Loud valves, lumpy idle...video

[Darius]

I just finished reinstalling my Series 1 RB25 into my S14 and started it up. After about 3 minutes of idling, it started to lightly smoke around the turbo. Below is a link to a video of it, but you can't really see the smoke. I'm wondering what could possibly be smoking from the turbo side of the motor? Anti-seize? Head gasket material?

A second weird issue that I have not had before are the loud valves. It sounds like a diesel civic

A third issue is that I'm getting a CEL #12 now for the MAF sensor. There was never a problem with it before today, so I'll have to run through the troubleshooting on that one.

Enough talk, here's the link:

http://media.putfile.com/Lumpy...25DET

[Carl H]

smoke from round the turbo is pretty normal comes from handling the manifold with greasy hands...the loud valves is due to the lifters being flat, revving the car to 3k and holding it there for a few minutes should solve the problem. as for the maf i dunno, is it connected?

*edit*dear god, the video just loaded, that sounds more like cam timing is off, you did double and triple check the cam timing right?that tapping sounds might be valves against pistons...

[27RB240]

Well atleast you got it running; I aggree with Carl on that 1.......... Sorry to change the subj. alittle, but how did those top hat mounts go with the swap???Did they do pretty good, meaning fitment and making things alittle bit easier.........???

[Eikon]

I've heard valve ticks and injectors ticking.. but i've never heard that sound from an engine. Sounds like metal on metal.

[Darius]

I double-checked the timing belt before I buttoned up the front and put on all the pulleys and timing belt covers. I'm wondering if it slipped a tooth (or more) upon startup?? Like I said before, it didn't sound right to me at all.

[Shocker]

sounds making me cringe... allthough sounds like valve tick when oil is to low sorta, check the oil level.. if not you might have missed a tooth.. lets hope not.. :/

[240slidekat]

hey any update on this?? im having the same problem

[Darius]

If I check my timing out with a timing light, it will be obvious if I've slipped a tooth on the belt, right? I'd rather check the timing first before I pull the front of the motor off along with the radiator and all that crap.

[USMCgetsome]

HOLY JEBUS!!!!!!! Do not turn that motor over again. I can assure you that your belt has slipped. Sounded exactly like mine when i cranked it over. Simply put. Realign everything and put the belt back on. Man i can not tell you how bad skipping 1 tooth will do to your engine. Check it again. I'm more than sure that is your problem. Also, the smoke might be due to a faulty injector seal or oxygen sensor. I had the exact same problems.

[Dano]

Ewww, that sound made me cringe as well, as they said, do back and check timing asap!

-Dan

[Joe]

If I check my timing out with a timing light, it will be obvious if I've slipped a tooth on the belt, right? I'd rather check the timing first before I pull the front of the motor off along with the radiator and all that crap.

cam timing and ignition timing are not 100% related. if you slipped the intake cam no you wont be able to see it with a timing light

pull the cover and check your cam timing.

[240slidekat]

so what do i look for when i take off the front cover?

[Joe]

you need to put the engine at TDC then check all your timing marks

[240slidekat]

ok, so if im not mistaking, put the #1 cylinder at TDC, then check for timing marks, are the marks real easy to see? where are the timing marks? i have a new timing belt so i dotn know if there is a mark on it or not. The machine shop did all the installing. do i aslo have to check the mark (if there is one) at the crank? thanks kamin

-rich

[gawdzilla]

theres a mark (dimple) on each cam pulley and the crank gear. i think every OTHER tdc is when the pulleys actully line up, i.e. exhaust cam mark facing 2 o clock, intake cam mark facing 10 o clock, dont remember where the crank mark faces, maybe 6 o'clock.

its possible to be at tdc and the dimples arent contacting the belt. if thats the case, just go to the next TDC.

if your timing belt isnt marked, just count the teeth and valleys, fsm should say.

[240slidekat]

i just finished checking the cams matches the line, the crank pulley is at 0 degree when they all match and TDC.

[Darius]

I just checked my timing marks and they all look like they line up. I'm a little suspicious about the bottom pulley lining up with the mark, but it's so damn close. The cam marks line up but don't look like it in the pictures because I couldn't get straight on. I also checked my oil level and it was at "H". Here are some pics:

[240slidekat]

mannnnn im on da same boat

[98birdls1]

If you think the timing is correct do a leakdown test (crank the motor by hand) that might give you a better idea of what is broken.

I think it sounds more like a bearing noise than a valve hitting something. How was your oil pressure when the motor was running? Seems you are having some problems with this motor. Good luck

Luke

[Darius]

I just took the front of the motor apart to verify the timing belt was correct and...it was. I even took the time to count the 47 teeth marks to the exhaust cam mark.

I do not know what my oil pressure is as I do not have a gauge in yet. I have just been trying to get this effing motor in and running before anything else. Seems like it's an endless lesson in engine mechanics.

I don't know what a leakdown test will do since I have already taken the motor apart and inspected the head/valves and had the head resurfaced. It almost sounds like there is no lubrication between my lifters and cam lobes.

This motor is confusing the crap out of me because it ran perfectly fine (not loud) before I took the head off to resurface it and now it's doing this.

I want to set the timing with a light but need to know what you guys think about starting it again? Would it do more harm than good or do you think the timing was just way off? I mean I had the CAS set in the middle of the slots.

[Bioxide02]

My rb25det sounds the same way.... .. My timing is correct, my oilpressure is fine and it runs great..

EDIT: My other two friends with rb25's sound the same way as well.. *shrug*

[Darius]

btw did anybody spot the potato gun in this video? I'm kind of disappointed since there's always somebody who comments about the stuff in the background of pics and videos.

And what is the deal with my PS fluid bubbling? Why would it do that?

[240slidekat]

My rb25det sounds the same way.... .. My timing is correct, my oilpressure is fine and it runs great..

EDIT: My other two friends with rb25's sound the same way as well.. *shrug*

dhude i hope your kidding, it just doesnt sound right. what have you guys done to your motor by the way? im trying to find similarities

[gawdzilla]

btw did anybody spot the potato gun in this video? I'm kind of disappointed since there's always somebody who comments about the stuff in the background of pics and videos.

And what is the deal with my PS fluid bubbling? Why would it do that?

i had a feeling that was a potato gun, but it could've just been some pvc pipe. i have one kinda like that .. about 8 ft long w/ electronic ignition

when you check your timing don't check it against the cover marks. that cover really has nothing to do with how your belt is lined up, and it really doesn't tell you much.

instead count the number of valleys on the belt between each of the dimples and make sure they are correct between the 2 cam dimples, and from one of the cams to the mark on the crank spoke. the FSM tells you the exact # of belt teeth. use some white out to mark your belt if you have to.

[98birdls1]

A leakdown test would tell you if you had piston-to-valve contact. If your car wasn't making that noise before your head was pulled they may have put it back together improperly.

And like was said before, ignition timing and cam timing aren't related enough to really help you in this situation. I don't think the benfits of checking ignotion timing is worth starting the motor again. I still believe it sounds like a spun bearing. Good luck

Luke

[Darius]

yeah we took a grill ignitor and put some tin foil near the tip for the spark to arc to. The thing works pretty well.

I counted the valleys in the timing belt as described above in my earlier post and they match those found in the FSM. So I'm happy about that at least.

I changed the oil again tonight and found some bad oil in it from accidentally getting coolant into it while the head was off. My filter was gummed up like a mofo with milky white oil, so I changed the filter to a K&N. Started it up since I figured my timing belt is aligned properly, there can't be piston to valve contact unless the machine shop took too much off of my head. Changing the oil actually made it run a lot quieter so I'm thinking that was the source of the problem, but still not to the point where I'm comfortable driving it.

[Carl H]

you should always change the filter after the head comes off, you never know what kind of crap got in it.it may just be lifters that need to be pumped up, revving it to 3k for 5 min should fix that problem...

[240slidekat]

ima do the same thing tomorrow, i did notice that the oil looks kinda like ****t. what oil weigh did you use? take a new video of it, so we can see the difference it made.

[blk90s13]

i have no input on the timing issue but you need to bleed your ps lines its full of air as you can see the fluid is boiling in the resevoir

[SR20Essex]

I tired to read everyone’s post, but I don't think I read if anyone noticed the blue smoke coming out of the exhaust. That sound could be a bent valve either from the timing being off (I don't know if RB's are interference engines, but if they are timing belt slipping would bend a valve from hitting the piston). And if the valve is bent, you will be sure to have a lumpy idle (loss of compression in that cylinder), and burning oil (blue smoke) because of the oil seeping past the valve guide seal. If its running rich and backfiring allot I'd be willing to bet that its an exhaust valve giving you trouble. Check the compression to at least begin the hunt.