Bush or Kerry

[The Mic]

5) Hope one of your classmates has the good heart (and balls) to come to your aid. Stand back and watch him take a 2x4 to the back of said bully's skull, then thank him for his help as bully lies unconscious on the playground. THEN, aforementioned classmate takes the time to reaffirm your value as a person, tell you that you don't HAVE to take a beating from this guy ever again, and teaches you some simple skills to help defend yourself in the future. You become confident, self-assured and hopefully a defender of others.

Think about it.

I thought about it and in that scenario the Bully would likely go to home to mom whod demand to know who did that to her son. Principal gets involved and expels the good samaritan. NOt sure if this makes any sense. Point? for every action there is a reaction.

-Think before you act

edit: And id chose #4 bc that way he wouldnt mess with me anymore bc hed know im capable of taking action . Doing it yourself builds your self-esteem a lot better and faster and lets others know your not afraid to use force. Suggestion? they(Iraqi ppl) should have done what the students in Kosovo did.

[VimyJ]

Vimy...try spewing some truth instead of left wing propoganda, you have no way to know if the Kurds will clamor for their own state or anything else, despite what you might think you are NOT Ms. Cleo. You know, of all the people I know, from left wing liberals (yes, I DO have some liberal friends, crazy eh?) to the staunchest Republicans, I haven't once heard any of this: "bush the war time hero president! bush the liberator! bush the protector!", the uninformed and 9-11 stunned electorate would chant. "Iraq was responsible for 9-11!"This is putting words in peoples mouths that just aren't there in enough instances to matter.

Jesus H. Christ, man! The Kurds have been clamoring for their own state for 80 friggin years! They have an ongoing guerilla war against Turkey (a NATO ally) to this day. They fought against Iran and Iraq for sovereignty. Syria is threatened by a new Kurdistan. Even now the Kurds are playing hardball with participation in any kind of puppet Iraqi federation. You have to get informed. You obviously haven't a clue about the history of that area of the world.

Why do you think SH was left to kill Shia by the truckload for years? It's because they wanted to overthrow the secular Ba'athists to establish their own Shi'ite theocratic state a la Iran.

Limburger is long on rhetoric but always short on facts. He is the Foghorn Leghorn of the political world.

[spitz7985]

I thought about it and in that scenario the Bully would likely go to home to mom whod demand to know who did that to her son. Principal gets involved and expels the good samaritan. NOt sure if this makes any sense. Point? for every action there is a reaction.

:ylsuper

[Nathan]

Jesus H. Christ, man! The Kurds have been clamoring for their own state for 80 friggin years! They have an ongoing guerilla war against Turkey (a NATO ally) to this day. They fought against Iran and Iraq for sovereignty. Syria is threatened by a new Kurdistan. Even now the Kurds are playing hardball with participation in any kind of puppet Iraqi federation. You have to get informed. You obviously haven't a clue about the history of that area of the

Your right, I dont really...I'll quickly concede that point as its something I need to learn more about. However, quite a bit of what you said was still conjecture or opinions, not fact. Now, go back and address a few of my points you've conveniently overlooked repeatedly...or will you concede those?

[Nathan]

I thought about it and in that scenario the Bully would likely go to home to mom whod demand to know who did that to her son. Principal gets involved and expels the good samaritan. NOt sure if this makes any sense. Point? for every action there is a reaction.

-Think before you act

As for the bully, then more extreme measures should be taken next...perhaps his mother should be beat, or the principal for acting unjustly

Edit: no matter what the reaction, there is still the issue of right and wrong. Sometimes its necessary to do what you know is right, even if you will face unpleasant consequences for your actions.

[spitz7985]

Edit: no matter what the reaction, there is still the issue of right and wrong. Sometimes its necessary to do what you know is right, even if you will face unpleasant consequences for your actions.

If the one kid (kid A, for discussion's sake) stands up for the other (kid B) to the bully, then kid A gets expelled, and lets say all of the kid A's friends also get expelled, not for being part of the feud, but for being associated kid A, is that fair to all the other kids and their parents? Now everyone associated with kid A and everyone associated with those associated with kid A suffer because kid A did a good deed. Meanwhile, kid B is livin it up with no bully on the playground.

Things are a lot more complicated now. The line between right and wrong is blurred.

Edit: I realize that this is not a realistic scenario in this case, it is only an analogy.

[VimyJ]

Your right, I dont really...I'll quickly concede that point as its something I need to learn more about. However, quite a bit of what you said was still conjecture or opinions, not fact. Now, go back and address a few of my points you've conveniently overlooked repeatedly...or will you concede those?

The fact you think there are WMD in Iraq because Limburger said there were and that you admit you have no idea of Mid East history renders the majority of your conclusions suspect to say the least. Since you have no idea of the tension fraught history of the region how can even hazard an informed guess as to whether or not my views are conjecture?

In the full light of history, bush's "Operation Iraqi Freedom" will go down as one of the most stupid and boneheaded chapters in US foreign policy. It's divided the West and further destabilized the ME. bush flipped us from the frying pan to flop in the fire.

[The Mic]

Politics shouldn't be discussed among simple men.

Anybody who runs a Register to Vote ad with partisan mockery, is a simple man with a weak mind and not much backbone. They're using you, and you don't know/don't care.

thread was closed, sorry:

wow Smith? You butt-hurt bc i told you to calm down? If I hurt your arrogant ego sorry i didnt know you were that sensitive (not using weak ). I didn't want to sound like i was telling you how to do your job bc i was talking to evryone in this thread, no just you. But taking cheap shots like that only demonstrates more immaturity from your part. I really thought you were better than that. As for that last part, you don't know me enough to make such a statement.

Please guys dont let this thread turn into a mud-slinging fight

-Mike

[SmithSR]

Dude, I'm not butt-hurt, and ego isn't an issue, and no, I'm not feeling sensitive.

You weren't telling me how to do my job, which I gladly undertook (all mods do) knowing there is no reward, other than sharing our knowledge.

There is no cheap shots on my part, was simply responding to your negative signature. You get to respond, hell we all do, so try not to take my response to your signature personally or else it's nothing more than me calling you wrong and you calling me wrong then WHAM thread closed.

No more condescending words from you, if you run that negative ad in your sig either. That's two-faced and you know it. You've had plenty of shots in to present your view, and I don't need to take any... because "politics" is too volatile an issue for a club that's known for being close-knit and friendly.

Phil

:peace

[The Mic]

My sig is negative? prob to you but not to other people. My sig is purely subject to interpretation, take it anyway you want it. Negative is a U.S. flag burning with "Screw all American Capitalists!!" in a U.S. based forum. And i will provide as many condescending words as i want @!!!111!!

btw this was another candidate for my sig:

negative? it think not

now i have to go put on my Mc donalds uniform, im working grill today

[90Q45blue]

Imagine if Clinton had been stupid enough to try a stunt like this.

http://www.nationalcenter.org/....html

Don't ever talk about Clinton and foreign policy in the same breath. It's not a good idea.

Nick

[ilovedrifting]

vimy you still haven't answered me HOW DID BUSH LIEand why isn't limbaugh, not limburger, a reliable source he scans the news and reports the stories, he doesn't make up stories like michael moore. this story never made it to major networks because the media is controled by liberals, even fox news, they're just aren't as bad as the rest. so please tell me how did bush lie

you make me want to f u c k i n g vomit

[VimyJ]

As if Gingrich, Hyde and their ilk would have supported military action in Rwanda after Somolia. Nobody cared especially a GOP congress. Don't let your partisanship cloud the facts. No resources there and no US interests to protect equals no action. And to be seen supporting the very president they so despised? Never would happen.

[ilovedrifting]

still not answering me vimy

[Sopdadope]

A failed presidency that freed MILLIONS of oppressed people?

There's your joyful liberated. Don't they look ecstatic?

[Sopdadope]

vimy you still haven't answered me HOW DID BUSH LIEand why isn't limbaugh, not limburger, a reliable source he scans the news and reports the stories, he doesn't make up stories like michael moore. this story never made it to major networks because the media is controled by liberals, even fox news, they're just aren't as bad as the rest. so please tell me how did bush lie

you make me want to f u c k i n g vomit

Another white "young republican" neo con who really needs to get a LIFE...or go ENLIST to fight in the war that you so strongly believe in perhaps? here: WWW.GOARMY.COM

If you actually bothered to read his posts...he's answered you question about oh...ten times!

[spitz7985]

still not answering me vimy

http://www.house.gov/appropria...m.htmh ... t/pages/1/

[f1seb]

vimy you still haven't answered me HOW DID BUSH LIEand why isn't limbaugh, not limburger, a reliable source he scans the news and reports the stories, he doesn't make up stories like michael moore. this story never made it to major networks because the media is controled by liberals, even fox news, they're just aren't as bad as the rest. so please tell me how did bush lie

you make me want to f u c k i n g vomit

BWAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Fox News controlled by liberals? HAHAHAHA...How did they manage such a thing?The network is owned by by f u k i n g Rupert Murdoch one of the biggest most open right wingers in the country how the hell can you say that they are left wing. Man you need to wake up and smell the coffee.

And like I said, if we are in the business of freeing people why not free the people of North Korea and China!!!! Answer me that buddy!!! And dont tell me that those people are happy and dont need to be freed.

[Nathan]

Dont even go there Sop, there are TONS of pictures of angry iraqi's and TONS of pictures of happy ones. It'd be ridiculous to say that ALL of them are happy about the situation and I am certain a lot of pictures have been taken of the angry ones. Besides, you dont know the context of that picture either (or have not shared it with us). Vimy, the tension fraught nature of the region does little to sway my opinion other than further inforce the notion that the whole damned region is a threat to our national security. First and foremost, our national security is what comes first. I dont care who we have to kill to keep this nation safe as long as it gets done. Saddam Hussein was a threat to our national security, I've detailed the reasons why numerous times allready in this thread and my points have gone unrebuked for the most part. Saddam Hussein hates the US and he was the ruler of a reasonably powerful country, hence he was a threat and needed to be removed. Ever since his little powerplay that started the gulf war, he's been sanctioned by the UN and I'm dead certain hates the US. He has motive and could have had means to harm our nation, whether it is through a direct attack (unlikely I think we can all agree) or through funding terrorism (something thats been stated by our government, the Russians, and others). Thats not even getting into the humanitarian aspect of it, which is also compelling. However, I do plan on picking up a book or something on Middle Eastern history, hopefully I can pick up a relatively fact based book to learn from.

[f1seb]

Plus the only thing to you republicans I say is:

ANN COULTER!!!!

Now explain yourselves.

[ilovedrifting]

"Another white "young republican" neo con who really needs to get a LIFE...or go ENLIST to fight in the war that you so strongly believe in perhaps? here: http://WWW.GOARMY.COM" -- Sopdadope I actually plan to join the marines after highschool so i can go and fight for other peoples freedoms , and by the way, wtf does race have do to with itand he never answered my questions, at least not that I saw

[ilovedrifting]

"And like I said, if we are in the business of freeing people why not free the people of North Korea and China!!!! Answer me that buddy!!! And dont tell me that those people are happy and dont need to be freed."

you're preaching to the choire, if i were pres. i would've already freed them because thats what america does. we help the oppressed

[f1seb]

But dont you find it at least strange why the president which you support doesn't think the same way?

[spitz7985]

Man, I'm glad you're not president. There is talk about reinstating the military draft as it is. The last thing we need is to send troops to every opressed nation in the world. Sorry, but I do not want to be drafted.

We are not the world's police men.

How come when it comes to national security we have to go over to Iraq and kill the man. Why not spend more money here at home to prevent terrorlst attacks. Like, more airport security, getting that shotty missle defense system working decently, AIR MARSHALLS, etc.

[Sopdadope]

you're preaching to the choire, if i were pres. i would've already freed them because thats what america does. we help the oppressed

A dose of reality would do you a world good. America helps the oppressed huh? America sure helped out the East Timorese, Rwandan's, Congonese, Sierra Leonese, Palestinians, Guatemalan's, etc.

[ilovedrifting]

i don't agree with bush all the time. there are many things hes done that i hate, but he is better than kerry so i support him

[VimyJ]

Iraq never attacked and never threatened to attack in word or deed the US. You admitted yourself that you don't understand the history of the area. When you get informed about the topic at hand and stop relying on bushie propaganda and Limburger rantings you will begin to see the bush administration for what it is: A weakling president (who thinks he was put in office by God personally) controlled by a bunch of demented chickenhawks trying to exploit a situation in order to further their ideology who count on the ignorance of the average uninformed American (of which you admitted you were one) to reflexively and blindly support anyone who says "Iraq is the center of the war on terror" despite the fact that there are no meaningful Islamic terrorlst connections to Iraq (at least prior to the invasion).

[ilovedrifting]

A dose of reality would do you a world good. America helps the oppressed huh? America sure helped out the East Timorese, Rwandan's, Congonese, Sierra Leonese, Palestinians, Guatemalan's, etc.

i agree we should've helped them too but that isn't up to me for the most part we help the opressed maybe not always but we try hard even with the UN breathing down are ****ing necks

[ilovedrifting]

vimy you're correct iraq didn't attack anybody. they were harboring terrorlst whil you'll argue that osama and saddam didn't get along and hated each other i agree completely, but it was a matter of who they hated more each other or america, they hated us more so saddam allowed for al-qaeda trainging camps (we found 2 in iraq) to operate inside his country and he funded these terror camps that makes them a threat to the us a threat which must be neutralized. and thankfully the country isn't led by a ***** like john kerry who is too much of a coward to stand up to the world and do what is right

[Sopdadope]

i agree we should've helped them too but that isn't up to me for the most part we help the opressed maybe not always but we try hard even with the UN breathing down are ****ing necks

At least we agree on something then. Anyway...all this debate is making me hungry. Think I'm gonna run out and get some.....

With HEINZ liberal ketchup, of course...