Project Supra Killer

[xe0]

Hi,

This is my first post, however I have been lurking this forum for a good year and a half so try to cut me some slack

I am in the process of gathering information for a project I am starting. Now, I know there are a lot of "I am making a 1000hp rb20/25/26 and OWNZORS ALL" threads, but this one is legitemate(sp).

To be honest with you I don't even own a 240sx quite yet. I am having trouble locating one in the condition I require. However, I have done a lot of research about how much money, time, blood sweat and tears it will take to pull this project off, but I am willing to do it.

It will not be a quick project, I'm estimating about 1-2 years if I'm lucky and everything goes right(and we all know when working with jdm parts + custom work+ cars everything always goes right the first time :rolleyez

My goals for this project are to have a 650-900rwhp 240sx that also gets 30-35mpg highway mileage. So how will I pull off this?

Engine:rb25detTransmission:Viper t56 6 speedSuspension: Tein flex coiloversLsd: Quaife 2 way lsdTurbo: t04r pushing 2-3bar

After I get my engine I plan on a full performance rebuild.

This includes Jun titatium springs, retainers, valvetrain,270/270 cams, solid lifter conversion, forged pistons, rods, all new bearings, arp head studs, bolts, metal headgasket, gasket set, oil squirters, and other parts.

I also plan to cryotreat the entire drivetrain to help reliabliity.

Hopefully everything will go as planned and I will have a 9000-10000rpm 800hp drag/highway monster getting 30mpg

Adam

P.S I know I missed a lot of things but I was just putting the main idea down.

[RMiller]

That sounds expensive. You listed like $15k of parts. Do you have $30k to build this up? (or more, I don't really know)

[nab911]

your looking at 20k, plus 6 dedicated months... but if you do.. you deserve a blumpkin

[xe0]

your looking at 20k, plus 6 dedicated months... but if you do.. you deserve a blumpkin

Hi,

No I don't have $15k or $30k or for that matter any money saved up. However, I do have a good job with about $1600 a month to spend after bills. Like I said, this will be a slow buildup, I will take lots of pictures and video tape everything once I start the rebuild and transmission fabricating.

Btw, what the hell is a blumpkin? or/and do I want to know? lol

Adam

[skillzilla]

If its anything like a Blumpy, no you dont want to know.

My advice is, have fun. This is a hard thing to do for peeps that have been tuning RB's for over a decade, so it will be no easy task. Id like to see it happen though.

[silkk]

welcome to nico

[93RPS13]

yea stop at a Rb25 go RB30 im sure that a RB25DE long block is cheaper then the RB25DET, pop the RB25DE head on the RB30 put on a RB25DET exh mani a nice to4r w/ adapter box, and a PFC

checkout http://dragdriftautox.com/ they have a RB30DET ready to special order

[S13ChucKAT]

Why not just go full out with the RB26dett... I figure if you are goign to spend all that money.. do something people will go crazy over.

[Joe]

sorry man i dont see 30mpg ever happening with over 600whp. even with a tremec 6 speed.

and i hope you have looooots of money, some of the things you listed are extremley expensive ALONE.

and why do you need all of this horsepower? there is a ~580whp s13 RB25 stock block that could run a soild 10 once the owner learns the car better. that already beats 97% of the supras out there because it takes 950whp for a 10 second 1/4 in a supra.

more power to you but i think you need to do alot more research :ylsuper

[BoostFab]

i think it would be cheaper to just swap in the 2jzgte...reliable power and proven...probably end up to be cheaper than what you described.

[xe0]

yea stop at a Rb25 go RB30 im sure that a RB25DE long block is cheaper then the RB25DET, pop the RB25DE head on the RB30 put on a RB25DET exh mani a nice to4r w/ adapter box, and a PFC

checkout http://dragdriftautox.com/ they have a RB30DET ready to special order

Well, for one, its a 3.0 litre engine, which will not help in my quest for good mpg. Also, there is not that much information out in the us in comparison to the rb25 block, but it is something to think about.

[quote=" S13ChucKAT Why not just go full out with the RB26dett... I figure if you are goign to spend all that money.. do something people will go crazy over.[/quote]

I don't see the .1 litre of displacement, solid lifters, and a few minor improvements worth the fabrication troubles of the 26.

Not to mention any 240sx regardless of the engine pushing 800rwhp in a daily driver will be crazy enough lol

sorry man i dont see 30mpg ever happening with over 600whp. even with a tremec 6 speed.

I was hoping with *conservative* fuel tuning,not under boost conditions (read under 4500 rms), and shifting economically(2500 rpms) I could attain this. I have not given up my hope, I will continue to research always, because knowledge is power .

think it would be cheaper to just swap in the 2jzgte...reliable power and proven...probably end up to be cheaper than what you described.

Blah! Even cheaper would be a ls1 swap or any other chevy v8. The point is, I'm not doing the swap because of *cheap* power. I am doing it because I like being unique (read *gay* lol) I enjoy pushing the limits, and plus it wouldn't be a skyline engine .

[gprodigy85]

you can be different and not need 900hp, thats just rediculous in a 240 man. Have you ever driven a 240? 250 rwhp in a 240 is a blast, 350 is plenty enough for id say 80% of people, anything above that is just for props in my opinion... but hey its your money, do what you want...

and as far as gas mileage, performance and mpg don't go together... in order to make hp you need fuel + air + spark... so the more hp you want the more fuel + air it will take, a stock rb25>240 probably barely gets 30mpg on the highway...

anyways im done. good luck in your ventures

[JonPowell]

On my RB25, even with conservitive shifting, I only got tops like 25MPG...30MPG isnt going to happen with a performance motor like this.

[goofynick6]

Depends on if you want numbers or results...

My buddy with an lightly built SR, bigger turbo and injectors running 20 psi just ran a 7.3 at 96mph in the 1/8th the other day, and has room left for more tuning and boost...so he's gonna be running 10's on probably 400whp...

Nick

[Imissmyturbo]

i think it would be cheaper to just swap in the 2jzgte...reliable power and proven...probably end up to be cheaper than what you described.

Very True! 2JZ's own all motors out there.

[93RPS13]

we are all forgeting one thing, how the hell you goin to get traction? also i really dont think you well got 30mpg, but if i want to do some research on the rb30 here you go http://www.skylinesaustralia.c...15420

the rb30 have crazy torque = fun, if u want unique RB30 is the way to go

[Wulfgang]

You could do 30 mpg easily with an RB25. But not with 900 hp on tap. To do 30 mpg, you'd be using like... maybe 30 hp, which is only 3% of your injector capacity. Now you tell me, can an injector regulate fuel accurately enough to get you 30 mpg at only 3% duty cycle??? To do something like that with 900 hp on tap, you'd need two sets of injectors -- one smaller set for low power and the other high capacity set for boost. I don't know of any standalone systems that can control two sets, but you could probably rig a standalone for the high power and let your ECU do the economy.

But with 300 hp, you're looking at more like 10% duty cycle, which is definitely doable in Oregon. Not in CA tho. You'd have to run on the lean side of 14.7:1 AFR, which will probably make your NOx numbers go thru the roof. And like others have said, 300 hp is more than enough fun for the street.

Since when did a car need 900 hp to become a Supra Killer?

[BoostFab]

I don't see the .1 litre of displacement, solid lifters, and a few minor improvements worth the fabrication troubles of the 26.

the rb26 is not just that. it's far more superior than the rb25. it has all the rev and displacement, very similar to the 2jzgte. plus the intake manifold, single throttle bodies, which allow a more even a/f mixture. the rb26 can put down 700hp on stock bottom end. see if you can do that on the stock rb25 bottom end.

fabrication for the rb26 is probably to the similar degree as you would for the rb25.

all i can say is, if you want to go all out, go rb26.

[PROJECTRB240SX]

OK,ONE: DISPLACEMENT HAS LITTLE TO DO WITH FUEL EFFCIENCY. CASE IN POINT THE 5.7 LITER LS1 GETS 25+ MPG.

TWO: A RB30DET OR DETT WOULD GET YOU 2/3 OF THE WAY TO YOUR GOAL STOCK, AND WOULD TAKE MUCH LESS MODS TO GET YOU TO YOU GOAL WHICH MEANS IT WOULD BE MUCH CHEAPER.

THREE: IF YOU CONSENTRAT ON TRACTION AND HANDLING YOU CAN GET A LOW QUARTER WITH LESS POWER. ALOT OF PEOPLE ARE UNDER A COMMON MISCONCEPTION THAT IT TAKES A TON OF HP TO MOVE A 2600LB CAR DOWN THE QUARTER IN 10'S OR LESS. NOW IF YOU PROPERLY TRANSPLANT YOUR POWER TO THE GROUND YOU COULD GET DOWN THE QAURTER QUICKER THAN SOMEONE WITH OVER ABUNDANT POWER (READ: ALOT OF SUPRAS).

FOUR: THIS IS AN EXPENSIVE UNDERTAKING....WHICH WOULD PROBABLY BRING YOU ALOT OF ENJOYMENT ONCE FINISHED. BUT, LIKE ALL MOTORSPORTS... THERE IS ALWAYS A THIRST FOR MORE POWER.

FIVE: TO GET THE MPG YOU ARE HOPING FOR YOU WOULD REALLY NEED A STANDALONE WITH SWITCHABLE MAPS, THEN YOU RPOGRAM A RACING MAP AND A ECONOMY MAP.

SIX: IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR DRAG POWER YOU MAY WANT TO RE-EVALUATE YOUR PARTS LIST. YOUR GOING TO WANT TO GEAR YOUR PARTS TOWARDS A MID TO HIGH RANGE POWERBAND. JUST REMEMBER YOU TRANSFER MOST YOUR POWER IN YOUR LOWER GEARS BECAUSE OF THE GEAR RATIOS, SO IF YOU ADD REVS YOU'LL HAVE MORE TIME IN YOUR POWER RANGE BUT YOU HAVE TO BE SURE THAT YOU ARE ABLE TO BUILD POWER TILL THE END.

[PROJECTRB240SX]

OHH ONE LAST THING:

GOOD LUCK AND HAVE FUN BECAUSE THATS WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT.

[goofynick6]

30mpg..why? That's like having a drift car that wins competitions, but drives like a cadillac over bumpy roads. I think the goals need to be slightly reevaluated...30mpg is for civics and corollas...20mpg is still not bad, especially with over 600hp.

And, if you do want to, the 034efi controller is a device that allows for 2 sets of injectors, can run 12 injectors and drive them how you want.

Nick

[BoostFab]

30mpg is no way for that power goal, let's be more practical here...

[RMiller]

You could absolutely get 30mpg, but running 2 sets of injectos would be necessary, otherwise you'd get much less. 1000cc injectors (assuming you want 900whp) aren't going to be able to supply a small enough amount of fuel to get decent fuel economy, like Wulfgang said. Also, 270 cams are going to kill your mileage. And I think you'll actually want more aggressive cams if you want to make power up to 10k. It's hard to have long duration cams and get great gas mileage. For this reason, I think you should stay below 9k rpm, use 270/270 cams, stock injectors and 1000cc secondaries.

[nab911]

I was just about to chime in with that... once you upgrade injectors... they have a minum is can spray. Thats like trying to fill a small cup by slightly opening a fire hydrant

[xe0]

the rb26 is not just that. it's far more superior than the rb25. it has all the rev and displacement, very similar to the 2jzgte. plus the intake manifold, single throttle bodies, which allow a more even a/f mixture. the rb26 can put down 700hp on stock bottom end. see if you can do that on the stock rb25 bottom end.

fabrication for the rb26 is probably to the similar degree as you would for the rb25.

all i can say is, if you want to go all out, go rb26.

I agree with you except I plan on building the engine(half the fun) so the 700hp on stock bottom end point is moot. I was planning on running a q45 throttle body instead of the individual ones found on the 26.

Maybe I will have to look into it?

[xe0]

OK,ONE: DISPLACEMENT HAS LITTLE TO DO WITH FUEL EFFCIENCY. CASE IN POINT THE 5.7 LITER LS1 GETS 25+ MPG.

TWO: A RB30DET OR DETT WOULD GET YOU 2/3 OF THE WAY TO YOUR GOAL STOCK, AND WOULD TAKE MUCH LESS MODS TO GET YOU TO YOU GOAL WHICH MEANS IT WOULD BE MUCH CHEAPER.

THREE: IF YOU CONSENTRAT ON TRACTION AND HANDLING YOU CAN GET A LOW QUARTER WITH LESS POWER. ALOT OF PEOPLE ARE UNDER A COMMON MISCONCEPTION THAT IT TAKES A TON OF HP TO MOVE A 2600LB CAR DOWN THE QUARTER IN 10'S OR LESS. NOW IF YOU PROPERLY TRANSPLANT YOUR POWER TO THE GROUND YOU COULD GET DOWN THE QAURTER QUICKER THAN SOMEONE WITH OVER ABUNDANT POWER (READ: ALOT OF SUPRAS).

FOUR: THIS IS AN EXPENSIVE UNDERTAKING....WHICH WOULD PROBABLY BRING YOU ALOT OF ENJOYMENT ONCE FINISHED. BUT, LIKE ALL MOTORSPORTS... THERE IS ALWAYS A THIRST FOR MORE POWER.

FIVE: TO GET THE MPG YOU ARE HOPING FOR YOU WOULD REALLY NEED A STANDALONE WITH SWITCHABLE MAPS, THEN YOU RPOGRAM A RACING MAP AND A ECONOMY MAP.

SIX: IF YOU ARE LOOKING FOR DRAG POWER YOU MAY WANT TO RE-EVALUATE YOUR PARTS LIST. YOUR GOING TO WANT TO GEAR YOUR PARTS TOWARDS A MID TO HIGH RANGE POWERBAND. JUST REMEMBER YOU TRANSFER MOST YOUR POWER IN YOUR LOWER GEARS BECAUSE OF THE GEAR RATIOS, SO IF YOU ADD REVS YOU'LL HAVE MORE TIME IN YOUR POWER RANGE BUT YOU HAVE TO BE SURE THAT YOU ARE ABLE TO BUILD POWER TILL THE END.

I would be interested in doing the rb30det if I could find more out about it. Everything I have read has come from a austrailian(sp) forum and it sounds like the biggest PITA ever.

As far as fuel economy goes, maybe I am too optimistic with my fuel goals. However I did plan on running a standalone with switchable a/f maps.

What in my parts list was not geared towards mid-high rpm range power? 270/270 cams? I'm confused by this statement.

[93RPS13]

if you want to build your motor then the RB30 is the way to go, cause you have to open it up to do the DOHC to do the conversion, i would love to have a RB30DET in a S13 but i dont think i have the money to pay some one to do the work, i dont trust my work.....

[BoostFab]

I agree with you except I plan on building the engine(half the fun) so the 700hp on stock bottom end point is moot. I was planning on running a q45 throttle body instead of the individual ones found on the 26.

Maybe I will have to look into it?

think about it, a stock rb26 bottom end supports 700+hp, what about a built rb26, say hello to 1000+hp GTR powered. let alone the built rb30det...

check out this (claimed) 1350HP rb26dett powered GTR... it hurts just thinking about it. http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/324721

see if you can crank out that much w/ a rb25

[BoostFab]

btw! check out this site. http://www.exvitermini.com....and go under "Specifications", and click on their "GTR-700: Nissan Skyline BCNR-R33 GTR V-Spec, 1995 model." you will see all the specs on their 1350bhp GTR. i can't imagine how much that build up would cost.

[eh?]

I don't see your point boostsfed. I don't think anything left in Mario's RB26 is still stock. There's going to be a point where one doesn't have a huge advantage over the other.There is a 900HP stock block RB25 in Florida .I doubt it cost 1/10th of Mario's build up.