DOC....Need a Couple Questions Answered Please!!!

[domdada]

That's the diagram I was goin by. At first I did try hooking up the power to the harness, and I got nothing....so that's when I tapped it in to the power outlet. I didn't check the continuity with a multimeter and this is probably because I don't have one...lol. I'm gonna try to run the ground wire to where I grounded the green parking wire to bypass watching dvd's while driving.

[AppleBonker]

That's the diagram I was goin by. At first I did try hooking up the power to the harness, and I got nothing....so that's when I tapped it in to the power outlet. I didn't check the continuity with a multimeter and this is probably because I don't have one...lol. I'm gonna try to run the ground wire to where I grounded the green parking wire to bypass watching dvd's while driving.

I'm assuming the video bypass is working? If so, that should function as an acceptable grounding point. I would also recommend tapping into the red accessory power wire for power to the adapter. If you use one of the always on power cables, you may be draining your battery with the PAC connector (albeit very slowly).

Based on your descriptions of the pins you connected the resistors to, something sounds wrong. I can see pin 6 as the fourth pin on the top row, but pin 16 is not the first on the bottom row. Or, was your numbering based on the pins that actually had wires connected to them (if I remember correctly some of the pins on that side of the harness had no wire)?

The fact that the light doesn't come on with the power of the car means that the adapter is not receiving power correctly. Either the ground or the power are not functioning correctly. If it powers on but you cannot program it correctly, that means the resistors are not connected properly.

[domdada]

I'm sorry, I meant to say the 3rd pin on the bottom (the first wire available on the bottom) and the 4th pin on the bottom for ground (the second wire available on the bottom)

[rjdmmfl1]

I'm sorry, I meant to say the 3rd pin on the bottom (the first wire available on the bottom) and the 4th pin on the bottom for ground (the second wire available on the bottom)

Domdada, I may go out and install my PAC unit just to help you out with this... I would have to really dissect where you made the mistake, and right now I'm a bit busy... thanks for holding it down applebonker, I'll try to chime in with some useful info after I re-read through this later this evening and have some free time

[AppleBonker]

Sounds like you should be ok. I would verify the ground and power connections. Also, you didn't disconnect the bluetooth module from the trunk, correct?

[domdada]

AppleBonker....Bluetooth to the trunk? I didn't run anything to the trunk. The only thing that I know of that would be ran to the trunk would be the wire going to the reverse light for a reverse camera, but I didn't do that.

Thanks Doc, i know about being busy. I'm juggling 3 jobs right now so time is at a minimal to me as well. I thought that you had the PAC in there and would have an idea what the problem would be. Take your time, I'm really in no rush to get it working. The remote control has been handy and if I don't get this to work.....I may just take the PAC out and not bother with it.

[AppleBonker]

AppleBonker....Bluetooth to the trunk? I didn't run anything to the trunk. The only thing that I know of that would be ran to the trunk would be the wire going to the reverse light for a reverse camera, but I didn't do that.

Thanks Doc, i know about being busy. I'm juggling 3 jobs right now so time is at a minimal to me as well. I thought that you had the PAC in there and would have an idea what the problem would be. Take your time, I'm really in no rush to get it working. The remote control has been handy and if I don't get this to work.....I may just take the PAC out and not bother with it.

Not sure what packages you have on your car, but if you have factory bluetooth connectivity (I think I'm seeing a sunroof so you should have this) the module is factory installed in the trunk under the styrofoam. Hopefully this wasn't removed. If it was, the steering wheel controls will not function.

[domdada]

I didn't have the factory bluetooth feature on my car. The 3.5 A/C come with standard sunroof. I have not removed anything that I don't need to. I do have experience in wiring systems together, but I have never dealt with a PAC before.

[AppleBonker]

My mistake. Shows how much attention I paid to the packages available. I don't see any reason why your unit shouldn't be working then. I'd have to look at mine to double check. Unfortunately, I probably wont have the opportunity to do that until I get around to installing the bluetooth microphone. Not sure when that'll be, but when I do it I'll take plenty of pictures to try to help people out. Maybe Doc will get around to his first, who knows?

[rjdmmfl1]

OK Domdada, just went out, replugged my factory bluetooth unit, and installed my PAC unit.. worked like a charm, only took about 10 minutes...

I'll be back on later with a step by step.. I think I know what your problem is... and i have a solution on how to fix it..



this photo is correctly color coded for the wires...

the conections must be secure, therefore I would

1. cut two small pieces of white wire2. Solder the 150 ohm and 47 ohm resistors to the white wite on the PAC unit3. solder the other ends of the resistors to one end of the small piece of wire you cut earlier4. use 22 Gauge T-tap connectors and tap into the wire in pin #16(grey/blue) and #6(white/green). COnnect the blue/black wire on the factory harness to ground.

Doing it this way should provide for strong connections, and now you can proceed with the install!

Modified by rjdmmfl1 at 12:50 AM 7/25/2008
Modified by rjdmmfl1 at 12:50 AM 7/25/2008

[domdada]

I swear I love u.....please do cause I don't want to have a half a** job sitting in my car.

Other than the PAC not working. I installed the DNX and it's working like a charm. I absolutly love this unit, you sold me off on this unit and it was well worth it. One of my boys has the Z2, this unit s***s on it. He fell in love with it too.

Get back with me so I know what the problem is and correct it.

[rjdmmfl1]

recheck my last post again.. I have the diagram there!

[domdada]

Robert,

Where did you ground the ground wires to? And did you connect the power wire to the kenwood's power wire or to another power source?

-Domonic

[rjdmmfl1]

Robert,

Where did you ground the ground wires to? And did you connect the power wire to the kenwood's power wire or to another power source?

-Domonic

well, remember, your parking brake wire is grounded somewhere right? So I just connected the ground on the PAC-SWi JACK to the grounded parking brake wire. Also, yes, just connect the power on the PAC-SWi Jack to the power on the aftermarket harness adapter (or the kenwood's power)

[domdada]

zerothread?id=294580

Looking at the link above....there's a pic that shows where the parking brake line was grounded to. I grounded mine to the bolt directly below that. Now seeing that when I put a CD in the DNX, it plays through the DVD source....and if this is working, does that mean that I bypassed the parking brake wire and have a good ground?

[rjdmmfl1]

zerothread?id=294580

Looking at the link above....there's a pic that shows where the parking brake line was grounded to. I grounded mine to the bolt directly below that. Now seeing that when I put a CD in the DNX, it plays through the DVD source....and if this is working, does that mean that I bypassed the parking brake wire and have a good ground?

not exactly, if you can play a movie through your DNX while driving, then you have correctly grounded the parking brake, and can tap into that grounded wire! The DNX , although it uses the same drive for DVD's/ CD's, can tell the difference between the two, and will allow CD's to play regardless of the condition of the parking brake, but will eiether black out the screen or have a flashing parking brake sign (while driving and watching a movie), if the parking brake isn't properly grounded

[domdada]

I'm about to leave the house to go to work....I'm gonna grab a dvd with me and see what happens. Like I said, I believe I should have a good ground because it's using the bolt below where you put your ground wire in that pic but it's on the same metal bracket.

[rjdmmfl1]

I'm about to leave the house to go to work....I'm gonna grab a dvd with me and see what happens. Like I said, I believe I should have a good ground because it's using the bolt below where you put your ground wire in that pic but it's on the same metal bracket.

Ok cool, hopefully you have a soldering iron, I just picked up a cheap one from radio shack to do mine...

its the best way to ensure good contact between the resistors and the appropriate wires... also, you can pick up those 22guage T taps in radio shack.. the radio shack workers may not know where they are if you ask them, but its in those tool drawers they have there with all the connections. Use these to tap into the wire on the factory harness as shown on the diagram I created... OK, now you have no excuses, go knock this thing out, and be happy about the $200 + dollars you saved in install fees

[domdada]

******EDIT******

I got DVD playing so that means my ground is good. I'm gonna ground the PAC to that spot too and at the same time, sodder the resistors and hopefully I will be all set. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

lol....Thanks Robert.

One of the installer (who i'm friends with) who used to work for my friends car shop still does car installs at home, but he's so busy....it be weeks till he got to my car. Also, because of the relation we have, he'll try to charge me next to nothing and I really don't want him to do that, he's got a family to raise.

But on a serious note....I really do appreciate ur help with this.
Modified by domdada at 10:57 AM 7/25/2008

[rjdmmfl1]

******EDIT******

I got DVD playing so that means my ground is good. I'm gonna ground the PAC to that spot too and at the same time, sodder the resistors and hopefully I will be all set. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

lol....Thanks Robert.

One of the installer (who i'm friends with) who used to work for my friends car shop still does car installs at home, but he's so busy....it be weeks till he got to my car. Also, because of the relation we have, he'll try to charge me next to nothing and I really don't want him to do that, he's got a family to raise.

But on a serious note....I really do appreciate ur help with this.

Modified by domdada at 10:23 AM 7/25/2008

I started out not knowing how to do any of this stuff.. an one by one, I began to tackle projects, learning as I go... after you tackle this yourself, and see how easy it is, you'll thank me! It'll give you that much more confidence to go tackle the next project

[domdada]

Robert,

Like I mentioned to you before, I have experience doing system installs.This experience that I have came when I worked on my 03 altima at my friends shop in detroit (Noyz and Toyz/313 Motoring)

I can hook up subs and amps and all the components that go along with that. Interior spearkers I know how do do. Headunits (dvd/navi now thanks to you) I can do like it's nothing. I know how install t/v's in headrests, visors, ect but not wiring them up to the main source. the only things that I need to improve on is building custom enclosures for subs and wiring up multi-media(t/v's and of that sort). As I have more time available to do this stuff, I will for sure tackle them down, but time is key and if i cannot get to it, that's when I call up my boy Will and ask him to do it for me.

I'm gonna try to tackle the PAC this weekend and Hopefully it will go well. I will keep you posted and let you know how it went.

-Dom

[domdada]

OK Doc, I have another question. First, I haven't had time to go back behind the radio and fix up the PAC but I hopefully will soon. My question for you is this.

I saw a post regarding the Boston Acoustic Pro60's and that you are not happy with the way they sound. I was thinking about getting these for my interiors except I was going to get the Pro 60's for the rear deck and make a templet for them to fit there. I have an audio control 3.1 and audio control matrix from my last car that I can tie into it the system. Will this help the cause for making the speakers sound better or are these speakers just a waste of money? If so, what's the next best thing?

[rjdmmfl1]

OK Doc, I have another question. First, I haven't had time to go back behind the radio and fix up the PAC but I hopefully will soon. My question for you is this.

I saw a post regarding the Boston Acoustic Pro60's and that you are not happy with the way they sound. I was thinking about getting these for my interiors except I was going to get the Pro 60's for the rear deck and make a templet for them to fit there. I have an audio control 3.1 and audio control matrix from my last car that I can tie into it the system. Will this help the cause for making the speakers sound better or are these speakers just a waste of money? If so, what's the next best thing?

well I went over this with my custom audio guy, and he also stated that he feels the new Boston Pro 60's are lacking in the mid bass arena. For $500, I am definately disappointed. RIt could be that I'm just putting too much power to them... the Rockford T600-4 does about 200 watts @ 2 ohms and ~120 watts at 4 ohms... the Pro 60's are 3 ohms, so I'm putting around 160 watts to them.

Another issue I'm having is that the way we wired my amp, I have the front channels going to the rear speakers and vice versa... we did this so that I could better control the highs coming from the Pro 60's with use of the remote EQ on the T600-4 (the remote EQ only controls the rear outputs)

In nay case, when I have some more time, I will go back in, switch out the wiring the way itys supposed to be, and use the remote EQ for the 6x9's.

THe new Rockford remote EQ's take the signal and increase the dB @ 45 HZ and 12 KHz... unfortunately, even though I have the HP crossover set at 120 Hz on both the headunit and the Amp for those speakers, the remote EQ overpowers that, and is still sending signals @ 45 HZ to the front mid bass speakers, thus the banging @ higher volumes

I think all in all, with some tweaking, I may be happy with them... I was blasting UGK's "Top Notch H*es" today, and the midbass was just plain sick.. sounded very good.. so I think there's hope for them.

In the end, the main problem is the neodynium drivers... they just don't produce very good mid bass

[domdada]

ok, I see what you are saying. Everyone here in the Detroit area know that the baddest interiors to get are Boston Acoustics and MB Quartz....(some people swear by pioneer and the "REV" series interior, which I had in my '03, but aren't all that). I researched and did a comparision on the 2 and seen that the B/A's specs are more appealing than the MBQ's.

Regardless of the interior speakers I choose to go with, I wouldn't really push them to get too much Mid-Bass Out of them. I would want them to sound more crisp and clean and have my sub do all the banging (Just like a home theater set up where your surround speakers give you the nice, crisp sounds of the music, and the subwoofer adding the bang.) But that's just my opinion.

You said that there is too much power from your amp to the speakers and this is resulting in the not so great sound.....I have 2 Mmats SQ 4070 amps that I'm gonna use to hook up the interiors. I was going to get 2 sets of the Boston Pro60 and a set or 2 of the S35 Tweeters. Will these amps do for the speakers.....are they overkill or not enough???

[rjdmmfl1]

ok, I see what you are saying. Everyone here in the Detroit area know that the baddest interiors to get are Boston Acoustics and MB Quartz....(some people swear by pioneer and the "REV" series interior, which I had in my '03, but aren't all that). I researched and did a comparision on the 2 and seen that the B/A's specs are more appealing than the MBQ's.

Regardless of the interior speakers I choose to go with, I wouldn't really push them to get too much Mid-Bass Out of them. I would want them to sound more crisp and clean and have my sub do all the banging (Just like a home theater set up where your surround speakers give you the nice, crisp sounds of the music, and the subwoofer adding the bang.) But that's just my opinion.

You said that there is too much power from your amp to the speakers and this is resulting in the not so great sound.....I have 2 Mmats SQ 4070 amps that I'm gonna use to hook up the interiors. I was going to get 2 sets of the Boston Pro60 and a set or 2 of the S35 Tweeters. Will these amps do for the speakers.....are they overkill or not enough???

OK, for crisp highs, the Pro 60's will hang with anything out there in the market... I have ~ 160 watts going to these things and the highs don't distort at all at cranked up volumes... ( aguy pulled up next to me last night while I was parked at a red light, and tried to out blast me with his system... after I cranked my up, it COMPLETELy drowned out his system, and he had to close his windows.... LOL

Again, my only complaint with the Pro 60's is regarding the midbass... but to fix that, I'm gonna keep the front crossover @ 120 HZ, and take the remote EQ off of the front...again, with tweaking, I think I can get it where I want... I just have so much damn power going to them !

Ok regarding your amp, the Mmats SQ 4070 , does 70 watts at 4 ohms, but it does not list a ratting @ 2 ohms... usually, when this is done, it means the amp is not stable @ 2 ohms, and thus it may not be stable @ 3 ohms!

I would say the Rockford T400-4 amp would be great for these speakers... the T600-4 is just too powerful!

Oh yeah, if you go with two sets of Pro 60's, your car is gonna be rediculously loud, crisp and precise with no distortion, but LOUD... in a good way

Honestly, if I could do it over again, I personally would go with some FOCAL UTOPIAS!

I decided I'm not changing my system any time soon.... gotta save up for other stuff now!

[domdada]

A bit off subject, but how sick is blakes turbo in real life?

Ok, back to this subject...I'm gonna sell off the 2 Mmats sq4070s and go with the Rockford amps. Now I was thinking since I would have an open channel on one of the amps, I would incorporate another set of S35's somethere in the rear of the car (possibly make a cut in the side panels next to the seats and flush mount the tweeters in there....if not, I will figure something out) If I do this....do I get 2 of the 400-4 amps or do I go with something different. And if you recommend both amps to be the 400-4, should one amp be dedicated to the pro60's and the other the S35's, or should each amp have a set of the Pro60 and a set of the S35?

Also, rather than the FOCAL UTOPIAS, why not opt for the B/A SPZ60's?

I'm sorry if I'm throwing out too much at you....especially this late at night.

[AppleBonker]

Just gotta throw in my two cents for component setups. It appears that you want to stick with component speakers (at least up front) rather than purchasing a mid and tweet separate and running an active crossover (this would also require an external audio processor). I would highly recommend checking out the following:

Dynaudio System 242 http://dynaudio.com/eng/auto/esotec/242.php This setup has phenomenal midbass. All of dynaudio's drivers perform well, and my next upgrade will probably be to some dynaudio esotar2 mids and tweets for my front soundstage.

Rainbow Audio Germaniums CS265.25 http://195.243.203.21/rainbow/...n=ENG This may have the best tweeter I've ever heard (from a component setup that is). I have heard better tweeters, but they'll run near $800/pair (just for the tweets) and will require active processing.

In my opinion, these are probably two of the best component systems on the market. You're not going to find either in stores, so reviewing them will be much more difficult. However, if you browse some car audio forums, you will find plenty of people that use them (and most likely someone who will let you demo them). One additional benefit to running somewhat unheard of speakers (although in the mobile audio community these are both VERY well known and HIGHLY regarded - just look up reviews), is the average person will ask you what you have in your car before hearing it and give this response - "I've never heard of them" while thinking (probably some no-name brand with terrible quality). Once they get a listen, however, they'll be soiling themselves. It's also nice when the average person has no idea how much you spent on your equipment.

Edit: I just noticed you're looking at the SPZ 60's. For that money, you should be able to pick up either of these two sets that I've recommended. Once again this is only my opinion, but the dynaudio 242 or germaniums will blow anything BA out of the water.
Modified by AppleBonker at 7:44 AM 7/30/2008

[AppleBonker]

Again, my only complaint with the Pro 60's is regarding the midbass... but to fix that, I'm gonna keep the front crossover @ 120 HZ

Do you really have your sub crossed at 120Hz?!?

That is insanely high. That could be why the midbass sounds off. The Pro 60's should still hit pretty cleanly. Plus, you're feeding a lot of power for something in the range of 120 Hz on up. From ~60 Hz to 120 Hz those speakers will chew up a lot of power (basically whatever you can throw at them). If I were you, I'd try crossing them at 60 Hz and work your way up until they sound right. 120 Hz is just way too high IMO. My CMass UL12 can easily run past 200 Hz, but you'll never find me feeding those frequencies to the trunk (my sub and interiors are crossed at 63 Hz right now, but if I ever upgrade my mids I'll probably lower that even more). Subs are supposed to output frequencies that are non-directional. For most listeners, this transition happens around 75Hz. Feeding above that to the sub will make you hear the bass in the trunk (whereas a sub is supposed to be felt). Just some food for thought. Plus, this would be an easy thing to test as I'm about 99.9% certain your high pass/low pass filter is controllable through your HU.

[domdada]

AppleBonker---The set up I wanna do is this:

-B/A Pro60 for the front and rear -B/A S35 Tweeters for the Front -Maybe another S35 Tweeter incorporated in the car somewhere. (The SPZ were only mentioned cause DOC was tellling me about the FOCAL UTOPIAS and I said that woundn't the SPZ's be a better way to go)

As to power for these speakers, I had 2 Mmats SQ4070 amps but Doc said that they will not run at the ohms that these speakers need to be at so I'm gonna sell them and opt for the Rockford t-400-4 amps.

Now to better tune these speakers and the sub (Mmats Juggernaut 12" w/Mmats 2200.1 amp) I have an Audio Control 3.1 sound processor, (http://mobileaudiocontrol.com/...0&l2=) which I had in my last car and was running 2 15" Juggernauts and 4 Pioneer Component sets, and I also have the Audio Control Matrix Line Driver for an extra boost http://mobileaudiocontrol.com/...9&l2=

What do you think of all this? DOC....Give me you input as well.

[AppleBonker]

-B/A Pro60 for the front and rear -B/A S35 Tweeters for the Front -Maybe another S35 Tweeter incorporated in the car somewhere. (The SPZ were only mentioned cause DOC was tellling me about the FOCAL UTOPIAS and I said that woundn't the SPZ's be a better way to go)

As to power for these speakers, I had 2 Mmats SQ4070 amps but Doc said that they will not run at the ohms that these speakers need to be at so I'm gonna sell them and opt for the Rockford t-400-4 amps.

Now to better tune these speakers and the sub (Mmats Juggernaut 12" w/Mmats 2200.1 amp) I have an Audio Control 3.1 sound processor, (http://mobileaudiocontrol.com/...0&l2=) which I had in my last car and was running 2 15" Juggernauts and 4 Pioneer Component sets, and I also have the Audio Control Matrix Line Driver for an extra boost http://mobileaudiocontrol.com/...9&l2=

What do you think of all this? DOC....Give me you input as well.

Ok, now I'm really confused. Are you planning on putting the Pro 60's in the front doors and the S35's in the factory tweeter location? That would be complete overkill. There is no way that many drivers will sound good together. You will get all sorts of frequency cancellation among other things. More speakers does not equal better sound. High quality setups operate under the blanket idea of less is more. Less drivers means less of a chance for physics to come into play and distort the imaging of your soundstage. I've only seen a few very top notch audio setups that have consisted of multiple drivers for one location (IE front right) at the same frequency, and they were all home theater setups costing upwards of $3 mil. To do this correctly in your car (which I've never seen BTW - look at audio quality competition rigs and there will not be any setup such as you are suggesting), you would need to do the most incredible job tuning. In fact, there are probably less than 10 people in the US that could tune this correctly, and they would charge you far more money than your budget allows (judging by the speaker selection).

You really only need two tweeters up front (one right and one left obviously) and two midrange/midbass. One set of Pro 60's would easily accomplish this (mount the midbass in the door and the tweeter in the dash - one possible option). I hope you haven't purchased all of this equipment already. If not, buy less but get better quality. That is why I recommended the setups listed in my prior post. Those will cost about the same as a pair of Pro 60s and s35s, but will sound significantly better (again, my opinion but there is a lot of support for this opinion on the web). Trust me, I don't push the brands I run because I run them. I researched these things for a long time before I decided to drop money on them, and they are worth every penny.

As far as amps go, Sundown makes a number of highly acclaimed amplifiers. For about the price of the Rockford, you could pick up a Sundown SAX-100.4

http://www.soundsolutionsaudio..._id=5

You may be able to find it cheaper than this, but that is a decent price. That amp is a hog though. If you're going to run component speakers up front and in the rear (IE two sets of the Pro60's, Germaniums or Dynaudio 242s), you would only need this one amp to power all of the speakers (the passive crossovers on either set will direct power to the tweeters or mids). Just throwing out ideas...