Tire Shopping.. F50 Still stock at 245/45/18

[qship96]

George,good to hear about the car!!....not so good to hear about YOU!!! My father had the whole bypass surgery years ago, and the only bit of advice I can give you is to make the rehab and exercise TOP PRIORITY-my dad didnt, and never fully recovered, just slowly decayed til the end.
Modified by qship96 at 12:16 AM 10/17/2008

[maxnix]

They are very quite, and contrary to what was said in this post, they DO NOT "At 5K they are severely degraded. At 10K, they are shot unless you have a high tolerance for abuse."

Well, here are three contradicting opinions.

zer...tires

But Z and I see pretty much eye to eye on tires for big Infiniti V8 sedans. Such pitful degradation at an such early stage on the lighter V35 sedan is just unacceptable unless you enjoy self flagellation.

It all depends upon your standards and to what you are accustomed.

[mcrews]

Marlin,your asked.."Did you recalibrate your speedometer? If not, you're not actually getting any better gas mileage, you're just getting an false report. You're speedometer is not displaying the actual speed, and your odometer is not correct either".

How does that work when I stated the difference is 3.4%? So ....maybe. .....just maybe, I figured in the diference when I did my mpg?

And actually, just using common logic and math would explain that a larger diameter, once in motion, reguires less energy to cover the same distance as a smaller diameter.

so yes, I got better mileage AND infact did factor in the size difference.


Modified by mcrews at 8:26 AM 10/17/2008

[mcrews]

you gotta love "objective facts"one member, brian's hero, Q45tech has a bad experience ....and that's a FACT. Two members (who are not brian's hero's) have good experiences and that's just perception.We are really rolling on square tires because ....well.. because.......brian says so!!!!!

wow, thanks for clearing that up brian... ....you said"TR essentially only reviews top performers. Why review mid level tires for happy-just-to-be-rolling types?"

just got back from tIRERACK.COM...(Because, brian, you are always slamming posters for grammer and spelling.).....TIRE RACK doesnt 'review', TIRERACK tests........the purchasers of the tires, customers, do the reviews.

but if you go to TIRERACK, you will see that TIRERACK has "TESTED" the kuhmos ASX.

so brian, just for consistancy.......huh ......which is it??????

a third tier company

or

a top performer??????????/
Modified by mcrews at 8:37 AM 10/17/2008

[marlin29311]

And actually, just using common logic and math would explain that a larger diameter, once in motion, reguires less energy to cover the same distance as a smaller diameter.

so yes, I got better mileage AND infact did factor in the size difference.

In theory, you are correct. In practical application, it's not necessarily true. Rolling friction, weight, pressure fluctuation etc. This only applies during steady velocity. At such point that acceleration is introduced, it can be argued, that the longer torque arm actually requires more power due to it's higher moment of inertia.

As for you second comment, lets have some facts.



Don't just go along saying that since they were reviewed they are quality. Tirerack reviews numerous tires just for comparison points. Your "top tier" tire doesn't compare to the other major brands, as you can see by their overall ratings on the road and track.

Also note that the wonderfully intelligent and super compitent auto enthusists reviewing the tires for you (aka the consumers) have rated the Kuhmo as 11th in its category, falling behind the major brands. These are "facts."

the Kumho Ecsta ASX displayed abrupt break-away characteristics, making it feel unsettled and very slippery, especially when attempting to accelerate and during braking.

Just throwing it out there too.

[maxnix]

No doubt it is third tier!

That second group cited above is a sorry set of performers. The Tire Rack test do show you generally what you are getting in new tire performance for the money you are putting out. It's all personal choice, but to maintian that there is no difference between top grades from tier 1 maufacturers and tier 2 and 3 manufacturerers is just plain ill inkformed and incorrect.

What's interesting abuot these tests is that they are new tires. It wouild be most enlightenting to test the tires at 5K, 10K, 15K after they have severely degraded. Then hwo constructs the best tires would be clearly apparent. The problem is one enver know how many curbs and chuck holes each tire has hit, how frequently rotations and balancing was performed.

Then there are the ones with colored and scented smoke for truly discerning.

[Unnatural1]

I think I've made my point fairly clear on this. The original poster said he didn't really want to spend $1000 on a new set of tires. I can understand this position, because who what's to spend that kind of money on a tire that is going to wear out in a short period of time. He didn't happen to mention that he will be autocrossing/road racing his Q.

The ratings graphs that were presented are not comparing apples to apples. You've got tire ratings for two different category of tires. The graph that includes the Eagle F1 is rating Max Performance Summer tires. Max Performance tires are the last stop before you get into the Competition tires. They are no holds barred performance street tires. You are then comparing them to Ultra Performance All Season tires. Wow, that's a fair comparison.

On the other hand, if you look at Sumitomo's Max Performance Summer Tire the HTRZ III you'll see it was given a 7.35 rating which puts in the realm as the other tires in that category. TR ratings are not gospel as they are subjective. But, what else do you have to go by but peoples opinion and personal experience. Having worked for a Goodyear shop at one point in my career I can tell you they are, for the most part, not worth the money IN MY OPINION. If you don't like that comment...tough.

Are these "lesser" tires every bit as good as the tires you list above? It's subjective but in many cases I'm sure the answer is "no". In most cases, you DO get what you pay but in some cases I don't think you do.

Originally, my only point was you don't have to spend a grand on tires to get a decent quality set that will perform well. Are they the end all in performance...no, but they don't need to be. He's going from used sets of tires of varying quality to a new set of decent quality tires. The car is not going to the race track anytime soon I'm sure.

BTW a transmission is not a brake pad. It's about as much a "wear item" as your engine.

[paranoidjack]

For what it's worth, I bought my Q with 72k on it. I have 158k now, with no major mechanical repairs (I take very good care of her).

72k-100k Bridgestone s03 pole positions....quiet, good grip, TERRIBLE longevity, TERRIBLE, tires were unbalanceable and worn to nothing in only 20k...light driving

100k-110k Kumho's....very disappointed with ride quality (heard the road like never before in my Q), poor traction in wet, and finally I nearly lost control going fairly cautiously around a rotary, and ditched them with only 10k on them for...

110k-158k....TOYO VERSADO LX's....What a truly fantastic tire!!! Quiet, incredible traction, and AMAZING tread life. I would recommend this tire to anyone with a 4,000lb+car, and will buy them again in a heartbeat. Probably still have 5/32 left with nearly 50k on them. Had them balanced last week, no problem. What a fantastic tire.

http://www.tirereview.com/?type=art&id=82735

[mcrews]

Marlin,you said "In theory, you are correct. In practical application, it's not necessarily true. Rolling friction, weight, pressure fluctuation etc. This only applies during steady velocity. At such point that acceleration is introduced, it can be argued, that the longer torque arm actually requires more power due to it's higher moment of inertia."

Which is why I prefface the larger size w/ "I do alot of hiwy driving."If I used the Q more that 50% in town miles, I dont think I would have the high mpgs. However, the upsize is so minimal, that intown performance seems unaffected. (stop sign to stop sign). But I am sure the intown mileage suffers.

I guess to wrap up this thread, blanket statements like "THEY DEGRADE AT 10K" serve no purpose in any conversation. especially when the blanket statement is not true. More than a few of us have had better than satisfactory results with kohmos. To then imply that we must not have any appreciation for 'real' tires is petty.

For another example, I think we all agree that aftermarket intakes DO NOT work on Q45s reguardless of model.

We all respect opinions, we roll our eyes at

[marlin29311]

The ratings graphs that were presented are not comparing apples to apples. You've got tire ratings for two different category of tires. The graph that includes the Eagle F1 is rating Max Performance Summer tires. Max Performance tires are the last stop before you get into the Competition tires. They are no holds barred performance street tires. You are then comparing them to Ultra Performance All Season tires. Wow, that's a fair comparison.

Look at the graphs closer - it says "Eagle F1All-Season." All the tires listed there are ultra-high performance all-season tires. Go onto the tire rack and read the full reviews for each one if you want. They're "ultra-high performance all-season" and "ultra-high performance all-season and low price." Same categories. Try looking a little closer next time.

[maxnix]

I guess to wrap up this thread, blanket statements like "THEY DEGRADE AT 10K" serve no purpose in any conversation. especially when the blanket statement is not true.

Tires degrade just sitting in air. They start structurally degrading upon use and continue from there. Why Michelin says all bets are off on tire ratings for any tire over 20K miles. One of the many reasons performance tires do not last 30K and have soft rubber compounds.

Some people are curious to know that there are numbers larger than 2 that are not collectively called "many", but have individual names and values. There's another true blanket statement for you.

[qship96]

The marketing slogan "Sooner or later you'll own Generals" is aimed at those who currently own Kumblos, Hankooks, Nankings, Nexens and aspire to move up in the tire world!

[Unnatural1]

Okay...my mistake. Sorry Marlin.

Here's another graph featuring the Eagle F1 All Season:

This time they rated it at 6.98, but that illustrates my point. It's all very subjective. In the end you are paying a premium for that last little bit of performance. You are getting to the point of diminishing returns. But again, that's not necessarily what the original poster of this thread wanted. His Q45 isn't going to be reaching it's limits on a road racing track anytime soon. If he asked about tires for a car he was going to race my original answer would have been some what different. But I still don't like Goodyears!

[Unnatural1]

The marketing slogan "Sooner or later you'll own Generals" is aimed at those who currently own Kumblos, Hankooks, Nankings, Nexens and aspire to move up in the tire world!

OMG...Generals...another tire company I've had bad luck with.

[mcrews]

Tires degrade just sitting in air. They start structurally degrading upon use and continue from there. Why Michelin says all bets are off on tire ratings for any tire over 20K miles. One of the many reasons performance tires do not last 30K and have soft rubber compounds.

Some people are curious to know that there are numbers larger than 2 that are not collectively called "many", but have individual names and values. There's another true blanket statement for you.

damn brian,I wish I could twist facts like you....you change arguements like you change underwear.The point of your broad stroke statement was that ALL KOHMOS DEGRADE IN 10 K.

Now you want us to believe that what you meant was that ALL TIRES DEGRADE in 10K.

my point was, (and everyone acknowledges,) you always quote Q45.(which actually raises the question of why Q45tech was even buying kuhmos to start with???!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?! )you said he had a bad experience , therefore all kuhmos suck...and those of us who had positive experiences don't know what the heck we are talking about. Then you state that TR only 'reviews' top of the line. FACT is TR only TESTS. Reviews are done by consumers. Then you say, all those comsumers drive on ****ty tires to start with. SO how would they know if kuhmos are any good. So while everyone else's opinions suck. your "opinions" are fact.

it gets old. it real does.

Come on.....which is it??????

[DBrown2]

Bump...

Since Brian didnt like me loosing the stock wheels... I am now staying stock wheels... But entertaining... mixing tire sizes...

Thoughts??