What path to walk down?

[cnichols]

I believe you'd have to get a manifold from one place and get the turbo itself from HKS. I'm not sure if Turbonetics makes a 3037.

The 3037 should be good for 500 hp with a very good spool time. That is if you get the ball bearing type. I wouldn't recommend anything else. I'm pretty sure the 3037 has a T3 flange. I'll have to look...

WD

The GT3037 actually uses a T25 flange.

[WDRacing]

Thanks WD, yer a great help.

Im basically gonna be doing boneyard boost :rolleyes just so i can have something fun while i go to university then after that ill buy a CA and get serious haha.

Would a used/rebuilt t3 or t3/t4 for say 10-11 psi _maxium_ be suitable?

-Andre

All of the above turbines will be fine. I would suggest the T3/T4 first though. That way you can keep it for more boost when your done with school.

Matt, the T3/T4 turbine is also a good turbine for you to use. It's also quite abit cheaper then the GT3037, which you would have to peice a kit together for. The T3/T4 is good for 500hp and still has a good spool time.

cnick, thx for the correction

WD

[cnichols]

Also, do some research as to what T3/T4 hybrid you use...there are quite a few combinations to choose from. Learn how to read the compressor maps and really do some digging into what turbine/compressor combo will work for the type of driving you'll be doing. Generally, a smaller turbine and A/R will net a quicker spool time for better response (everyday driving on the street), etc...Figure out what you want and then figure out how to get it.

Don't just get any T3/T4!

[ST240]

Haha ok cnichols, i will heed your advice, thanks.

Remember im on a really tight budget for now and maybe the only turbo i will be able to get is some rebuilt one or something cheap of ebay, or maybe even a used t3 outta a wrecking yard :rant

But even so, im sure ill have a good time along the way.

BTW. How is that Turbo book you got that pic of? i was thinking of buying it.

-Andre

[matt0941]

cnichols great quote BTW, but where should I do that research of what hybrid to do (and hybrid means different compressor/turbine?) I am clueless on where to look for what turbos besides the boards.

[matt0941]

Sweet Moses ST240! you are a damned fast responder... but is that website that you sent mainly for domestics?

[cnichols]

Alot of it is explained in Maximum Boost by Corky Bell...just do a search at amazon or barnes and nobles.com.

Yes, a T3/T4 hybrid means using a turbine from a T3 and compressor from a T4 generally. Turbonetics website might have some compressor maps, but Corky Bell does a pretty good job of explaining without getting too technical in his book. It really is the best information source I've had and maybe the best $30 I've spent towards this crazy hobby that we're all obsessed with.

And, I can get you a brand new Turbonetics turbo for cost if you would like. If I get some time I'll even do my best to pick out the best suited, or we can put up a poll or something.

[matt0941]

Yea I found and looked at their website at ( http://64.225.76.178/catalog/t3t4.html ) But I am having trouble understanding what the h*ll the prices at the bottom represent, cnichols... since you seem to have a FAR better understanding of turbos than I do (I probably will read that book and don't think I will fully understand turbo systems till 15 years down the road and would like one before that) could you explain it to me or give any insight? Thanks, ya been great help.

[WDRacing]

Ahh nonsense Matt, turbo's and forced induction are easy. Once you start trying to figure compression and piston to head quench area, thats when things get fun.

But seriously, turbo's are fun and can be learned very easily. Cnick is correct about the trim sizes being a fairly large concern. With the Hybrid T3/T4's there are quite a few trims to pick from. I would stay at or under an 86 AR section, but as large as possible compressor section. The AR is the exhaust side, the CR is the intake side. The larger the CR the more volume of air it can force into your motor, aswell as being more efficient. Like cnick said already, you don't want to go huge with the AR section cause it creates alot of lag.

But if you can only afford a T3, that will still net you some serious improvements.

WD

[matt0941]

Thanks you guys are a big help, I will look into the prices of the t4/t3 hybrids and start compiling my list of engine mods soon.

[WDRacing]

Hey Matt, check out this site, http://64.225.76.178/main.htm

Go to the BB series turbos and look at the first 2 GT30 series on the list. Those are the two GT30's I would suggest for you.

Then check out, http://64.225.76.178/main.htm Go to the catalog page, then go to the T series turbo's. Then go to the T3/T4 series. Read what it has to say and then look at the 8th turbo down on the list. Its part # is DB-TURBO. Thats the T3/T4 I would go with.

Hope that helps a little...

WD

[ST240]

Hey guys, maybe you've seen this but maybe not.

But here it is anyway: http://www.turbofast.com.au/tfcalc.html . I dont know how accurate it is but its good for a kick if nothing else

Maybe WD, can demo it on one of his ever lovin' skylines or supras or ferraris or whatever else he has turboed haha.

-Andre

[WDRacing]

I'll plug the #'s in for a street built 240 later on today, unless someone beats me to it.

WD

[matt0941]

Hey WD, I was just reading another post and remembered that you said something. I know that I will probably (hopefully) be pushing 300+ whp. And I agreed to just go with the HKS SAFR piggy-back system and the stock ECU and MAF due to their cost. But in another one of your posts you said that the stock ECU (or atleast JWT said it) only handles 260 whp. Doesn't this present a problem... if going to 300+ is it necessary to upgrade ECU and MAF then?

[WDRacing]

I believe I was referring to the MAF sensor only being good for that much. There really isn't a point where you can say a certain ecu won't be good anymore. A fuel/timing map is either good or bad.

The JWT allows you to encorporate a lrger MAF from a Mustang.

By the way, the SDS standalone is almost the same price as the JWT and SAFR.

SDS is a decent standalone too, sorry to keep on throwing descisions at you bud.

WD

[matt0941]

But WD are you sure that it was the MAF that may not be able to handle it or the ECU because I thought you said that you read from JWT upgrade that the stock ECU can't handle 260+, anyways thanks for the information. I would be confused rather than be stuck with something I don't want.

[cnichols]

The ECU is limited by its programming...nothing physical.

The MAF, however, will give you a physical limitation if you try to push big hp.

[matt0941]

Ok well I suppose I will compare the costs of the JWT upgrade + HKS SAFR + MAF to the SDS system. Oh BTW anyone know how much an MAF would cost roughly, I can't seem to find one for around 300ish HP on the net (Cobra one work?). Thanks.

[WDRacing]

The only thing I like about the Piggyback route Matt is that you can by it piece by piece. Cause chances are you aren't going to have everything for a 400hp motor all at once.

The JWT is also tuned for, you won't to spend hours on the dyno tuning it to run just right.

Oh and what thread was I saying the ECU was only good till 260 or whatever. I'll need to correct myself. I'd hate to give out bad info.

WD

[matt0941]

Actually I made two mistakes.

1) It was not you that posted it, it was C-kwik in this forum that posted it. Guess I am just too used to you posting all of the info.

2) He actually did in fact say the stock MAF maxes out at 260hp, my bad; I just saw JWT and 260 and linked ECU in there I guess.

Option 1:HKS SAFR ~ $340+MAF ~ $200 (really unsure)+ JWT ECU Upgrade ~ $600------------------------------------Total ~ $1140

Option 2: SDS (Simple Digital Systems) EM-4Total ~ Don't know! I finally found their website but have no idea which one I need, could someone look at it and give me a price estimate? http://www.sdsefi.com/specific.html

Thanks.

P.S.: That was a heated argument!

[WDRacing]

All you need is the SDS EM-4. That will solve all of your fuel problems. Since it doesn't require a MAF signal for the ECU.

You'll also need a 3 bar map sensor, I say 3 bar just incase you get silly with the boost someday. Might aswell have it now.

Sounds like a grand total of $875 + shipping.

I'd say its a better option. You can also upgrade to the version that controls ignition if you need to a later date.

PS...That argument would have got real ugly if demcj didn't step in.

WD

[WDRacing]

I think I was smoking crack for the last post. I'm not sure if the stock ecu will work inconjunction with the SDS. You might need to go one step higher and get the SDS that controlls ignition and fuel.

I'd look into that, send them an email. It must work like that on some cars or they wouldn't even offer that version.

WD

[cnichols]

Hey Matt, just in case you didn't know already, I'm selling my JWT and Cobra MAF if you're interested....

[email protected]

[matt0941]

But why would it work in conjunction with the ECU... I was under the impression that it was a full standalone system. Thanks.

[ST240]

how much you want for the ecu? what are its specs?

-Andre

[cnichols]

All I know is that it's tuned for 50 lb. injectors and the Cobra MAF Sensor. I bought it on the car and am selling because I bought a standalone.

[S13Ka24e]

If you are planning to go over 260hp and want to stick with a piggy back then you can use Greddy e-manage. It says "Upgrade Air Flow Meter adjustment" then i think that you could use the Cobra or z32. I would use the latter. But you do need a laptop, but if you got one you could save some money. Link:

http://www.greddy.com/products...anage

[C-Kwik]

If you are planning to go over 260hp and want to stick with a piggy back then you can use Greddy e-manage. It says "Upgrade Air Flow Meter adjustment" then i think that you could use the Cobra or z32. I would use the latter. But you do need a laptop, but if you got one you could save some money. Link:

http://www.greddy.com/products...anage

The problem is that the Cobra MAF may not be compatible with the E-Manage. At least not in a plug and play sense. The Greddy E-Manage only allows a change to a MAF that is on their list. But you may be able to use the Cobra MAF with a lot of tuning using the airflow signal adjustments and adjusting the tuning maps to the new signals. But this would defeat the purpose of the ease of use designs that Greddy incorporated. As far as I know, the E-Manage can only use popular Japanese import MAF's. The S14 KA MAF isn't listed in their Japanese manual, but was added in an English version. They probably figured KA guys would use it, especially if their turbo kit ever makes it out and they probably already figured out the KA MAF when they were designing the fuel controller for the Greddy Turbo kit. That's just speculation though.

[WDRacing]

But why would it work in conjunction with the ECU... I was under the impression that it was a full standalone system. Thanks.

Sorry for the confusion Matt, the SDS is a standalone. But the cheapest version only controls your fuel maps. It doesn't control ignition. So that would mean that your stock ecu would still need to control the timing.

The more I think about, the more I would go with my original suggestion. A complete standalone system to control everything. You will pay more then all the other methods. But just barely.

After all, anything worth doing, is worth doing right...

I'd rather see you go cheap or used on a turbine, then the ECU stuff. I got my TO4E used, worked for the last 2 years just fine.

I'll look online a little later for some good standalones. I know of quite a few more besides the famous Haltech, SDS and TEC3.

I'll post my findings, with some detailed info on each.

WD

[S13Ka24e]

Didn't know thet you had to use there list. I thought that it was universal, do you know what MAF's you can use?