S13 wheel question
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Hellion240sx
- Posts: 793
- Joined: Mon May 12, 2003 6:30 am
- Car: 1992 240sx se
- Contact:
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veilside180sx
- Posts: 674
- Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2004 7:15 am
Using H&R spacers and wheel studs
Hi Greg,
I was just skimming this thread when I noticed that you are considering purchasing H&R spacers. I recently installed H&R 15 mm spacers, so I wanted to share my experience with you regarding using spacers and using H&R spacers/studs in particular.
You can see this information at the OptionImports web site: All H&R spacers 40 mm or less are sandwich type spacers i.e. they are NOT bolt-on. 40 mm and greater are the bolt-on type.
I have a '92 240SX Coupe (S13), so our suspension mechanicals are probably similar, if not identical. For what it's worth to you, I recently installed H&R's 15 mm spacers on the fronts to accomodate Z32 calipers and rotors. I was going to share my experience with the group in a separate thread, but I'll go ahead and share some relevant information here which may be of help to you.
The stock wheel studs on your car should be around 42 mm. With a 15 mm spacer, I needed wheel studs which were around 42 + 15 = 57 mm.
The H&R spacers are extremely light and well-made. I bought them from OptionImports.com. They come with longer wheel studs to replace the existing studs on your car's hubs. The H&R wheels studs are almost exactly 57 mm.
I had a very difficult time with the wheels studs that came with the spacers. The problems began the first day they were installed.
After hammering out the existing studs from the two front hubs, we attempted to install the new H&R studs. We took each stud, passed it through the (now empty) hole in the hub and tried hammering it into place as best we could (I say tried because there is not much room to swing the hammer hard in the tight space behind the hub).
We then slided some rings onto the studs (from the outside) and screwed on an open ended lug nut on top of the washers. We used a torque wrench to tighten the lug nut to around 100 ft-lbs. The goal is to seat the new wheel stud into its place AND make sure it doesn’t turn. If it does, you’ll never be able to securely tighten a lug nut on the wheel studs.
Well, some of the H&R wheels studs took more easily than others. On some of them, we had to apply in excess of 150 ft-lbs for them to seat firmly and not turn.
Even the ones that appeared to be firm didn’t give much confidence, but we proceeded anyway (we had to get the car mobile again). One of the wheel studs would not seat at all. In the process, we stripped it, which is a difficult thing to accomplish in of itself. So we went to O’Reillys and purchased a temporary wheel stud and nut with a different diameter since there was not one available with the same diameter, stud length, and knurl length and size (wheel stud shape and design matching could be a separate thread in itself). I learned through this process that the most critical part of matching a wheel stud to a hub is the design of knurl – the part that seats in the hub.
You can’t order replacement studs only from OptionImports.com. They send you to H&R. H&R does not sell to consumers directly, so they sent me to a German tuning parts company. I ordered two replacement studs (one extra just in case) for almost $9 each.
With new wheel studs, you need to torque them every few days until they are fully in place. You’ll know when to torque them because the steering wheel will starts shimmying a little.
The problem is even after two months of regular torquing, the H&R wheel studs would not fully seat themselves. To make matters worse, some of the ones that were firm before loosened up. These studs were not working out.
So, I decided to bite the bullet and order NISMO 60 mm wheels studs while wondering if any studs other than the original ones were going to hold.
I installed the new NISMO wheel studs in an hour. I hammered them from the back as best I could. I didn’t torque them with washers and an open nut for fear of stripping them.
The result…they have worked like a charm. They took hold almost immediately. While I have had to re-torque them a little (it’s only been two weeks since I put them on), none of them have come loose and they appear to be as firm as a rock. I am re-torquing them less and less now.
Bottom lineH&R spacers are very good quality, but use NISMO wheel studs instead of the wheel studs that come with them. The knurl design is critical to getting a firm seating in the hub. The knurl (teeth) on the H&R wheels studs is shorter in length than the Nissan stock and NISMO wheel studs and apparently not the exact diameter which allows proper seating in S13 hubs.
[Edit (this was added later): I don't know where Dori Dori got his information, but you can use your existing lug nuts on both the H&R wheels studs and the NISMO 60 mm wheel studs.]
To save money, see if you can purchase the spacers only (from someone other than OptionImports) and not waste your money on the H&R wheels studs.
H&R Special Springs1-888-827-8881 Ask for Rob to get the right part # for the spacer only
ECS Tuning1-800-924-5172 Ask them if you can order the spacers only
By the way, for 25 mm spacers, you would need 42+25=67mm wheel studs. The NISMO 60 mm wheel studs are only 59 mm. So that might present a problem.
By the way, again, I was very apprehensive about using spacers, and many people cautioned me against it. I have had no problems with using spacers. The wider wheel base has actually given me more confidence in turns and cornering. I have driven speeds in excess of 100 mph repeatedly with no issues.
Hope this helps you make a decision.
I was just skimming this thread when I noticed that you are considering purchasing H&R spacers. I recently installed H&R 15 mm spacers, so I wanted to share my experience with you regarding using spacers and using H&R spacers/studs in particular.
You can see this information at the OptionImports web site: All H&R spacers 40 mm or less are sandwich type spacers i.e. they are NOT bolt-on. 40 mm and greater are the bolt-on type.
I have a '92 240SX Coupe (S13), so our suspension mechanicals are probably similar, if not identical. For what it's worth to you, I recently installed H&R's 15 mm spacers on the fronts to accomodate Z32 calipers and rotors. I was going to share my experience with the group in a separate thread, but I'll go ahead and share some relevant information here which may be of help to you.
The stock wheel studs on your car should be around 42 mm. With a 15 mm spacer, I needed wheel studs which were around 42 + 15 = 57 mm.
The H&R spacers are extremely light and well-made. I bought them from OptionImports.com. They come with longer wheel studs to replace the existing studs on your car's hubs. The H&R wheels studs are almost exactly 57 mm.
I had a very difficult time with the wheels studs that came with the spacers. The problems began the first day they were installed.
After hammering out the existing studs from the two front hubs, we attempted to install the new H&R studs. We took each stud, passed it through the (now empty) hole in the hub and tried hammering it into place as best we could (I say tried because there is not much room to swing the hammer hard in the tight space behind the hub).
We then slided some rings onto the studs (from the outside) and screwed on an open ended lug nut on top of the washers. We used a torque wrench to tighten the lug nut to around 100 ft-lbs. The goal is to seat the new wheel stud into its place AND make sure it doesn’t turn. If it does, you’ll never be able to securely tighten a lug nut on the wheel studs.
Well, some of the H&R wheels studs took more easily than others. On some of them, we had to apply in excess of 150 ft-lbs for them to seat firmly and not turn.
Even the ones that appeared to be firm didn’t give much confidence, but we proceeded anyway (we had to get the car mobile again). One of the wheel studs would not seat at all. In the process, we stripped it, which is a difficult thing to accomplish in of itself. So we went to O’Reillys and purchased a temporary wheel stud and nut with a different diameter since there was not one available with the same diameter, stud length, and knurl length and size (wheel stud shape and design matching could be a separate thread in itself). I learned through this process that the most critical part of matching a wheel stud to a hub is the design of knurl – the part that seats in the hub.
You can’t order replacement studs only from OptionImports.com. They send you to H&R. H&R does not sell to consumers directly, so they sent me to a German tuning parts company. I ordered two replacement studs (one extra just in case) for almost $9 each.
With new wheel studs, you need to torque them every few days until they are fully in place. You’ll know when to torque them because the steering wheel will starts shimmying a little.
The problem is even after two months of regular torquing, the H&R wheel studs would not fully seat themselves. To make matters worse, some of the ones that were firm before loosened up. These studs were not working out.
So, I decided to bite the bullet and order NISMO 60 mm wheels studs while wondering if any studs other than the original ones were going to hold.
I installed the new NISMO wheel studs in an hour. I hammered them from the back as best I could. I didn’t torque them with washers and an open nut for fear of stripping them.
The result…they have worked like a charm. They took hold almost immediately. While I have had to re-torque them a little (it’s only been two weeks since I put them on), none of them have come loose and they appear to be as firm as a rock. I am re-torquing them less and less now.
Bottom lineH&R spacers are very good quality, but use NISMO wheel studs instead of the wheel studs that come with them. The knurl design is critical to getting a firm seating in the hub. The knurl (teeth) on the H&R wheels studs is shorter in length than the Nissan stock and NISMO wheel studs and apparently not the exact diameter which allows proper seating in S13 hubs.
[Edit (this was added later): I don't know where Dori Dori got his information, but you can use your existing lug nuts on both the H&R wheels studs and the NISMO 60 mm wheel studs.]
To save money, see if you can purchase the spacers only (from someone other than OptionImports) and not waste your money on the H&R wheels studs.
H&R Special Springs1-888-827-8881 Ask for Rob to get the right part # for the spacer only
ECS Tuning1-800-924-5172 Ask them if you can order the spacers only
By the way, for 25 mm spacers, you would need 42+25=67mm wheel studs. The NISMO 60 mm wheel studs are only 59 mm. So that might present a problem.
By the way, again, I was very apprehensive about using spacers, and many people cautioned me against it. I have had no problems with using spacers. The wider wheel base has actually given me more confidence in turns and cornering. I have driven speeds in excess of 100 mph repeatedly with no issues.
Hope this helps you make a decision.
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BuudWeizErr
- Posts: 4745
- Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2002 11:35 am
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sil80drifter
- Posts: 1313
- Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2002 5:53 am
- Car: 1990 240SX Hatch
225/45/17 and any other 45 sized tire thats over 205mm wide is too tall/slow compared to the stock one.
use this to find the right size tire that will match the stock dimensions:
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
225/40 or 235/40 is better.
sil80
use this to find the right size tire that will match the stock dimensions:
http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
225/40 or 235/40 is better.
sil80