STILLEN Lightweight Pulleys - Introductory Offer!

[dangeris]

Anyone with a 2.5 got this installed and care to share impressions?

^^ yes please do tell

I think LBC was one of the first 2.5ers that got the pulley. However, he's in the middle of moving and getting his cable hooked up for internet. Maybe he'll see this thread and post up. To be honest, I'm not sure if he got it installed yet either.

[RobPaulson]

wait i could have SWORN i saw a nice writeup on how to install this pulley . . . it was late and i was a bit out of it when i saw it though . . . was i imagining things lol??

[RobPaulson]

http://forums.altimas.org/zero...05345

there it is, can we get a mod to add this to the DIY section please??

[Marisha]

Don't tell me none of the 2.5 guys installed this yet. Brian? Anyone?

[dangeris]

No i don't know if any 2.5ers installed these yet. I did the write up on it this past weekend but that was for the 3.5. I wold imagine the 2.5 would be the same.

[Marisha]

I was wondering more of the effects on the car. With all the talk of how one is an underdrive and the other one isn't, I figured there might be a difference in them.

[maxentropy]

I was wondering more of the effects on the car. With all the talk of how one is an underdrive and the other one isn't, I figured there might be a difference in them.

The 2.5 one is the same size as the OEM pulley which means no change in performance. However one could argue Stillen's is lighter in weight so your car goes faster (less weight + same amount of power = faster). But think about how much lighter this small pulley is... a few ounces? Only other arguement for buying this for the 2.5 is it's "Stillen quality"... last longer? Maybe... maybe not.

I'm no expert but here is my two cents; This is pretty much worthless to a 2.5er. I like Stillen, but if you buy this for a 2.5, either 1) your pulley is bad and you need to replace it or 2) you are very unintelligent.

I have a 3.5 and still can't pull the trigger because of the negatives involved with this. I'll wait till I hear more reviews after another month or two to see how the part is holding up.

[dldjros69]

But think about how much lighter this small pulley is... a few ounces?

Isnt the 2.5 pulley at least 3 lbs lighter. 48oz???

[Team STILLEN]

The 2.5 one is the same size as the OEM pulley which means no change in performance. However one could argue Stillen's is lighter in weight so your car goes faster (less weight + same amount of power = faster). But think about how much lighter this small pulley is... a few ounces? Only other arguement for buying this for the 2.5 is it's "Stillen quality"... last longer? Maybe... maybe not.

I'm no expert but here is my two cents; This is pretty much worthless to a 2.5er. I like Stillen, but if you buy this for a 2.5, either 1) your pulley is bad and you need to replace it or 2) you are very unintelligent.

I have a 3.5 and still can't pull the trigger because of the negatives involved with this. I'll wait till I hear more reviews after another month or two to see how the part is holding up.

Wow, this is full of misinformation. I'm sorry we've done a poor job explaining the benefits, and max I'm not sure why you're so biased against something you haven't tested, but let me try to give some additional information.

The engine has to spin the crank pulley to drive the rest of the accessories. That pulley is heavy and made of steel. We've produced a billet aluminum (a much more expensive process then casting them) version to significantly reduce the weight of the pulley. This improves the ability for the engine to accelerate that pulley, creating faster throttle response, quicker revs, etc.

It's the same principle in lightening the wheel/tires on a car. Less rotating mass means less weight for the driveline to accelerate.

The factory pulley is 4.71lbs, and we reduce it to 1.10lbs. That's a 3.5 pound reduction in weight, or 75% weight savings. Of course you're going to see performance results, but this isn't a turbocharger, your 2.5L is not going to be overtaking 3.5L with the install of a lightweight crank pulley.

Another benefit that can be achieved from pulleys is reducing the size, called underdrive, because they are under-driving the accessories, such as the alternator, water pump, and the A/C when activated. This frees up horsepower, but is also only about a 20% reduction, so there aren't issues with the A/C not keeping up, flickering lights from the alternator, etc. Those problems have existed with other cars and other pulleys, but as that's been shown here (check the reviews), not the way we designed them, so it's not an issue.

So to say someone is unintelligent for purchasing a performance upgrade is just plain wrong, and completely short-sided, and honestly quite surprising.

Just to add: Doing an underdrive setup for the 2.5L isn't possible, because it wouldn't clear part of the engine, the pulley can't physically be smaller in the configuration the 2.5L is in.

[Marisha]

Thanks for all the responses. I was just hoping that someone (ahem...Brian) that has bought one could chime in and talk about first hand experience with this thing before the introductory offer ran out.

[dldjros69]

Thanks for all the responses. I was just hoping that someone (ahem...Brian) that has bought one could chime in and talk about first hand experience with this thing before the introductory offer ran out.

i thought it IO ran out on the 15...

[Marisha]

It got extended til the end of the month. There is a post about it further up in the thread.

[dldjros69]

Cool, im gonna end up paying full price. Im not buying anything for my car til my footy is better.

[Boilermaker318]

The performance benefits of lighweight pulleys have been proven on so many platforms I'm surprised it's even being questioned. It's really like high school physics level stuff. I had one on my 3000GT.

[D-Roll]

Thanks for the info Josh

[maxentropy]

Josh, my post was purely to the 2.5ers with the same size pulley, but lighter weight. Sure you reduce the weight of your car by 3lbs-- go on a diet for free and save much more than that in weight. Dump your girlfriend and there is like 80lbs or more....

Seriously though, yes less weight is good but does the pulley turn faster (more revs per min) now since it's lighter? It'll take less power to turn, which will marginally help your mileage. Please tell me how this will benefit 2.5ers performance wise.

Worth it for the 2.5ers? IMHO, no. Just looking out for the 2.5 folks, that's all.

The 3.5 underdrive is "worth it" if you want to trade the loss of power elsewhere for the better performance. Again, nothing against Stillen at all- just trying to save the 2.5ers some cash.

[RobPaulson]

Please tell me how this will benefit 2.5ers performance wise.

The engine has to spin the crank pulley to drive the rest of the accessories. That pulley is heavy and made of steel. We've produced a billet aluminum (a much more expensive process then casting them) version to significantly reduce the weight of the pulley. This improves the ability for the engine to accelerate that pulley, creating faster throttle response, quicker revs, etc.

[D-Roll]

For the 2.5er's, it's worth it if you were to upgrade to a lighter flywheel as well. When i got a lighter pulley on my previous 02 SpecV, I didnt notice anything until I upgraded to a lighter flywheel.

[maxentropy]

All my reasoning is deductive from what seems obvious. Perhaps only to me it seems. A 3lb lighter wheel takes less power to spin yes, giving more power to throttle response, etc... but how much? Is that minimal gain worth that much money?

If I had a 2.5 the gains would be too neglible for me to offer more than $50 for this product. For the 3.5, I believe it to be worth every penny. I just think it sucks Stillen is charging an arm and a leg for the new belt.

Someone ought to post a link to a cheaper one for the 3.5ers that want quality but a decent price. Not too change the subject too much.

[Marisha]

A 3lb lighter wheel takes less power to spin yes, giving more power to throttle response, etc... but how much? Is that minimal gain worth that much money?

That's what I'm trying to figure this out based on others' feedback.

[Team STILLEN]

All my reasoning is deductive from what seems obvious. Perhaps only to me it seems. A 3lb lighter wheel takes less power to spin yes, giving more power to throttle response, etc... but how much? Is that minimal gain worth that much money?

If I had a 2.5 the gains would be too neglible for me to offer more than $50 for this product. For the 3.5, I believe it to be worth every penny. I just think it sucks Stillen is charging an arm and a leg for the new belt.

Someone ought to post a link to a cheaper one for the 3.5ers that want quality but a decent price. Not too change the subject too much.

I realize it may not seem to make sense on how lightening by 3lbs can make a difference, but it's rotating mass, that's different than simple weight.

I'll give you an example. We have a supercharged Titan here on 24" wheels. For shows or demos, we put the stock Titan wheels back on. That nets 40hp to the wheels because of the rotating mass and difference in weight. I'm not saying that this pulley gets anywhere near this, but the weight of the wheels and tires themselves has to be spun by the driveline, just like the pulley.

And if we're overcharging for the belt, which is expensive, it's a full serpentine, and it's a quality Gates belt, simply use your stock belt, and/or see if you can find it for a better price, the part number is K060878. We have them in stock, and it ships for free with the pulley. Beware though, most claim to have every belt in stock, but don't.

It think it's been shown time and again that we supply you guys with quality parts at extremely competitive prices, not sure why you would think thigns were different now..

[maxentropy]

This pulley doesn't make contact with the ground like those tires did. You are talking completely different physics.

I'm simply giving my opinion to the 2.5 folks saying save your $$ for something more worthwhile.

I'm just giving you a hard time about the belt- one of you said before it was a tad more expensive than usual for some reason.

The gains I could see from the 2.5 lightweight pulley:

1) Gains from the entire mass of the car and contents being 3 lbs lighter. (losing weight or emptying out your trunk or not driving with others in the car is a much more beneficial and cheaper way to do this)

and

2) I'm not totally sure how the internals of the pulley works but I will give it the benefit of the doubt and say that it will take the engine less power to rotate it than it used to-- so your engine has that "saved" power to put to the wheels. How much, if any power is saved from spinning a now 3lbs lighter pulley? I don't know.

Again, this is for the 2.5 lightweight pulley. The 3.5 lightweight pulley is fantastic if you are looking for a great ratio of HP gains per dollar. I don't mean to be a "dooshbag" in my posts, just trying to learn. By all means if my reasoning is wrong correct me. I am on these forums as I want to learn and I will not unless folks come on and set me straight from time to time.

[Team STILLEN]

I appreciate questions, and appreciate information as well, but when it's stated so harshly like someone is "unintelligent" to pick up a part, you're stating more than just an opinion (as openly admitting limited understanding the physics of pulleys), and that's the only reason I wanted to respond, so I could hopefully interject some info.

Whether this is the right product for you depends on your goals, and expectations, and desires. For some it's all about horsepower, some suspension, some styling.. we make products for all of those.

Thanks for taking the time to discuss, a lot of times people have the same questions but don't ask.. figuring people would think they should know, or whatever the reason. Discussions are good in my book..

[RobPaulson]

I think you may need to brush up on some phsyics (i know some schools dont offer it in high school as regular curriculum so its understandable if you've never been taught this concept)

So here goes . . . It takes a certain amount of power (energy, whatever you want to call it) to get that pulley moving from a stop to its ideal speed (which i'm assuming varies** depending on desired acceleration etc). that means that it must accelerate to reach such speeds, it accelerates VERY fast and seems to be instant to us, but regardless of how fast we percieve it, its still accelerating and gains can still be had by altering a variable.

Now lets alter josh's example a bit, lets say we have those same set of tires on the truck, but the truck is suspended in the air so the ground is not a factor. Lets also assume for the sake of this example, you have a the heavy tires on first. Try to spin that wheel by hand (obviously car needs to be in neutral lol) It is going to be difficult, but do-able.

Now put the lighter tire on, try to spin that to reach the same speed you spun the last tire at, its going to take a HOLE lot less effort on your part to get the wheel going that fast.

This is what is happening with the pulley system, the less mass an object has, the less energy it takes to get going at an optimal speed, which means your hitting those desired revolution speeds that much faster, since there is less mass for the engine to move.

did i do it right? (someone please confirm this . . . not trying to come off like a jerk just trying to educate, but i havent taken physics in years lol )

**It's these variations which make the pulley worth it, the lighter weight increases the ability for the pulley to accelerate and decelerate at a higher rate.

[michaelthepsycho]

Max, you seem to not get that pulley's are an "internal" (if you will) leech and that payload is an "external" leech. I'm not saying the pulley is a huge difference but 3 lb reduction at the most direct source (as opposed to payload) is far more beneficial than losing three pounds of excess body weight. When it comes to building a car, every little bit counts. Call it $1xx for peace of mind if you want. When it scales down to the total value of our cars, that's close to nothing. Complaining about this is like saying motor oil is "expensive," which a lot of people seem to do. 50 bucks every 3,000 miles? I don't think so.

[maxentropy]

I think you may need to brush up on some phsyics (i know some schools dont offer it in high school as regular curriculum so its understandable if you've never been taught this concept)

So here goes . . . It takes a certain amount of power (energy, whatever you want to call it) to get that pulley moving from a stop to its ideal speed (which i'm assuming varies** depending on desired acceleration etc). that means that it must accelerate to reach such speeds, it accelerates VERY fast and seems to be instant to us, but regardless of how fast we percieve it, its still accelerating and gains can still be had by altering a variable.

Now lets alter josh's example a bit, lets say we have those same set of tires on the truck, but the truck is suspended in the air so the ground is not a factor. Lets also assume for the sake of this example, you have a the heavy tires on first. Try to spin that wheel by hand (obviously car needs to be in neutral lol) It is going to be difficult, but do-able.

Now put the lighter tire on, try to spin that to reach the same speed you spun the last tire at, its going to take a HOLE lot less effort on your part to get the wheel going that fast.

This is what is happening with the pulley system, the less mass an object has, the less energy it takes to get going at an optimal speed, which means your hitting those desired revolution speeds that much faster, since there is less mass for the engine to move.

did i do it right? (someone please confirm this . . . not trying to come off like a jerk just trying to educate, but i havent taken physics in years lol )

**It's these variations which make the pulley worth it, the lighter weight increases the ability for the pulley to accelerate and decelerate at a higher rate.

This is the same concept of gains that I was referring to in #2 of my post above.

Max, you seem to not get that pulley's are an "internal" (if you will) leech and that payload is an "external" leech. I'm not saying the pulley is a huge difference but 3 lb reduction at the most direct source (as opposed to payload) is far more beneficial than losing three pounds of excess body weight. When it comes to building a car, every little bit counts. Call it $1xx for peace of mind if you want. When it scales down to the total value of our cars, that's close to nothing. Complaining about this is like saying motor oil is "expensive," which a lot of people seem to do. 50 bucks every 3,000 miles? I don't think so.

Again, I stated 2 benefits, one as a load lightener (total car mass is now 3lbs less, which like you stated is really nothing) and the second one was the gains due to the lighter pulley being more easily spun by the engine and thus freeing more power to for acceleration. As far as money is concerned, I'm in no way complaining-- I'm simply stating that to me this is like buying a NISMO oil cap... since I can't see much "extra power being freed up" by losing 3lbs on a pulley.

I would be interested for someone who really knows physics/internals to post the math to figure out how much more power would be again "freed up" by spinning a 3lb lighter pulley.

And yes, to me still, until someone can actually prove that this provides more power to the wheels by being lighter by even a few HP, the 2.5 lightweight pulley is like buying a NISMO oil cap for your car-- but more expensive and to me, an unintelligent choice. Apologies if I offended anyone but this is solely the opinion of one person. Understand I believe the 3.5 underdrive lightweight pulley to be a heck of a deal, but I am not convinced on the 2.5 lightweight pulley.

Thanks for all the discussion so far and I hope to continue the good chat

By the way- I just talked to Dangeris and he is really amazed at the performance of his 3.5 after installing his pulley. I hope he posts soon and let's us all know the details of his experience so far!

[michaelthepsycho]

Well, I have one and can't put numbers out on the table but I'll try to be "un-placebo-ed" and give you my thoughts about the butt dyno... Once I pick my car up from the shop... Dangit it's taking sooo long Might be chopped and in Mexico for all I know

[dangeris]

Well since I've had the pulley installed last weekend, I'm going to post my thoughts on this mod....and that is

Joking...in all honesty I have notice better throttle response and quicker acceleration. Yesterday morning on my way to work I was going up the on ramp. Before, in 1st, when I punch the accelerator, it'd just rev and go. This time, it spun the wheels and left tire marks on the road which was still there this morning. That never happened before. Also with highway driving, in 6th gear, if I drop it to 4th and punch it, holy cow! The acceleration is unreal! IMHO, I think this was great performance mod that didn't cost a lot. for me on this Stillen product!

[maxentropy]

Well, I have one and can't put numbers out on the table but I'll try to be "un-placebo-ed" and give you my thoughts about the butt dyno... Once I pick my car up from the shop... Dangit it's taking sooo long Might be chopped and in Mexico for all I know

Definitely! Let's hope it's not being chopped!

[maxentropy]

Well since I've had the pulley installed last weekend, I'm going to post my thoughts on this mod....and that is

Joking...in all honesty I have notice better throttle response and quicker acceleration. Yesterday morning on my way to work I was going up the on ramp. Before, in 1st, when I punch the accelerator, it'd just rev and go. This time, it spun the wheels and left tire marks on the road which was still there this morning. That never happened before. Also with highway driving, in 6th gear, if I drop it to 4th and punch it, holy cow! The acceleration is unreal! IMHO, I think this was great performance mod that didn't cost a lot. for me on this Stillen product!

HAHA I almost had a heart attack!! After talking to ya it sounded awesome then I read this first line and almost fainted! Anyway, glad to see the write up-- I'm gonna have to put in for one of these soon.

Oh, you need to tell folks what you thought about the steering wheel/accessories...