My 1998 I30 barely starts...NEED HELP

[edpapaj13]

Hello everyone, i'm new to forums. I'm having a hard time with my car and its gotten me really aggravated. I have 1998 Infiniti I30 with near 140K. I've invested a lot of money with aftermarket rims, dvd, navi, HID. I hate to sell or get rid of the car. I have changed the battery, my dealer checked all parts ( alternator, crank sensor etc) and everything turned out normal. The car keeps cranking at 2000 rpms, it sounds like it would start but it doesnt. What I have been doing is when I hear that it might turn I press the gas pedal and if i get lucky it starts, if not I keep trying. Its very frustrating as the car looks really good and I've had it for 6 years and I would like to keep it for 1 or 2 more. I have also cleaned the grounds for better contact. My dealer said that it might be a wiring problem and they will charge $100 an hour unti they find the problem. I was wondering if someone is familiar with this issue???

[Presscott707]

did the dealer read out the codes on the ecu, if there were any?

[edpapaj13]

No codes. My mechanic and dealer checked with the the OBDII and nothing came up. Thats why they cant really tell where to look. My dealer said they were sure its the wiring. Something about firewall. But he said he doesnt even know how long it will take to find it and if they find it. I will look for he most inexpensive ways. I read on the forums about recoding your key, ingition switch. I replaced fuel filter, cleaned all grounds. i don't know what else to do if key and swictch don't fix the problem

[Ryan Heo]

I have the similar problem when my engine is hot even though the car doesn't have CEL. I also replace lots of things as like you. I've been dealership the last week. The dealer told me it could be ignition coils. He wasn't sure that. Just that's the best guess in this time. And I paid $170.

What he told me.1. the ignition coils might be needed to replace all of them.2. The camshaft position sensor and crankshaft sensors. 3. The ECU is malfuncutioned.

Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

Thanks for the info. I think both my sensors work. They were replaced by new parts and car still had the same problem so my dealer put the old ones back in. I don't know what the ECU is or how much it is. I'm going thursday to the dealer and from what I read people solved this problem by either replacing ingition switch and/or recoding the key. I want to try and do minor work done on it since I'm already thinking to get another car since my patience is running out. Anyway though I will see what the dealer says. I might suggest him the idea of replacing the ignition coils if they cost aroung that much money as you paid. How is your car starting after you replaced the ignition coils?? Thanks for all your info

[Sentientbydesign]

The ECU is essentially the cars computer. All of the sensors "report" to it.

What do you mean by "recoding key"?

How is the car cranking at 2000 RPMs if you are having problems starting it???

This is a shot in the dark, but I would check the ignition coils, the spark plugs, plug wires, and fuel related components (pump, lines, etc).

I'm not a big advocate of going to the dealer either. For the most part, they just charge you up the rear and their techs are rarely very knowledgeable about our older cars.

[edpapaj13]

Someone on another post mentioned that they recode the key. I don't know what it means either. I have to look at the forum. I think he had a Maxima with very similar problems. I have changed the spark plugs and fuel filter. I When I turn the key on and the car sounds like it going to start and the rpm go to 2000 when its cranking. Today my car stopped starting at all. I tried for an hour. When it did start the rpms on idle were near 1000. I don't care about the high rpms, just want to have my car starting normally. I'm trying to make a list when I go to the dealer ( if my car starts at all) so far I have IGNITION SWITCH, INGINTION COILS, FUEL PUMP, and that KEY coding or whatever its called. If anyone is familiar with any of them how much they cost at a dealer itd be great so i'm prepared. I'm looking to spend 500 max and get as much fixed as possible before I give up and look for an 03' Max.

[edpapaj13]

Here's a link to a very similar problem to mine zerothread/240032

[edpapaj13]

Something else that I noticed is that when the engine is warm and i turn it off, when I turn it back on it takes a lot longer to start then when the car sits over night or for a few hours. I'm not sure if that makes a diff on finding out the problem.

[dr-rjp]

Your problem is NOT electrical.

It is in the fuel delivery system. If you replaced the battery, starter, and alternator, and you are having issues with hard cranking when warm, then you definitely are getting vapor lock on top of what you already have.

Your injectors can go bad (leak, clog) w/o throwing codes. Same thing for your fuel pump.

So, that's where I'd begin my search.

BTW, you should be able to start the car without touching the gas pedal at all.

[edpapaj13]

So should I start by replacing the fuel pump? And that didn't show up when my dealer did the diagnosis. neither the pump or fuel injectors? Shouldnt any codes show up? Im taking my car this thursday and I don't know where to start. Itd be the ignition switch but if it the fuel delivery system is it expensive and what part would I need to replace?

[edpapaj13]

Also one of my friends helped me to check the fuel injectors and they were fine. They weren't flooded also he went in the back seat to check the fuel pump and he said it was working ( I don't know how he could tell ). And no my car doesnt start without pressing the gas pedal. Sometimes when it sounds like its ready to start if i don't press the gas pedal then it gives like a choking sounds and turns off. So i have to time when I think the car its about to start, thats when I press the gas pedal. By fuel delivery system you mean replacing fuel lines, pump, filter etc? My dealer said that only for the fuel pump, just the part, is about 300. how much do you think might cost to replace the whole system? Thanks for your help

[NutriaforBreakfast]

Sounds like it needs air too?

When you hit the gas pedal I assume you areopening the throttle plate. Check the idle aircontrol valve and the throttle position sensor

[edpapaj13]

I dont know how to check them both but Ill ask my friends on sunday. It sounds like the car doesnt really get enough fuel and I guess by me pressing the gas pedal I force the fuel to go to the engiine. I don't even know... A couple days ago I was trying to start it and kept cranking it off and on for abuot half an hour and my battery just gave up. I had to jump start it

[Ryan Heo]

Hi. I'm still having the same problem but I don't think fuel pump or injectors problem. If they have some problem, it should be CEL or you can feel something wrong while you are driving or after starting. I don't have any problem after starting. Anyway I found a tip to how to start when hot. I'v used to turn the ignition key more than 5 sec. when it is hard to start but the mechanic told me "do not that, it makes worse" and he advice me "just turning less that 3 sec. and try again" Even I don't believe that at first time, it works good now. I don't know what different it is but it is helpful to me at least.

Also I have another issue. The gas mileage is getting worse. Now it was over 300 miles but these days I've got 250 miles per full tank (it is only permium). It doesn't have any CEL though.

Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

Thanks for your tips Ryan. Yeah my car after starting is fine actually. And I have noticed that its wasting more gas now too. I used to hold the key for even like 10 sec but just kept cranking. very frustrating. I will try your way too though maybe I have luck but i'm still going to the dealer and see what they say. Most likely i'm replacing the ignition switch as first step. It did help some people so far. I hope it will be that easy but with my luck I'd have to try a million things before it gets fixed

[NutriaforBreakfast]

I would take off the air box and associated equipment so youcan see if the throttle is opening. Might just be a partial open.

The 3 second rule for the starter is to help prevent u from burningup your starter

Charge up your battery and check the water so you don't haveto spend more money than u have too

Check the pressure on the fuel pump while running to make sure its ok

Check each spark plug wire to see if there is a spark

[edpapaj13]

Thanks for all the tips. The only thing at the dealer tommorow is change the ignition swictch. I don't want to mess around with that. Everything else you have mentioned can be done without going to the dealer. I hope I can be able to find the problem and help out other people with similar problems. If I can't my car fixed this week, then i'm gonna look for an 03 Maxima.

[Ryan Heo]

I changed 5 coils to the brand new but unfortunately it doesn't help me at all. I don't know what's the next?Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

I dropped off my car at the dealer yest. Did some test, of course everything came up to working normally, however they wanted to replace the crank sensor. That was their best guess so far. I asked them about the ignition swicth but they said that wasn't the problem at all. They will go over the parts today again and check maybe they find the problem. I will update in any new info I get. They loaned me an 06 G35X. I really don't want to give it back to them. Its a basic model but this car is ridiculously fast. Wasted 20 dollars on gas for half a day. Needless to say I was punching the hell out of the car...

[Ryan Heo]

Please let me know what the dealer told.Thanks.

[dr-rjp]

Didn't mean to leave you hanging on the issue of "fuel delivery."

When I said, "fuel delivery," I meant all of the things that deliver fuel & air and that monitor fuel delivery and the fuel/air mix, things like fuel pump, fuel injectors, throttle plate, throttle position sensor, MAF, idle air control valve, and anything else actuated via vacuum pressure.

The crank position sensor, IMHO, is not what is giving you poor gas mileage.

Bad O2 sensors would, and they can go bad w/o throwing codes, but since they are offline when you are start a cold engine, you can rule them out.

The throttle plate might be sticking, but it would have to be virtually closed for the car not to start.

The throttle positioner, on the other hand, could be giving false signals, and causing your car to run rich, but I don't think it would prevent you from starting the car.

A bad MAF most certainly will prevent you from starting your car and running properly, but the ECU usually (but not always) throws a code.

The IACF mainly affects idle speed. A bad or clogged valve would cause your car to idle roughly, but it would not prevent it from starting.

OK, has anyone checked for vacuum leaks? They will reproduce all of the symptoms you are having.

AND, anything that cuts off the air supply getting to the throttle.

That's my 2 cents.

[edpapaj13]

That certainly cleared a lot of my questions. So far my dealer did the 1st diangostics and although they would change the crank sensor they asked my other dealer and found out it wouldn't solve anything. They are running a last diagnostic on monday. As suspected no codes come up. After the car starts it runs smooth, without any problems. I wanted to suggest some of the ideas here to the dealer but they say they have are connected with other dealerships about all problems and what solutions to try. Needless to say, they didn't give me a chance to say all the things I heard from you guys. I hope once I go monday I can tell them when I pick up my car and check them out. Will keep you updated.

[Ryan Heo]

Please let me know what the dealer told.Thanks.

[Ryan Heo]

I would like to say something. When my I30 was bought on 5 months ago, the transmission was rebuilted. After that, the car wasn't started at all.I sent the car to the another shop in where there wasn't dealer. They charged me $600.

It is the labor description.

CRANKS BUT WILL NOT START ------------ $192HAS SPARK AND INJECTOR PULSE. HAS GOOD FUEL PRESSURE. INSPECTED SPARK PLUGS AND FOUND PLUGS GAS FOULED.REPLACED SPARK PLUGS WIHT O/E STYLE.CARBON BUILD UP CAUSING HARD START WHEN COLD.NEEDS TO CLEAN MOUNTING SURFACE BETWEEN ENGINE AND TRANSMISSION. REROUTE GROUND CABLE TO THE STATER BOLT.

CLEAN MATING SURFACE BETWEEN TRANSMISSION AND ENGINE.INSTALLED GROUND CABLE TO THE STARTER BOLT. AFTER CLEANING VEHICLE NOW STARTS AND RUNS. -------------- $352

It was a perfect condition right after the repair but it is getting worse a month later.

I hope helpful to you.Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

Hey Ryan

Thanks for all the info. My mechanic did tell me that it might be contact somewhere between the engine and transmission. I hope my dealer finds that out. i will most likely cal him on monday if they weren't able to find anything wrong with the car. So even after they did all that work, the car now has the same problem with starting?

[Ryan Heo]

Hi.

When the job was done, it was good the same as a normal car at that month. However it is getting worse. Now the problem is hard to start when the engine is hot or outside temperature is high (over 80F). It starts good in the morning or when the engine is cool or outside temperature. After I drove it for 5~10 min. The engine is normal temp. At that time it starts very hard. At least I'v tried more than 4~5 tims or 15~30 sec. long crank.So I just guess the problem is related to temperature. It is all what I know so far.

Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

You know I had the same thing a couple days ago. In the morning when the engine was cold it started after a few time cranking it. When I went to a store and tried to turn it back on it wouldn't start. I was trying for half an hour then it started. It does seem to me that is related to the engine's temperature. i already mentioned that to the dealer but I guess they can't tell why that is happening. I will until monday but i'm slowly giving up on it. I already have appoinments to see 3 Maximas. Thanks for your info

[Ryan Heo]

It could be the best solution to the problem. My solution is to be swap the engine next year because I can't afford to get another maxima. It mean I can't give up and would like to know what's wrong. Anyway I hope you to share any information related to the problem.

The list of parts which were replaced.1. an alternator2. a starter3. spark plugs4. a PCV valve5. a coolant temperature sensor6. an ignition switch7. a fuel pump relay8. a knock sensor9. a fuel filter10. a valve cover gasket11. spark plug tube seals12. a battery13. an air filter14. oxygen sensors15. five ignition coils (one is left)16. cleaned IAV valve and throttle body17. cleaned the engine grounds18. put the fuel system cleaner

Those are repleced by myself for 3 months.

Thanks.

[edpapaj13]

I can't believe you replaced all those parts and still have problems with the car. Sometimes the problem was fixed by just an ignition switch or knock sensor. I cant replaced all those parts. They'd cost 2 or 3 grand. You think by changing the engine will solve the problem? It seems expensive to do and the labor would cost a lot. my friends told me to do the same thiing and put a 3.5 engine in there but its a huge project and needs a lot of time and money. Right now Id rather finance 10G and get a used 03 Max with a warranty then spend time to troubleshoot. maybe it will be a nice summer project to do but not right now. Anyway thanks for all that info. Ill have them in mind. By monday I will let you know what the dealer say but I really don't think it will be any different than the diagnostic on friday which found no errors.