Smoke At Startup After Synthetic Oil Change

[Flagship-Q]

I have a concern now that I have changed to synthetic oil. After sitting for a week or so when I go to start the car it smokes for about 10 seconds (decent but not mosquito fogging) since I switched to full synthetic (Syntech - Wal-Mart brand 10w30). I've had the car for 4 mo. now and didn't notice this when I inspected the car before purchasing. Should I switch back to regular dino oil or just dismiss this? Thanks.

[0wn3r]

Is it this the first time you started it up since you changed it?

[nuQ]

what color smoke???? don't know how cold it is by you now,,but, the Q is very well know to blow white smoke, esp. when it's cold, for quite a while. r u hearing any new valve rattles since the change? another complaint when swithching to synth. oil. i do know that, in the winter, mine looks like i'm dusting for mosquitos until it's totally warmed up!

[Flagship-Q]

what color smoke???? don't know how cold it is by you now,,but, the Q is very well know to blow white smoke, esp. when it's cold, for quite a while. r u hearing any new valve rattles since the change? another complaint when swithching to synth. oil. i do know that, in the winter, mine looks like i'm dusting for mosquitos until it's totally warmed up!

It's a light white-ish smoke, not from cold weather (80+ degrees outside). It's been about 1K miles ago since the oil change so it's been started many times since then. No irregular noises from the engine or rattles either. I wonder if some is seeping past the valve guides? It doesn't seem to do it again if I have been driving it for say the weekend (driven everyday).

[pito11213]

I notice Q's when cold tend to smoke a little. I believe it to be normal. Just dont want blue smoke. That is the killer. Or sweet smelling real white smoke.

[elwesso]

Yeah unless its blue then theres nothing to worry about... had nothing to do with the oil change!

[GreenQ45a]

I will happen till you burn off all the real oil...Nutt'n to worry about.

I got a ticket once for my 300ZX after switching to synthetic I mixed 5 bottles of synthetic with 1/2 real oil and it looked like James Bond was trying to loose some baddies.

If you did not drain all the old oil first it will do it untill your next synth change.

[DominickJ30]

I will happen till you burn off all the real oil...Nutt'n to worry about.

I got a ticket once for my 300ZX after switching to synthetic I mixed 5 bottles of synthetic with 1/2 real oil and it looked like James Bond was trying to loose some baddies.

If you did not drain all the old oil first it will do it untill your next synth change.

This is entirely incorrect. The oil is not supposed to burn.

[GreenQ45a]

All conventional oils contain naturally occurring substances such as sulfur, sulfur compounds, reactive hydrocarbons and other materials, that can not be completely removed from the petroleum crude and thus end up in the final product.

High oil temperature in excess of 240°F (115°C) will break down petroleum oils and cause oxidation

Synthetic oils are produced either by a chemical reaction (synthesis), severe refining or other complex chemical processes, that yield molecular uniformity and purity that is impossible to achieve through normal refining process.

All consumer level "synthetics" are still produced from petroleum and although more uniform and better performing at the temperature extremes, they still suffer from the same problems that petroleum does. Additionally many "pure" synthetics are very poor lubricants and cause excessive wear. They also have poor solubility for additives.

Sorry DominickJ30... what were you saying?

[0wn3r]

All conventional oils contain naturally occurring substances such as sulfur, sulfur compounds, reactive hydrocarbons and other materials, that can not be completely removed from the petroleum crude and thus end up in the final product.

High oil temperature in excess of 240°F (115°C) will break down petroleum oils and cause oxidation

Synthetic oils are produced either by a chemical reaction (synthesis), severe refining or other complex chemical processes, that yield molecular uniformity and purity that is impossible to achieve through normal refining process.

All consumer level "synthetics" are still produced from petroleum and although more uniform and better performing at the temperature extremes, they still suffer from the same problems that petroleum does. Additionally many "pure" synthetics are very poor lubricants and cause excessive wear. They also have poor solubility for additives.

Sorry DominickJ30... what were you saying?

so you're saying that when the car is started and runs hotter than 240 degrees, it's just going to burn all of your oil away? That'd mean that when your 3K+ miles are up, you'd probably have no oil left. I think he meant that it's not supposed to be visibly bad which seems like it is in this kid's case.

[DominickJ30]

GreenQ, I mean like blue smoke out the tail pipe, but thanks for coping and pasting all that nice info.

[pito11213]

Play nice guys.

Oh and its copying as in reproduction

Not coping as in ghetto slang for buying.

[elwesso]

lets not get in a hissy fit about whos right... The bottom line is that the oil has nothing to do with car "smoking", or more correctly steaming..... GreenQ was wrong but thats not important.. he is right that that it will oxidize, but that will just mean more blowby and sludge buildup, it wont come out the tail pipe. It will somewhat reciculate into the PCV system...

Sorry green, you didnt own anyone!! Good information but not applicable here.

[Jesda]

After a switch from dino to synth, one can expect leftover insoluble contaminants to burn off. Or maybe I'm full of ****. Report back in another 3000mi and let us know what happens.

[elwesso]

After a switch from dino to synth, one can expect leftover insoluble contaminants to burn off. Or maybe I'm full of ****. Report back in another 3000mi and let us know what happens.

How? They would just go out with the oil, down the drain!!!!

[GreenQ45a]

so you're saying that when the car is started and runs hotter than 240 degrees, it's just going to burn all of your oil away? That'd mean that when your 3K+ miles are up, you'd probably have no oil left. I think he meant that it's not supposed to be visibly bad which seems like it is in this kid's case.

NO what I'm saying is Synthetic heats up slower than conventional oil.

Also @ 240 degrees the convetional oil will start to breakdown were as the synthetic will not start to breakdown till 350-400 degrees.

Enhanced high temperature durability, reducing oxidation rates and wear on some engine parts because many synthetic will tolerate temperatures up to 400°F.

So yes running both your engine will allow conventional oil to begin "smoking", or more correctly steam..... While the synthetic will remain stable...

[FarFetched]

There are factors that play role in oil consumpion (burning) inside of an engine.. Steaming is one, smoking tail pipe after an idle time or at hot/cold start-up is another problem!You have valve stem seals, you have oil rings, you have compression rings wich gaps must (in perfect) form 120 degrees pattern for tight seal in cylinder bore! At least compression ring gaps should be opposite of each other. Valve stem seals are easy to understand. In a worn engine those things aren't happening thus you have more blowby and increase oil consumption. A stuck oil ring will let oil enter combustion chamber. A misaligned compression rings will give you different problem with similar symptoms (different smoke color). It might be so minuscule so you will never notice by checking oil level. However, it will always give you a puff of smoke every time pressure(flow) increses in combustion chamber. In simple words, any oil that enters combustion chamber will be expelled in a form of smoke (normally bluish color with specific odor)Cheers!P.S I've never heard of synthetic/mineral mix oil burn-off situation
Modified by FarFetched at 8:36 PM 10/5/2005

[rasrx7]

could it be possibly that you are running a lighter oil then your motor was using. If you bought the car used. Some people will toss in 20-50 oil to cover up the smoke from burnt valves or bad rings. Maybe the car you have was running a thicker oil and when you changed to the synthetic, after all the heavy oil passed, the synthetic is getting in and it slips right through cause its better and more refined grade?..just a thought...

[Flagship-Q]

The oil filter had a date that was marked with a pen of 12/03, so when I bought it in 5/05 that told me it hadn't been changed (the filter atleast) for quite some time (he didn't drive the car very much or in the winter time) and the oil was pretty dark color. I have all the reciepts from the previous owner and he took very good care of the car so I don't tend to think it was neglected very much. At just turning 100k, I wouldn't think there would be too much excessive wear by now so maybe the next oil change may have a different outlook. Thanks for all the replies too.

[PoorManQ45]

NO what I'm saying is Synthetic heats up slower than conventional oil.

Also @ 240 degrees the convetional oil will start to breakdown were as the synthetic will not start to breakdown till 350-400 degrees.

Enhanced high temperature durability, reducing oxidation rates and wear on some engine parts because many synthetic will tolerate temperatures up to 400°F.

So yes running both your engine will allow conventional oil to begin "smoking", or more correctly steam..... While the synthetic will remain stable...

Dude, I think it's time for you to get a tune up, you're starting to smoke something fierce

Here you go, first of all, Standard motor oils do NOT start to break down at temperatures near 240. If that was the case then the current GMC SUVs would be running with only a 30 degree overhead(215 measured via temp sensor in the cooling system). The fact of the matter is that Motor Oils can be used to the same temperatures as synthetics. Don't believe me? Here you go, I uploaded this handy Oil Guide for you. Notice that even the crappiest motor oil withstands 350degrees+.

Now to the mixing of synthetics with motor oil. You stated that the motor oil would be burned off! WTF! Are you suggesting that the piston rings have these magic little gates in them that only let motor oil through? If so then holy $hit them japanese are way ahead of us. The fact of the matter is that if any oil is getting by the rings, then all types of oil will get by the rings.

You say that synthetics heat up slower then motor oil? Would you care to provide a source to this information?(please don't show me a picture of a pot on your stove with oil in it, a thermometer in it and a stop watch in your hand)

Anyways, we run a 5:1 ratio of synthetic to motor oil in all of our vehicles. Not a single one of them smokes, or "steams" as you suggest

You talk about oxidation rates at temps up to 400 degrees. This ALL depends on the additives in the oil. Take a look at the guide that I provided you. You'll notice that high quality motor oils have flash points HIGHER then low quality synthetics. Care to explain this?

[Flagship-Q]

Updating this: I've been driving it this weekend and it is smoking at about every startup blue-ish smoke for about 5 seconds! I wonder if the Syntech oil has anything in it that swells the seals in the engine. I seriously think I'm gonna switch back to regular oil because I don't like it a bit.

[qship96]

blue smoker is a worn engine,period. a heavier oil may allow less to get by valve seals or piston rings,but nothing short of a mechanical renewal{rebuild} will return a worn motor to pre-worn condition.usual cause is extremely high miles on motor,or more likely poor oil and filter change intervals from as early as day 1.

[elwesso]

it is somehwat common for engines to do this with higher miles, especially switching to synthetic... BTW syntec is not a full synthetic, it is a synthetic blend..... at least that what ive been told, i could be wrong....

have you run the car hard at all???? Maybe you should, thats a good thing!

Honestly, what I would do is switch to something like valvoline durablend....

[GreenQ45a]

Poorman do you beleave half the **** you post?

Your "Website" is a cut and paste of others websites.

I found six of the pages you stole from. you referred to none of the creators of the webpages...

Like "Your" Mold making page:

http://www.fibreglast.com/cont....html

Or "Your" Mulitstage Gain Adjustment page:http://www.mmxpress.com/technical/gain.htm

The list goes on and on...


Modified by GreenQ45a at 11:52 AM 10/9/2005

[DominickJ30]

Green, you just got owned my poorman.

[Jesda]

Well now that we know the color of the smoke...

[GreenQ45a]

I KNOW it SO sad.

[PoorManQ45]

Green, you just got owned my poorman.

Your "Website" is a cut and paste of others websites.

I found six of the pages you stole from. you referred to none of the creators of the webpages...

Like "Your" Mold making page:

http://www.fibreglast.com/cont....html

Or "Your" Mulitstage Gain Adjustment page:http://www.mmxpress.com/technical/gain.htm

Yep, it's easier that way . If you'll notice I didn't once lay personal claim to those copied webpages. I just removed all the excess crap on them. I've actually been meaning to redo all of those writeups sinse they all have slight flaws in them.

anyways,

Poorman do you beleave half the **** you post?

What do you mean? Would you like to dispute anything that I posted?

[GreenQ45a]

Of course its easier to cut and paste test rather then re-typing it.I do it everyday at my job.

I just think you should post the source's that is all.

I like all the info Its a one stop shop for car audio which I love.

Lots of good info.

I should not have been so stupid what I was talking was not even the issue at hand. I was talking about my old 300ZX it had still smoked after it had been running for a while...

but for the record dom-J30 was right first...

[Flagship-Q]

Just another update. For some reason, now that I have been a little harder driving the Q, I get NO smoke at all at start up. I'm pretty happy! Don't know if it just needed wound out to burn something off or what.