KA24DE(T) Megasquirt 2 V3 help- Need help. Krazy,Zig,480sx,Anyone... Please?

[Invallid]

Ok guys I know this is my first post... long time lurker... Anyhow. I'm hoping someone can help me. I have been reading on basically every forum that I can to try and figure out why my KA24DE isn't starting. It seems that I have every setting correct or as close to it as possible without the car actually running.

Background:Stock KA24DE (Was running, everything in stock form.)Compression test ~190 across the boardMegasquirt II PCBV3 purchased pre built now installedGM IAT sensorWalbor 255HP fuel pumpJGY fuel railMSD 72lb injectorsStock FPR ~43psiMSD Blaster 2 coil (stock was working)TPS calibrated and working2 banks of injectors sim shot 2 per rotation

Ok I don't know where to start or how much information is needed so I will just try to cover it all in one shot, please let me know if more is needed. After 4 solid days of trying to get it to work here is where I am..

I started by installing the MS box as directed on the site. I have used megatune with MS2-Microsquirt BG 2.980 to get everything dialed in. I currently have bypassed alot of the factory harness to help me in time convert to a full custom harness and do away with the birds nest of un nessicary wires. Currently the IAC thermo valve has 12V, the fuel pump cycles as it should, I have spark and I the injectors are definatly working (wet plugs) However when trying to set my base timing I have tried it 2 different ways. 1) Dizzy at stock position and 2) turned all the way to towards the fire wall. neither seems to help. I have adjusted the timing of the trigger offset from 60 to 110 degrees using 2 degree jumps... the higher seems to be better. The car will start and run for a few seconds (2 or 3) then it turns off. sometimes it will start again immediatly sometimes it doesnt until I let it sit for a while. Sometimes it starts and runs backwards

I don't know what else to do. I have tried setting my spark maps and VE maps differently ranging from 5 to 20 degrees spark advance and from 20 to 80% VE and every combination between. It just won't run. I have used different maps posted by Zig and Krazy to try to get this thing to idle and although their maps are completely different I figured something would happen. Nothng... that is other then finally toasting a starter which I accomplished about 10 mins ago. If anyone has some stock MS2 base maps or anything else that could be of use to me please post it up or direct me to it.

Thanks!

MSI: http://www.filefactory.com/fil...9_msq

Modified by Invallid at 2:45 PM 7/6/2009
Modified by Invallid at 12:58 PM 7/8/2009

[480sx]

Ef its been so long since i messed with MS but i know exactly what you need to do to fix your problem.. Its just locked in my brain somewhere lmao. Basically, your problem exists because the stock CAS wheel is horrible for stand alone ECU's. Durring extremely low and changing RPMs that the starter does, the ECU doesnt get enough information to give you correctly timed spark. Once its running its fine, but startup is a bish. The only input they can read is from the one slat per rotation disk. There is a few fixes for this.. I have HEARD(multiple good sources) that you can use a DSM distributor and it just slides right in, and has 4 slats for the CAS pickup. There are also 24-1 wheels that are ideal that you can pick up for pretty cheap from AEM and some other guys. Your trigger angle should be ~75 IIRC, but its different for each vehicle you need to use the trigger offset wizard and figure it out for sure. The best option is just to use the Ford ignition setup, EDIS? something like that, its the best thing for MS and there is a metric ton of support for it.

Oh yea you have to do something with your 'False Trigger' settings or something. Set it to advanced mode, and i believe you put the 'false trigger' percentage fairly high and it wont do the miss timed firing that you are getting. I also found that retarding my timing bins(i had it super low) for startup conditions significantly on startup helped stop this situation

Unfortunately, all my information and knowledge comes from a really outdated software version. I mean, the rest of us got it running just from the Mega manual. I believe i was the first to get it running although i never actually boosted on it. It pissed me off one day by frying the ignition driver chip when i left my ignition on, the damn thing desoldered itself from the board lol. That was it for me, ill eventually go back to it. Iv heard the new software is awesome.
Modified by 480sx at 7:05 PM 7/6/2009

[Invallid]

Ef its been so long since i messed with MS but i know exactly what you need to do to fix your problem.. Its just locked in my brain somewhere lmao. Basically, your problem exists because the stock CAS wheel is horrible for stand alone ECU's. Durring extremely low and changing RPMs that the starter does, the ECU doesnt get enough information to give you correctly timed spark. Once its running its fine, but startup is a bish. The only input they can read is from the one slat per rotation disk. There is a few fixes for this.. I have HEARD(multiple good sources) that you can use a DSM distributor and it just slides right in, and has 4 slats for the CAS pickup. There are also 24-1 wheels that are ideal that you can pick up for pretty cheap from AEM and some other guys. Your trigger angle should be ~75 IIRC, but its different for each vehicle you need to use the trigger offset wizard and figure it out for sure. The best option is just to use the Ford ignition setup, EDIS? something like that, its the best thing for MS and there is a metric ton of support for it.

Oh yea you have to do something with your 'False Trigger' settings or something. Set it to advanced mode, and i believe you put the 'false trigger' percentage fairly high and it wont do the miss timed firing that you are getting. I also found that retarding my timing bins(i had it super low) for startup conditions significantly on startup helped stop this situation

Unfortunately, all my information and knowledge comes from a really outdated software version. I mean, the rest of us got it running just from the Mega manual. I believe i was the first to get it running although i never actually boosted on it. It pissed me off one day by frying the ignition driver chip when i left my ignition on, the damn thing desoldered itself from the board lol. That was it for me, ill eventually go back to it. Iv heard the new software is awesome.

Modified by 480sx at 7:05 PM 7/6/2009

You must unlock your brain I NEED that information lol. I am honestly about a week from ditching this whole portion of the project and just moving towards using a JWT ecu. I really like the ability to tune the computer for any future changes or upgrades and that is the only reason I went with it. Anyhow..

http://www.diyautotune.com/tec...x.htm

Above is the page on the manufactures site that shows what needed to be done. I have also read that using a mitsubishi dizzy wheel works great... It is interesting to me that it works better then the stock one as it is described as a "4 slot" ring. I don't want to spend 75 bucks on a trigger disc, It just seems silly to buy something that simple for that much money. first step is to buy a 1G DSM dizzy disk i can get one locally, likely for 5 bucks or so. EDIS would be great, but you have to have been where I am before... I have a lot of cash already out there and just want to get it to run before I make it better. I'm sure any car builder can understand that...

I can't seem to find any sort of false trigger whatchamacallit selection anywhere and I have looked thru all the tables many time... many many times... lol. If you can remember the name let me know.

You should go back to megasquirt... its user friendly and simple to use...

Thanks for the help

[480sx]

Again, i stopped using MS2 right before they came out with their new 'Extra' version of the software, so things might be different. Ill see if i can pull up the MS prog on my old laptop and pull up some of my settings and their locations in the prog today or tomorrow.

Im 80 percent certain that your problem has to do with this setting, this 'false trigger something'.

[Rhapsody]

MegaTune Configuration for MS-II

As this is a 'path less traveled' thus far you probably won't find people with maps to share for your car just yet. You can however dial it in with a bit of patience and some 'how to tune' homework, most of which you can do in the Megamanual at http://www.megasquirt.info.

Set ignition capture to "Falling Edge."

Important when using the VB921: On the 'Ignition Settings' menu make sure to set 'Spark Output' to 'Going High (Inverted)' and set 'Coil Charging Scheme' to 'Standard Coil Charge'.

find the stock spark map around here somewhere that the guy with ITB's has and set it to that.

now when you go to do the timing it seems confusing but actually its simple.Under spark settings your trigger angle is what your max timing will go up to. So on your timing map your (deg) can go up to a max of 60 if 60 is what you put in for the trigger angle.

Trigger Angle set to 60 should be fineset Trigger Angle addition to 0

For Cranking Timing Set it to Time Based

Now that is the so called confusion part.

The Fixed Angle is basically whatever angle your engine will run at. For ex. set it to 20 deg and your engine will run at 20 deg no matter what you do to the cas or how much you acc. When you set it to -10deg it tells the MS to use the Ignition table instead of a fixed angle. ****Important part*****To set the timing all you need to do is set the fixed angle to some number say 20deg. Then use a timing light and make sure on the crank pully it is at the 20 deg mark. So what ever you set your fixed angle to, the crank pully should correlated to that number. Once its set correctly put the Fixed Angle back to -10 deg so it can run off Ignition table.

The Cranking Advance Angle is basically what angle you crank your engine at.If our engine idles at 800rpm and has a kpa of 40 then on the stock Ignition table the trigger angle should be at around 20 deg (FSM says 20 + or - 2 deg).During cranking your engine speed is around 350rpm or so and your map i think should be around the idle map 40. You need to figure out what the cranking angle should be and each car will be a bit different depending upon setup. I have my cranking angle set to 10 deg.

so to recap (these are my settings and should help you get started)

Trigger angle - 60Trigger addition - 0cranking timing - timed basedcranking advanced - 10fixed Angle - -10

any other setting should be set according to the DIYauto tune guide.

I hope this helps and is what your where looking for.

[Invallid]

MegaTune Configuration for MS-II

As this is a 'path less traveled' thus far you probably won't find people with maps to share for your car just yet. You can however dial it in with a bit of patience and some 'how to tune' homework, most of which you can do in the Megamanual at http://www.megasquirt.info.

Set ignition capture to "Falling Edge."

Important when using the VB921: On the 'Ignition Settings' menu make sure to set 'Spark Output' to 'Going High (Inverted)' and set 'Coil Charging Scheme' to 'Standard Coil Charge'.

find the stock spark map around here somewhere that the guy with ITB's has and set it to that.

now when you go to do the timing it seems confusing but actually its simple.Under spark settings your trigger angle is what your max timing will go up to. So on your timing map your (deg) can go up to a max of 60 if 60 is what you put in for the trigger angle.

Trigger Angle set to 60 should be fineset Trigger Angle addition to 0

For Cranking Timing Set it to Time Based

Now that is the so called confusion part.

The Fixed Angle is basically whatever angle your engine will run at. For ex. set it to 20 deg and your engine will run at 20 deg no matter what you do to the cas or how much you acc. When you set it to -10deg it tells the MS to use the Ignition table instead of a fixed angle. ****Important part*****To set the timing all you need to do is set the fixed angle to some number say 20deg. Then use a timing light and make sure on the crank pully it is at the 20 deg mark. So what ever you set your fixed angle to, the crank pully should correlated to that number. Once its set correctly put the Fixed Angle back to -10 deg so it can run off Ignition table.

The Cranking Advance Angle is basically what angle you crank your engine at.If our engine idles at 800rpm and has a kpa of 40 then on the stock Ignition table the trigger angle should be at around 20 deg (FSM says 20 + or - 2 deg).During cranking your engine speed is around 350rpm or so and your map i think should be around the idle map 40. You need to figure out what the cranking angle should be and each car will be a bit different depending upon setup. I have my cranking angle set to 10 deg.

so to recap (these are my settings and should help you get started)

Trigger angle - 60Trigger addition - 0cranking timing - timed basedcranking advanced - 10fixed Angle - -10

any other setting should be set according to the DIYauto tune guide.

I hope this helps and is what your where looking for.

I have done the proper steps based on the MSmanual as you outlined at the begining of this post. However... I can not find anywhere to make the changes that you recommended.. I have gone thru each menu in Megatune. can you please tell me where you found the places to make those changes? Is this something in another software package other then MegaTune running 2.890? This is exactly the information I needed... asssuming I can find a way to apply it.

Thanks for the help

[Rhapsody]

ok i think i know whats going on. Are you using microsquirt? Do you have the full MS2? If you have the full standalone MS2 and not the mircosquirt you should be useing MS2 Extra 2.0.1. You need to go to the megasquirt sight and read up about which software to use and how to setup/burn it to the megasquirt.

I think whats going on is your useing the microsquirt program which is not suppose to run full standalone. If this is the case follow this link http://www.msextra.com/ms2extra/ to install the MS2 Extra. Make sure you read the whole manual so you can understand where everthing is and what the options do.

[480sx]

^^ Nice catch.

[Invallid]

ok i think i know whats going on. Are you using microsquirt? Do you have the full MS2? If you have the full standalone MS2 and not the mircosquirt you should be useing MS2 Extra 2.0.1. You need to go to the megasquirt sight and read up about which software to use and how to setup/burn it to the megasquirt.

I think whats going on is your useing the microsquirt program which is not suppose to run full standalone. If this is the case follow this link http://www.msextra.com/ms2extra/ to install the MS2 Extra. Make sure you read the whole manual so you can understand where everthing is and what the options do.

OMFG your a super hero,I reflashed to the proper firmware, then I used Kraze settings I found in another thread...adjusted some things so it matched my injectores etc It fired right up. Now is where I become lost again I have it locked on -10 when I change it to 20 to set my timing it dies immediatly.... It is also ideling at ~2300 rpm and smoking like a freight train. I assume adjusting everthing in my VE tables etc will fix that. Tell me one more time in moron words how to set base timing.. I thought it was as simple as set fixed timing to 20 degree with it running then adjust the actual cas to 20 deg adv. I can't do that if it dies immediatly lol.

Again thanks so much to those that tried to help me

[Invallid]

^^ Nice catch.

Indeed!

[progman]

Just for reference is this a 89-94 ka24de? or a 95-98?

[Invallid]

Just for reference is this a 89-94 ka24de? or a 95-98?

89-94, Technically a 92

[Rhapsody]

OMFG your a super hero,I reflashed to the proper firmware, then I used Kraze settings I found in another thread...adjusted some things so it matched my injectores etc It fired right up. Now is where I become lost again I have it locked on -10 when I change it to 20 to set my timing it dies immediatly.... It is also ideling at ~2300 rpm and smoking like a freight train. I assume adjusting everthing in my VE tables etc will fix that. Tell me one more time in moron words how to set base timing.. I thought it was as simple as set fixed timing to 20 degree with it running then adjust the actual cas to 20 deg adv. I can't do that if it dies immediatly lol.

Again thanks so much to those that tried to help me

You got it right, it should work correctly when you set the fixed angle to 20 deg then use a timing light to make sure it corresponds to 20 deg on the crank. Its probably smoking badly because the fuel is not correct.

Just make sure you use a timing light and it corresponds to what the fixed angle is set to.

Unlug the tps set fixed angle to 20 deg and make sure with engine running and timing light setup is shows the 20 deg mark. Do it for 3 different timings also. try 17, 20 , and 24 or something like that, so you know that when you set the fixed angle to whatever deg, the cas also see's whatever deg you set it too.

Question? Did you use the fuel calulator to create a table for you? If so then it will get you into a ball park to startup the engine but it will not run very well.

resend me your .msq and i will take a look at it for you and let you know what changes you might need.

I'm glad you made some progess on your engine and it starts now, congrats.

Just for a reference progman I made a guide alone with DIYautotune to make a full standalone work with the S14 cas. No longer do you have to use the S13 cas + external coil if you do now want to.
Modified by Rhapsody at 9:03 PM 7/7/2009

[480sx]

Just for a reference progman I made a guide alone with DIYautotune to make a full standalone work with the S14 cas. No longer do you have to use the S13 cas + external coil if you do now want to.

Wow nice. I like the CAS's, but without a more advanced wheel i dont feel confident in them. Cory has had a few blown motors relating to the stock CAS(he believes, and i would second his belief), i dont feel that it is a viable, reliable tuning sensor with one tooth per rotation.

As far as the auto generated map, its actually not THAT bad. You can lean it out by eh, 10-15 percent from the start and just go from there. You will have to lean out your idle and low vac afr's even more than that, the MS map generator gives you a really rich map for obvious reasons.

[Invallid]

You got it right, it should work correctly when you set the fixed angle to 20 deg then use a timing light to make sure it corresponds to 20 deg on the crank. Its probably smoking badly because the fuel is not correct.

Yea it's definatly a bit rich... I'm pretty sure it's all fuel related.

Just make sure you use a timing light and it corresponds to what the fixed angle is set to.

Unlug the tps set fixed angle to 20 deg and make sure with engine running and timing light setup is shows the 20 deg mark. Do it for 3 different timings also. try 17, 20 , and 24 or something like that, so you know that when you set the fixed angle to whatever deg, the cas also see's whatever deg you set it too.

I will work on that as soon as I can start it again... tomorrow lol.

Question? Did you use the fuel calulator to create a table for you? If so then it will get you into a ball park to startup the engine but it will not run very well.

I did but it isn't right.. I have a lot of trimming to do.

resend me your .msq and i will take a look at it for you and let you know what changes you might need.

Where do you want it sent?

I'm glad you made some progess on your engine and it starts now, congrats.

Yea me to it's been a long few weeks.....

Just for a reference progman I made a guide alone with DIYautotune to make a full standalone work with the S14 cas. No longer do you have to use the S13 cas + external coil if you do now want to.

I like my MSD

[Rhapsody]

just post the link for your msq on the forum and ill take a look. When i first got my engine started it ran like crap. I had to adjust the fuel constants and the fuel table to get it to run decent. It still didn't accel right and i had to adjust accel enrighments to get it to accel decent when i steped on the pedal. Its a major acheivment to get the engine to run after installing megasquirt and getting it tuned correctly to run like a normal car is a differrent thing altogether. I'm still working on that and unless you go to a dyno with someone with megasquirt experence its gonna take a long time. Megasquirt is full standalone yes but its also a learning experence. Read what you can, learn what you need, and never ever stop dataloggin. Dataloggin will be your best friend cause it tells you what happend when you boosted to 8psi and feel like the power droped off. You just need to understand how to interperate the charts.

[Invallid]

Wow nice. I like the CAS's, but without a more advanced wheel i dont feel confident in them. Cory has had a few blown motors relating to the stock CAS(he believes, and i would second his belief), i dont feel that it is a viable, reliable tuning sensor with one tooth per rotation.

Looking on the DIY's site they claim that it is a 4 slot disc, however it looks more like a 1 and a few tiny holes disc... I bought a mitsubishi dizzy from the local scrap yard today for 15 bucks with a nice 4 slot disc in it. I have read these are a simple easy and effective upgrade. IF it works as well as described great, if not.. 24-1 will be on it's way no doubt. I am definatly sticking with CAS and not doing a true crank trigger.

As far as the auto generated map, its actually not THAT bad. You can lean it out by eh, 10-15 percent from the start and just go from there. You will have to lean out your idle and low vac afr's even more than that, the MS map generator gives you a really rich map for obvious reasons.

I'll look into doing exctly this tomorrow, I dont know that this is the only issue I'm having right now with the fact that my car is idleing at ~2300 I'm relatively confident that it's a combination of things... atleast I'm having a problem with it idleing high then the problems I was having this time yesterday lol.

[Invallid]

just post the link for your msq on the forum and ill take a look. When i first got my engine started it ran like crap. I had to adjust the fuel constants and the fuel table to get it to run decent. It still didn't accel right and i had to adjust accel enrighments to get it to accel decent when i steped on the pedal. Its a major acheivment to get the engine to run after installing megasquirt and getting it tuned correctly to run like a normal car is a differrent thing altogether. I'm still working on that and unless you go to a dyno with someone with megasquirt experence its gonna take a long time. Megasquirt is full standalone yes but its also a learning experence. Read what you can, learn what you need, and never ever stop dataloggin. Dataloggin will be your best friend cause it tells you what happend when you boosted to 8psi and feel like the power droped off. You just need to understand how to interperate the charts.

Good advice, I intend to have it dyno tuned I just need to get it managable to the point where it can be driven there lol. I also want to get the bottom end of the power tuned in so it can be applied later.. you know the "before the turbo starts to work" part of it all. in other words low end tip in, idle start up etc. basically everything that will make it daily driveable... even though it won't be.

I failed to mention in my inital post that I have a LC-1 installed and hope that the auto tune feature works fairly well in this software. Any input on that?

Oh also I need values for the stock CLT sensor I saw the values for the temp/ohms but never saw the bias resistor values. Ill try to search again for that in a bit.

[Rhapsody]

Good advice, I intend to have it dyno tuned I just need to get it managable to the point where it can be driven there lol. I also want to get the bottom end of the power tuned in so it can be applied later.. you know the "before the turbo starts to work" part of it all. in other words low end tip in, idle start up etc. basically everything that will make it daily driveable... even though it won't be.

I failed to mention in my inital post that I have a LC-1 installed and hope that the auto tune feature works fairly well in this software. Any input on that?

Oh also I need values for the stock CLT sensor I saw the values for the temp/ohms but never saw the bias resistor values. Ill try to search again for that in a bit.

I recently installed the LC-1 on my car and it works fine as far as widebands go. Make sure you have it installed right. That is very important. There is 2 analog outputs one for 0-1v and one for 0-5v. You want the 0-5v one going to ms and the 0-1v going to an AFR gauge if you have one. There are a few guides to help you but if you still dont understand or suspect its not reading correctly i will help you with that.

With the CLT and Air intake Temp you need to calibrate thoes with therm something i forget the name but look it up. Basically it works off ohms.Stock CLT from the FSM reads this.

4.4 v = 9.2 ohms3.5 v = 2.5 ohms2.2v = 0.8 ohms0.9 v = 0.s ohms

Intake Air temp readings are this from FSM

68deg F = 2.1-2.9 ohms122def F = 0.68 - 1 ohm

Look it up under EC for the FSM. It has a chart that will give you more options to put into that therm calc.

[WDRacing]

Just my .02

I've read through the MS forums and I've read almost all of the threads on NICO where Nissan guys have had awful issues with the MS system. Can it work? Definitly, but it's very rare to hear of someone in the 240 world that has one running well. There always seems to be "something" that needs tweaking.

WHY friggin bother is my question? There are better ways to rom tune your own stuff or just buy a known good tune from EFI Specialists, JWT or Enthalpy.

Hell...I'll take an FMU over MS all day everyday

WD

[Rhapsody]

Just my .02

I've read through the MS forums and I've read almost all of the threads on NICO where Nissan guys have had awful issues with the MS system. Can it work? Definitly, but it's very rare to hear of someone in the 240 world that has one running well. There always seems to be "something" that needs tweaking.

WHY friggin bother is my question? There are better ways to rom tune your own stuff or just buy a known good tune from EFI Specialists, JWT or Enthalpy.

Hell...I'll take an FMU over MS all day everyday

WD

I agree MS isn't the best way to go when it comes to fuel management for turbos, but my reasons for wanted to go MS is because its a learning exp. I'v learn a great deal more about how engines work and sensors. I'm an auto tech and i have a bachelors degree in auto tech, but i still am learnin from MS. I feel that in the future i will be able to apply MS to any car, and tune it with a WB almost as good as a dyno.MS users are people who want a challenge and are not looking for an easy way to turbo a car. Definitaly go with fmu so super cheap or rom tunes if you don't have enough money to get a plug and play standalone.

[480sx]

^^ Nice. MS was an AWESOME learning experience for me too.

MS2 is incredible as a tuning system, its exactly what i want. However, its just the Gdamn optical CAS's on the Ka's that causes all the real problems IMO.

Which is why im going to eventually just go with the ford EDIS system. An engines just an engine, ya know? The EDIS system is practically ideal for an ECU's primary source of engine timing data, you cant really get anything simpler, more basic, reliable and easy to fix/get parts for.

[WDRacing]

I agree MS isn't the best way to go when it comes to fuel management for turbos, but my reasons for wanted to go MS is because its a learning exp. I'v learn a great deal more about how engines work and sensors. I'm an auto tech and i have a bachelors degree in auto tech, but i still am learnin from MS. I feel that in the future i will be able to apply MS to any car, and tune it with a WB almost as good as a dyno.MS users are people who want a challenge and are not looking for an easy way to turbo a car. Definitaly go with fmu so super cheap or rom tunes if you don't have enough money to get a plug and play standalone.

The FMU example was just something for simplicities sake.

If you want a learning experience, there are still far better options IMO. Just because something allows you to learn a new method, doesn't mean it's good. I sincerally hope this works out well for you. You can pave the way for others and make this something less painful.

I'll stick to methods that are proven and have far less headaches. Especially since there isn't anything the MS can dot that a simple DIY rom tune can't.

WD

[Invallid]

I recently installed the LC-1 on my car and it works fine as far as widebands go. Make sure you have it installed right. That is very important. There is 2 analog outputs one for 0-1v and one for 0-5v. You want the 0-5v one going to ms and the 0-1v going to an AFR gauge if you have one. There are a few guides to help you but if you still dont understand or suspect its not reading correctly i will help you with that.

I configured mine to do 0-5 out on both. you can configure it in the logworks settings. I have my other output going to the optional gauge...

With the CLT and Air intake Temp you need to calibrate thoes with therm something i forget the name but look it up. Basically it works off ohms.Stock CLT from the FSM reads this.

4.4 v = 9.2 ohms3.5 v = 2.5 ohms2.2v = 0.8 ohms0.9 v = 0.s ohms

Intake Air temp readings are this from FSM

68deg F = 2.1-2.9 ohms122def F = 0.68 - 1 ohm

Look it up under EC for the FSM. It has a chart that will give you more options to put into that therm calc.

Yea those are the numbers I have seen floating around, but what I'm missing is the number above all of that the BIAS.

[Invallid]

Just my .02

I've read through the MS forums and I've read almost all of the threads on NICO where Nissan guys have had awful issues with the MS system. Can it work? Definitly, but it's very rare to hear of someone in the 240 world that has one running well. There always seems to be "something" that needs tweaking.

WHY friggin bother is my question? There are better ways to rom tune your own stuff or just buy a known good tune from EFI Specialists, JWT or Enthalpy.

Hell...I'll take an FMU over MS all day everyday

WD

A FMU won't accomplish what I'm trying to do... I know several people with store bought tunes, I know that many of them also had issues and had to put the car on a dyno and pay to make a few pulls just to send information and an ECU back to JWT amongst others to have alterations made to their map which cost them money. Also every time they do anything different it cost them more money to retune yet again. I know how to get the basics running and in time I will be able to get the rest of it working properly. I have a WB and a big hard drive for logging... I don't mind the extra effort because in the end I have learned something, even if what I learn is not to use this particular stand alone lol.

[Invallid]

^^ Nice. MS was an AWESOME learning experience for me too.

MS2 is incredible as a tuning system, its exactly what i want. However, its just the Gdamn optical CAS's on the Ka's that causes all the real problems IMO.

Which is why im going to eventually just go with the ford EDIS system. An engines just an engine, ya know? The EDIS system is practically ideal for an ECU's primary source of engine timing data, you cant really get anything simpler, more basic, reliable and easy to fix/get parts for.

This is exactly right, but ironically there is nothing wrong with optical CAS as a trigger... there is however a serious problems with the stock trigger disc and an after market ECU. As i mentioned above I picked up a mitsubishi 4 slot which is a direct drop in. This should help greatly. if that doesn't work I will buy a 24-1 which also drops right in (~75 bucks). From what I have read this is the way to go if you want perfection... which for the cost I may as well in a few weeks.

I have exactly the same feelings as far as an engine is an engine. The fact that it is a nissan should make absolutely NO difference in how it runs or if it can... Once I remove all of the stock crap and get it to the point where I have just what is needed and everything else is remove its exactly the same as any other inline 4 cylinder.

[Rhapsody]

I havn't really heard of the stock optical trigger being a big problem. Testings if different disc would be great for a sticky, but it should be done with someone who has their car working perfectly so as to see what kind of difference it will make. I would like to see if putting a different disc really will make a big difference in power or fuel consumption.

[480sx]

They are a problem, trust me.

Inval - Im aware of the trigger wheel issue, and as far as ease, thats probably the best way to go. I however would rather just block the whole damn CAS off, that port and everything. Run a COP or close to it setup with EDIS.

The main drawback to the EDIS system is the fact you have to precision machine a trigger wheel as well as your crank pulley.. Then balance it. Although the trigger wheels are already available elsewhere online.

[flynbyu82]

Just my .02 WHY friggin bother is my question? There are better ways to rom tune your own stuff or just buy a known good tune from EFI Specialists, JWT or Enthalpy.WD

WHY friggin bother, pssh !! Do you take your car to the auto shop everytime you need something done? Do you take it to QuikyLube to get your oil changed? MAN TAKES PLEASURE in getting things done himself... THATS why people bother with Megasquirt. Not only is it FUNCTIONAL, RELIABLE, and CHEAP, but its GRATIFYING, SATISFYING, and FULFULLING to build a electronic control unit from the ground up to control an engine. Megasquirt does not need "tweaking". The only thing megasquirt needs is a patient and intuitive operator.

[WDRacing]

WHY friggin bother, pssh !! Do you take your car to the auto shop everytime you need something done? Do you take it to QuikyLube to get your oil changed? MAN TAKES PLEASURE in getting things done himself... THATS why people bother with Megasquirt. Not only is it FUNCTIONAL, RELIABLE, and CHEAP, but its GRATIFYING, SATISFYING, and FULFULLING to build a electronic control unit from the ground up to control an engine. Megasquirt does not need "tweaking". The only thing megasquirt needs is a patient and intuitive operator.

First off...check yourself. You have NO IDEA who you're talking to or what kind of car guy I am by reading one friggin post. I've been involved with the KAT world for years and turbo's even longer. Back when running a hacked maf was an option. Because we had no options...we had no kits, no ebay manifolds etc.

I built and tuned my own 3 stage alcohol injection system from spare parts and things I could get from the junkyard. I fabbed my own FMIC piping, manifold, downpipe and all the rest of the crap I have. I even used a top feed fuel rail from a 4.6 Mustang because the injector spacing is close and it was a cheaper alternative. So bring your attitude to someone who deserves it.

You say it doesn't need tweaking...WTF are you talking about? It's a standalone, it needs a complete tune. Which IMO is quite more then "tweaking".

Show me a large group of KAT guys that have the MS running trouble free. Trouble free meaning no idle/stalling issues and no issues with start or rich conditions. By large I mean 100 or more...because that's what it takes to be considered reliable and functional.

My point isn't to trash MS, because I know it works. I'm simply presenting my opinion as a boost veteran. Others read these forums ALL the time. I don't want them thinking the MS is some type of bolt on ECU that works if you load some maps...because it isn't. I also suggested other methods of "DIY tuning". Like Rom tunes etc...which can be done yourself for just as cheap as the MS.

WD