I am SOOOO not impressed with Joe Biden right now.

[Eikon]

Well.. more like his speech-writers...

I'm watching the DNC on TV right now.

Biden just got done playing telcoman and blaming every challenge we face today on George Bush. The price of oil, the mortgage crisis, etc...

What a toad.

OMG. now they are playing cheerleader and repeating the "that's more of the same" phrase. That's the best the Dems can do in the year 2008? Repeat a slogan that's been used in every election since democracy was born...

He just said our country is less secure than we ever have been in the past.. Seriously??? That's a rediculous statement.

[Eikon]

HOLY HELL

I'm speechless right now!

Biden just said that he and BO would pressure Russia out of Georgia and rebuild Georgia afterwards. ARE YOU FREAKING JOKING???? ISN"T THAT WHAT YOU'VE JUST HAMMERED BUSH FOR DOING IN IRAQ???

What a complete freaking idiot.

or wait.. perhaps he forgot to read his speech before he got up there.

[audtatious]

Cuz it is Bush's fault and the rubber stamping republican Congress. Just ask Ishk.

[Eikon]

I absolutely cannot believe that they just said that they would go into the Russia vs. Georgia issue and pressure the Russians to leave and then pledge US dollars to rebuild Georgia..

Have they not spend the last 6 years crucifying Bush for stepping into the middle east, effecting political leadership, and then rebuilding a country???

Now during the national convention they say they are going to do the same thing?

Maybe I didn't hear that correctly? Perhaps my grapefruit juice is spiked?

There is no way that just happened.

[OriginalWheelman]

It's the dems flowing with public opinion.

Perfect example: My friend Eric's mother Kathy.

Kathy: "I can't stand how America goes around actring like we are the world's police."

Two weeks later we watch "Hotel Rawanda"

Kathy: "Oh my god, why didn't we step in and do something!"Me: "Um... wouldn't that be acting as the world's police?"Kathy: Scowls and walks away.

We all want to help, but only when we feel bad about what is happening. If we do go in it will be just like Iraq. The people will demand "justice" at the hand of the US military. We will spend lots and lots of money, the people will look at the bill, and now desensitized to the violence and turmoil, will demand a pull out. It's the political equivalent of trashing someone's office, then putting the stapler back on the desk and leaving.

[brizanden]

ohhh lol now i get it. all that money obama said we would be saving by pulling out of iraq and afghanistan is now going to be pumped to georgia. now its all so clear. i was worried we would be rebuilding our economy for a while.

[HashiriyaS14]

I wasn't terribly impressed with Biden's speech. It was okay, but not great.

Bill Clinton and Warner were the two rockstars of the DNC so far this year. Those were two GOOD speeches.

FOUR MORE MONTHS.

EDIT: Kennedy was great too in his own way, but his speech was so much shorter and it wasn't intended to be as pointed as the other two. His real triumph was the 2004 speech on Iraq.

[ishkabibble]

Cuz it is Bush's fault and the rubber stamping republican Congress. Just ask Ishk.

Nah, it's Congress' fault. With their -42% approval rating.

Or is it the Carter administration's fault?

Perhaps both.

[audtatious]

It's Marsha Brady's fault

[ishkabibble]

It's Marsha Brady's fault

Maybe Obama can use this as his campaign theme song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyooALwfxO8

[audtatious]

He can't. The Brady's are racist (they are all white) and I'm sure they would never allow his use of that song.

[ishkabibble]

It sure would have made for an interesting backstory on the show if a couple of the kids were black.

[audtatious]

Alice looked kinda like Louise Jefferson after being airbrushed so you can really never tell I guess.

[AZhitman]

What a crock of crap. I'm convinced, all this rah-rah nonsense is so much fluff...

So, they've determined Russia is the bad guy, Georgia is the good guy?

Are they SURE?

And what if Russia decides to open a can of whupass on us? What then, Obama?

What happened to NEGOTIATIONS?

Bob, maybe you can speak for these morons... they're gonna "pressure Russia out of Georgia"?

Is that OUR business?

Go ahead, defend this horsecrap - I can't WAIT to see what "The Messiah Of Hope And Change" is planning to tell Russia...

I hope he gets bitchslapped.

Pompous turncoat treasonous liberal...

[OriginalWheelman]

Exactly. We have no business in a border dispute between two sovereign states.

[HashiriyaS14]

Exactly. We have no business in a border dispute between two sovereign states.

WRONG

We have a continued and inarguable interest in the expansion of NATO, and Georgia falls under this purview. Containment of communism during the Cold War was important, but the post-Cold War expansion of NATO is MORE IMPORTANT. It will be the defining US foreign policy issue of 2010-2020.

Russia is not going to "open a can of whup ***" on us, they have too much to lose, just like China. You guys have been spending too much time listening to d!ck Cheney tell scary bedtime stories. Russia doesn't have the capability to attack us effectively with conventional arms and they're no more likely to do it with nuclear ones than they were 30 years ago.

At any rate, Kerry's speech was GREAT. Where the f**k was that in 2004?

I'm not certain I understand how someone can be FOR a war in Iraq with no clear purpose but at the same time AGAINST the defense and support of a nation that wishes to become part of NATO. Explain that one to me, I'll wait.

[rn79870]

Well.. more like his speech-writers...

I'm watching the DNC on TV right now.

Biden just got done playing telcoman and blaming every challenge we face today on George Bush. The price of oil, the mortgage crisis, etc...

What a toad.

OMG. now they are playing cheerleader and repeating the "that's more of the same" phrase. That's the best the Dems can do in the year 2008? Repeat a slogan that's been used in every election since democracy was born...

He just said our country is less secure than we ever have been in the past.. Seriously??? That's a rediculous statement.

Many republicans feel the way you do. However, many others have faced the reality that the last 8 years have been a dismal failure, if not a strategic disaster for this country. What Biden did was call a spade a spade. He assigned the blame exactly where it belonged, on the current administration. He also pointed out that McCain has backed Bush 95% of the time when voting and that says something about more of the same.

Now, you chance will come when the VPs debate later this fall.

[audtatious]

Talking points. Still no substance. Follow the "blame Bush" motto and ignore what has NOT been done in the last 2 years with the democratically controlled Congress since the republican controlled Congress was so bad.

You guy's can't even admit that the Dems have been a failure for the last 2 years in Congress and instead just sling mud at the republicans 6 years even tho they themselves didn't have some supermajority.

Figures. Business as usual with Democrats.

[rn79870]

Talking points. Still no substance. Follow the "blame Bush" motto and ignore what has NOT been done in the last 2 years with the democratically controlled Congress since the republican controlled Congress was so bad.

You guy's can't even admit that the Dems have been a failure for the last 2 years in Congress and instead just sling mud at the republicans 6 years even tho they themselves didn't have some supermajority.

Figures. Business as usual with Democrats.

The OP lists the points, or substance as you call it. No need to repost them. Once again, I blame the captain for letting the ship flounder. That's what the Navy does.

A good leader would have led the congress, actually, a good leader could have led the congress.

[AZhitman]

...still waiting for an exlpanation of HOW Biden (who appears to be taking a 180-degree turn from his previous stance) can justify hiscomments, given they're EXACTLY the same as what the Left has criticized the current administration for all along.

Let's not forget that all the supposed "positives" about Biden can be applied to Cheney, yet the left isn't singing HIS praises.

I'm not disagreeing with you Hash - I'm pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of getting all rah-rah over Biden, who's parroting Bush/Cheney, just in a different venue.

[audtatious]

And you obviously think Obama is one who can lead even though he has only thus far shown he can follow the likes of Wright, Ayres and Rezko. Tell ya what, if my reps follow they lose votes and I'm sure others feel the same way. Unless the Dems can get a supermajority in congress then it's going to be the usual "get nothing done" routine.

[rn79870]

Obama can lead because he has a few rare qualities McCain lacks. Energy, Intelligence, Compassion, Courage, Credibility, and of course, Change.

It's not a hard decision given that there are only two choices. One offering to some degree or another, more of the same. The other offering a change in direction for this country. If you're happy with the course this country has been on, then your choice is easy. If, on the other hand, you believe we need to undo much of what GW has dome, then your choice is also an easy one. The bottom line is you need to make a choice between the two viable candidates if you're planning on voting.

[AZhitman]

Obama can lead because he has a few rare qualities McCain lacks. Energy, Intelligence, Compassion, Courage, Credibility, and of course, Change.

HUGE stretch.

Energy? Is that an age thing?

Intelligence? Are you sure? Checking test scores?

Compassion? For who? This is subjective... Pretty low on my list of requirements for a candidate.

Courage? Sure Bob. Obama's all about courage. The courage to open his mouth prematurely and correct it a day later? The courage to "work" his way through school? The courage to serve his country (oops, he didn't)...

Credibility? Eroding every time he changes his stance. I'd make a list, but you've already seen it.

Change? More "change" talk without specifics. Still waiting to see what he'd do differently. Not euphemisms, not nebulous thoughts... ACTUAL SPECIFIC DIFFERENCES.

To claim the GOP candidate "lacks" these qualities is a desperate stretch.

Back to Biden and his smooth moves.

[HashiriyaS14]

I'm not disagreeing with you Hash - I'm pointing out the blatant hypocrisy of getting all rah-rah over Biden, who's parroting Bush/Cheney, just in a different venue.

And for what it's worth, I more or less agree with you. The Dems are using Biden to give the GOP a bit of their own medicine in a somewhat hypocritical fashion. His job is to play the hardliner for the election to hedge any concerns people might have about Obama not being able to handle the foreign policy aspects of the job. I don't necessarily agree with it, either for it being good politics or for it being correct. I probably would've picked Tim Kaine.

I find that criticism humorous though, as Clinton had less foreign policy experience than Obama does and he seemed to do okay, with the few exceptions most Presidents have.

I just wanted to make sure I spelled out for everyone precisely WHY it is our business to meddle in the Georgia affair. This isn't like India and Pakistan hitting each other, this is a nation that clearly wished to become part of NATO and that was also clearly one of the reasons the Russians hit it so hard.

EDIT: I find it funny, from a grammatical standpoint, how Bob listed all the qualities Obama has and then added "change" to the list.

"I have credibility" makes sense, but "I have change"?

I CAN HAZ CHANGE!

Sorry Bob

[rn79870]

Intelligence? Are you sure? Checking test scores?

Right, they must have been near the top to earn him 5th. from the bottom in a class of 899. That's the bottom 1/2 of 1%.

Change? More "change" talk without specifics. Still waiting to see what he'd do differently

You've come to the right place. The short version....1. Iraq. 2. Economy.3. Social Security.4. Health Care.5. Terrorism, (the actual declared war).6. Employment/outsourcing7. Education.8. Taxation.

Those are the basic differences between GW/McCain and Obama.

[AZhitman]

1. Iraq. 2. Economy.3. Social Security.4. Health Care.5. Terrorism, (the actual declared war).6. Employment/outsourcing7. Education.8. Taxation.

Those are the basic differences between GW/McCain and Obama.

No, that's a list of words that represent topics that are important to our nation right now.

Those aren't "differences".

BO has still not laid out specifics on what (if anything) he would do differently (that's within his scope of influence) in those areas.

He says, "we'll turn around this economy".

OK. Good. I'm excited.

How?

....silence.....

[Eikon]

I'll concede book smarts to Obama. McCain didn't do well in the US Naval Academy studies.. But then again, he learned how to be a soldier and fly ground attack aircraft off of aircraft carriers. Perhaps there is a little more to the Naval Academy than test scores?

Obama is one hell of a smart cookie when it comes to school. He graduated from Columbia and Harvard Law.. That's no small feet. He was the first black head of the Harvard Law Review... again very impressive.

Does book smarts = good President?

How's Steven Hawking's campaign going?

I'll trade the character and courage of a man who spent 5.5 years in a POW camp and 20+ years in the military followed by 20+ years as an elected US government official for some dude who got straight A's in college.

[HashiriyaS14]

I'll trade the character and courage of a man who spent 5.5 years in a POW camp and 20+ years in the military followed by 20+ years as an elected US government official for some dude who got straight A's in college.

Eh, it goes both ways.

Intelligence DOES make you a better leader, but it also isn't the only factor. I would argue that between two people of equal life experiences, I'm always going to opt for the person with more demonstrated intelligence, even at the expense of values.

I don't generally think that McCain's time as a POW is any advantage to him being Preisdent. Does it make him a revered American hero? Yes it absolutely does, but I'm not certain how it qualifies him to lead. Making sacrifices, ultimately, doesn't demonstrate any actual competency. It's noble and I respect him a ton for it, but I don't see how it is otherwise material.

Obviously, the years in the Senate ARE material, but due to the current political climate, his voting record seems to be hurting him. He shed his "maverick" image to win the primary and now he's trying to bring it back, but I don't think it's going to work. Too bad, because the 1996-2000 John McCain is a guy I'd have enthusiastically voted for.

That's no small feet.

WAT?

[Eikon]

haha... little feet. oops.. feat.

I think his POW experience does lend itself to leadership. I think he understands better than anyone the risks and costs of sending our soldiers to war. If that decision needs to be made, it will be with a full understanding of the gravity of the situation. I think his decision to stay until every last one of his co-prisoners was also released rather than taking the release they offered him because of his pop's role in the Navy showed a TON of character. He put others ahead of himself and made the tough decision that was the right decision even though it was worse for himself personally. McCain was pushed to the very limit of his life, in fact spent years on the brink of death. I'd say that gives him some perspective that very very few others in the world can have.

Now, do I think sitting in a POW camp and being tortured daily lends itself to knowing how to structure our economy or appoint supreme court justices... No! But it lends me to feel more comfortable with him making those decisions because I think he's a man of good character.

[rn79870]

There is documented evidence that McCain suffered irreparable psychological damage at the hands of the north Vietnamese during his captivity. Many blame his hot tempered, flying off the handle responses to many little situations on that damage.

I give him credit for the suffering, but when that's added to the normal effects of age on a persons brain, he's too much of a wild card to want in office.