A Q45 brake kit would be great for the track. You can get away with less. The guy who owned my car before me put on Brembo rotors, Hawk HPS pads, and stainless steel lines. You can easily do the same for less than $500.
Bart mentioned the HKS actuator for your turbo. That's a great way to go. You can run 14 psi, which makes for a surprisingly different experience compared to the stock 7-8psi. If you were to get that, with a Z32 MAF and an AFC or something similar to tune your fuel, I think you would be very happy with the outcome.
On the other hand if you go get a bigger turbo, you then expose yourself to thinking.. "Well, for another $300 I could get bigger injectors, and run this new turbo at more boost. But then I need a larger MAF, and this, and that..." And then before you know it, you're spending more than you wanted to, and making WAY more boost than the stock braking system can handle.
Were does my SR go from here?
Fred, I think you should make the brake upgrade or at least pads and rotors a top priority. Looks like you're gonna have one hellufa ride soon and stock stuff won't cut it. I know you're smarter than some guys who street race and crash their car, but I'd like to see you keep this one around and brakes do help in that dept. Oh and tires...can't forget those. lol.
Cams will probably help you in your pursuit of more power too, figure the more exhaust gas they can let pass through, the more gas your turbo can use to spool itself up eh? After all, the more air and gas you can burn then expel, the more power you're making.
Probably other thing to consider are injectors, mafs, and the turbo...lol You can get new s15 t28's for 800 bucks dealership in Japan. Seriously. Figure if you can manage to swing one used, much cheaper than 800. Get the oil and water lines and bam. Easy stuff. z32 mafs and some 550cc injectors would probably help round out the upgrade with some space to breathe later on when you're ready to upgrade to a beefier turbo.
Cams will probably help you in your pursuit of more power too, figure the more exhaust gas they can let pass through, the more gas your turbo can use to spool itself up eh? After all, the more air and gas you can burn then expel, the more power you're making.
Probably other thing to consider are injectors, mafs, and the turbo...lol You can get new s15 t28's for 800 bucks dealership in Japan. Seriously. Figure if you can manage to swing one used, much cheaper than 800. Get the oil and water lines and bam. Easy stuff. z32 mafs and some 550cc injectors would probably help round out the upgrade with some space to breathe later on when you're ready to upgrade to a beefier turbo.
Who needs to stop? I got brembo stock rotors and autozone pads and the only time i have any trouble is after repeated autocross runs (Fun runs at the end are less than 1 minute apart)
You guys might want to check your stock breaks to make sure everything is 100% Sure it's not like the 240 has ferrari breaks but the stocker ones arent' that bad. My 240 stops just as well as my GSX did and it had 2 piston calipers and bigger rotors up front.
p.s. GET THE TURBO!
You guys might want to check your stock breaks to make sure everything is 100% Sure it's not like the 240 has ferrari breaks but the stocker ones arent' that bad. My 240 stops just as well as my GSX did and it had 2 piston calipers and bigger rotors up front.
p.s. GET THE TURBO!
I am getting SS brake lines + a flush.
Once pads/rotors need replacing maybe a Q45 upgrade all around.(My other car is a Q45)..Again folks dont forget how ligfht a base S13 is, with Silvia front end and SR and stripped to a good extent.
As for tires all 4 of my tires are excellent and have less than 3000 miles on them.Yes they are not the same all around (not a choice), but they are all premium Ultra performance Summer tires with soft compounds and very low wear ratings.
It looks like I am going to go with this Heavy throttle kit, linked above:
http://srownersclub.com/Mercha...RBKIT
Hal aka hlh0501 who is a NICO member well know for his expertise with aftermarket turbo set-ups (check the Multi -Media forum) will help me (or more likely do it, while I stand around and hand him wrenches and buy Beer)
Fred..
Once pads/rotors need replacing maybe a Q45 upgrade all around.(My other car is a Q45)..Again folks dont forget how ligfht a base S13 is, with Silvia front end and SR and stripped to a good extent.
As for tires all 4 of my tires are excellent and have less than 3000 miles on them.Yes they are not the same all around (not a choice), but they are all premium Ultra performance Summer tires with soft compounds and very low wear ratings.
It looks like I am going to go with this Heavy throttle kit, linked above:
http://srownersclub.com/Mercha...RBKIT
Hal aka hlh0501 who is a NICO member well know for his expertise with aftermarket turbo set-ups (check the Multi -Media forum) will help me (or more likely do it, while I stand around and hand him wrenches and buy Beer)
Fred..
I would think that you should have NO problems if you can drag decent.
BTW, from the looks of Heavy Throttle's page they are now offering the PE1820sp turbo as a kit with ECU tune, mafs, and injectors. Have you looked into that?
Also is there any reason you are leaning toward the FP vs. the S15 GT28 other than the FP comes as a kit?
BTW, from the looks of Heavy Throttle's page they are now offering the PE1820sp turbo as a kit with ECU tune, mafs, and injectors. Have you looked into that?
Also is there any reason you are leaning toward the FP vs. the S15 GT28 other than the FP comes as a kit?
Quote »Who needs to stop? I got brembo stock rotors and autozone pads and the only time i have any trouble is after repeated autocross runs (Fun runs at the end are less than 1 minute apart)[/quote]No autocross course I've ever seen or driven has been even remotely hard on the brakes. Back to back autocross runs didn't even get my brakes up to their optimal temp(400-600*F on my old pads), while I could get my brakes so hot they outgassed and transferred visible pad material on the rotors within 4 laps of Road Atlanta(about 7-8 minutes) on my M3 that had 12.4inch and 12.5 inch rotors all around and pads with about 3 times the surface area of the 240SX brakes. Sure, it had about 600lbs over the 240SX, but it was only making 212rwhp at the time. A well tuned Big28 setup will easily make 100rwhp more than that.
I just think it's silly to pinch pennies on brakes when you've near tripled your stock power output. I've seen too many people take their cars on a twisty mountain road and cook their stock brakes in about 10 minutes and act surprised when they almost have a wreck. Heck, I had a guy in a BMW 318i with an M3 motor in it and stock dinky brakes(which are larger than an S13's brakes btw) almost rear end me on a downhill mountain that I was only leisurely driving on(6/10ths). His reasoning: he just didn't get around to upgrading the brakes beyond painting his calipers red. But he did have $4000 to put in an S50 M3 motor and then another $1k for bolt-ons.
I'm not comparing Fred to this guy, as he seems to have his head firmly on his shoulders, I just think one needs to start thinking about safety at some point when you start grossly increasing some facet of the vehicle's performance.
If you have sports car acceleration, you might want to get sports car braking to go along with it.
I'm just trying to keep people safe, but I'll drop it now. The point's been made, and the opinions tossed around till we're knee deep in 'em.
Enjoy the Big28 kit Fred - it looks like a real screamer. Just remember to keep the shiny side up!
I just think it's silly to pinch pennies on brakes when you've near tripled your stock power output. I've seen too many people take their cars on a twisty mountain road and cook their stock brakes in about 10 minutes and act surprised when they almost have a wreck. Heck, I had a guy in a BMW 318i with an M3 motor in it and stock dinky brakes(which are larger than an S13's brakes btw) almost rear end me on a downhill mountain that I was only leisurely driving on(6/10ths). His reasoning: he just didn't get around to upgrading the brakes beyond painting his calipers red. But he did have $4000 to put in an S50 M3 motor and then another $1k for bolt-ons.
I'm not comparing Fred to this guy, as he seems to have his head firmly on his shoulders, I just think one needs to start thinking about safety at some point when you start grossly increasing some facet of the vehicle's performance.
If you have sports car acceleration, you might want to get sports car braking to go along with it.
I'm just trying to keep people safe, but I'll drop it now. The point's been made, and the opinions tossed around till we're knee deep in 'em.
Enjoy the Big28 kit Fred - it looks like a real screamer. Just remember to keep the shiny side up!
Def wrote:Just remember to keep the shiny side up!
:Werd
I just need to beat on the brake drum one last time. If you've never had your brakes go out on you due to heat, you're in for a surprise. One second you step on the brakes, and the car stops just like it always does. The next time you step on the brakes, the car keeps going. In my case, there wasn't any hint of, "I think my brakes are going out." It was just a night and day difference.
With that having been said, I'm interested in what kind of power you're going to eventually put down with the HT kit. It looks all good. Do you know if JWT tuned the ECU specifically for the mods? I know that some guys in KA-T land just get JWT N/A tuned ECUs and go from there.
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Movingviolation240
- Posts: 1681
- Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 2:26 pm
- Car: '95 Nissan 240SX 400hp SR20DET -SOLD
'93 Lexus SC300 w/ SP66 turbo kit
I wouldn't waste money on that 'kit' you can get an S15 turbo from Phase 2 motortrend for $799, then figure $350 for used 555cc injectors, $280 for an SACF II, and $100 for a Z32MAF. Then you have money left over for a dyno tune ($200-300). And you can still afford the Greddy O2 housing (a must have if you want to make over 280RWHP in my opinion) and some Q45 brakes. If you drive your car hard with 300rwhp you will NEED brakes, even if you don't beat on it it will scare you. Trust me......
I'd also look into spending what little money you'd have left on an electronic boost controller, once you start upping the boost, a manual one just dosn't cut it (up past 15psi). They spike and creep, which is bad for a motor running that high. The Greddy O2 housing helps that, but dosn't eleminate it.
PaulOrlando, FL
I'd also look into spending what little money you'd have left on an electronic boost controller, once you start upping the boost, a manual one just dosn't cut it (up past 15psi). They spike and creep, which is bad for a motor running that high. The Greddy O2 housing helps that, but dosn't eleminate it.
PaulOrlando, FL
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Movingviolation240
- Posts: 1681
- Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 2:26 pm
- Car: '95 Nissan 240SX 400hp SR20DET -SOLD
'93 Lexus SC300 w/ SP66 turbo kit
Just to make another point, my 2 biggest problems with the HT kit are the price (that is a little high to me) and the fact that they use a JWT ECU. JWT SUCKS! They have the most horrible A/F maps of any custom ECU I've ever seen. It's settup for 91 octan california reformulated mule piss gas, so it has to be like that. Put it on a car running 93 and there is a LOT of room for improvement. JWT runs less timing, so you have higher EGT's, worse MPG, and it will blow lots of black smoke on boost. That's my experience with them anyhow.
Paul,
I am glad you came into this thread, as your input is always welcome and knowedgable.:thumbup
I do have a couple of questions though:
Isn't the turbo thats in that kit an upgrade from the basic T28?Plz tell me if I am mistaken.
Also wouldn't that JWT in that kit, be pre-tuned for that set-up thats in the kit?
Also I do like the idea of not chasing down used injectors and having it all in one set.
So I really like the idea of a kit and it looks pretty complete to me.But I gladly will look elsewhere if I find a better one for my application.
Fred..
PS:Having it tuned for 91 wouldnt bother me, since I cant count on always being close to a 93 octane pump either
I am glad you came into this thread, as your input is always welcome and knowedgable.:thumbup
I do have a couple of questions though:
Isn't the turbo thats in that kit an upgrade from the basic T28?Plz tell me if I am mistaken.
Also wouldn't that JWT in that kit, be pre-tuned for that set-up thats in the kit?
Also I do like the idea of not chasing down used injectors and having it all in one set.
So I really like the idea of a kit and it looks pretty complete to me.But I gladly will look elsewhere if I find a better one for my application.
Fred..
PS:Having it tuned for 91 wouldnt bother me, since I cant count on always being close to a 93 octane pump either
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Movingviolation240
- Posts: 1681
- Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 2:26 pm
- Car: '95 Nissan 240SX 400hp SR20DET -SOLD
'93 Lexus SC300 w/ SP66 turbo kit
Yea, JWT dosn't care what mods you have, they just give you a random chip for a set of injectors and a given MAF.
Used 550cc SR20DET injectors are on Ebay all the time, as a set of 4, for a very reasonable price.
The 'big 28' is just a T-25 that's been machined out to accept bigger wheels. The S-15 turbo will out spool, and make the same HP as the GT28 aka 'Disco Potato' turbo. The S15 turbo is made using the new Garrett GT spec compressor and turbine. It comes from the factory with an inconel turbine wheel! Plus it's full ballbearing.
that's my .02
Used 550cc SR20DET injectors are on Ebay all the time, as a set of 4, for a very reasonable price.
The 'big 28' is just a T-25 that's been machined out to accept bigger wheels. The S-15 turbo will out spool, and make the same HP as the GT28 aka 'Disco Potato' turbo. The S15 turbo is made using the new Garrett GT spec compressor and turbine. It comes from the factory with an inconel turbine wheel! Plus it's full ballbearing.
that's my .02
You can piece together a better setup, but this requires plenty of research and a little risk if you buy used components.
Honestly, the HT.com kit isn't ideal(mostly because of the JWT ECU in my opinion), but they go through the hassle of giving you a "turn-key" turbo upgrade.
It's not bleeding edge performance, but it's all new and takes the work of piecing stuff together out of the equation. So you have to look at the cost to benefit ratio here. Some people are *really* adverse to putting together various components then "making" them work, while others live for that kind of stuff. Your call ultimately.
The FP Big28 will flow a bit more than an S15 turbo, but probably be just a hair slower on spool up. It's a tradeoff you'll have to decide if it's worth it for you.
Here's an alternate shopping list for pure power tho':1. S15 Turbo, new - $8002. 4 Nismo 550cc inj, new - $480-5003. Z32 MAFS (used from sponsor) - $200-2504. S-AFC II, new - $320ish5. Dyno time and some forum help to tune it - $100-200
All said and done, you might be making slightly more power than the HT.com kit, but you've spent nearly as much as the Big28 kit and had a little bit more work to do on your end. So is the money you saved worth the extra work and research you'll have to do? Only you can decide...
Going with used components is also a risk you can decide to take if you feel the money saved will be worth the small chance that you'll get completely ripped off and lose ALL that money outright. I buy some used components, but I'm wary and try to go with new stuff if it's a wear item.
Honestly, the HT.com kit isn't ideal(mostly because of the JWT ECU in my opinion), but they go through the hassle of giving you a "turn-key" turbo upgrade.
It's not bleeding edge performance, but it's all new and takes the work of piecing stuff together out of the equation. So you have to look at the cost to benefit ratio here. Some people are *really* adverse to putting together various components then "making" them work, while others live for that kind of stuff. Your call ultimately.
The FP Big28 will flow a bit more than an S15 turbo, but probably be just a hair slower on spool up. It's a tradeoff you'll have to decide if it's worth it for you.
Here's an alternate shopping list for pure power tho':1. S15 Turbo, new - $8002. 4 Nismo 550cc inj, new - $480-5003. Z32 MAFS (used from sponsor) - $200-2504. S-AFC II, new - $320ish5. Dyno time and some forum help to tune it - $100-200
All said and done, you might be making slightly more power than the HT.com kit, but you've spent nearly as much as the Big28 kit and had a little bit more work to do on your end. So is the money you saved worth the extra work and research you'll have to do? Only you can decide...
Going with used components is also a risk you can decide to take if you feel the money saved will be worth the small chance that you'll get completely ripped off and lose ALL that money outright. I buy some used components, but I'm wary and try to go with new stuff if it's a wear item.
I like the S15 turbo setup. Maybe add a few more $$ for injectors and make note that you will have to modify you turbo inlet and outlets (or buy S15 ones) to make your stock hotpipe and intake tube to work.
The other alternative is to get these inlet and outlet adapter plates. Sorry this is not from a sponsor, but maybe you can find them from one.
http://www.raretrick.com/index...=6779
The other alternative is to get these inlet and outlet adapter plates. Sorry this is not from a sponsor, but maybe you can find them from one.
http://www.raretrick.com/index...=6779
T3's can either struggle to max out your stock MAFS/injs or they can support 300+rwhp. It depends on the A/R of the compressor and turbine, the wheels and their trims.
Honestly, it'd have to be a KILLER deal and a good turbo for your application for it to even be worth it.
I'd go with a turbo that bolts onto your stock manifold if you only want 300-350rwhp, but that's just me.
Honestly, it'd have to be a KILLER deal and a good turbo for your application for it to even be worth it.
I'd go with a turbo that bolts onto your stock manifold if you only want 300-350rwhp, but that's just me.
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s13sr20chris
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- Car: '89 Nissan S13 w/redtop running 13psi and not leaking fuel anymore
- Contact:
can i beat the brake drum some? i have found that stock brakes are fine on the street assuming that they are in good shape. on the other hand there are a lot of nissans with sticky calipers that you dont even know are sticky. now road racing is different... if i were you fred, i would just get pads and fluid. i think you should be in the low 13's with your stock turbo and 14 psi.
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s13sr20chris
- Posts: 4148
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- Car: '89 Nissan S13 w/redtop running 13psi and not leaking fuel anymore
- Contact:
Also I don't understand people who advocate the S15 turbo over the Big28. The S15 T28 is far less powerful turbo and only spools marginally faster. If spool time is EXTRA important to you then I can understand, but the ability to make higher horsepower for less money with a few hundred RPM of extra lag is good enough for me. With a Stainless manifold the Big28 will spool identical to the stock T25 and can put out 330-340whp if tuned right (I already posted about this a few weeks ago). It might fall off a little sooner than the S15 T28 at 6800-7000 (not sure what the S15 turbo drops at), but I shift there anyways, so once again not an issue.
Does anyone else have any other reasons why the S15 T28 is a good turbo, becuase I've yet to hear one good argument.
Does anyone else have any other reasons why the S15 T28 is a good turbo, becuase I've yet to hear one good argument.
It is a stock turbo.It's ball bearing.It has not been machined by anyone but garrettIt's $800It has a divider on the exhaust side to keep the 2 flows separate.It looks like it has a better wastegate actuator.Phase2 Rocks, the turbo comes immediately and when i called they had 9 in the warehouse.
I am not a fan of using a small housing for a big turbine. Seems like you would loose some structural integrety in the housing.
I also just bought an S15 T28 so I feel the need to justify...
I am not a fan of using a small housing for a big turbine. Seems like you would loose some structural integrety in the housing.
I also just bought an S15 T28 so I feel the need to justify...
Re: Were does my SR go from here?
PalmerWMD wrote:I am pretty sure I want a trasher kit, so I dont have to worry about my valves too much at high rpms.
By trasher kit you mean body kit? and worry about what valves?
unfrgivn wrote:Fair enough but once again, you have presented nothing which leads me to believe I should spend an extra $50 for a turbo that makes 40 less whp and only spools marginally faster.
That's cool The biggest reason I let go of the $50 is because i wanted something that hadn't been massaged. Thats all. I'm not hating on the FP Big28 or anything. I am also only looking for right at 300 RWHP and i figure with the AEM (when it comes out) and all the other bolt-on stuff on the car i should be able to make it to 300. (thats only 50 more than the S15 makes at 7 PSI)
As soon as AEM comes around and i make the drive up to next level i'll be able to give everyone a LOT better idea of how much power you can actuially get on 93 octaine with a standalone and an S15 T28.