So my dad is going to buy a 05' and told me today the LS430 is the car. I cannot really give him a good arguement.
First, the car is better looking, not by much, but the exterior to him is better looking and I agree.
Second, six speed transmission versus 5 speed.
Third, back seat room, no contest, the LS is much roomier
Interior, he feels that is a wash, both are incredible.
So, how can I even tell him to look at a Q again (he already did). Yes the Q is just a bit faster (he agreed) but he's 68 years old and that 1/2 second 0-60 just isn't that important.
I'm afraid I know why the Q doesn't sell, BTW, he has already got it spotted out around the same price as the Q so there isn't going to be a big cost savings either and the M is too small.
LS430 for my Old man
Hey, the Lexus has dimples!
And the market certainly does get subjective and peculiar at $60k. A performance-luxury buyer these days might be looking at the M45, 5-series or CTS, while those in the upper crust full size crowd might favor a plush ride over a quick burst to 60.
The Q is due for a major update anyway.
-Jesda
And the market certainly does get subjective and peculiar at $60k. A performance-luxury buyer these days might be looking at the M45, 5-series or CTS, while those in the upper crust full size crowd might favor a plush ride over a quick burst to 60.
The Q is due for a major update anyway.
-Jesda
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maxnix
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You know, I like the LS, until I sit in it. Then the flat panel of the back of the seat pan immediately has me slumping as my behind slides towards the front of the seat pan, even without any dynamic forces present at a standstill. Slicker than snot.
The other thing I really don't like is the way the seat bottom feels like a director's chair - i.e., it is slung between the sides like a piece of canvas. I am most uncomfortable in chairs with that kind of architecture. My mom has about 11 years on your dad, and she didn't like how low she sat in the LS400. She loves the Q45.
Lastly, I will never own a car with belt driven camshafts again. Be sure to get an estimate of the after waranty labor.
The other thought is to have him wait for the 2005 model if he wants to buy new. On the 2003 and soon on the 2004 models, he should be getting about $10K below list.
What does he think of your FY33? I recall he had a G50. While the exterior of the F50 (until model year 2005) maybe too understated, the LS430 is just too much a heavily accented derivative of the previous generation of the S class.
The other thing I really don't like is the way the seat bottom feels like a director's chair - i.e., it is slung between the sides like a piece of canvas. I am most uncomfortable in chairs with that kind of architecture. My mom has about 11 years on your dad, and she didn't like how low she sat in the LS400. She loves the Q45.
Lastly, I will never own a car with belt driven camshafts again. Be sure to get an estimate of the after waranty labor.
The other thought is to have him wait for the 2005 model if he wants to buy new. On the 2003 and soon on the 2004 models, he should be getting about $10K below list.
What does he think of your FY33? I recall he had a G50. While the exterior of the F50 (until model year 2005) maybe too understated, the LS430 is just too much a heavily accented derivative of the previous generation of the S class.
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elwesso
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This is one reason I dont like the way infiniti is going... Case in point: they havent stuck to their roots, the real bread and butter of their existance...
Look at it this way.... BMW has been making essentially the same cars for about 20 years..... The 1988 750iL is surprisingly similar to todays 760Li in terms of how it rides/drives compared to the competition.....
The cars sold good then, and they still sell good...... IIRC, the G50 from 90-93 has been the best selling Q ever, but the 1994 wasnt too far behind... From 93 they have slowly gone to a more lexusy ride and styling, and now we're left with this thing called hte F50..... In all honesty, its nothing like what the original G50 was, and I think the engineers who designed the G50 would be ashamed to see this car wearing the Q45 badge...
Dont get me wrong, I like the new Q enough, but I just dont know about its styling..
I think infiniti would be doing a lot better if we just keep seeing reiterations of the G50, so that today we might have something that looks similar to an E38 BMW or late 90s S-class, rather than a car that looks more like a lexus....
Sorry just my little rant for the day..
Look at it this way.... BMW has been making essentially the same cars for about 20 years..... The 1988 750iL is surprisingly similar to todays 760Li in terms of how it rides/drives compared to the competition.....
The cars sold good then, and they still sell good...... IIRC, the G50 from 90-93 has been the best selling Q ever, but the 1994 wasnt too far behind... From 93 they have slowly gone to a more lexusy ride and styling, and now we're left with this thing called hte F50..... In all honesty, its nothing like what the original G50 was, and I think the engineers who designed the G50 would be ashamed to see this car wearing the Q45 badge...
Dont get me wrong, I like the new Q enough, but I just dont know about its styling..
I think infiniti would be doing a lot better if we just keep seeing reiterations of the G50, so that today we might have something that looks similar to an E38 BMW or late 90s S-class, rather than a car that looks more like a lexus....
Sorry just my little rant for the day..
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elwesso
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Too expensive for what it is??? :bsflag:
Sorry had to whip out the flag for that one... The Q is much cheaper than the competition and offers more options..... From a statistical standpoint, this car is better than any of the others in its class... Not to mention you can get them for cheaper than sticker (some high 30s, low-mid 40s)..
The Q with the supercharger (cant remember the name) makes it 15grand less than the S55AMG and still faster.....
You cant say the Q isnt fast compared to what else you can get in the price range, because its right on top...
Sorry had to whip out the flag for that one... The Q is much cheaper than the competition and offers more options..... From a statistical standpoint, this car is better than any of the others in its class... Not to mention you can get them for cheaper than sticker (some high 30s, low-mid 40s)..
The Q with the supercharger (cant remember the name) makes it 15grand less than the S55AMG and still faster.....
You cant say the Q isnt fast compared to what else you can get in the price range, because its right on top...
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natsoundup
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My dad has been driving a Grand Marquis for years.... it's amazing to see how they have gone from fast, tight cars to something that just floats on the air now. They have changed those cars to fit the market.
My dad got in the 90 and could car less about how fast it goes. Said he sat too low and the seats were hard. Got in the 94 and said it was a bit more comfortable...
if I had the next couple of generation Q's it may start appealing to him.
Have to agree with Wes...the Q has gotten away from its roots, but has tried to find the Lexus crowd while trying to retain loyalty.
Maybe many of us will never migrate to the newer generation Q's.
Obviously most are just car enthusiasts.
You see few on this board who trade up every few years. I had my 90 10 years before I got the 94. Now I feel like I have almost a new car. I don't think I would buy a new Q if I had the money. Still would like to have one of those 2001's however.
I do hope the next re-do takes it back more to its roots.
well, enough of my blather.
My dad got in the 90 and could car less about how fast it goes. Said he sat too low and the seats were hard. Got in the 94 and said it was a bit more comfortable...
if I had the next couple of generation Q's it may start appealing to him.
Have to agree with Wes...the Q has gotten away from its roots, but has tried to find the Lexus crowd while trying to retain loyalty.
Maybe many of us will never migrate to the newer generation Q's.
Obviously most are just car enthusiasts.
You see few on this board who trade up every few years. I had my 90 10 years before I got the 94. Now I feel like I have almost a new car. I don't think I would buy a new Q if I had the money. Still would like to have one of those 2001's however.
I do hope the next re-do takes it back more to its roots.
well, enough of my blather.
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ddrumman
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quote:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Originally posted by Altiman94 Id drive a BMW over any infiniti/nissan ever made --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Spoken like someone who has owned neither a BMW nor an Infiniti!
LOL
D.
Spoken like someone who has owned neither a BMW nor an Infiniti!
LOL
D.
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BadQ45t
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'84 Nissan 300ZX (Original Owner)
'16 Mercedes Benz S550e V8 Power & 35 MPG - Location: Half Moon Bay, CA
Well he loves my 97', drove it down to LA and was ready to trade his 92' for my 97' in a minute. I have not made him drive the new Q, but the biggest problem he has is small back seat, totally understated looks (he's in the woman's garment business in LA so status is a player).
I will force him to drive the Q, but how do we justify the bigger back seat, the more stately exterior, and a 6 speed transmission. I will be interested to see him drive the Q, but I think his mind is made up in any case.
I looked at a new Q the other day and the back seat is SMALL for a car of that size, so is my 97' for that matter. My brothers 96' LS has a much bigger back seat.
Plus he's doing a 3 year lease so timing belt changes do not mean anything to him, but he thinks the LS430 is "more than likely the most perfect car on the road."
I will force him to drive the Q, but how do we justify the bigger back seat, the more stately exterior, and a 6 speed transmission. I will be interested to see him drive the Q, but I think his mind is made up in any case.
I looked at a new Q the other day and the back seat is SMALL for a car of that size, so is my 97' for that matter. My brothers 96' LS has a much bigger back seat.
Plus he's doing a 3 year lease so timing belt changes do not mean anything to him, but he thinks the LS430 is "more than likely the most perfect car on the road."
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sijoko
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The supercharger kit for the VK is made by a company in Australia.
So, if Keuylian is not around anymore, there is still a good chance on getting the supercharger.
AGM had given me the contact info for a gentleman by the name of Courtney Tassie. He said that his company had done extensive testing on the supercharger setup and felt confident that they had a good product.
It might be a good idea to contact Courtney and find out how much it would cost to buy the supercharger kit minus the Keuylian markup.
-sijoko
So, if Keuylian is not around anymore, there is still a good chance on getting the supercharger.
AGM had given me the contact info for a gentleman by the name of Courtney Tassie. He said that his company had done extensive testing on the supercharger setup and felt confident that they had a good product.
It might be a good idea to contact Courtney and find out how much it would cost to buy the supercharger kit minus the Keuylian markup.
-sijoko
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greg_atlanta
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If backseat room is important, Q45 is out of the picture. The only time the back seat has enough legroom is if the front seat is pushed all the way forward. The reclining rear seats don't make much sense since it just reduces legroom even more.
In Japan the executive always sits in the left rear seat and the left front seat is pushed all the way forward and reclined forward.
In Japan the executive always sits in the left rear seat and the left front seat is pushed all the way forward and reclined forward.
Since there are no more early Q's for me to buy, and because I can only drive this car if I do the work myself, since, like the rest of you, I know it better than the dealers, I am looking to pick up a late model sedan to replace it for a ten year holding period. German cars are not reliable in my view, and in Consumer Reports and JD Powers view, so I will stay with Japanese. That leaves me the choice between the Q and LS. The M is too Japanese-I find it claustrophobic, and of the 12 or so I have ever seen the styling is not for me.
I just tested an LS430 with the sport suspension. It is soft, but not floaty, and I suspect that its limits are higher than mine. It has 18"wheels, and huge 4 wheel vented discs. It goes without saying that there is no wind noise, the engine runs smoothly and quietly, and there is not a stitch out of place. The acceleration is impressive, and at full throttle it shifts (first and second- the salesman was in the back) quickly and smoothly at the rather low redline. I don't like the drive by wire from a standstill, but it is not as bad as some Mercedes. And there is a ridiculous amont of wood, albeit beautiful wood, all over the inside.
I plan to drive the new Q also. But it sticks with me that the Q is kind in a land of its own. Except for the aforementioned belts, and the lack of a LSD, the LS seems to have a higher content then the Q. Luxury lines don't have MacPherson strut suspensions. We don't get an update version of the first Q, we get a gussied up version of a different car.
And, while Infiniti is a solid second in quality surveys, someone has to be first.
I will post again after I test the Q. Who else has driven both?
I just tested an LS430 with the sport suspension. It is soft, but not floaty, and I suspect that its limits are higher than mine. It has 18"wheels, and huge 4 wheel vented discs. It goes without saying that there is no wind noise, the engine runs smoothly and quietly, and there is not a stitch out of place. The acceleration is impressive, and at full throttle it shifts (first and second- the salesman was in the back) quickly and smoothly at the rather low redline. I don't like the drive by wire from a standstill, but it is not as bad as some Mercedes. And there is a ridiculous amont of wood, albeit beautiful wood, all over the inside.
I plan to drive the new Q also. But it sticks with me that the Q is kind in a land of its own. Except for the aforementioned belts, and the lack of a LSD, the LS seems to have a higher content then the Q. Luxury lines don't have MacPherson strut suspensions. We don't get an update version of the first Q, we get a gussied up version of a different car.
And, while Infiniti is a solid second in quality surveys, someone has to be first.
I will post again after I test the Q. Who else has driven both?
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BadQ45t
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I have not had the chance to go drive either, my Dad lives in LA and I live in SF so we are not going to be together for a while. Since he's not buying until Oct (he wants 05) we have some time.
Post your Q impressions, I'm going down to Peninsula Infiniti which is right next door to a Lexus dealership. I figure my very clean 97' gets me quick test rides in both cars (the sales rep at Peninsula is still the same guy so no problem there) and do a back-to-back comparo.
Interested to see what you think....
Post your Q impressions, I'm going down to Peninsula Infiniti which is right next door to a Lexus dealership. I figure my very clean 97' gets me quick test rides in both cars (the sales rep at Peninsula is still the same guy so no problem there) and do a back-to-back comparo.
Interested to see what you think....
Well, Hitman has the 4.08 gears. I have everything else. I would think he could easily take my Q off the line, unless we brutalized our transmissions by pumping them up to 3000. Pat Barrett from Level 10 did that to demo my old Q to me when I got it back....He was smiling like a kid at what he had done to my 4800 lb car.
And that's why Lexus, BMW and Mercedes have the six speed. Grunt off the line, and 25 mpg at cruise.
Technology triumphs.
And that's why Lexus, BMW and Mercedes have the six speed. Grunt off the line, and 25 mpg at cruise.
Technology triumphs.