thread is supposed to be about.

As far as the latest ones, I think the jury is still out on which is the best, & only time will tell. My money is again on the Q.

[jEzTeR]

I must be lucky to recieve good service at both the Nissan and Infiniti dealership that I use.I had some problems with one place the found the one I use now.For you to have had bad luck/service from 8 places thats terrible.I can only hope that you keep some love for the Nissan/Infiniti.:xfingers

[szh]

I have also received great service from the local Infiniti dealer where I bought both my Q's from: Frontier infiniti in San Jose, CA. From Day One!

Only time I had any difficulty was with one new service rep, who always ended his discussion with "well, we will check to see if the warranty covers it or not" and irritated the heck out of me. The third time he did that, I said loudly that I was not interested in his checking anything - the warranty had better cover whatever was wrong, period. He was gone in a few months. Before and after that, no troubles at all!

Z

[nlzmo400r]

way to set em straight , sometime they want to give u that damn runarouund

[elwesso]

Thats terrible! Over at my cadillacforums, we have been having discussions on how bad the cadillac service is..... But I guess sometimes other companies can be worse......

What seems weird is you drop 30-50k on a new infiniti, and they dont want to take care of you!! Every dealer should treat you like you are their most valued customer!! And unfortunately, the bigwigs at Infiniti havent realized that...... Lexus, on the other hand, has...... I dont care how good a certain car is, if the service sucks all around, they will go somewhere else, even if the car is not as good........

For instance, we have had only good things to say about GM service........ I really dont know how the dealers stand my grandparents.... They have a 95 fleetwood brougham, and are INSISTANT about keeping in perfect shape, no matter the cost.... They have taken it in several times for a "rattling door", and they dealers dont know whats going on, because it is just the leather on the door rubbing up against the dash!!!! But still, they continue to bring it back!

If you take care of your customers, they will come back, regardless (to a certain degree) of the product...

[elwesso]

By the way, i was referring to aztecks post!

[szh]

Oh, other than that one service rep - who I only saw three times - service at Frontier has been excellent! The rep I deal with (William Perry) for the past few years takes the time to listen to me and does not give me the run-around. He has been helpful in working around the idiocies of the long-term warranty company when they wouldn't meet their obligations. And also working with me when I get parts from elsewhere and ask them to do the work (like the recent I-Rotors rotors I had them install).

Z

[szh]

I know of two people who have had excellent luck dealing with Infiniti headquarters too. Me and my boss.

In my 1991Q, after the warranty expired, I paid for two broken window regulators (parts and labor) that broke about a year apart. Then when the third one went - in about another six month period, I argued that this was a faulty design and wanted it changed at no cost. Marty Wiegert at Frontier Infiniti contacted Infiniti corporate in Los Angeles, and they not only paid for the third fully (parts and labor), they refunded the parts cost of the previous two replacements. That was sufficiently fine by me!

Last year, my boss contacted Infiniti corporate inre his 1993 Q45A that developed a problem with his active suspension. I forget the exact problem, but he was able to convince them that his particular situation was a defective system, so they gave him a tremendous discount for a complete replacement of all four shocks. And this was on a nine-year old Q (at the time)!

I kinda feel that Infiniti corporate seems to want to do the right thing. If you have a correct convincing argument, without getting emotional about it, or insisting on extreme measures, they are generally willing to accommodate reasonable requests.

Z

[AZhitman]

Well, all i can say is every time I show up at Scottsdale Infiniti's service drive, i get treated like I'm one of the owners of the place...

Scottsdale ROCKS!