Car dies, won't idle

[Edub1]

got it running plugs were fouled beyond help. slapped new ones in and it fired up the 1st try. Now the issue is inconsistant idle. it fires up and revs to 15 settles down at 800 then slowly drops till it dies. I am gonna hook my wideband to see the afr's and maybe that'll shed some light on idle. does it matter what o2 sensor I remove? I have the plx m-300 and it gives off a short band signal, do I just wire it into the short band wire?

You beat me to it - the lesson here is that once fouled, plugs can't be cleaned and need to be replaced.

From what you are describing, it sounds like you are excessivly lean.

[1995240sxSE]

an idle afr of 14.5 is not excessively lean???... is it? I am leaning to iacv issue or vac leak or both. Will keep updated!

[Chezedik]

At idle, it is fine.

[1995240sxSE]

thats what I thought! is it either my iacv or vac thats causing my idle issue or could it be other stuff as well. I am trying to narrow this down. it starts at like 1200 and starts dropping right away hits like 500 then dies.

[NateDogg]

Is it 14.5:1 all the way down when it stalls?

If you are gettin a good AF like that it's most likely timing or spark problem.

[1995240sxSE]

it is at 14.5 when it stalls. timing is dead on and I got brand new plugs in there.

[Chezedik]

HELLO! CODE 21?!?! Do the Trouble Tree for code 21. It is not spark plugs and timing, it is a series of actual tests. You have to do this to fix the problem.

[1995240sxSE]

think that'll fix my idle issues? I will run the trouble tree!

[1995240sxSE]

I looked at the trouble tree... I had previously swapped from auto to 5 speed and jumpered the neutral safety switch. All of the continuity is not gonna be good because I have the power transistor bypassed to use the msd ignition source! and I pass all the other steps in the trouble tree! It then refers me to dtc 103 neutral safety switch that is jumpered. I am confussed.

[Chezedik]

When you do that swap do you remove the Auto computer, or is yours OBD2? I would guess that if it is OBD2 that the AT comp is in the ECU. If so, that may explain the Neutral safety switch code. But that code is non-critical.

While I agree with the transistor test being somewhat different, it is not an invalid test. So you bypassed the transistor with the MSD, that's fine. Now your MSD is the transistor. So, check and verify a proper connection to the box. You do this by checking continuity, which a way of using your ohmmeter to check to see the there is a reading other than OL or infinite.

Then make sure that it is coming on correctly, and making output to the coil. Finally check your MSD coil, you do have an MSD coil, right?

If you pass the other steps that is grand! Did you backprobe the computer, and test the harness to the MSD box? What about to the Coil? How about the ignition resistor, did you test it? Did you check for the analog signal coming from the dizzy? What about the connection from the dizzy to the computer, did you check continuity on that harness?

Since you said that it passed all of the other tests besides the transistor test, which you skipped, you should check continuity from the computer to MSD. If you missed any of those tests, I would suggest you try them also.

[1995240sxSE]

I am obd 1. Where are u located. Wanna make a trip to washington state? Just kidding. I have the msd 6btm so it is not a coil but electric ign box. how would I go about testing that for correct readings? What would they be and where would I test the 2 output wires from the box?

Totally unrelated but the oil pickup in oil pan is bolted on the front bottom of block correct? I have somthing covering up one of the bol holes on the back of oilpan by the transmission! Thus leaking out of there.

I am gonna pull all of my wires apart clean, solder, cover with shrink wrap, and retest. Hopefully all will be good. I am gonna pull iacv off and clean thourly. Retrace all vac lines and make sure there is no leak! If I get a SH**ty idle I am gonna have to start frum scratch.

[Edub1]

14.5 is actually rich at idle - should be about 16.

I can't see why an electronic problem would run for a while and then quit. Could be the IACV or perhaps an intake leak. Does this happen when cold or just when hot. If it's when hot, inspect intake for water. When my timing cover sprung a leak steam was entering my intake.

[1995240sxSE]

thats what I was also thinking I took upper intake off iacv off cleaned iacv. double checked all vac lines. replaced gaskets on h20 pump and thermostat housing. (the water pump housing was leaking a tad. tomarrow am I gotta re re redo the oil pan gasket, and put all back togother. I should have a good Idea on the idle tomarroww am!

I havent let it get hot yet cause of oil leak! I wil tomarrow!

[Chezedik]

The oil pickup is attached to the front of the timing cover where the oil pump is. So yeah, that is where the pickup is bolted, there is also one (bolt)that goes to the crank girdle on a support.

For testing the MSD box, you should be able to go to a registered MSD dealer and they should be able to test your box. Testing the coil should be similar to testing your stock coil. In effect, you are looking for something like 100 ohms primary, 10 K ohms.

I think that you could check for your output voltage to the coil will be 12v, with a fairly high amperage, do your check on the volts scale or you will burn up your DVOM. If it has a min/max setting, that would be best, since it is a capacitive discharge. But for the most part, if you get any output, I would think it is okay to move to the next step. Again, your MSD dealer should be able to test it, or call MSD direct, and they can walk you through it.

[1995240sxSE]

cool man I am still using the stock coil that is in my dizzy, I was confussed for a sec. I was looking at the back of the msd and it is wired to the stock coil inside the dizzy. I have another issue then 2. There is somthing blocking an oil pan bolt on the backdrivers side of oil pan. Couldnt put bolt in, now is leaking out of there. I am gonna repair that tomarrow. I have all of my h20 leaks fixed! Oil will be fixed tomarrow. I will drive car around tomarrow and warm up. I am thinking that I might just be having a bad gas issue. 6 month old gas causeing a bad Idle and some safc issues. I am going to re install msd as epr jwt website after I test every end of that thing!

I should just get a new ka24de and unturbo this car, Atleast I wont have any more frustration! But then I will be slow! UHHHHHHHHHHHHHH the headaches!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chezedik]

OMG! You need to change that coil! Test it, and see if it is still worth a damn. The MSD coils are designed to handle the stress of the MSD set (or so they claim, and so do many people who have fried stockers with one). Test your coil, and replace it and your stock wires. Of course, to do so, you will need to buy the 'Power Tower' from MSD, to modify your dizzy for external coil capability. Or you can put in an S13 dizzy.

EDIT: I checked the picture again, and I see your wires are Accel, they should be fine.

[1995240sxSE]

OK the 6btm and not the btm. I need to buy an external coil? and mod the dizzy to work with out one, can u show me a pic? So this could be the problems for the crap idle? I am going to do reading! but I am confused Again!

[1995240sxSE]

also in readng the directoions on jwt it says to avoid a stored code use the tach adaptor, well I didnt use the tach adaptor. That is the source of my stored code! http://jimwolftechnology.com/w...D.PDFI am not sure why this would be on jwt if it was so harmful to the internal coil?

[Chezedik]

Yeah, the tach adaptor is the part that I mentioned, I can get the number for you. I had to buy one for MSD on my last 240. It's like 50 bux.

Here is what the tower looks like. They used to offer them individually, I don't know what happened to that though.

http://www.msdignition.com/sci_10.htm

Here is the Power Tower:http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...wItem

Here is MSD Troubleshooting info:http://www.msdignition.com/1troub1.htm

Here are the instructions for Tach adapter 8910, which is the one for KA:http://www.msdignition.com/pdf...r.pdf

I hope that helps. I have been through the whole MSD crap myself, that is why I am running Jacob's i.C.E. Pak this time.

[Edub1]

My car wouldn't run worth squat without the tach adapter.

[WDRacing]

My S14 ran like a raped ape with just the BTM and wires. I don't see anyone having spark issues until they are in the 400's maybe. Thats why I just recommend the BTM by itself. Simple straight forward install FTW...

[1995240sxSE]

i got the 6btm when I was a noob and had lots of money and didnt know how to search. I thought I was buying the btm not the 6 btm. So a tach adaptor would make me run correctly? I got the part number for one. Anyone got 1 laying around?

[Chezedik]

It's part number 8910. As far as it making you run correctly, I thought you had this before you had the problem? All of your trouble started when the head gasket got changed, right?

Did you have a CEL when you ran it before? You are def getting multiple sparks or not? I am not rescinding anything I said, but I want to make sure you change the right part. I know that it is more common than not to have a disconnected ground after an HG job, or loose wire, than it is that something broke at the EXACT same time. So I would look into that. Call MSD for them to tell you exactly what you need the 8910 for. I was told my car would not run without it, and it never did.

[1995240sxSE]

i think that will work for clearing the cel! I figured out the problem I have had on idle dying. I had a serious vac. line routing problem. I had the factory fmu hooked up to a vac line that didnt see vac. I pulled the lower intake off and took off every vac line! I got them routed good and everything has a direct to intake vac line. I am 99% sure this was my problem, or one of the problems. I am gonna order the tach adaptor and I am sure that will clear my codes other thatn the auto transmission ones. Thanks for all of the help!

[Chezedik]

No prob, so she starts? I hope your boost experience is better this time than the last few.

[1995240sxSE]

the last time was good, it lasted for a few months. I blew the hg when I was changing turbos and knocked a radiator hose off, and didnt realize it! I am making sure I dont leak ankything before I get boosting again tho!

[Chezedik]

Good deal and good luck!

[1995240sxSE]

got to boost but got back and had no coolant in radiator. found out my lower timing cover has a small crack on thermo housing. I am gonna pull the motor out and re^10 do the oil pan gasket and swap out the lower timing cover!!!! Fix the shiz right so I have no more worries!

[Chezedik]

You can pull the timing cover without pulling the motor. You just unbolt the mounts and jack up the transmission, then you can pull off the pan and then pull off the timing cover. You could also tow the car to a shop that will weld aluminum, and let them fix it without pulling the engine.

[1995240sxSE]

yea, I have tried to band aid this motor too much. I wanna pull it and go over every piece. It isnt really that long of a process! I will see.