valve train upgrade

[1SlowCA18DET]

what options do i have?

[themadscientist]

bronze valve guides, solid cam followers, stiffer springs and titanium retainers.

[originalsin]

bronze valve guides, solid cam followers, stiffer springs and titanium retainers.

sources and prices?

[dattodude]

Tomei, JUN are the old main contenders..

For the High performance Tomei procams, expect no change out of US$1500.

JUN only sell spring retainers for CA18 these days.Neither JUN or Tomei sell CA18 Cam Followers (Solid Lifters).Tomei have suspended manufacture, but they are still on the catalog (which hasn't been updated since 2003).

So before you open your wallet. Get the full solution with quotes on price and delivery time. Because the time for some parts is open-ended at the moment.

I'm still on the lookout for solid lifters/shims to suit my Tomei cams.

I believe the CA18 is almost 'end of life', in regards to aftermarket parts.

This is a controvertial statement, but the writing is on the wall.

If you settle for the lower lift Tomei PONcams, you could get the cams and springs from Tomei, and get some new titanium retainers from JUN. ~US$1100. This would allow you to continue using the hydraulic lifters that are standard on a CA18.

Cheers,Chris

[teddy]

Valvesprings and lifters for VG motors work in the CA's.

You can also get Tomei Procams for $190 apiece +s&h at Greenline. They also have your(dattodude) shimset for $68. Unless they're prices haven't been updated in 4 years, which everything seems updated to me.

[OmarM]

whats greenline?>

[Kouks]

Here ya go, I got this one....

http://www.greenline.jp/catalo...issan

there ya go, shut up, venture into the world of japan and happy exploring!

BTW.....whats the current exchange rate....????
Modified by Kouks at 12:18 PM 2/23/2006

[dattodude]

I was told 2 weeks ago by Greenline that solid lifters are not available, and they have no idea when they will become available..

How recent is your information??

The shims are useless without the lifters.

Cheers.

[float_6969]

I don't have any personal experience with it, but I have also heard that VG solid lifters will work. You can also go to http://www.coltcams.com and just get your cams reground. That's what I plan on doing eventually.

[dattodude]

Yeah,

I'm not looking to pick an argument. I'm quite frustrated though at the lack of availability for the lifters. The VG, CA and RB25 lifters are all the same, they only differ in the number of them you need for the head.

The CA/RB25/VG lifters are all hydraulic from the factory. So all of the engine owners planning to go with a reground cam with high lift, must get aftermarket solid lifters with shims to suit the new base circle. So CA18 owners aren't the only owners starving for aftermarket parts. I wonder if VQ35 ones fit? I know RB26 lifters are 1mm bigger in diameter (and solid type).

I'll probably end up making my own. Or getting a CNC-equipped shop to do it for me.

Colt Cams might be able to change the duration, but without modifying the base circle (requiring solid lifters), you won't get anymore lift from the factory cams. The Tomei website shows pictures of what I mean in their camshaft tech section.

Cheers,Chris
Modified by dattodude at 11:20 PM 2/24/2006

[float_6969]

That's not entirely true either though. All you've got to do is shim underneath the hydro lifter to compensate for the smaller base circle. I think Colt has those available and sells them with the cams.

[silvia_ca18det]

i have talked with tomei just a few weeks ago, u can call them in japan and when the jap guy answeres just say english and they can tell u if they still have the stuff in! i just ordered my tomei rods from them and should be here in about 4 weeks, the solid lifters are still there aswell as the valve springs and all the goodies! u just have to wait a little!

[boost_boy]

i have talked with tomei just a few weeks ago, u can call them in japan and when the jap guy answeres just say english and they can tell u if they still have the stuff in! i just ordered my tomei rods from them and should be here in about 4 weeks, the solid lifters are still there aswell as the valve springs and all the goodies! u just have to wait a little!

Tomei rods? You must have some serious bucks to toss away, huh! If you guys are not shooting for big power, I wouldn't waste a penny on the solid lifters. Just buy some new lifters, feed the engine fuel and air and keep going. Don't forget, crower, carillo, just to name a few also makes rods.

Dee

[Kouks]

money to burn, tomei rods IMHO are not worth the extra money. valvetrain is another story, unless you are going for the stroker kit, buy cheaper American made rods. Pauter also makes rods for the ca.

[dattodude]

i have talked with tomei just a few weeks ago, u can call them in japan and when the jap guy answeres just say english and they can tell u if they still have the stuff in! i just ordered my tomei rods from them and should be here in about 4 weeks, the solid lifters are still there aswell as the valve springs and all the goodies! u just have to wait a little!

Thanks for the update.

I was told by Greenline. "Unavailable". They never responded to my 2 requests to be put on a waiting list.

Thanks to this thread, I was thinking about doing the hydraulic + shim job today using the same steel we use for the custom drive axles for Z32 R200 diff conversion into Datsuns. But I'm unsure how big I should make the shims. I expected the shims (under the lifter) would need to be equal to "difference in base circle diameter / 2" As close as possible. Can anyone confirm?

The reason I'm going for high lift cams, is for high rev horsepower, and bouncing hydraulic lifters will lose a good percentage of the projected benefit. So I'm still going for solid lifters and shims when Tomei put them back into production. I plan to use compressed air into the sparkplug hole to keep the valve in the head while I change cams, springs, retainers, lifters. Using compressed air means the head doesn't need to come off.

Anyone know when using fully solid lifters, what the (cold) lash should be set to? Maybe I should go read the R32 GTR factory manual PDF, where it will discuss the adjustment of the solid lifters in the RB26dett.

R32 GTR Manual saysMeasure ONLY when cold.Intake 0.45mm +- 0.03mmExhaust 0.38mm +- 0.03mm

For RB26dett, there are 70 types of shims, from 2.275mm 3.325mm in 0.015mm increments.

Cheers,Chris.
Modified by dattodude at 5:16 AM 2/26/2006

[dattodude]

Remember when overhauling RB26 heads..be sure to remove 'fur' from the heads !? :-) Japanese Workshops must commonly have pets wandering around their workshops??

[yourmomsrps13]

haha, there was a shop (mighta been signal) that had a kitty cat stuck in a customers exhaust where the downpipe meets the catback. he heard meows and thought he was losing his mind, they un bolted the exhaust and then pulled the cat out. so watch out for the fur!

[r34 gtr]

im sure paeco will make you some solid lifters for next to nothing. i love those guys.

- tim

[boost_boy]

im sure paeco will make you some solid lifters for next to nothing. i love those guys.

- tim

Yeah, I strongly caution anyone wanting to buy their double valve springs. I hate to say it as I had hoped to rely on theeir product, but pure junk. I had some break in my head and I didn't even drive the damn thing and then my fiance ordered some more, not only did they not cut us some slack on the broken stuff, but sent us the wrong ones in which we had to get a refund. But hey, take your chances. Tim, you may have a better chance at dealing with them than anyone else sice you live in Alabama.

Dee

[r34 gtr]

yeah, the only way im gonna deal with them is face to face. its so cheap i just automatically assume them to be shady as crap.

ive got a guy up here in huntsville that is happy to make solid lifters out of anything (titanium, scandium aluminum, inconel) but he charges a freaking fortune!! i trust his work with my life though, as he also does all the machine work for my dad. if its good enough for NASA, its good enough for me!

- Tim

[dattodude]

Hi Guys.

I got a local dealer to pressure a response from Tomei, and they suggested we source the CA18 solid lifter from Kameari Engine Works Japan.

Worked out to be about US$700 delivered. Which is a lot more than the Tomei ones. But at least I'll have them in the next 21 days.

So the 270degree/9.25mm cams will finally make it into my engine. I've got crossed fingers that the valves have enough clearance on the forged pistons. Should have it all installed and re-tuned in next month or so.

Cheers,Chris

[silvia_ca18det]

Hi Guys.

I got a local dealer to pressure a response from Tomei, and they suggested we source the CA18 solid lifter from Kameari Engine Works Japan.

Worked out to be about US$700 delivered. Which is a lot more than the Tomei ones. But at least I'll have them in the next 21 days.

So the 270degree/9.25mm cams will finally make it into my engine. I've got crossed fingers that the valves have enough clearance on the forged pistons. Should have it all installed and re-tuned in next month or so.

Cheers,Chris

did u have to do any machine work for the 9.25 cams? just curious as cuz i will be getting the same set!

[top_secret]

I had a set of JUN 272 10.5's before but once I realized 1) the nightmare that installing them would be and 2) that I would need a fully built bottom end to even reach the power band peak on those I sold them. I wonder where they ended up!? Hopefully on a badass motor somewhere. This was a few years ago when raretrick had the tomei solid lifter ish available.

[dattodude]

Shouldn't have to. I have aftermarket forged pistons with machined clearance for the valves, also have o-ringed head, so should not be a problem. I'm a gamb|ing man.. so have to wait and see, I might choose to take off the head and use some plasticine to check valve/piston clearance as I should. Will be a rather large pain if I need to get the pistons machined and bottom end rebalanced.

I won't be able to comment on the clearance of the cams when using standard pistons.

I'll know more in 4-5 weeks. I'll be sure to publish my progress in this thread. Good place to keep the info together.

did u have to do any machine work for the 9.25 cams? just curious as cuz i will be getting the same set!

[progman]

Did you ever buy these double valve springs from paeco? If you did let me know if it worked out.

Thanks.

[float_6969]

Just to re-iderate, but the solid lifter and springs from a VG30DE(TT) (Z32) will work just as fine, you'll just have extra's.

[boost_boy]

Did you ever buy these double valve springs from paeco? If you did let me know if it worked out.

Thanks.

You gotta read, bro! They broke while the car was just idling. My machinist called them 'JUNK' and I truly believe that they were. Contact Jim Wolf technogy and tell them you want some valve springs. That's what I'm using now in one of my engines and a couple of customer engines and they are better than fine. Stay away from Paeco's valve double valve springs........You've been warned.

Dee

[dash]

when the path to higher performance is heavily lined with dollar bills, I see it as time to look at another powerplant.... you may wind up paying so much for cam/valvetrain mods, when you could've been alot happier with an unopened rb25 or v6 for example. Law of diminishing returns will own u.

Camshafts other than the proven japanese brands may be another area of risk. Most off brands lack R&D and often show little to no gain. Anybody remember Ivans early KA24DE Crower cam dramas - they lost power vs stock throughout the rev range. He's making sick power now. Another classic example of this is what the DSM community went thru trying to find an alternative to rival $700 HKS cams that were usually on back order. Now they have $400 u.s. "drop-in" counterparts that outperform the ol 'benchmarks'. Didn't come ez tho, and no chance the ca18 has a comparible market to drive at similar outcome. We'd have to get 'lucky'. I went thru the same crap with a toyota 4cyl and was astonished at what a difference a *properly* designed/ground camshaft made.

[r34 gtr]

i never said i was going to buy the valve springs. i only spoke to paeco once actually, and it took them so long to reply i had almost forgotten i emailed them in the first place. they dont seem to do quality work, and i am not about to risk anything. you could contact endura-tech, one of our sponsors, as i understand they rule at making valve springs.

as far as ive seen, every path to higher performance is heavily lined with dollar bills. even on new cars. four pistons and rods are cheaper than six! actually, i have seen the aftermarket for the CA pick up a good bit in the time i have owned the engine. i know they are getting harder to find, but i think it just makes them cooler!

[AWDB12wagon]

so will the RB26DETT solid lifters work??? Thanks GURU's.~Ryan