Y33 vs. G50, light to light.

[Falkdesigns]

Last night, from a 5 mph rolling start, we actually came around a corner, lined up, slowed down, he hand signaled 3, 2, 1, go! Both of us got about the same start, but by about 60 I was about a good car length ahead. I didn't expect to win, but I didn't expect to loose by much if I did loose. Anyhow, there it is, a clean G50 Q45a in excellent running condition, vs. my clean Y33 Q45t in excellent running condition. At the end, he said "you win, that's all I've got.". I'm going to let him chime if he want's to, but it was me vs. a member on this board.

Now I know all the naysayers will never believe this, so I say, bring it on, I'll gladly race any of you in a little light to light action and if I loose, I have no problem admitting it. It doesn't take a genius to figure it out though. Y33 = 268 hp @ 3800 lbs. G50 = 275 hp @ 4100 lbs (+200 for active). 3-500 pounds is a lot to make up with a whopping 7-10 hp difference. All the magazine tests said performance was about the same due to the lighter weight, every number I've found on the web and otherwise puts them very close together but G50 guys just refuse to believe it could be so.

It's been killing me to not post this, so I had to do it (with a little encouragement from a fellow Y33 driver who's owned a G50 and has an F50 in his immediate family).

So guys, bring it on!

[gniknave]

I'll be in L.A. Saturday the 25th (yes next Saturday). Email is [email protected] let's do it...Just remember, I'm not stock...

[Falkdesigns]

Well that's not fair now is it?

I was like, 2087 posts, how come I've never heard of this guy! But I see who you are in your sig. I'll still meet up with you and let you spank me (or at least try).

[AZhitman]

Kevin, I wanna see some 1/4 mile times from you before I take you up on that one..

Good kill, too bad it was an Infiniti brother!

[Jesda]

The Y33 has a shorter wheelbase and is lighter than many 94-96 G50s, even though handling isnt as tight. The G50 to watch out for when drag racing is a well-maintained 1990-1992 (295hp). Subtract sodium filled valves for late 92-93. 94-95, depending on options, gained enough weight to make up for differences in power. 96 (no VVT) is around 275hp.

You need to take that bad boy to a track!

[Falkdesigns]

It makes it that much sweeter to beat an Infiniti NICO brother! You have no idea, I was grinning ear to ear all the way home. All the smack that people say about the performance of the Y33, how the G50 is much faster with it's negligable power difference and significantly heavier weight. To beat one was such sweet nectar. It was like money burning a hole in your pocket how bad I couldn't wait to post this up.

With my suspension, I'll guarantee my car's handling is at least as tight. The Y33 is significantly stiffer overall than the G50 (as the F50 is stiffer still than the Y33), and came stock with front and rear STB's. Add some performance shocks, springs and much wider, lower profile tires, my Q handles baby!

[zinkie13]

Yes!!! You did it!

[Jesda]

Sweet!

Now, what we're really comparing is the Nissan President to the Nissan Cima. They both happen to be called Qs.

Bear in mind all the differences from 1990-1996. No two G50s are the same. The 94s I've driven are noticeably slower off the line compared to previous years, although much more refined. Active suspension adds a hundred pounds or more. The 1990 Q45 is about 3800 lbs with around 295hp. The active in 91 adds 100-150lbs. A 94 active? Make that 200 lbs more for the extra sound deadening and other extra hardware.

Its time for you to get some time slips! If I was down there, I'd take you for a race.

[Jesda]

All the smack that people say about the performance of the Y33

I think most of that is due to its comparison to the Lexus of the same era, which has better gearing and therefore, better 1/4 mi performance. Lexus always seemed to have that advantage. In addition, a lot of NICO members own 'original' G50 Presidents, which will indeed outrun(1/4 mi)/outhandle(skidpad) the Y33 Cima. I say, take a drive to Evan's house and you two have a go at it.

[Falkdesigns]

Well apparently he'll be down here next week.

As a general rule of thumb, as time goes on, cars get stiffer and stiffer. The Q45 (as it was sold in Japan and the US) was developed in the 80's and debuted in US in 90. When the Y33 Q45 was released in 97, it's chasis was much stiffer (can't recall exact numbers, but over 100% wouldn't suprise me). There is not much chance that the G50 Q out handles the newer, shorter wheel base Y33 Q. Shorter wheel base is better for handling, while longer wheel base is better for straight line stability.

However, as I figured, I can't win. Even though I did. Apparently the G50 still beats my Y33 in 1/4 mile and skid pad (not true).

The original US Q45 was never a Nissan President, it was sold and badged in Japan as an Infiniti Q45. The active Q might out handle a stock Y33 Q, but a G50 Q45t, will not outhandle a Y33 Q45t -stock vs. stock.
Modified by Falkdesigns at 3:42 PM 6/17/2005

[AZhitman]

Awesome!!!

Kevin, the bottom line is, they're damned fast for their size, which is what many people base their "perception" of a "fast" car on.

I'm eager to hear how it goes with another Q.

[gniknave]

Kevin...

[Fastlane]

I've got both cars and I feel the Y33 is quicker off the line but the G50 stronger on the upper end.........When you choose the stiffer setting on the suspension, the y33 is more nimble, (lighter and smaller).

[elwesso]

IM shocked Kevin.... Congrats..

However something to try onthe G50 end. I read a few magazine test articles and they said if you move the shifter into the 1 position and manually shift it, it makes it slightly faster.. Still, by 60 to have him by a car length thats pretty impressive...

I think Evans Q would take my Q with ease..

[redmanfx]

You guys on the west coast are having all the fun! I would love to be out there and meet up. I think the Grilleless G50's are quicker.. My 92 has done well for itself when going up against the newer Q's. Falk, I can see your huge grin all the way over here on the beach. Sure wish I had some NICO brothers here!

Evan, love that post man. Represent!!!!!! Don't forget the Bk44.

Have fun fella's

red

[DAEDALUS]

We'll have to make it a SoCal NICO meet, round 2, no pun intended. I'll bring the Dodge again!

Forget the racing, guys, Falk's Q is a stunner on looks alone. Jesfugginnice. I'll post a pic once I get it off the digicam. Too bad it was so dark by the time we got the cameras out.

[3Q Jay]

Kevin- glad you and Quash had some fun with no one getting hurt...You've earned some bragging rights!I'm actually not surprised. Since I also own both my observation to you over a beer still stands: the fy33 has more linear acceleration. The G50 is lacking out of the hole [maybe not true on the 90-92 with wider 1st and 2nd], but comes on strong at 4000. I like the visceral 'feel' of my G50 as it tachs up, while the fy33 feels more effortless.

anyway it's all about having some fun!

Enjoyed meeting you, Quash, Robert and Robert.Hope we can bring in a few more next time!

Jay

[pito11213]

Trust me when I tell you when you race a good running 90 you will see the difference. My 90 had two bad injectors and blue smoke from the tailpipe. I used to smoke my friends 98 Y33. He always thought he had the faster car because it was more new. Whenever it was time to race I threw it down to one and shifted through all the gears. I used to always win by 1.5 car lengths. That was on regular streets. When we hit the highway it was worse. My 90 would hit 120 so easy that he would call me on the cell phone and compliment that. My friend with the 98 528I with M5 package including suspension would also try to fly on me. We went head to head on a nice stretch and he topped out at 125 when I flew by him hitting 140 before I had to slow down to get off my exit. It was sweet. The Q hit that 140 so easy.

[Q_SHIP]

I have never ridden in a 94+ but I know my old 93 G50 would give my Y33 a good schooling.

Falk, I got my car running right now. I did Knock sensors and the car is not nearly as slow as I thought it was. I gotta give you credit there. You are correct. The Y33 will get up and go when running right.

[JT_MONEY_2004]

Trust me when I tell you when you race a good running 90 you will see the difference. My 90 had two bad injectors and blue smoke from the tailpipe. I used to smoke my friends 98 Y33. He always thought he had the faster car because it was more new. Whenever it was time to race I threw it down to one and shifted through all the gears. I used to always win by 1.5 car lengths. That was on regular streets. When we hit the highway it was worse. My 90 would hit 120 so easy that he would call me on the cell phone and compliment that. My friend with the 98 528I with M5 package including suspension would also try to fly on me. We went head to head on a nice stretch and he topped out at 125 when I flew by him hitting 140 before I had to slow down to get off my exit. It was sweet. The Q hit that 140 so easy.

Word?

[Q_SHIP]

What does a Y33 top out at anyways? Never tried it yet.

[zinkie13]

Mine topped out at around 143 or so

[zinkie13]

Dude, there is no reason to be a d!ck. He won the race fair and square. Yes maybe the g50 would have pulled on him at higher speeds but he never said it wouldn't. He just let everyone know the the y33 isn't as slow as everyone thinks.

[Jesda]

One exception though: The 1996 Q45 without VVT and all the extra weight and emissions changes is slower than the 97-01 Y33.

Looking at luxury sedans eight years or newer, I generally prefer domestics and europeans, as they've caught up (a little bit) to the Japanese for quality, but have more distinct personalities. I wouldn't mind adding a Seville or 5/7-series to the collection. Its a shame the J30 went away in 1997. That car conveyed class but still had its own character. I wonder what a second-gen J30 would look like?

[rsiwicki]

you guys are all crazy debating who is faster. Seriously 0.5 secs in the 1/4 faster is 1 car length where the front bumper of one car is even with the back bumper of the other car. It really does not make that much of a difference to be 0.5 secs faster on the street...although faster is faster.

You guys keep quoting magazine articles like they are the holy grail of who is faster. Only real road 1/4 testing over and over again proves anything. They could have tested the 96 car in the summer and the 95 car in the winter thereby making it seem as if the 96 car was slower. FastLane's 96 Q is as fast as any 94-96 Q45 running solid mid 15's. Too many variables out there from the mag articles to take them to be 100% accurate. Only way to test is do as Falk did and line them up side by side.

Btw...I let me friend drive the beast last night and I told him to take it up all the way to see what it got adn what it feels like to be the passenger for a change going 130+mph....it was fun and very very smooth and quiet. A lot different sensation then being behind the wheel. We ran it up several times from 80 to 140....it was a good ride home.

[Jesda]

Actually, the performance issue with the 96 is related to 1) emissions controls 2) weight 3) no VVT. Its not a matter of testing conditions, its one of model year changes. Otherwise, it would be the same as 94-95, but it isnt, even though there's some quick 96 Qs on NICO. The discussion is mostly about stock vehicles, because once you begin modifying, nothing really matters.

And really, Citroen hatchbacks are faster than all of our big sedans.

[Fastlane]

Thank you Rob.........I have been unable to find any published times that are faster than my fastest run of 15.36 for a stock Q45. That doesn't necessarily mean that mine is the fastest times (driver,track conditions,temp etc,) but it is a finite time, measured at an official N.H.R.A. track.........this is a fact .......the rest are just words. (Jesda I can't believe you are still seperating the 96Q as being the slowest one.........please show me a faster time slip.)

[Fastlane]

Oh yeah............the car is absolutely stock.

[Jesda]

If a 1990, 1996, and 1997 Q45 all in perfect condition ran down the same track at the same time, the 90 would finish first, the 97 second, the 96 third -- but they wouldn't be very far apart. A 91-95 would depend on equipment -- active suspension, TCS, and HICAS add some extra weight.

Absolutely -no- improvements in power were made throughout the run of the G50 in the US, but weight was gained. The transmission changed in 1994, resulting in reduced 1/4 mi performance, smoother shifting, and much better reliability.

No tests or reviews are available on the 96 Q45 because it was the last year for the vehicle, and in 1996 the press focused on the Y33. Also note that all US cars in 1996 were subjected to changes emissions rules that generally resulted in a loss of 5-8hp. But then why did Infiniti continue to publish 278hp for the 96? Simple. In 1990 the power was underrated because of a 'gentleman's agreement' among Japanese automakers to not exceed 278hp -- I dont know why. The loss of sodium filled valves (in mid 92?) also reduced power output a bit for emissions reasons.

My point:If a perfectly maintained '90 or '97 ran down the track next to you, it would likely win by a car length. Of course, the guy with the Civic spraying nitrous would beat all of us.

Dennis's 1990 Q45 is probably the closest you can find to a near-perfect test example, but he now has 280k on the clock.

[FarFetched]

It is good to know this from another Y33 owner because I got a FAT "speeding ticket" for "pushing" another q45 on I-5 north going to Canada last monday even though it did not start on I-5 at all. I won't go in details how much the ticket, all I say I was doing 125 in "XX-ligal" mile zone when our race was over. I was clocked by a cop at much lower speed. The Q I was against did not have front grill, so it was 90-93. Clean looking Q. At Mt.Vernon exit I was waiting for the "go" to get on I-5 when "He" rolled at the light. In my Old Lady was my wife and buch of junk in the trunk besides my fat @ss. So I would say 200-300 Lbs havier than stock Y33. As soon as "go" light turned green with TCS off I stepped on the pedal. We were about head to head till about 70 and then I started to pull forward at about 120 I was almost a full length ahead. Then he sounded his horm and we ended the "race". TOO LATE FOR BOTH OF US . He and I both got nailed! Quote »Kids do not do it w/o parents permission [/quote]I am not gonna say bad/good words about G50, all I want to say it was an adrenaline rush! My Old Lady is bone stock. I don't know machanical condition of opponenet's Q, but I know he was trying his best. How I have to travel over 100 miles to get my "fine" reduced in half.