Bill Maher on tax increases...

[RCA]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/huffpost/201009 ... ost/737429

[Mr1der]

wake me up when we have a flat tax.

[Poyzinous]

lol wut? greedy a-holes. that's funny.

[Dattebayo]

I just found out why people are so up in arms about taxes. I work for myself now, and I wonder why the fu*k I have to pay double SS tax because I'm my own employee... It somehow doesn't make sense.

[PoorManQ45]

Any changes in the tax rates are useless when the politicians just make it all disappear...

[Jesda]

Oh cool, populist nonsense to help cheer on the underachievers.

[D1SR240]

Taxes are part of the reason why companies outsource in the first place. IBM is building a multi-billion dollar factory in China, and part of the reason is because they're saving approximately a billion dollars in taxes alone as compared to building it in the U.S.

The government is does not efficiently spend money, there's a lot of waste. http://articles.sfgate.com/2010-09-16/n ... lus-audits
This is of course only one example, but you don't have to look far to find many others.

I say less taxes and less government spending.

[ADDirishboy]

wake me up when we have a flat tax.

[PoorManQ45]

Taxes are part of the reason why companies outsource in the first place. IBM is building a multi-billion dollar factory in China, and part of the reason is because they're saving approximately a billion dollars in taxes alone as compared to building it in the U.S.

The lack of an outsourcing tax is allowing companies to move overseas...

What? You want to move your manufacturing overseas? That's fine. Your taxes are now xx% higher!

[Jesda]

Taxes are part of the reason why companies outsource in the first place. IBM is building a multi-billion dollar factory in China, and part of the reason is because they're saving approximately a billion dollars in taxes alone as compared to building it in the U.S.

The lack of an outsourcing tax is allowing companies to move overseas...

What? You want to move your manufacturing overseas? That's fine. Your taxes are now xx% higher!

OH COOL LETS JUST MOVE OUR MNC TO ANOTHER COUNTRY ENTIRELY

[PoorManQ45]

OH COOL LETS JUST MOVE OUR MNC TO ANOTHER COUNTRY ENTIRELY

We have offered incentives to companies in other countries to sell goods in the United States.

That doesn't help the situation.

Goods manufactured outside of the USA should be taxed heavily.

[PapaSmurf2k3]

Any changes in the tax rates are useless when the politicians just make it all disappear...

+1

[s0m3th1ngAZ]

Oh cool, populist nonsense to help cheer on the underachievers.

Obvious capitalist is obvious.

[Jesda]

OH COOL LETS JUST MOVE OUR MNC TO ANOTHER COUNTRY ENTIRELY

We have offered incentives to companies in other countries to sell goods in the United States.

That doesn't help the situation.

Goods manufactured outside of the USA should be taxed heavily.

The real world doesnt work that way. If you tax something, it will LEAVE. The US isn't the only game in town anymore.

[PoorManQ45]

The real world doesnt work that way. If you tax something, it will LEAVE. The US isn't the only game in town anymore.

That is what happens when corporations are allowed to take over our country...

[PapaSmurf2k3]

I wouldn't say the corporations have taken over, but Enron sure did f*** us pretty hard.

[Jesda]

The real world doesnt work that way. If you tax something, it will LEAVE. The US isn't the only game in town anymore.

That is what happens when corporations are allowed to take over our country...

No. And thanks for the NPR cliche. This is what happens when the US fails to be internationally cost competitive and clings desperately to a false idea of what Americans "deserve."

[PoorManQ45]

That is what happens when corporations are allowed to take over our country...

No. And thanks for the NPR cliche. This is what happens when the US fails to be internationally cost competitive and clings desperately to a false idea of what Americans "deserve."

Or maybe it's the fact that some countries have artificially deflated their currency...

[Jesda]

No it isn't as US currency has declined heavily since the abandonment of the gold standard. Other nations have manipulated their currencies to prop up heavy industries but have suffered from perpetual recessions and high living costs (Japan) as a result.

You cannot artificially raise the cost of doing business while expecting large firms to stay. There are options now.

[PoorManQ45]

No it isn't as US currency has declined heavily since the abandonment of the gold standard. Other nations have manipulated their currencies to prop up heavy industries but have suffered from perpetual recessions and high living costs (Japan) as a result.

China, Taiwan, Malaysia, etc. all have very weak currencies. We know China has manipulated the currency to attract production facilities. I'm not sure about the other two.

You cannot artificially raise the cost of doing business while expecting large firms to stay. There are options now.

So what you're saying is you can't unscrew the pooch?

[Urabus GodofTraction]

Oh cool, populist nonsense to help cheer on the underachievers.

Said more politely than I would have managed, good sir.

Everyone certain has an argument when they're being used as a strawman and getting robbed at gunpoint.

[IBCoupe]

The real world doesnt work that way. If you tax something, it will LEAVE. The US isn't the only game in town anymore.

^ Assumes there are better places out there. Except for what might be a recessional blip, the US is one of a very small number of games in town.

[RobPaulson]

Oh cool, populist nonsense to help cheer on the underachievers.

Amen homie, I'm FFAAAARRRR from rich, and i think taxing the rich more than anyone else is absolute complete s***. this is amurrika, y0. you get lucky and strike it rich, good for you. still not anyones right to stick their hands in your pocket.

and bill maher is the most pompous manipulative phuk in comedy/politics. That entire article can be summed up with "Oh look at the richies crying, they never worked hard for their money, YOU DESERVE IT!" Such a joke, he plays to peoples emotions with his examples just to open them up to accept his ideas. It's truly pathetic.

Obvious capitalist is obvious.

You claim capitalist like its an insult? This is amurrika bish, we were founded on the idea of capitalism. u dont like it? ggeeiiittttout!

[RCA]

You claim capitalist like its an insult? This is amurrika bish, we were founded on the idea of capitalism. u dont like it? ggeeiiittttout!

Capitalism as we know doesn't work. It's broken.

We are going to need to raise taxes, we are is a financial sh*t storm and this is America so if taxes are raised and you can't handle it "ggeeiiitttout". A 3% tax increase when you are living check to check is difficult to deal with. But when it cuts into your expendable income, I stop caring.

FTR:
I do think our government is miserable with spending money.

[themadscientist]

wake me up when we have a flat tax.

A flat tax is a regressive tax. It hurts low income people the most. Who misses 10% of their income more, the guy at $100,000 a year or the guy at $20,000. Figure in certain fixed expenses like rent, utilities, gas, food and clothing and the squeeze gets tighter. The flat tax is a neat thing to yell but it punishes people at the bottom of the income scale.

[IBCoupe]

Mad's right. I've been over this with coworkers repeatedly. Most of them admit that there are fixed expenses that one can't avoid, and most will accept that any tax system will have to account for it. But my point is, as soon as we start accounting for it, the flat tax becomes a progressive tax.

Let's say we set a "flat" tax at 20%, but acknowledge that a person living on only the most basics of essentials will still need roughly $5,000 a year to get by. These are just numbers, please refrain from nitpicking them.

A person making $20,000's flat 20% would be $4,000, but if you take out that $5000, they're still in the red without taxes. So right there, we establish this "flat tax" with a "Taxes are only paid by people who make $25,000 or more a year." It also means that a person who makes $30,000 a year will have an actual tax rate of 3.33%.

A person making $50,000's flat 20% would be $10,000, but if you deduct the $5000, their actual tax rate is only 10%.

A person making $100,000's flat 20% would be $20,000, but if you deduct the $5000, their actual tax rate is 15%.

So either you have a flat tax that puts a disproportionately heavy burden on the lower income brackets, or you have one that doesn't but is not "flat" in any sense of the word. In fact, it starts to look very much like what we have now.

The other aspect to a "flat tax" that's problematic is that people want to get rid of all the other deductions that citizens, especially high-income citizens, enjoy. But a lot of those deductions are there for a reason. For example, we'd like people to donate to charity, and if they do and we still tax them, it's like society is hitting them up twice. Maybe you don't like social engineering with the tax code, but just know that when you remove some of this, there will be greater implications beyond the tax code.

[themadscientist]

I like the direction that's going but we would need to account for standards of living by region. It's cheaper to live in deersnot Nebraska than New York city, but I think a relatively simple system could be put together. I am for a progressive tax system. That doesn't mean punishing the rich parse', I am against capital gains and inheritance taxes for instance.

[IBCoupe]

Oh, absolutely, Mad. $5,000 in Boston is not the same as $5,000 in West Virginia. I was just trying to illustrate the foolishness of a "flat" tax. It becomes no less foolish when it's made more complicated on a regional basis.

[themadscientist]

We know that there is no way the powers that be want a simplified tax code, though. The complexity is there on purpose.

[RobPaulson]

Capitalism as we know doesn't work. It's broken.

We are going to need to raise taxes, we are is a financial sh*t storm and this is America so if taxes are raised and you can't handle it "ggeeiiitttout". A 3% tax increase when you are living check to check is difficult to deal with. But when it cuts into your expendable income, I stop caring.

FTR:
I do think our government is miserable with spending money.