Forced Induction Q45 Discussion

[HeavyDuty]

I was browsing Jim Wolf Technology's website, and noticed for the Q45, they list....

NON-APPLICATION SPECIFIC TURBO

They (finally) have a new website, but on a sidenote, anything's possible. You want to make your own Schedule 30 cast iron manifolding, intake piping, intercooler piping, downpiping, etc. & you, too, can bolt on this turbo to your Q45.

[HeavyDuty]

240SX, 280ZXT, 300ZX (Z31), ALTIMA, G20, I30, J30, M30, MAXIMA, Q45, SENTRA, SENTRA GTIR, TURBO ALL, ALTIMA 2002+, SENTRA 2.5L,

My reply was strictly tongue-in-cheek, there are only two cars on that list that ever came with turbos from the factory where an upgrade would be possible. (USDM cars), the 280ZX-T, Z31T.

The GTIR was a Sunny (B13 chassis, our Sentra or Canadian Sentra Classic, not offered w/turbo here) or Pulsar (JDM only, Japanese Direct or Domestic Market only, not available in the US-DM)

Sometimes even emoticons can't effectively convey tone of voice, inflection, or attitude correctly.

Verbatim, that's not a typo, but to list it as an upgrade for most of the vehicles listed above, it kinda is a web-goof.

[HeavyDuty]

FWIW, I wouldn't consider it outrageous, they stated "Non Application Specific." But perhaps they should add some verbage about it being the foundation of a custom made kit to avoid any confusion.

[911/Q45]

Don't forget you'll also need a bushel basket full of money!

[maxnix]

Money cures everything.

[AZhitman]

I know of at least one supercharged Q45 that is in exactly the same predicament that jkill referenced, and money ain't helping it (at least not yet).

[HeavyDuty]

Custom twin or single turbo, 10K before it's overwith. Subsequent systems would benefit from a lower price once jigs are made to reproduce the piping.

Still dunno if JWT makes a boost program for a Q, doubt it, which leaves you with an FMU (boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator that incrementally blocks the fuel return line based on xpsi/boost > fuel rail pressure increase.) For instance, a 10:1 FMU increases rail pressure 10psi per 1 psi of boost. There are FMU's from 2:1 up to 12:1.

Also some sort of BTM (a device that reads boost & retards timing based on user input for one psi/boost) For instance, at 1psi boost, it would retard the timing 1/3:1. 1/3 degree timing removed per 1 pound of boost.

Functional, but crude in an app like this.

If you were to remove the fan shroud, clutch fan, move the battery to the trunk, you'd have ample room for plumbing, the front end looks too smallish for one large front mount intercooler, you'd probably wind up using two smaller side mounts.

Biggest issue I see is making manifolds & engine management. Utilizing one larger turbo instead of two smaller would cut down on the plumbing. You'd be limited to 6-8 psi safely, I personally wouldn't want any more than that from a longevity standpoint.

[maxnix]

10,000, doesn't sound that outrageous to me at all. If a shop could give me that price, guarantee the work, and perform it in a decent timeframe, I'd make the check out immediately. It's something I've always wanted, and for a total investment of 20k (including car) I'd have one helluva automobile. The day someone does this, and is able to provide some know how, consider me in

Yes, dkill, there is a Santa Claus. And some fine real estate in Florida I would like to sell you.__________________Brian1995 Q45 & Q45t & 2000 Q45

Discover the power of the button!

[HeavyDuty]

What is the skinny with Rex's Vortech car? He told me about it when he came to my shop in 2000, but I didn't follow it.

As far as I can tell, man-ifolds and man-agement are the two big stumbling blocks, the plumbing is time consuming but not impossible.

[SOCAL91Q45a]

dkill ......

http://www.inductionconcepts.com/MustangCobra.asp

If these guys can twin turbo these cars, I bet a Q45 gen 1 is doable. Looks like their standard rate is $7500, and since you'd be a prototype custom install - you may get a price break.

I have no affiliation with these folk ... just like some of the work theyve done on the cars they illustrate.

Cant vouch for their abilities or speed of completion.

But damn - if they can fit all that into a mustang engine bay - there's enough room in the q45, especially if you mount batter in the trunk.

Good luck

[HeavyDuty]

Hey Ryan, thanks for the email.

The problem is that we spend huge amounts of time and money to develop a new turbo system. We have to ensure that when we are done, we can sell enough kits to offset the development costs.

Everyone "says" they want it, if it were tooled up, less than ten worldwide would not offset the R&D cost. They'd enjoy better success reproducing 52 Studebaker P/U seat frames. (see sig)

[QShip]

Everyone "says" they want it, if it were tooled up, less than ten worldwide would not offset the R&D cost. They'd enjoy better success reproducing 52 Studebaker P/U seat frames. (see sig)

Sad but true.

[SOCAL91Q45a]

Uhhh nico members ..... shall we send some email to RAD at induction concepts?

I find it rather hard to beleive that there is THAT much R&D expense - when you already have similar experience doing forced induction/turbo on 4.6L / 5.4L DOHC ford motors. The Gen 1 Q motor isnt too terrible different in concept and function. Jeez man its a MOTOR, not a Mars Lunar Lander ..... Sure its hard, but wtf - isnt that what they say they do?

That email response from induction concepts is WEAK!

Very disappointing. Sounds like these cats dont really have the ROCKS they portray themselves to have.

[HeavyDuty]

With an upcoming 100shot, I won't have any power troubles, but I don't think I have any now.

List your name if you're seriously interested in a 90-95 twin turbo setup with manifolds, wastegate(s), turbos, downpipes, intake piping, intercooler & piping, recirc valve, and appropriate engine management. Keep in mind the system would probably retain the stock injectors or might have to upgrade to ~50lb inj, if necessary, would probably utilize a Cobra MAF or Z32 MAF, and the target boost would be less than 8 psi. Target system price with installation would be around 10k.

It would require a lot smaller turbo(s) than you would think for quick spool up and only 8 psi.

[SOCAL91Q45a]

8 PSI ? $10k for 8 PSI? Doesnt steallen have a roots style set up that produces that much boost?

8 PSI by intentional design, or thats the max these units can put out?

What about forged internals such as rods, pins, bolts, pistons - costs? Perhaps thats why there is a 8 PSI target?

Im on the list for a twin set up - but for $10k I want a lot more than 8 psi brother! Sorry to sound so "greedy".

[SOCAL91Q45a]

dkill - Im not saying the price is "outrageous" - at all.

Im saying if Im gonna drop that much coin on a 13 yr old hot rod - I want more boost :-)

[Tgvince]

HD dont forget to add about 5k for the Level 10 transmission:)

Terry

[IvoryJ30t]

Listen, I would be willing to pay quite a bit of money for a high powered twin turbo VH45de. What I am scared of is having a project vehicle i know nothing about, sitting dead in a shop for years, while it undergoes something that has never been done before.

ship your q to new york, give me $17,000 and ill drop a 5 speed vg30dett in it pushing 400-500 horsepower.

two month turn around.

[HeavyDuty]

8 PSI ? $10k for 8 PSI? Doesnt steallen have a roots style set up that produces that much boost?

AFAIK, not for this application.

8 PSI by intentional design, or thats the max these units can put out??

By design, for stock internals.

What about forged internals such as rods, pins, bolts, pistons - costs? Perhaps thats why there is a 8 PSI target?

Im on the list for a twin set up - but for $10k I want a lot more than 8 psi brother! Sorry to sound so "greedy".

A forged rotating assy, different turbos & appropriate mgt. could produce enough to take you wherever you want to go. Rough calc's287 base hp x 8psi = 440hp260 base hp x 8psi = 400hp

Schtealin' uses Vortech head units, centrifugal, not roots, positive displacement, whipple, etc.

No doubt, Vince, a stout trans, good mounts, suspension is all part of the package, but we're only bench racing anyway...right?

Ivory J30t said:"ship your q to new york, give me $17,000 and ill drop a 5 speed vg30dett in it pushing 400-500 horsepower. two month turn around."

400-500 is a big range. Is that with a stock long block vg30? I'm with ya, I follow ya & I believe ya, but I think the idea was improving the VH45.

[1qckser]

Remember AGM has done a lot of the work for us to follow, I dont think he is too far from complete, and the good thing is if its gotta go back to N/A it wouldnt take that long to just remove the plumbing, or you could just try this.http://www.ststurbo.com/____why_remote_mounting

[SOCAL91Q45a]

HD ... what have we here?

This was what I was talin about when I recalled seeing stillens jive ....

http://www.stillen.com/Sportsc...age=1

[IvoryJ30t]

Ivory J30t said:"ship your q to new york, give me $17,000 and ill drop a 5 speed vg30dett in it pushing 400-500 horsepower. two month turn around."

400-500 is a big range. Is that with a stock long block vg30? I'm with ya, I follow ya & I believe ya, but I think the idea was improving the VH45.

yeah. I was more or less playing around.

i was toying with the idea of a 1st gen Q45 after i finish my J project.

what i would do is use the VG30DETT, 5 speed transmission [saves alot of cost without a beefed up auto]

twin ball bearing turbos, injectors, intercooler [placement would be tough] and various other goodies.

since the Q is a heavy car, it would never be a drag racer, but it would be a damn nice mile muncher with a 400-450 horse VG 5 speed. that thing would be an animal on the highway.

the actual cost would be far below 17K, since the VG would pump that out on stock internals and not break a sweat.

its just a thought. i dont know if i would even bother to do it. this whole "RB 5 speed in my J30" is gonna take up all my free time.

i dont need a two ton money vacuum. i already have my J.

[HeavyDuty]

HD ... what have we here?

This was what I was talin about when I recalled seeing stillens jive ....

http://www.stillen.com/Sportsc...age=1

I knew I should have clarified that with (Maxima) supercharger kits from them. I've not had a chance to do any work on a G35, except for minor bolt ons.

[1qckser]

I think that if we could fab up a bracket for a Vortech or a Paxton Supercharger it might be a little more economical than throwing 10+ thousand dollars at a 1st gen Q, move the battery to the rear, have the piping done, do an fmu and a Greddy E-Manage and run say 5-7 psi to keep it safe and you have a really nice power producing package for not a ton of money, the Mustang guys are always selling used chargers and it would be easy to fab up a bracket, just my 2 cents.l:pimp

[PalmerWMD]

Hmmmm.

My battery is already in trunk.

Fred...

[SOCAL91Q45a]

1qckser - Ive been thinking the same thing for quite a while now. from my Mustang background ... It needs to be done! :-)

[PalmerWMD]

If someone had a package deal already sorted, where I could just show up with my car and say $5000 and leave with my car and a sorted SC on it, I'd do it.

Fred..

[SOCAL91Q45a]

$5k - $10 for 7-8 PSI of boost to run safely on STOCK internals seems a bit .... short sighted. I feel good about the stock crankshafts, however the rod/pistons and misc hardware concerns me in a boosted application. Id rather find a proper set of forged rods, pistons and new bearings, THEN boost it to 10+ PSI :-)

But I guess we need to start somewhere .....

Bolt it on till it blows ?

[IvoryJ30t]

I think it's a great idea. If you're going to do it on a j, why not do it on a q. It would be one helluva freeway monster. Like those sc430s with supra tt engine swaps, mean sonuva*****es

the j's getting an RB. when im done with that one, i was seriously considering a VG'ed 1st gen Q. it would all depend on if i can get a good physical condition Q with high miles or a blown motor for cheap. ill probably be done with my J by the end of the year [hopefully sooner, but its an expensive project]. ive gotten my fill of little cars, and i focus mainly on full size cars with power.

ill see how it goes.

[IvoryJ30t]

also, i would not keep the 8 cyl. z32 front cuts are cheap enough. i always prefer pushing a motor built for boost, than a motor that was designed and engineered to be naturally aspirated.