Another Iraq thread... don't read it if politics offend you!

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big jon's 240
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s14=pimpin' wrote:Take it easy big J, I ain't trying to start a battle with you.


Im not trying to get into it with you either, In fact i find it very admirable that there are people who read this thread (im such the poet), posted their reply even though it may not be the most popular opinion, and had the cajones to stand by their convictions.

I am fortunate enough to know what really is "propaganda", and what really is fact when it comes to waht you see on the news. And yes there really were people dancing in the streets after 9/11, that is fact, they were not "superimposed" (ever heard Adam Sandlers "talking goat"?):D

Anyhow, i really am glad that some educated (at least you guys sound like it) people came in and offered a different opinion, otherwise this thread would have gotten very boring, very quick!

And on a final note, if you guys are ever in Augusta, GA, let me know and we will :beer , and argue some more! (my wife and most of my co-workers tell me i like to argue just for the sake of arguing!)

:patriot Jon


Rockenreno
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arguing for the sake of arguing is my middle name... I know it's kind of long, but my parents thought it had a nice ring to it... or they were drunk;)

89sxRCR
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S14 pimpin u seem to think "propaganda" is anything that lends support to an argument... (wrong)

Quote »YES, WELL, THIS GUY FAILED TO MENTION ALL THE ATTACKS ON MUSLIMS MOSQUES (sp?) AND PERSONAL ATTACKS ON MUSLIMS IN GENERAL SHORTLY AFTER THE ATTACKS?[/quote] Those atacks were not perpatrated by orginizations..those were done by a few individuals. America does not endorse or support retaliation against innocent muslims..its a crime. there is ALWAYS crime in society.

Quote »GIMME A BREAK, DO YOU REALLY WANT TO BLAME IRAQ AS A WHOLE, OR IN PARTICULAR, BIN LADEN OR SADDAM, FOR THE ACTS OF A CLAN OF FANATICS??? BOMBING HALF OF AFGANISTAN TO FIND ONE PERSON, WHO IS A RELATIVE OF A BUSINESS ALY OF THE PRESIDENT?[/quote] Bin Laden SHOULD be blamed, he PLANNED the atacks. Yeesh, any country that aided the terrorists orginizations aided killing us. That clan of fanatics is actually quite large and recieved support and funding from numerous orginaztions. Those orginizations that supported them should be treated just like the terrorists.

Quote »THAT IS A STUPID REMARK ALL TOGETHER[/quote] well i think you are stupid...go figure. oh yeah its called YOUR OPINION

Quote »ALL THOSE BOMBS DROPPED ON AFGANISTAN WAS A PEACEFUL RESTRAINT??? DAMN, I'D HATE TO SEE HOW LOW BUSH WOULD GO IF YOU REALLY PISSED HIM OFF[/quote] Its apparent you dont know history. More people were killed in sep 11 than in pearl harbor. Do you know how we retaliated after pearl harbor? I suggest you look it up, it would be a change from pulling this **** out of your a$$. Compare THAT to bombing a few terrorists camps...

Quote »ITS A FREAKING WEDDING FOR CRYING OUT LOUD, AND I'M SURE ITS NOT THE FIRST TIME SHOTS WERE FIRED AT A WEDDING IN CELEBRATION. NOW PEOPLE HAVE TO CHANGE THE WAY THEY CELEBRATE BECAUSE TRIGGER HAPPY AMERICAN PLANES MAY BE FLYING UP ABOVE?? DO I EVEN NEED TO MENTION THE 4 CANADIAN SOLDIERS THAT WERE WRONGFULLY BOMBED UPON BY A, YES, AMERICAN PLANE? DID YOU GUYS EVEN KNOW OF THAT BOMBING?[/quote]

Are you sure? did you research it? i bet not. typicall. Anyone firing into the sky filled with american planes knows DAMN well what they are doing. I hardly think requiring people from firing weapons into the sky when our planes are there qualifies as forcing them to change thier way of life...unless thier way of life DID include firing at americans. ant btway, the canadians killed was a tragic accident but nothing more.. ACCIDENT key word. There are training casualties in the us army every year, do we stop having an army because of them? Quote »I'M SURE THERE ARE MANY NATIONS THAT CAN JUST AS EASILY TURN THE US INTO ONE LARGE GOLF COURSE, WHATS HIS POINT HERE? THAT THE US IS OH SO PATIENT? PLEASE, A LOAD OF BULLSH!T IF YOU ASK ME (AND YOU DID BTW).[/quote] ummm NO. The u.s is the most powerfull nation in the world right now..anybody tries to wipe us out would find thier continent a nuclear wasteland. The u.s is patient, thats why we are sitting here waiting for a godamn resolution we dont need before we go into iraq.

Quote »WOULD AMERICAN TV'S TELL US IF THEY DID?[/quote] YES. you are paranoid, take your medication lately?

Quote »OK, THIS LITTLE BIT OF BS REALLY PISSED ME OFF. FIRST OFF, US TELEVISIONS DO NOT HAVE TO AIR THE DATE OF A CLIP WHEN THEY SHOW IT ON US AIR WAVES. MEANING, THOSE "LIVE" SHOTS OF "PALESTINI" PEOPLE DANCING ON THE STREETS THE DAY OF THE 9/11 ATTACKS, COULD BE FOOTAGE FROM MONTHS, YEARS, OR EVEN WEEKS EARLIER, FOOTAGE OF THAT COUNTRY ELEBRATING A WORLD CUP BIRTH (YOU GET MY POINT).[/quote] is it fun to make **** up?? that footage IS palestinians celebrating 9 11. look it up if you dont bieleve me. I know thats foreign to you cuz its all "propaganda"Quote »SO, IS HE IN FAVOR OF OPENING THE GATES OF HELL, OR WHAT? THAT WAS SUCH A STUPID, RUN AROUND THE BUSH STATEMENT.[/quote] he didnt say he was in favor, all hes saying is that we can bring it if we want to. duh.

Quote »REALLY, HOW CAN HE PROVE THIS? CHINA HAS, WHAT, 2 OUT OF THE 6 BILLION PEOPLE THAT INHABIT THE EARTH? NOT TO MENTION THE LARGEST AMOUNT OF LAND IN ASIA? AND HAS ANYONE EVER INVADED CHINA TO SEE THEIR WEAPONS OF DESTRUCTION? WHERE IS HALF THE CRAP WE BUY, MADE IN? CHINA, TAIWAN, WHAT MAKES YOU THINK THEY ARE NOT CAPABLE OF MAKING THEIR OWN NUCLEAR WEAPONS? MORE MISLEADING INFORMATION, ALSO KNOW AS [/quote] the more i read what you post the more i know you dont have a CLUE about the real world. HOW CAN YOU argue that america isnt the worlds largest military power??? Oh i know how, you havent looked it up. Look up the numbers man, you will be amazed. Quote »THAT LAST BIT WAS JUST PLAIN OLD DISTASTEFUL, AND MEANINGLESS. I'M SURE THAILAND HAS SOME OF THE STRICTEST AND TOUGHEST LAWS IN THE WORLD, BUT YOU DON'T SEE THIS POMPOUS JERK THROWING INSULTS AT THEM.[/quote] hmm have you been to thailand (even tho its off the subject, dont know why u brought it up) I have. And actually its practically anything goes there. And how is that insulting them? Its one of thier laws. Quote »HE RATHER BE A DOG, OVER A PRINCE? DO I REALLY NEED TO GO ON?[/quote] since literary analogies are obviously too complex for you, i will explain it, he would rather be a AMERICAN than a prince in another country. Quote »Typing this reply is very exhausting and tiresom, and I really have nothing to benefit from it. My point is, keep your eyes open, and don't believe everything you hear on CNN.[/quote] where do you get your information then? im curious, because its obvious you performed exhausting research and are on top of your game. you know what you are talking about. >>>>>SARCASMthis is what happens when uneducated people try to have opinions.... :(

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big jon's 240
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[quote=" 89sxRCR ummm NO. The u.s is the most powerfull nation in the world right now..anybody tries to wipe us out would find thier continent a nuclear wasteland. The u.s is patient, thats why we are sitting here waiting for a godamn resolution we dont need before we go into iraq.[/quote]

:Werd

:patriot

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Well, the latest opinion polls from the US's close and dear ally, Spain, say that 80% of the population is against the war. 80% against in the UK as well. No basing rights in Turkey where it's 90% against.Looks like it's a coalition of the unwilling.

What a friggin' mess W & Co. have gotten the US into. Sorry to break it to you but Washington didn't throw a dollar across the Potomac and W isn't a brilliant leader. The former myth is quaint, the latter myth is dangerous.

Are you aware that W stated the he feels that God put him in his position to carry out this war. Can you say crusade? Holy crap!

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this whole recent mess was started over religion, I just hope Bush doesn't end it the same way. This goes back to the discussion of separation of church and state though. Another reason to keep God out of politics...

As for those numbers, I don't know where you got them, but they don't sound right. I could be wrong though. I also don't trust most of those polls because they are usually taken over a sample of aboutt 200 people, which hardly represents a nation. Along the same lines, you always see protesters for everything the government does because those who agree have nothing to protest. Just because there are protesters doesn't mean everyone doesn't want this war. I am not a big fan of war, but I am a big fan of solving this problem before Iraq and North Korea start bombing everyone... and it won't just be the US.

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VimyJ wrote:Well, the latest opinion polls from the US's close and dear ally, Spain, say that 80% of the population is against the war. 80% against in the UK as well. No basing rights in Turkey where it's 90% against.Looks like it's a coalition of the unwilling.


I thought you said earlier that you didnt place much faith in polls? OK, so the UK and Spain can stay home, we dont need them anyhow. And since we wanna talk polls, latest polls indicate 71% of americans FAVOR taking out saddam.

I have a question for you. Say we become a bunch of p****** all of a sudden and go the french route. We send in more inspectors, they maybe find some weapons, maybe they dont. What next? 5 years later, a mushroom cloud goes up over Isreal and then we are back at square 1 all over again! There is no way out of the inspection proccess that guarantees he doesnt start trying to make a nuke after we leave. So where does it end?

Iraq has already violated several aspects of 1441, which the french voted for. If they dont have the balls to back up their vote, (or spain, china or anyone else) thn they shouldnt have voted in favor of it. So i say screw em, lets go blow some **** up!

Jon

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[quote=" big jon's 240 I thought you said earlier that you didnt place much faith in polls?[/quote]Nope. I never said that. Polls are polls. I took a statistics course at university (which I hated and eventually dropped) but have a bit of appretiation of how they work. They are useful indicators hence W's rush to invade because the polls are with him. Too bad Blair misjudged his backing so badly.

Quote » OK, so the UK and Spain can stay home, we dont need them anyhow.[/quote]The US is creating a lonely world for itself through W and that means a more dangerous place for Americans. There are 6 million Muslims in France and, of course, some of them are hard core extremists. Can the US afford to sever ties with the French and other allies? Intelligence is crucial in the war on terrorism (of which Iraq doesn't really fit). Is it intelligent to cut relations with the French when they also have solid intelligence of Islamic radicals from their involvement with Algeria, their former colony and other places in the mid east?

Quote » And since we wanna talk polls, latest polls indicate 71% of americans FAVOR taking out saddam.[/quote]I call it mass hysteria because the sentiment is not based upon any evidence at all. None.

Quote »I have a question for you. Say we become a bunch of p****** all of a sudden and go the french route. We send in more inspectors, they maybe find some weapons, maybe they dont. What next? 5 years later, a mushroom cloud goes up over Isreal and then we are back at square 1 all over again! There is no way out of the inspection proccess that guarantees he doesnt start trying to make a nuke after we leave. So where does it end?[/quote]Well, that would be one way of settling the Israel/Palestine mess. :eek: (that mess is a big part of our problems)

Do you think that if Saddam manages to hold onto power that there won't always be inspectors in Iraq? Saddam will never be given any peace to sit around and build weapons. He cooked his goose that way. The problem is that the nuclear genie is out of the bottle and despots all over the world be working on them. W's actions will probably only encourage them to work faster so they have it in case Uncle Sam wants to go stomping around their neck of the woods in the future. Look at N. Korea, sitting pretty with its nukesand delivery systems, threatening the US every day with a "sea of fire" if it tries anything.

Quote »Iraq has already violated several aspects of 1441, which the french voted for. If they dont have the balls to back up their vote, (or spain, china or anyone else) thn they shouldnt have voted in favor of it. So i say screw em, lets go blow some **** up![/quote]We've got two extremes going on here. On one side there's the US saying "Look this vial of icing sugar could be anthrax! This artists conception of what maybe a mobile biolab might look like if they might have them is proof!" Yada, yada, yada.Then we there are the French who say they will automatically veto anything before they have even seen anything. The French are not helping the inspectors with this crap.

So we have competing idiotic extremes. Crap, it doesn't get more interesting than this! However, there is one thing that both nations agree on and that thing is money. France does a lot of business with Iraq that it could lose if the Yanks oust Saddam AND this is a perfect opportunity for W and Co. to scoop up ALL the oil rights and use taxpayer paid security guards (or army of accupation if you please) to secure the entire mid east oil region using the "War on Terror" BS as cover. I maintain including Iraq in the War on Terror is unfounded and unproven due to lack of both evidence and motive. The US public are buying a bill of goods from W & Co. The frogs are just doing their stupid "gaulic" pride thing again.

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These Iraq threads are very repetitive.:(

Members, PLEASE, do not post any more Iraq threads!At least until the war is over.

Fred...:firedevil


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