Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

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Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby Ace2cool » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:46 pm

Posting this here instead of Gen Chat or Sentra because I, as a moderator, don't want to drive away any traffic due to Nissan's ABSOLUTELY s*** CUSTOMER SERVICE. But I still wanna vent.

So. As a lifelong Nissan enthusiast, and a resident of the town home to the US's largest auto manufacturing facility that just so happens to be run by Nissan, two years ago, we bought Brooke another Nissan. Brand spanking new off the lot. She drives a lot. Like, a lot a lot. So as gas mileage was a concern, we went with the most basic and fuel efficient, the Sentra. 2015 SV model with 13 miles on the clock after the test drive. Cool. Gonna last a while for sure.

So like I said, Brooke drives a lot for home health physical therapy. She put a ton of miles on it the first year. We bought it in May 2015, and by January 2017 it had about 58k on the clock. The reason I know it had 58k is because that's when we took it to the dealer. Right after I started the police academy. I normally handle all the car stuff, so it was frustrating that I was shipped off and not able to help her with the dealer that time. It was having CVT issues. While holding the pedal steady, the RPM's would fluctuate and "hard shift" into lockup and start the cycle again. Felt like the damn thing was gonna stall. It would at times fluctuate almost 2k RPM. Dealer sends it back, "we can't find anything wrong." So they reflash the TCU and we move along.

We go on our way. Goes OK for a week or two, starts doing it again. I take it down, and basically tell them you keep it till you figure out what's wrong with it and give us a damn courtesy car. Clock at 62k. 2k over the mileage limit. They try to say you're out of warranty and I tell them to get f*cked because I brought it in at 58K for the exact same issue and I will see them in court if they refuse to fix the issue. Tell them exactly when, where, and how to recreate the problem, and finally get a call back. "We're gonna get it to do it while we have the diagnostic equipment hooked up and send the data to Nissan so they can advise what to do." Whatever. Don't know why you didn't just datalog it while testing. ANYWAYS. A few days later, we get a call back stating that they've successfully logged the issue, and it seems like a blockage or some other issue in the valve body. They're waiting to hear back from Nissan to see if it's more cost effective to repair/replace the valve body or just scrap the whole transmission. I can tell you the answer to that, but whatever. Nissan finally gets back and they replace the CVT. Cool. May have been a manufacturing issue and probably just a fluke. Service manager (I know, snake oil salesman) says he's never seen a repaired transmission come back when I ask about the warranty but he'd have to double check the mileage and time limit on the warranty. We're in a hurry, so we say don't worry about it. Figure there's at least a decent warranty on parts replaced UNDER WARRANTY. Move along. This was in February '16.

Fast forward to two days ago. We are on our way back from the hockey game (go Preds!) and the damn thing starts doing it all over again, just as bad as last time. Last time, it took a few weeks to get bad enough for me to accurately say that it wasn't a minor fluctuation of my foot on a bump or something. This time, it just went 0-100 all at once. Bouncing revs, hard lockup, lather, rinse, repeat. Call the dealer. Ask what the warranty on a replaced CVT is. "12 moths, 12,000 miles." You've gotta be f*cking with me. The first one lasted 58k before issues started. Replaced at 62k. sitting just under 89k now and it's gone out again? 27K miles is all this damn transmission is good for? And now we're gonna be out of pocket $3k for the new one? And even if we replace THIS trans, how long will *IT* last? No, no, no. We took that damn car in and traded it for a Hyundai. So Brooke is now the proud owner of a 2013 Hyundai Elantra GT hatchback with only 31K miles on it.

It seriously hurts when a brand that you've loved your whole life and faithfully driven literally turns around and produces such a s*** product and then basically says "tough luck buttercup" when it has issues. Both of us have literally always either been in the Nissan family or driven or owned a Nissan in some way since we have had our Driver's Licenses. My first car that I owned was my Z, and she literally grew up in the Nissan Family. Her dad's employee number is like 384 or something like that. He was there at groundbreaking. I can't believe that I couldn't even consider Nissan. I thought maybe Facebook was killing the forums, but I now think it's just Nissan's s*** product. They haven't put out anything worthwhile except for possibly the Titan XD in the past 10+ years. I'm just done with them. And that sucks.


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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:17 pm

Yeah man, I avidly advise everyone in the market to stay he heck away from Nissan CVTs. They always claim they've fixed whatever teething issues they had on the previous generation, but they never do.
That alone would be enough to not buy their product, but then, they also have GOD AWFUL customer service. Combine the 2, and I honestly wonder how they are still in business in the days of the internet and rapid communication.

When you're building cars that are worse than the f*** K car, its time to re-evaluate yourself as a company.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby Rogue One » Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:22 pm

Sorry to hear that, but a good rant nonetheless. The 2nd gen Rogue makes the old one look like a pig, but I'll never buy another Nissan, primarily for the reasons you've stated. Nissan's may look nice and have a good price point, but they're made with inferior components that fail too early and too often.

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Postby Larz » Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:53 pm

I couldn't agree more. We have an '09 M35 and a '17 Q60.
Even considering the difference in the 'type' of cars, there is still a massive void between the two. Both were mid $50k cars, both have every possible option, but the M is sooooooooooo much better built. I was hoping against hope to see a colab between Merc and Infiniti that produced a diesel sedan in the Q line-up, but no luck there.
It is obvious that Nissan / Infiniti have gone the way of ho-hum car makers - keeping the prices up while downgrading the quality. The amount of plastic inside the Q60 is just horrible. They didn't go full on 'tic-tac' container plastic, but it's not far above that level of quality. I only bought the Q60 because the lovely misses fell head past heels over it and we wanted to trade the huge SUV for something she would enjoy driving. Mind you, she still absolutely loves the Q60 and couldn't be happier, but i would never buy a Q60 for myself. The M (now Q70) is due for a refit in the next 2 years or so but I fear it will go the way of the Q60 with cheaper everything, instead of raising the standard of the present sedan. As for the CVT's ... I reckon they will continue to be used and continue to disappoint until the CVT issues are synonymous with Nissan.
It's a well known fact that the sole purpose of inventing the Infiniti brand was to capture the US market and compete with Lexus and the like. In reality, Americans have gotten used to plastic, low reliability US built cars, so maybe that is there excuse for not holding the higher ground? If my M dies tomorrow, I will look at the used Q's but also at the used Jag XJ's and used Lexus 460's. I have a feeling that Inifniti will not measure up to either of those.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby Kompresshun » Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:45 pm

Sadly I feel the same. I’ve been driving Nissans for over 16 years and Nissan literally makes nothing I would buy right now. When Kristen needed a new car, we ended up with a Mazda. I honestly am surprised I ended up with another Infiniti myself, because I came DAMN close to buying a Volkswagen Golf GTI or a Focus ST. My Q50 has been great so far, but aside from the power it really just doesn’t have that magic I remember from the other ones i’ve had... I just seems like Nissan not giving a crap anymore is trickling down to everything slowly.

The Pathfinder is the last thing I own that Nissan made right and I will drive it until it falls apart. It makes me sad to think when the day comes to replace it, because I honestly don’t know how I ever could. It saddens me even more to think that it will likely be with something that is not anything like it either. Hopefully it’s a long way away though, because it only has 156k on it right now.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby AZhitman » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:39 pm

Wow.

This echoes a lot of the threads we're reading in the Sentra forum. There's no way in hell I'll have a CVT in this family, unless I get to where I can't physically clutch/shift (and even then, it'll be an automatic).

It's only a matter of time before we say "fuggit" and start putting these rants out as content. Nissan's never done anything but hassle us anyway, and I'm all about honesty - I don't owe them s***.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby Bubba1 » Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:49 am

I've been a long time Nissan guy too, even bought several new. But I'm now down to just one, and it's 15 yrs old. I guess I've morphed into a classic Nissan/Datsun guy. Your experience reinforces my view that Nissan has still yet to figure out how to make a reliable CVT despite years of practice. I'm like Greg. I don't see myself ever buying a CVT car and with Nissan obsessed with the dang things, that pretty much rules out Nissans except perhaps a 370Z, which still offers a stick...at the moment. Though Nissans stubborn lack of development has made it into momentum car, which is kinda depressing. And NISMO has become little more than a cosmetic option package.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby Ace2cool » Fri Jan 12, 2018 6:54 am

Honestly I debated dropping this straight into general chat. Still toying with the idea of doing it because people looking at this brand need to know what they may be stepping into. My former coworker had a juke doing basically the same thing except it would just hold the revs at 4k no matter throttle input. Was more like the runaway Toyota thing than anything else. But it was a CVT issue too. Took him about 6 or 7 months to get Nissan to buy the damn thing back and him get a Frontier. It's like they don't care what happens once the car leaves the factory.
Actually I know for a fact they done care what happens after it rolls off that line. Someone last year stole like 14 cars off the lot, and Nissan didn't even want to prosecute. They just cut it as a loss and moved on. They don't care what the end result consumer feels like. They just care about how many cars they're pushing out those roll up doors at the north end of the plant. I worked there. Saw it firsthand. Saw long term employees get shafted and no answers. It's maddening.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Ilya » Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:49 am

My dad's CVT on his '14 Pathfinder failed before it hit 10kmi. I'll never own a car with a CVT. I've had ZERO issues with my other 4 Nissan products ('97 Maxima GXE, '99 Maxima SE, 07' M35x and current '11 M56x) that are non-CVT. My brother has had a '01 Maxima SE and '02 Altima and he's been fine too.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby centralcoaster33 » Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:26 pm

I've seen so many posts like these. All I can say to the public is to take it to the dealer if it's still under warranty usually. What I want to say is you shouldn't have bought a CVT. They suck. They're s***. I'm sorry you were talked into it or just didn't know. Sell the whole car ASAP and get something else, without a CVT, especially if it's a Nissan. But I don't say that to members of the public. I have zero plans to ever own any CVT until I start hearing about one that actually lasts the life of the car (and I still expect that to be above 250,000 miles). So, yeah, pretty much zero plans.

Anyway, I've come to the realization that I'm a 240sx guy, maybe even just a car guy, I'm not really a Nissan guy. I like the ideas of faith and loyalty, but it doesn't fit with the logical side of my brain in regards to cars. Besides, Nissan's never done anything to earn my faith or loyalty. We bought a Versa with automatic for my wife our first new car purchase ever. BTW - the purchase experience was not very good and I can't say I'd like to do it again at a dealership. I don't like a lot of Nissan cars and the current lineup is blander than ever. With all the CVT applications it may be the least reliable lineup ever as well. I don't see why I'd go back to a Nissan dealership (Okay, just for OEM parts and just for the ones that I can't source elsewhere).

I'm a huge fan of cars, yet I don't like a lot of modern cars (to be fair, it's not just new Nissans). For my garage and my tastes, I only like a few cars and of those, used 240SX's are the right compromise between budget and performance.

This Sunday I look forward to purchasing my 5th 240SX from a private party and not having to deal with Nissan in anyway whatsoever.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Desert Rat » Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:03 pm

I was lucky on the 2 Muranos I owned....Ex wife has the last one....don't care if the damn thing blows up now...lol

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Jesda » Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:35 pm

This is probably how a lot of Ford, GM, and Mopar fans felt when the late 70s and early 80s ushered in an era of disposable trash. They defected in droves and gave rise to Nissan, Toyota, and Honda in North America.

The tables have turned. I'd buy a Corvette or Mustang with zero hesitation. You couldn't put a gun to my head to get me to take ownership of most modern Nissans.

A friend went through a similar hassle with steering issues on his G37 (or whatever it's called now). Barely a fart cloud out of warranty. Cost him almost three grand out of pocket to fix.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Ace2cool » Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:32 pm

Yeah, that's about how much it would've cost for the new trans.

And as a continued narrative to what you said about the big 3 giving rise to the Japanese automakers, we have moved on to Hyundai. Good things coming out of Korea right now.

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Re: I'm gonna have a rant outside of the public eye. Don't mind me.

Postby Buzzman » Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:26 pm

Bubba1 wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 3:49 am
I've been a long time Nissan guy too, even bought several new. But I'm now down to just one, and it's 15 yrs old.
I don't see myself ever buying a CVT car
Add my name to the list. No more Nissans.
Like you, I still have my 2002 Pathfinder in the driveway, but that's it. I'll keep it until it breaks.
I've had 5 Nissans in the family at one time, but they're all gone, save the Pathfinder.
They were all good cars, the newest one being a 2006 Altima, which I traded in on a new Mazda 6 GT two months ago. Great car.
I didn't even bother visiting the Nissan dealer when shopping around.
Like others here, there's not a single Nissan in the showroom that I would buy today...
....and definitely no vehicles with CVT's. That ruled out Honda, Subaru, and others as well.
Nissan has certainly diluted their product quality, all for a quick buck it seems.
They sell a crap load of Altimas (esp. in Florida) to the car rental companies.
They rely much too much on this business to increase their sales numbers.
Looks good on paper, but it won't last.
It's going to hurt them big time when all these used rentals hit the used car market.
Anybody buying a new Altima will be shocked at the depreciation hit their car will take. These things will be worth nothing in 5 years.
Imagine trying to unload a 4-5 year old Altima with a bad transmission? Ouch.
As for dealer service....my original Nissan dealer was great.
Unfortunately, they got bought out a few years ago by a corporate chain of dealerships, and promptly went down the sewer.
They renovated the place somewhat (looks worse), but they also brought in their own people, and turfed most of the good folks who worked for the previous owner.
I've been back with my Pathfinder several times (oil change, recalls), and can tell you they sucked big time.
Like others have said, they just don't give a s***.
Buh bye Nissan.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Ilya » Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:32 pm

centralcoaster33 wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 1:26 pm
Besides, Nissan's never done anything to earn my faith or loyalty. We bought a Versa with automatic for my wife our first new car purchase ever. BTW - the purchase experience was not very good and I can't say I'd like to do it again at a dealership.
Unfortunately this is the case with most dealerships regardless of brand.

I did a pretty great job at negotiating the deal for my parents on the aforementioned '14 Pathfinder (mom at the time was like 55 and dad was 62) and unfortunately due to work I wasn't able to be there on the day they picked it up. Dealership didn't try to pull any fast ones on them while I was there but as soon as I wasn't, they talked my mom into signing something which added an additional like $750 to the price. My mom, who's no longer with us, was a smart lady...but even with her smarts and her pretty good English...at the end of the day they were immigrants and don't catch EVERYTHING that us kids who grew up here (me since I was 2) would catch when negotiating. Hate it when people take advantage of people like that.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby Buzzman » Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:29 pm

Ilya wrote:
Sat Jan 13, 2018 3:32 pm

Unfortunately this is the case with most dealerships regardless of brand.

they talked my mom into signing something which added an additional like $750 to the price.
We could/should probably start a new thread just on dealership experiences, as well as continuing on with the dreaded CVT crap thread.
Anyway, I agree, dealerships are not really your friend. They are there to make money. Period.
Some dealerships are just better at hiding that fact.
Having gone through the shopping/buying process recently, I can attest to that.
I recently bought a fully loaded Mazda 6 GT, and in the process, visited more than a few dealerships.
I'm also a little older than most, so I have many years of experience with various makes and dealers.
As an example, my undying hate for everything Honda and Acura is based 90% on dealer experience.
Every visit to one of their dealerships has been horrid, and I have taken a personal oath never to have one of their products in my driveway...ever.
In my latest travels, I stopped by a new Toyota dealership in my neighbourhood, to check out the 2018 Camry and Avalon.
I walked in the door and around the showroom, and was promptly completely ignored.
Not even the receptionist could be bothered lifting her eyes off of her phone.
I checked out the showroom cars, sat in a few, and not a single employee acknowledged my presence.
I gave them plenty of time to approach me, and....nothing. It wasn't busy either. I was the only guy wandering around.
I finally just walked out. No Camry for me thankyou.
As for my Mazda experience, I dealt with two dealers, playing one off against the other. One dealership wasn't pleased, but the other one was great.
They had no problem with what I was doing, and actually encouraged me to shop around.
All they asked was for me to give them a chance to respond, which I did.
I was in no hurry, so I took about two months to finally pull the trigger. The dealer was patient and very cooperative, with no pressure.
Even the chat with the manager to sign the paperwork was pressure free.
I was firm with my stance that they shouldn't bother trying to sell me any add-ons, extended warranties, etc., etc., and they didn't.
I also snagged some free stuff that the other dealer wasn't willing to do.
All this to say, that there are bad dealers and good dealers.
Not everyone has the fortitude to stand up to the bad guys, and those people are the ones that get taken advantage of.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby MikeRL411 » Sat Jan 13, 2018 11:09 pm

I have developed a strategy for dealing with buying a new car [yes from a Datsun or Nissan franchise]. After negotiating with the jerk at the desk, insist on talking with the real decision maker. The salesman is just a puppet and is looking to preserve his/her commission. If no response, walk out. If the real money man does show up, repeat your last best offer. Leave with the "I'll be back when you are willing to deal." Come back a few days later, insist on meeting with the last meeting deal maker. Pull out a check with the face down. Tell the dealer that you will turn it over and sign it when he says the right number or you will tear the check up. It works ! I buy cash up front, not time payment.

The best time to buy is at the end of the sales quarter and especially at model year change over. Most dealers are stupid enough to post tags on the window shield giving the date the vehicle was first put on the lot. Not obvious but month and dated are easily decoded. "Do you want the bank to sell this vehicle through another dealer since they now own the paper work or do you want to get the seller's credit?" is also a good tactic. Most vehicles on the lot are financed through a bank loan, and if not sold within a set period the bank is free to sell through another of its loan circle of dealers.

Going through tne fleet sales department is also a good tactic if you are looking for a particularly hot model.

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Re: Originally posted this rant just in the mod forum. I reconsidered due to an obligation to honesty.

Postby MinisterofDOOM » Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:05 pm

Jesda wrote:
Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:35 pm
on his G37 (or whatever it's called now).
[email protected]#KING JOHAN.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby Ace2cool » Mon Jan 15, 2018 7:15 pm

2013-nissan-sentra-jerking-on-interstat ... l#p6762903

Unbelievable.
johnblaze wrote:
Mon Jan 15, 2018 4:32 pm
update

Service drove the car around 300 miles, one trip, noticed that the rpms would bounce and car would jerk... but did not think it was very bad, also no data of why exactly it was doing this....so in conversation recording above, the acknowledged there is a problem, but cant tell what it is

nissan called and expressed they will do nothing today, stating dealership could not reproduce problem....and they are done doing anything....have a great day

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:13 am

That would make me irate to the point of violence and destruction.
Its like "not only are we not going to help you, but we're also calling you a liar, even though this is a fairly well documented occurrence".
I'm glad I'm not involved in this one.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby centralcoaster33 » Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:46 am

It takes a certain type of personality to be a salesperson and there are good and bad ones. I needed work and tried sales once, but I don't have it in me. My solution to dealing with car salesmen has been to not deal with them at all. For our Versa, the sales rep was unfortunately typical of the bad sort and I won't go into it because that is another topic. I did get my new 240sx, also another topic.

On topic, there's just too many sad stories of CVT owners hoping they don't have to buy yet another transmission to put into their car. The only happy stories of CVT owners I've read are when the units are replaced at the dealership under warranty. Those people are happy at that point. But that tends to not last. Once the CVT is replaced, it's time to unload the car because you'll likely be buying and paying for installation of the next one sooner than you think. I remember there is a medium ground also. People who have a working CVT but just don't like the feel and or the lack of power delivered, so they come here asking about 'mods' that might help them. Try nice wheels and a sub-woofer?

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby Ace2cool » Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:39 pm

centralcoaster33 wrote:
Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:46 am
The only happy stories of CVT owners I've read are when the units are replaced at the dealership under warranty. Those people are happy at that point. But that tends to not last. Once the CVT is replaced, it's time to unload the car because you'll likely be buying and paying for installation of the next one sooner than you think.
Literally my narrative in johnblaze's post.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby WDRacing » Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:39 pm

I've never been a huge fan of Nissan. I got into Nico because I had a Skyline over on Okinawa. If not for that car I'd have never owned one most likely. I certainly wouldn't ever own anything newer than 98. Just too many better options available in every market segment. Not mentioning all the customer service s*** I've been exposed to through Nico.

I like the old stuff Datsun/Nissan made.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby RicerX » Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:21 am

Will say this... knock on wood, our 2015 Rogue is fine, but the powertrain warranty expired on it last week (already hit 60,000 miles) so it's likely we're trading it soon (need something bigger anyway). I need to get my Titan back and settle with insurance before I even visit that. In light of such, we have begun test driving nearly everything but a Nissan. The Mazda CX-9 is absolutely fantastic and might even be my top pick for a three row crossover in that segment. She really likes the Pathfinder and at the end of the day, if Momma really wants that, that's what I'm buying her, but the second it begins to give us trouble and leaves my wife and kid stranded somewhere, the jig is up. It will get ONE chance and one chance only, and that's only if I've exhausted all other options. Right now, the Acura MDX, CX-9, Pathfinder, QX60, and Toyota 4Runner are among those we have driven and liked, and I'd entertain the Infiniti because Infiniti knows if their customer service sucks they'll just get finished off by Lexus and the Germans. They can't afford not to take care of their existing owners. Nissan can, for now.

My stepmom's 14 Pathfinder was getting ready to drop transmission #3 at 75k miles when they traded for a QX80. A close friend of mine has a Quest that crapped a CVT on a family road trip at 61,000 miles. They were 1200 miles from home in the middle of nowhere when it croaked.

I wouldn't have bought my Titan if it wasn't for the insane price and the 100k mile bumper to bumper warranty, and I will say even above that, it's a pretty blunt instrument that I'll get solid use out of for a long time. Time will tell if it's another variation Nissan's cookie cutter printing press is stamping out. I'm hoping it's a solid vehicle and I have faith it will be as the Titans have been generally good for a while. If it ends up giving me grief, I'll dump it for a new Ram or Silverado... I'm genuinely impressed by what they showed in Detroit last week. The brand new Titan is now already a full generation behind those trucks... that didn't last long at all. Their updates are absolutely superb.

The Frontier, Titan, Armada, GT-R, and Z are the last Nissans worth buying, and they're up against STIFF competition. None of those are class-leading in any way, despite what their marketing team will tell you (at least the GT-R was at one point, but it's $30k more expensive now and the competition has responded accordingly). Everything else is stamped out in volume with a CVT and it's clear that Nissan only cares about making the sales and flooding the roads with them. Their customer service reminds me of Verizon before the competition stepped up. "We don't care if 1-5% of these things have any problems as long as we're selling billions of them." It's sad.

Full final disclosure to echo Chris's sentiments above - I think I was done lying to myself about my Q50. It was absolutely a very nice car... nicely styled and did the job well. Easily the nicest car I've owned to date, but at the end of the day, it was pretty damn boring to drive. Even without the steer by wire system it still felt very disconnected. Open diffs on RWD also suck, and I don't care how much you inject automatic braking into the picture, that crap will never replace a true LSD. The G37 might not be better on paper, but it's absolutely more fun and direct to drive. Hell, I had a QX70 loaner car while my Q50 was in for service, and it was a BLAST. Infiniti's hallmark sport sedan should not feel less engaging to drive than a 7 year old crossover, but it does.

Nissan has gotten into the business of building appliances for maximum profit. This time around, I needed an appliance (my Titan), but when it comes to fun cars, I'm gonna spread my wings and look around a bit. I can't say it won't be another Z (that's been my lifelong favorite sports car), but I can't say it will be either.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby PapaSmurf2k3 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:45 pm

I can't believe you'd let your wife get a Pathfinder knowing all the issues it's got, along with the MASSIVE depreciation it will have.
Some things affect you too, you know!

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby MinisterofDOOM » Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:47 pm

The thing is...

Even before CVTs, Nissan never made a decent trans. At least, not a decent automatic. They were all timebombs. Every damn one of them. ESPECIALLY the transverse boxes.

The RE4F? You'd be lucky to hit 200k.
RE5F? Lucky to hit 150k. They pretty much all explode at 130k like clockwork.
Even the RE4R was prone to issues with the cooling system in lots of models.

Basically, there's never been a Nissan with an auto that would last the life of the car.

In the '80s, Ford and Nissan got together and formed Jatco, which proceeded to s*** out some of the worst slushboxes in the history of the world.
Then, in the early 2000s, Nissan got the brilliant idea to use their demonstrated utter lack of experience and expertise in the transmission industry to create their own CVT manufacturing plants building their own design. No surprise after the previous decades of fail that these CVTs were as bad as transmissions can get.
But Nissan seems to demonstrate a trend of sticking with their products, good or bad, and the CVT wasn't something they were willing to replace or even revisit. They just stuck with the flawed design, added warranty coverage, and pretended it didn't happen.

The RE4F was in production for almost 30 years. It was never any good. It couldn't handle torque and wore prematurely. It also had slushy shifts that killed performance and wore clutches prematurely.
The current crop of CVTs will likely last until the end of Nissan's internal combustion product line.

The other thing that's crazy to me is Nissans aren't very good anymore anyway. Every time I get stuck in an Altima rental, it's a thoroughly unpleasant experience. Granted, there really aren't many midsize sedans I like much, but that's at least partly because automakers are giving up on them in favor of increasingly fuel-efficient midsize crossovers (Ford says the current Fusion only existed as a means to buy time to get the Edge's fuel economy where it needs to be, and there won't be a next-gen). But the Murano is meh. The Rogue is awful. The Sentra is upscale but mechanically inept. And why buy a Maxima when you can get an Avalon (let that statement coming from me sink in for a bit)?
Nothing in the Nissan lineup is above average, and most is well below.

The real problem is that people buy these cars. And they buy LOTS of them. The Rogue is the best selling single model in north America. What incentive does Nissan have to fix their s*** when people don't seem to care?

Stop buying s*** cars.
There's absolutely no reason to. There are more good options than ever, so the bad ones shouldn't warrant consideration.
Don't buy Corollas, don't buy Mitsubishis, and don't buy Nissans with CVTs.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby MikeRL411 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:33 pm

I beg to differ with the [never a decent automatic transmission in a Datsun] allegation. My British Borg Warner M35 in my 1967 RL411 has given me 50 years of reliable service. Granted, only 160,000 miles, I am gentle with my cars, but periodic preventive maintenance does pay off in reliability. Also I get a kick out of the dealership mechanics swarming around my car when I bring it in for transmission filter change and inspection/band torque test. I don't do that myself any more since my local Air Force Base discontinued the Auto Hobby Shop. I have a complete rebuild kit for future mishaps, the M35 is still used in European cars.


Now if you are talking Nissan JATCO transmissions you are probably right. Toyota used to use AISIN/WARNER transmissions and to my experience they were good. After all they were Borg Warner derivatives.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby wa-chiss » Fri Jan 19, 2018 11:17 pm

wow, makes me glad I work on and drive Toyotas (besides the S13). The amount of issues I see with Toyota (Aisin) transmissions is so minuscule, I venture to say 4-5 a year get replaced at my dealership. I can also say, most of those are usually owner neglect or damage from road debris type faults. I've only see like 2 corolla CVT transmissions need replacement due to manufacturer defects in my 8 years for Toyota (at my dealership). We usually only see issues in the trans right after they release a new model (See: New Tacoma, camry torque converter shudder, etc) and those can be chocked up to reprogramming and a slight fluid level increase of like 200ml (I rolled my eyes when Tech Assistance told me to add that much via the "Hand Pump").

AISIN, can build one heck of a transmission, can't design a water pump that doesn't leak.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby amc49 » Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:13 am

Borg Warner has made their share of junk too, I'm thinking of the M11-M12 ATX that used to go in American Motors cars (late 60s-early '70s), they broke at the drop of a hat and not recommended for anything putting out more than 300 hp., the problem being the larger 390 engine made 325 and we broke them left and right in 13 second drag cars, they became a reason to go to 4 speed MTX in the cars. Those were Warner Super T-10s and much stronger, at least until you were running in the low tens at 135+ mph, then they began to break with regularity as well.

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Re: Nissan CVT rant - from the people who know them best.

Postby centralcoaster33 » Mon Jan 22, 2018 1:34 pm

MinisterofDOOM wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:47 pm
The thing is...

Even before CVTs, Nissan never made a decent trans. At least, not a decent automatic. They were all timebombs. Every damn one of them. ESPECIALLY the transverse boxes.

The RE4F? You'd be lucky to hit 200k.
RE5F? Lucky to hit 150k. They pretty much all explode at 130k like clockwork.
Even the RE4R was prone to issues with the cooling system in lots of models.

Basically, there's never been a Nissan with an auto that would last the life of the car.
Well, not owning older Nissan slush boxes, I didn't really know this. However, it seems the old crappy automatic offerings are being replaced with even crappier CVTs that have half the old, crappy lifespan. That really is the opposite of progress.


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