Dont kick me off here, but......

[Sopdadope]

I got off the phone with Tom earlier tonight. The man is a thesaurus of inner turmoil right now and he's wrestling with something few parents, unfortunately, do. I won't go into further detail as to manipulate the feelings of the members on this board but reading some of the posts on this thread has me absolutely livid.

1) I take issue with the name-calling on this thread, regardless of how subtle it is. Never, and I emphasize never did Tom resort to name-calling of any sort in this thread yet some of you folks referred to him as liar, whiner and a baby. As a matter of fact, the only negative remarks he made were against Infiniti in which he is entitled to. He gave an honest opinion in response to the very first question asked in this thread: Is Lexus better than Infiniti...? To bluntly accuse a man of lying or bending the truth is absolutely ludicrous. If you weren't a fly on the wall to witness his experiences at the dealership, you have no right to accuse an honest, hard-working, widowed father of an ailing daughter, mind you, of being a liar, period. This man has seen more drama in his life than many of us combined and that deserves some respect.

2) I also have a problem with the moderation, or lack thereof, in this particular thread. There is no consistency whatsoever. It was stated that no BS would be tolerated yet moderators turn a blind eye to members taking cheap shots at another for posting an unfavorable, albeit true in my experiences, opinion?

3) I don't care if I make myself look like an ******* with this post. I'm not going to sit idly by while one of my best friends of mine gets reamed here. It's no longer an online pissing contest, it's personal. So I'm calling out any of you that have a problem with him, you're losing points with me. My email's [email protected] so at least have the decency to sling your crap off the boards.

Lastly, for some of you out there, and you know very well who you are, congratulations on running a good guy out of NICO.

[Jesda]

I am sorry if Tom was offended, and do sincerely wish him well.

But to make things clear, unrelated personal drama has little bearing on the issue at hand. For example, the fact that I was homeless and living in a Mazda for a period of time and lost a company I built would not justify me coming to a forum and bringing up controversial numbers without evidence. What productive gain is there in doing that in a venue like this?

Thus, I sensed a vendetta on his part against the brand in general, perhaps due to some bad experiences, that skewed his perception of reality.

I think its time to close this thread.

-Jesda

[Sopdadope]

The point I was trying to make is that it's sooo easy to knock someone in an online forum due to the impersonal nature of the internet. To everyone here, Aztek72 is just some joe-schmoe troll behind a keyboard. It's harder to rip someone once you put a face and a history behind a username isn't it?

It's quite clear, there's vengeance behind his opinions but after what Infiniti's put him through, who could blame him? I used to be a die-hard Infiniti guy myself.

I agree though, this thread should be closed.

[maxnix]

It's quite clear, there's vengeance behind his opinions but after what Infiniti's put him through, who could blame him? I used to be a die-hard Infiniti guy myself.

I totally missed any ordeal visited on Tom by Infiniti.

I personally have no problem with him posting. We all need to cite references or quote accurately when we attribute facts to other sources. This is what elevates the content of Q45tech's posts above mere opinion.

No harm or ill-will is wished on anyone by the members of this board.

[szh]

Hi, Sopdadope.

I do not know either Tom or you personally, and from my posts, I hope you will agree that I did not attack Tom in a personal way. I only stated my specific positive experiences with Infiniti, in detail, to counter his statement of having had bad problems with so many Infiniti dealerships. So, I also hope that you will take my final comments here as being said in the same non-attacking way.

I just went back and re-read this entire thread - every post - to feel more comfortable about making my observations here.

1. Yes, the discussion got a tiny bit out of hand. But I feel that Tom was part of the problem too - every time that it looked like the postings had gone in the right direction, Tom would re-inflame with his comments and defensiveness. Including statements (somewhat snide, in my opinion) that no-one in an Infiniti forum would say anything bad about Infiniti, even after some people responded with knowledge and experience from ownership of both marquees.

2. It also seems to me that both of you may be making more of this than is necessary. Perhaps this is due to the personal circumstances that Tom finds himself in. If that is the case, I certainly can understand that. I apologize if this discussion has made life more difficult for him. But, if that is the case, then I think this thread heat is not the root issue at all, and other steps need to be taken to resolve whatever may be troubling him.

I wish both him and you the best. Please be very safe and careful in your travels coming up.

Z

[AZhitman]

Eloquently and efficiently said.

Well done, Z. Having just read this thread from front to back, I concur fully.

If this is what we gotta do to get a visit from Sophann, then by all means do it again. Missed you, buddy!

Actually, I'm gonna box Wes's ears for asking such a dumb question (post #1) in the first place. :beatfreak

[90Q45blue]

I wouldn't trade my Q45 in for 10 SC430's.

Nick

[Sopdadope]

I may have overreacted a bit earlier. It's just the trappings of the internet frustrates me sometimes. Tom's a real colorful character (I call him the black Howard Stern) and his sometimes over-the-top personality gets him in trouble in online forums sometimes. Playful banter can sometimes be seen as snide, condensending ranting, which I'm sure wasn't his intention. However, if you were to talk with him in person, he's actually an easy fella to get along with. Heh, if was anywhere near the ******* online, even Mother Teresa couldn't tolerate this guy.

If time permits, I'll be posting some pics of me, Aztek72, my cousin John (MaxI30t) and hopefully some fine chicas posing in front of our Nissan/Infiniti's.

:bearchug everyone.

[maxnix]

I wouldn't trade my Q45 in for 10 SC430's. - Nick

Neither would I, but my wife would. Hmmmmm...maybe I would so I could resell them and by a Q45a!

Funny thing, is this is how I found the Texas 1995 Q45. The owner had a SC430 on order. I never thought I would say it, but thank you, Lexus!

If time permits, I'll be posting some pics of me, Aztek72, my cousin John (MaxI30t) and hopefully some fine chicas posing in front of our Nissan/Infiniti's. - :bearchug everyone.

Looking forward to that, Soph. And tell Tom to come back also. Any post that contains unsubstatiaded facts is subject to harsh scrutiny, as it should be. The integrity of the board is thusly maintained. Statements identified as beliefs or unsubstantiated rumors are judged less harshly, but are also of less value for their lack of veracity.

__________________Brian1995 Q45 & Q45t

Discover the power of the button!

[AZhitman]

Ditto what Brian said.

[OLU40]

I love my Q (my first car). Lexus makes a damn good car and so does Infiniti. I actually was a LS man before the Q. However Infiniti needs to pick a direction and be gung ho about it instead of making scared incinsistent moves. How is the middle of your lineup hotter than the upper echelon 02-03 Q? Keep in mind Lexus has a KILLER LS and GS with all-wheel drive (optional) and a bigger engine possibly 5 liters. What's funny Infiniti pioneered the rear view camera before Lexus but they still get props for the RX having it like they brought it out first. Come on! The promotion and the development/design team need to step up. Infiniti need a big coupe in the lineup. A s/sl coupe killer. With the new 6 series coming out, trust me there is a need.

[OLU40]

The Germans as much as they brag on performance, are years behind in quality. If the Japanese catch up evenly as they almost are, it'll be 89 all over again.

[OLU40]

I really wanted to stay away from this but I'm a bit disappointed with how this thread's turned out. It seems like everyone's unfairly jumping on Tom.

The fact of the matter is, Infiniti services here in the Northeast usually leaves something to be desired and has sometimes been downright insulting. I've spoke with other members like Tom (aztek72) and Chad (Qship) and the general consensus is that the service here has much to be desired. For instance, I once dropped off my Q45 at Kelly Infiniti in Danvers to get the door hinges replaced, hood shocks and transmission mounts (could've done it myself but figured o what the heck). The mechanics patronized me, talking to me as if I were a two-year old child, but I let that slide. I wasn't offer a loaner car as I had usually been because they scheduling was screwed up and the minor fixes on my car didn't warrant a loaner. I bit my lip and just said "that's not problem" and subsequently waited for over two hours before a friend mine 40 miles away picked me up.

I had a similar experience to Tom at Herb Infiniti in Boston. I had given the parts guy a list of parts labeled by numbers. The parts guy however didn't agree with me and told me numerous times "You ain't gonna do it," "Can't be done," "It's not gonna work." And despite my most earnest attempts to be friendly to the guy he whispered some not too pleasant things about me to his coworker when I was on my way out. If memory serves me correct, Chad and Todd have also had sour experiences. I don't know whether to attribute to the bad treatment our owning first gen Q's or because we're all men of color but I usually give people the benefit of the doubt. Maybe that parts guy just had a death in the family or is going through a bad divorce? That's me, I'm forgiving like that. To be honest bad service is probably one of the reasons I sold my Q.

Fred, just curious but care to elaborate on what "that one incident" was? I'm just curious because as long as I've known Tom he's never said anything offensive at the old Yahoo forum. I hate to see inner turmoil here at NICO.

BTW, happy late 4th of July everyone! I'll keep you posted from the land of ancient ruins and water buffalos!

I agree. In New York they act like they are doing you a favor/ I'm one of the few New York NICO members who knows what the hell he is talking about. I would hope it is not a color issue though. They would be idiots to judge me on that. but it happens.

[OLU40]

Thanks to all you guys since the old forum for making me a semi-expert and making me proud to be an owner of a great underated car.

[AZhitman]

Olu - Long time no see!

How's your Q? Did you know we have another Q owner on board named Olu? Must be an omen or something...

[Chally]

Aztek & Sopdadope, I humbly apologise if I offended either of you.I like to shoot from the hip with facts, where possible, & I too thought aztek was a bit unreasonable with the facts, which makes me see red, especially if the person won't budge or be reasonable, hence my "Frasier" post.I do hope you can sort out any problems.

Chally

[FrEaK]

Welcome to the internet gentlemen....

This is what it's like... unfortunate yes, but thats reality.

[AZhitman]

Shut up, wanker. :beatfreak

(j/k buddy, LOL)

[PalmerWMD]

I think this thread has outlived it usefulness.

I also have nothing to add.

Fred...