OUR M45 AND SNOW? DO THEY GET ALONG?

[TorontoM45]

Hey guys, I just got my 2006 m45 and I love it so far because its still nice and warm outside. I understand I need to get my snow tires and rims, but do you guys think that will do it? It was raining here in Toronto today and i needed to pass this car beside me, I pushed the gas and the wheels started spinning and the VDC light came on. I love that the car got so much HP but im hoping that my snow tires and rims will get me through our winter here in Toronto Canada. What do you guys think????

[dvan]

From what I've read, the M45 sucks in the snow no matter what tires you happen to use. When it snows this winter here in Virginia, i'll be sure to park the M and drive my mountaineer =)

[tigerclaws1318]

I learned my lesson last winter with the car. I did have the bridgestone potennza oem tires and it was a terrible experience. I was stuck in an in of snow and over cooked the brakes with traction control on. With it off it doesnt help much but waste gas everytime you rev the nuts out the engine trying to free yourself. Yes, the car would be bouncing off redline to free itself after 10 minutes of trying. I caused a lot of traffic cause I was stuck with the nose of the car blocking traffic flow. Do yourself a favor and dont drive the car in the winter time if you have summer tires on. Last winter when I would make a u-turn the tires would lose grip and start skipping. The car was understeering making a 1mph u-turn.

If you do plan on driving during the winter time get yourself a good set of winter tires. Go on tirerack.com and watch the video they have where they compared a winter tire to a summer tire on a Maserati Gran Turismo.

[fiveliterbeater]

answer to the question in your thread: not a good combination and NO.

solution: get a rental when it snows; buy a 4x4 beater

[MinisterofDOOM]

A limited slip differential would go a LONG way toward taming the M in the snow. If anyone makes them (I'm not really up-to-date on the M aftermarket) it'd be a very wise investment for anyone in snowy areas.

[Bob24]

I live in snow country (Minnesota) My M was a death trap with my 19 inch sport rims and summer tires once it snowed. However, I ordered up a set of 17 inch wheels and Blizzak LM-22 winter tires. It made a HUGE difference. The car became a capable performer in the snow and on the ice. Don't get me wrong, no matter what the tires are it isn't going to turn into a Subaru.

But, with the right winter tires and not driving like an idiot you can make it through a winter in an M.

[tytamto]

Finally an answer worth something, Bob24. Thanks.

Don't listen to the people who call it a death trap, because they run summer or crappy all season tires in temperatures below 40F, or in the ice/snow. A set of four dedicated winter tires will make a huge difference. Cold temperatures cause summer and all season (to a lesser degree) compounds to harden, resulting in a significant loss if traction. Due to that fact, winter tires should be used not only when it snows, but when outside temperatures are slightly above freezing (and below, obviously). That is why they are called winter tires, and not snow tires. Referring to studded winter tires as snow tires is more correct (but still wrong)

If you buy slightly undersized and narrower winter tires and take it easy on the gas pedal, you will do fine. The traction control part of our ESP system will help with the most difficult situations (starting up a snowy incline, etc). Drive within your limits and you will find the levels of grip more than adequate.

Since winter tires contain a lot more silica in their compound, they stay pliable in low temperatures and don't turn into stones like summer rubber. The tread pattern (multicell technology) has a lot more grip and spreads open under pressure, creating a larger contact patch that literally bites into the underlying surface with its thousands of edges (snow, slush, ice).

Look up some test results and find a quality, well rated winter tire and go out and drive your a** off. You will find it very fun to be able to powerslide the back end on snow, while still having decent input control from the front winter tires that will retain a ton of grip.

Afterall, a set of winter rubber with dedicated wheels will last you up to three winter seasons, and will end up being cheaper than paying your collision deductible, or owning a winter beater (purchase cost, insurance, maintenance). If it gets cold where you live for long enough, and you experience more than a few days of snow, proper rubber is a good investment.

[szh]

I agree with the last two posts. Any high-powered RWD car is going to have difficulty in snow, but with snow tires, the results will be dramatically improved.

Still does not mean that you can drive in snow and ice as if it was summer, but you can now drive safely - albeit with care.

MoD is also right ... an LSD would have helped a lot too.

Z

[TorontoM45]

Hey guys, thnx to everyone for their input. I will definitely look into buying some new winter tires and rims for my M. im thinking on going on a 17 inch rims and some tiny tires (as low as possible but something that i wont lose handling) im coming to this powerful M45 from a 2004 4.4 BMW X5 thats why i was a little concerned. thnx anyways.

[AD1787]

I see Bridgestone makes a 19inch winter Blizzak-LM60 for our car.

Does anyone have these or have an opinion if this would be better or worse than getting a set of 17inch wheels and matching blizzaks

[ninos_9]

"torontoM45"

I live in Chicago and we have one of the worst snow seasons during the winter... last year when i baught my M45, i remember i was at work and it started to snow bad,, When i got in my car n tried to leave, i notice i was trapped lol.. I had to call the towing truck to get me out of the parking lot lol...

I went and baught me Khumo Tires (all season) and they were good during the snow season.. you have to be really carefull when you driving, specaily when your accelerating & making sharp turns!

Overall, M45's are really bad in snow! They have to much power and the rear wheel drive makes it really difficult as well...

Good Luck..

[szh]

Overall, M45's are really bad in snow! They have to much power and the rear wheel drive makes it really difficult as well...

Correct. But, if you get true snow tires (on a second set of cheap wheels), then the behavior in snow is as good as any other high-power RWD car.

It is truly amazing how much of a difference snow tires can make ... having lived in New England for many years, I know that if I ever move back there, this cost will be part of the move cost for sure.

Z

[szh]

Way too large an image in your sig, ninos_9 ... please trim it down to 600x200 maximum per NICO requirements.

Thanks!

Z

[Andrew224]

I'm in Chicago and get quite a bit of snow and horrible driving conditions. I no longer have my M but let me agree with everyone who said that you need dedicated winter tires. If you live somewhere cold and snowy, you NEED WINTER tires if you want to drive your M in the winter. I had Blizzacks and they made me feel so much more confident that I would not get stuck in the snow and that I would not slide off the road. The difference is night and day.

Andrew

[WhoDey456]

wow! this sucks I live in Iowa and the winter's suck here. And I just bought some all seasons

[Andrew224]

http://www.tirerack.com/videos...inter

Andrew

[Andrew224]

WhoDey456,

I'd suggest that you get a set of extra rims and put the winter tires on them. Sucks at first because of the cost, but you won't have to get new tires for a while. As each set will only be on the car for like 6 months. And you'll be safer. Anyways, even if you bought winter tires instead of All season, using winter tires in the summer would eat right through them I'd imagine, so you'd have to get a set of summer tires in the spring / summer anyways.

I can't stress enough the difference in the ride and driveablity once I put winter tires on my M45. It was like I had a different car.

Andrew

[TorontoM45]

thanks for all the help. ill definitely get a set of winter tires for my M. I just bought this M45 and I used to own a BMW X5 with the sport package. Having the X (4x4)drive on my bmw I still had to buy a set of ring and winter tires to get through our rough snow here in toronto. hopefully i could just trade it for a set of rims and tires for this M considering my bmw rim and tire only worked for 4 months and then i had to sell her.

[ArbitrageMan]

I dont want to 'jack this thread, but I need some input for the DC, NOVA area.

Last winter was a debacle in my car; I have summer tires on it and it snowed twice, both were bad experiences. The first snow fall was on my way home from work one day, and with 2 inches of snow on the ground, I couldn't get out of the parking lot at the dry-cleaners.

The second time it snowed was during the night. I backed out of my driveway, tried to get moving, parked the car and called in sick.

When its just cold (30s), the tires were fine. But when it snowed, they stopped working altogether.

Since, we don't get snow here... 2 inches twice a year doesn't really count, am I safe going with all-season tires? Am I going to see any improvement? I'm worried that if I put winter tires on, they're a) going to wear out really quickly, and b) be horrible for handling in the dry.

[The00Dustin]

I've always used all-season tires in FWD cars here in Indiana. We had some serious snow last year, and I was fine. Of course, RWD may not be as forgiving, and this car is a bit more powerful than my previous (99 Park Ave Ultra). That said, I had Goodyear TripleTreads on the PA; they have pretty good scores for snow and ice on TireRack. Those Goodyears werent' available in the M45's size/performance ratings, so I now have Michelin Pilot Sport A/S Plusses on my M45 (TireRack snow and ice scores are almost as good on these), and I am hoping it will be fine, though it may depend on the winter, or I may be getting snow tires. That said, while I can't definitively answer your question, because I have very little experience with snow tires, I think you would be fine with those tires. However, if you prefer better summer performance in the summer, then you may as well get winter tires for the winter instead of using all-seasons year round. My understanding is that this is mandated by law in many european countries, and more importantly, regarding your wear concern, there are other threads in this forum talking about how snow rated tires are made for cold weather more than snow specifically. Obviously you wouldn't want studs, but I don't know if we could even fnid studs for our cars without going way out of spec on tires. Finally, regarding your handling concern, it is my understanding that higher performance tires are softer than touring tires, so I would expect better handling with snow tires (but massive wear once the temperature is steadily above a certain point).

[ArbitrageMan]

I dont want to 'jack this thread, but I need some input for the DC, NOVA area.

Last winter was a debacle in my car; I have summer tires on it and it snowed twice, both were bad experiences. The first snow fall was on my way home from work one day, and with 2 inches of snow on the ground, I couldn't get out of the parking lot at the dry-cleaners.

The second time it snowed was during the night. I backed out of my driveway, tried to get moving, parked the car and called in sick.

When its just cold (30s), the tires were fine. But when it snowed, they stopped working altogether.

Since, we don't get snow here... 2 inches twice a year doesn't really count, am I safe going with all-season tires? Am I going to see any improvement? I'm worried that if I put winter tires on, they're a) going to wear out really quickly, and b) be horrible for handling in the dry.

Yeah I guess I need to clarify that I would use the A/S tires only in the winter on a second set of rims. I would put my summer tires back on in the summer.

[RONSM35X]

WELL I bought dedicated Winter Tires for my M35x (2008) n it was ok in the winter snow of New York. It holds well but still not what i expected for a all wheel drive car but again its not a Subaru (which i hear r better than Santa Claus sled ) in the snow . If u drive like Grandpa( no offense 2 any Grand pa's out there) in the snow it will do fine but then again u have the m45 and that's a rear wheel drive car so u r asking for trouble in the snow w any kind of high speeds.

[szh]

Last winter was a debacle in my car; I have summer tires on it and it snowed twice, both were bad experiences. The first snow fall was on my way home from work one day, and with 2 inches of snow on the ground, I couldn't get out of the parking lot at the dry-cleaners.

The second time it snowed was during the night. I backed out of my driveway, tried to get moving, parked the car and called in sick.

When its just cold (30s), the tires were fine. But when it snowed, they stopped working altogether.

Since, we don't get snow here... 2 inches twice a year doesn't really count, am I safe going with all-season tires? Am I going to see any improvement? I'm worried that if I put winter tires on, they're a) going to wear out really quickly, and b) be horrible for handling in the dry.

Summer tires work in temperatures above freezing - when the temperatures get down to 33 or 34 F, they get rock hard and act like billiard balls on the roads ... even without snow!

Yes, you could indeed get all-season tires ... I have done so since April of 2008, because of a decision to go into snow country (Lake Tahoe) on occasional skiing trips. I carry chains too though.

But, the difference in handling between true summer tires and all-seasons is very clear. The Goodyear Eagle F1 GS-D3 that I had prior to switching to Michelin Pilot Sport A/S were that much better in handling (dry and wet) and braking.

So, on some twisty hill curves near my house, I take it easier now - the tires let me know clearly that they are not going to be able to take the higher speeds. I understand this trade-off, so I shrug it off as the compromise I chose to make.

Z

[szh]

Yeah I guess I need to clarify that I would use the A/S tires only in the winter on a second set of rims. I would put my summer tires back on in the summer.

Hmmm ... in that case, I still would consider snow tires instead, since you do have a spare set of rims, as they will be better in snow than the all-seasons. You may only use them for 2 to 3 months perhaps ... the wear will not be too bad and the tires will last you a number of years. The handling on dry roads is not great, of course, but you can always look forward to the summer tires being back on soon enough!

Z

[seldomseen]

All-Season tires simply will not cut it if you live where it snows a lot in the winters. Once it snows beyond half an inch the A/S tires simply are worthless. A quality set of snow tires will be a great improvement and prevent you from getting stuck every time you get more than 1" of snow.

[rbaman]

Ok, so here's my question pertinent to the pacific northwest (coastal oregon, near portland, to be specific). I'm coming from a 96 Q45 with summer tires and a second set of rims with studded winter tires. No prob there. I just acquired a 2004 M45 (y34) with the OEM 18in wheels and some crappy Kumho tires on it. I was looking at getting a second set of rims, but was told by a regional chain (Les Schwab) and a loval independent dealer that there aren't any studded snow tires in an 18in variety, and my car needs 18in wheels because of the large brakes. Les Schwab suggested buying a separet care for winter...and the local independent guy suggested something called Spider Spikes...

and the reason I need something with spikes, instead of just "good" snow tires is that 1 have a 15 degree grade up to my house, and it ices up at night here sometimes in the winter. I can still see the chewed up road from last year where my studs were ripping up the road as I drove home from my night shift. And, yes, this is driving like a Grandpa.

http://www.fawnskinflyer.com/w...r.jpg

So, here are my questions:1. Can a Y34 have a smaller rim on it? 2. If not, does anybody know anything about these spider spikes?

Thanks!Raj
Modified by rbaman at 11:39 PM 10/29/2009

[rbaman]

Ok, so ignore the fact that I appear to be talking to myself here...replying to my own posts, etc.

So checking at tire rack, they do offer 17" wheels/tires for the 04 M45. checking at discount tire, they offer 17" and 16" wheels/tires for winter. Hell, if I could put 16" on for winter, that would be great (and cheap)!

Anybody know if these options work?

Also, the stock donut spare is 16" diameter, so doesn't that suggest strongly that 16" will fit on this would a brake clearance issue?

raj

[bosh]

Did you look at these?

http://www.tiresbyweb.com/m-10...99999

https://www.tiresavings.com/nokian.php

[rbaman]

well the hakkas are definitely more tire than I need for the winter, and definitely more costly than I want. I'm more interested in knowing whether I can downsize my rims for winter.

I've read thru as many of the threads here than I can find, and I see a lot of "you should be able to..." etc, but I haven't seen anyone confirming that you can do it.

thanks for your help, tho, bosh.raj

[rbaman]

talking to myself again, I think...

I just got a spare set of 16s from an 2008 altima (16X7 in the back, 16X6.5 in the front) and mounted Firestone Winterforce studded tires (215/60R16). Fit on the car fine. I have TPMS on the OEM wheels, and so far, the flat tire lite has not turned on, but I fully expect that it will.

So, now, I think that we can definitely say: You can mount 16s on the Y34 M45. There is not much brake clearance, but there is enough. Obviously, mounting 17s would be no problem, then.

Thanks for the help!Raj

And, yes, I know, that many would consider it sacrilege to put 16s on an M45, but hey it works for me for the winter (2 mile round trip to-and-fro work, occas runs to portland or salem for supplies).