No spark

[S^13]

Recently swapped a ca18det in a s13 and all the wiring seams to be good, I tested the ignitor getting 12v one side .33 on the other and I tested the coilpack closest to front bumper got 14v havent tested the others with the multimeter. Maybe Im checking for spark wrong? I put it in the coilpack and the end of plug on valve cover and intake manifold and also tried holding the spark plug off the intake manifold a little bit and still nothing. If theres another way I can test lemme know. I can smell gas on the spark plugs so I dont think its a fuel issue.

Lemme know if theres anything I can test cause I cant wait for my car to run!
Modified by S^13 at 10:34 PM 4/29/2005

[NateDogg]

The best place to ground the plugs is on the strut tower bolts IMO. Get someone to crank the engine while you ground the plugs on the strut tower bolt and check for spark that way.

[S^13]

Will try that tommorow. What would be causing it not to spark but the coilpacks be getting power though?

[NISTECH]

the ECM tells the coils to spark via the trig unit based on input from the CAS. This is where your testing needs to be done. I hope you have a service maual for the ca18det if for nothing else the wiring diag so you know where to probe. If you have a diag and can post it perhaps I could point out where to probe and what you should expect to see.

[S^13]

So check what code the ECM shows? or check for power getting to the ECM? sorry I dont really understand your post

[NISTECH]

you need to look for the signal going to the trig unit from the ECM. If it is not present you need to look for the 2 signals coming from the CAS[Crank angle sensor] on the front of the timing cover. This is typically done with a oscilliscope but if you have a high sample rate volt meter you can"catch" some of the signal. you wont be able to tell the integrity of the signal with a volt meter but you will be able to tell if it is at least pulsing something.

[S^13]

I think this is the page?http://www.we-todd-did-racing....DE%3D Also whats trig and ECM stand for? Sorry For all the questions, I really apreciate the help

[NISTECH]

trig is the unit that fires the coils, Ignition trigger

ECM ,Engine Control Module

[NISTECH]

on that diag ,the black with white tracer wire should be battery voltage, the solid black wire should be ground [with the key on less then .2v] you are not ohm checking the ground wire ,set your meter to volts and check for power on that wire as if it was the power wire, this is how you will determine if its less then .2v. Do THAT first, then if those are ok have someone crank the engine while you check for power on the other 2 wires, there is nothing specific you are looking for with a volt meter just that it looks like it has a pulseing voltage[your meter will intermittenly show a voltage as the car cranks] if you see that ,it means it is sending some thing to the ecm. It is a digital on off signal so the computer does need to see a specific squre wave to fire. But as long as the squre wave reaches it maximum and minimum voltages the computer will try to fire the plug. If you get good source voltage ,good grnd [less then .2v] and some kinda signal off those other 2 wires ,chances are the CAS is good.

Now do you have a link to the Trig unit[Power transistor]?

[S^13]

alrighthttp://we-todd-did-racing.com/...DE%3D does that work?

[NISTECH]

yep thats fine, I have to ask though do you understand what your looking at when looking at that drawing?

You do a commonality comparison of the wires going to the coils versus the wires going to the power transister[trig unit] against the wires going to the ECM[ECCS] If you can see the commonalities all I need to tell you is look for the same type of intermitten pulse you seen for the CAS on those wires. just know the pulses will be longer so it may take longer to "catch" them on the volt meter.

Also check the black wire into the trig unit for a ground, should be less then .2v if its higher then that you need to fix the ground first.

If you are unable to figure it out just post back and I will go through each wire and tell you which is for what. and what you will see on each wire.

[S^13]

Also check the black wire into the trig unit for a ground, should be less then .2v if its higher then that you need to fix the ground first.

If you are unable to figure it out just post back and I will go through each wire and tell you which is for what. and what you will see on each wire.

If you could that would be great and where to test (the ecu plug or ignitor plugs or cas plug ect.) that would be great....

I havent goten to do any tests cause my battery has died

[NISTECH]

Ok I will have to do it tonight as I gotta leave for work here shortly. I am going to rework the drawing so its easier to read for you and give you some detain in the reworking drawing on what each wire is. Do you know if the engine you got came out of a left hand drive car or Right hand drive car as that diagram is for both, I can cut out which ever one doesnt apply.

[S^13]

it came out of a right hand drive car

[NISTECH]

it came out of a right hand drive car

ok here is the slightly more understandable version.

[NISTECH]

The wire with a question mark on it I believe goes to the white wire on number 1 coil, that wire is where the power comes from on the circuit. I did not want to show it attached to the coil as it might confuse you, but dont be suprised if you see 2 wires shoved into the number 1 coil connecotr pin b.

Btw I want to clarify a term your using in this thread. What are you calling the "Igniter"?

[S^13]

Btw I want to clarify a term your using in this thread. What are you calling the "Igniter"?

power transistor

If it is same thing as ignitor which i think it is... I already tested the wires that go to it... one side is reading high 12v the other is .33v and im not sure what pulsing is like when reading on multimeter (like fluxuating?) I think the side thats pulsing is the .33v side I also stuck the pos test end into the spring where the spark plug goes and tested there and got 14v. Does that sound right? Also if power is getting to the coilpacks doesnt that mean the ignitor (power transistor?) is good? Maybe my ecu is fried?

[NISTECH]

in my diagram you can see there is more then 2 wires, There is 9 wires to test. The power to the coils does not come from the power transistor and neither do the grounds to the coils. the only thing the power transister sends to the coils is the firing signal which esentially is a ground. The voltage builds in the windings of the coil creating a feild when a pulse[ground] is sent, that feild collapses sending the built up voltage to the plug to fire it. if you have power and ground to the coil then your problem is lack of a pulse. What I am asking you to do is determine where that pulse is present or where does it fall off. The ecm sends a volatge pulse to the power transistor, the transister takes that pulse and sends a ground pulse to the coil to colapse the feild. It determines which coil to pulse based on which wire the voltage pulse comes in on from the ECM.

Make sence?

[S^13]

so i need to look for pulse from the ecm and power transistor? what should it be like on a multimeter? should it be fluxuating or what?

[NISTECH]

it will be quick blips of voltage as you crank, and as i said how frequently you see a blip will be based on how fast of a sample rate your meter has. As mentioned before you will NOT know the integrity of the signal just that it is sending one. This test is mearly a "is it doing anything" test. To see if it is doing it right would require the use of an oscilliscope which is typically to expensive for the DIY'er. Chances are though, if it is doing something its doing it right.

[S^13]

I got to do a quick test today and did the coilpack plugs when cranking the side wires read .19 and less they fluxuated and the middle wire when in the on position read high 12v except for the second closest coilpack from the front bumper which wouldnt even hit 1v while in the on position. I also tried to check my ecu for any codes and Im not sure how to read them tell me if im doing somthing wrong. I cranked the car left it in on position then turned the screw on the ecu clockwise wait 2 seconds then turn it back counter clockwise But before the 2 seconds was up both red and green lights would flash togather and I thought they were supposed to flash individually?

[NISTECH]

when you turn the screw the lights flash in unison they are flashing modes of diagnostics. It goes like this 1 flash pause 2 flashes pause 3 flashes pause...it does this to 5 then starts over again. When it flashes 3 times turn it back to its original position and watch the lites they should then start flashing codes.

Your readings on the coils dont sound right , the 12volts is right but the one that reads less then 1 volt is wrong. Which side wires did you check? both? they were plugged in right?

The #2 coil should also read 12volts on the white wire if not you have a problem with the splice in the harness. double check and make sure you had good contact wiht the terminal in the connector.

[S^13]

yeah I checked it a couple times to make sure,I checked the plugs that plug into the coilpacks, I tested it a couple times and was always the same... next time I get a chance I will check for ecu codes and test it again. If the splice wasnt good would that mean all the coilpacks would suffer not just one? Also I was wondering whats the minimal of stuff you can have for the engine to start? Cause my car has a few things off at the moment (BMC Clutch MC driveshaft shifter and Some other stuff...) Is there any sensors that could be telling the ecu to not allow it to start cause it is unsafe to drive? lol
Modified by S^13 at 7:49 PM 5/10/2005

[S^13]

ok I put in a diffrent battery tested the plug to the coilpack and its reading like the others now. I checked for ecu codes I let it go through the 5 modes 3 times then switched it back and nothing Not sure what else to check

[NISTECH]

no you dont let it go through three times, you wait till it gets to mode 3 and then turn it back. You dont want to let it get to mode 5 cause when it hits mode 1 again all codes are gone.

crank the engine again then check for codes. Also recheck the other wires on the coil now that the new battery is in. look for the pulse on the wires that are a different color on every coil. except 1 which is black but in the same terminal as the other coils.

[S^13]

ok that worked I got code 55 55 Normal engine management system operation is indicated hm

Could it be a fuse problem? Im gonna check them all tommorow just to make sure

[S^13]

I cant tell if its pulsing with my multimeter but the wire on each coilpack thats a diffrent color are testing around .11v-.19v

[NISTECH]

ok If the voltage is holding at that .11v-.19v steady while cranking and not bouncing around I would say your not getting the signal to fire the plug. now you need to move to the power transister and see if the ECM is pulsing it. you will be testig the wires on the 6pin connector[not the 4 pin]. The wires you should check will be R/G,R/L, R/Y and R/W your looking for the pulse. Also check the black wire while cranking its voltage should be below .2V and hold there. This is your Ground for the power transistor. If it is over .2v you need to supply a better ground to it.

[S^13]

Well they fluxuated from around .11v-.19v

I will try that and see whats going on

[S^13]

alright tested the connector and they were all .17v-.18v and the ground was .15v