Redline

[InsanityInc]

Yes you are quite right, I mistyped and "240sx" did not make its way into that statement, thusly: "any nissan 240sx" meaning a 240 with a nissan factory installed motor.

I was not talking about a turbo motor. I was taking about the L28 N/A motor.I never mentioned turboing anything and comparing it to a N/A car. Its not logical to consider the two kinds in the same category.

L28's could come with a factory turbo, I owned one. Google "280ZX turbo". Z31s could also come with a factory turbo. Also, talking about straight up drag racing and not talking about turbos is a little silly. As much as I hate driving turbo cars, if you're going to drag race, turbochargers are the way to go.

As for "a 240sx with a factory installed motor" you're limiting me to a stock KA, yet your honda gets a hybrid of 2 engines that didn't come in the car? That hardly seems fair.
Modified by InsanityInc at 6:17 PM 6/15/2005

[InsanityInc]

I think if you got to switch YOUR cams near the end of your powerband, you'd have a lot of top end too, but the thing is, the cars aren't real well rounded. Topend is great if you're looking to get tunnel vision on some abandon country road but peak HP means close to jack, unless you've got some low end and mid power to get to that point.

You'd think. Problem is, the intake manifold is poo on a stock KA. You can't move enough air at high RPMs through it's massive 21 inch runners to get a decent cylinder fill. That's why people replace their cams with crazy JWT or PDM cams, and gain like 5 horsepower.

Also, even when designed for top end, a KA will have far more torque than a (non-3.0) honda. For one thing, the KA is of higher displacement than every small engine honda makes (only the prelude engines really come close), and on top of that, it has an incredibly long stroke. If you have two engines of equal displacement, the one with the longer stroke will always make more torque, simply due to the nature of what torque is. Moving a piston with force F at a distance d from the crankshaft produces X torque. Moving a piston with force F at a distance 2*d from the crankshaft produces X*2 torque. Same way you use a longer wrench when you're trying to get off a tough bolt.

Quote »Since we are in a redline thread it is totally approprate to bring up these cars that have redlines higher than our own.[/quote]Most hondas actually have lower redlines than the KA. Only the VTEC ones go higher as far as I know...

[Dattebayo]

Dude, you totally missed the point.

We are in a N/A forum right now. I am obviously talking about N/A motors here, right? Quit changing the subject to turbos.

If you want to talk about turbos, go over to the forced induction forum and blab away.

As for "a 240sx with a factory installed motor" you're limiting me to a stock KA, yet your honda gets a hybrid of 2 engines that didn't come in the car? That hardly seems fair.

Quit picking on my little tidbits! Does the KA have the ability to have frankenstein stuff done to it to actually make it more efficient and powerful? Not as far as I know. Which is another reason i brought up the point of honda to begin with.

[TogueDrifter]

Does ANYONE know why the S13 DOHC has more aggressive cams then the S14 DOHC???

[Dattebayo]

it probably has something to do with the SCV (secondary butterflies) in the S13 intake manifold that the S14 doesnt have.

[InsanityInc]

Dude, you totally missed the point.

We are in a N/A forum right now. I am obviously talking about N/A motors here, right? Quit changing the subject to turbos.

If you want to talk about turbos, go over to the forced induction forum and blab away.

Or you could realize that the discussion is about going fast for cheap, and it doesn't matter what section of the forums you posted it in. Did you honestly expect to post something as retarded as "xyz will beat any nissan for cheaper!!11 eleven" without a response?

Quote »Quit picking on my little tidbits! Does the KA have the ability to have frankenstein stuff done to it to actually make it more efficient and powerful? Not as far as I know. Which is another reason i brought up the point of honda to begin with.[/quote]Talk about missing the point. You're claiming that this setup will beat any KA, yet you're imposing a double standard on who gets to do what to which car. My 240sx has to maintain a factory installed engine, yet you get to have a hybrid of two engines that didn't come with your car. Your entire comparison is stupid. You may as well claim all hondas are better because you can put a twin-turbo 427 into a CRX and run 5's.

Not to mention you're yet to post any performance numbers (or price) for the godly b18/b20 of ultimate ownage!!11 while at the same time claiming it'll outperform any KA for cheaper. Excuse me if I'm a little skeptical.

[Golden]

Honda hater huh? My honda has more miles than my gf's 240sx and mercedes190e combined. We drive it every day to get parts for these pos real wheel drive toys.

[tryiian]

nobody but a street ricer would deny the true and original purpose of a honda being to drive to the store forever and a day. It`s supposed to have all those miles, just not to rack them up as quickly per session as the "toys".

[InsanityInc]

Honda hater huh? My honda has more miles than my gf's 240sx and mercedes190e combined. We drive it every day to get parts for these pos real wheel drive toys.

Uh. Great? My 240 has 215,000 miles on it, and the compression is still factory perfect (actually, it's above factory due to mods, but the ring leakage is 8% across the board, which is about what brand new cars have). My 1982 280ZX had 232,000 miles on it and perfect compression when I sold it. I've known people that are running their nissans (well, datsuns, actually) at 350,000+ miles with compression that's just fine. One of my dad's friends has a 1974 celica with over 400,000 miles on it, with just fine compression (it's a bit under stock, like an 8psi loss or so), and smogs with a HC reading of 14. As long as you take care of a japanese car, it will last forever, regardless of brand, and regardless of the drivetrain, as well.

Not to mention "but it's reliable!" is a terrible argument when we're talking about the performance of the cars.

[KarateBoy]

well considering i blew my first motor by reving to 8 a couple times and spinning the bearing... its advised not to rev past 6 ... first off... after 5 the power band drops off like a dead body off a cliff... and second.. after 5 normally you start wearing the hell out of anything that moves at an accelerating rate

Woah, that's interesting.

I actually think that it still pulls pretty well in the 6K range.

Since I'm new to the engine, educate me.

As a daily driver I shift @ 2500-3000 rpm but when I wanna just have that little bit of fun I like to "rev" it to 5K+. However, I don't do this often because my engine has 102K miles (not that old but I just got the car and I want to baby it)

Anyway, I once accidently reved the engine to 8K by pressing the gas with the clutch in. How bad is that and how long do you think the engine can last if I keep it above the 5K mark for...lets say 3 minutes?

Does it matter if it is 3 minutes straight or 6x 30 seconds?

Better yet is there a "learn EVERYTHING about the KA24DE engine" link?

I always thought that since the redline is @ 6900 it should be able to handle that and continue to run as reliably as Nissan's reputation suggests. Just never had the balls (because of lack of money) to try it myself.

[JimmyMethod]

This thread = dead.

Jesus, did you downshift on the freeway or something? Don't mess with the fuel cutoff, it's there for a reason. You shouldn't ever rev your engine to the point where it would become a factor. 8k is WAYYYY to high for your engine.Anyway, your shift point should be around 5.5k to get the best acceleration, until you start giving your engine a little bit better top end. The engine doesn't produce a whole lot of torque up there, and the number of RPMs can't make up the difference.

I haven't actually check acceleration times using the Nissan recommended shift points for heavy acceleration, they're in the manual, if you want to check for yourself. I looked at it and it said you should only be in 4th gear from 40mph to 45mph, and that seems a bit off...but who knows. Driving your car moderately hard for a while, and really paying attention to it is probably the best way to figure out what you should be doing.

[InsanityInc]

This thread = dead.

Jesus, did you downshift on the freeway or something? Don't mess with the fuel cutoff, it's there for a reason. You shouldn't ever rev your engine to the point where it would become a factor. 8k is WAYYYY to high for your engine.Anyway, your shift point should be around 5.5k to get the best acceleration, until you start giving your engine a little bit better top end. The engine doesn't produce a whole lot of torque up there, and the number of RPMs can't make up the difference.

I haven't actually check acceleration times using the Nissan recommended shift points for heavy acceleration, they're in the manual, if you want to check for yourself. I looked at it and it said you should only be in 4th gear from 40mph to 45mph, and that seems a bit off...but who knows. Driving your car moderately hard for a while, and really paying attention to it is probably the best way to figure out what you should be doing.

You should shift higher than 5.5k. 5.5k isn't even the power peak yet. I ususally shift a bit above 6000, depending on the gear I'm shifting to. 1-2, I ususally take it to 6400 or so. Anything beyond that, 6100ish. That will put you back in your powerband.

[ATXBoy]

Hey, but what about your good ol' gear ratios, shouldn't they help even though you lose some power, 'm really interested in acceleration times at 5500 rpm shift and redline shiftsATX

[InsanityInc]

Hey, but what about your good ol' gear ratios, shouldn't they help even though you lose some power, 'm really interested in acceleration times at 5500 rpm shift and redline shiftsATX

Redline isn't ideal either, though. The idea of shifting at the point I specified takes gear ratios into consideration. Hence why the shift point is a bit different between different gears.