I am building an all motor KA and am looking for ideas

[240sxRAOR]

I have a plan to build a KA from scratch in stages. I don't expect to make 250hp but I will shoot for it. I will tell you guys what I have in mind and any suggestions would be realy helpfull. And I don't want to hear a word about Turbo, I don't hate it or anything but this thread is All Motor, I have made up my mind. I just want a balanced motor with alot of pick up not high rpm, I don't mind if it peaks at 6,000.

My current plan is Stage 1 building the engine and necesary componentsKa24de from a 92'Arias 10.7:1 pistons 89.5mmAms sportsman rodsArp studsFel pro gasketsCailco coated main and rod bearingsSupertech ValvesPort polished headOil pump and Timing chain replacementBlock bored .5mm and head shaved (not sure how much)I'd like to lighten the crank and have it polished so it cuts through the oil betterAem wideband o2 sensorSome kind of ecu tunning possibly JWTbigger injectors (I'm not sure what size)I will run 93 octane gasI don't know if cams will be a good idea so I will just do the valves first and see how it turns out

Stage 2 add onsVery short cold air intakeShorten the intake manifoldHead back exhaust 2.5"UD pulley(s)Electric fansRemove AC since it doesn't work anywayIgnition coil to improve sparkKoyo Radiator all metalAluminum driveshaftSome kind of LSDEngine oil coolerB&M ShortshifterXTD Lightweight flywheelCenterforce clutch12 lb 17x7 rims

Thats my plan so if you guys have any advice on my set up or what I'm going to need. I would realy apriciate it

[redtop91]

While I only do things FI, it should be noted that the SOHC has been repeatedly documented as being more capable in NA form that the DOHC. And I doubt you'll have any trouble trading someone for their SOHC if it is in your interests.

[240sxRAOR]

I have Sohc already and I like the Dohc better. I am not trying to make the best numbers out there I'm just trying to make 250 at the crank and over 200 rwhp.I also don't want more than 11:1 compression cause I have a very crazy idea but I'm keeping it to myself till I try it out because I want to be the first to try it.

[redtop91]

IIRC very few, if any individuals (Non race team) crack the 200whp mark in NA form. Irregardless here are some NA KA threads that you might be interested in: zer...49831 zer...age=7

[240sxRAOR]

thanks

[240sxRAOR]

Any one else got any suggestions or comments?

[Bigvinnie]

Yeah if you are doing a full out build get ride of the wack half weighted crank and get an AMS fullycounterweighed crank for more high rev and HP.

[240sxRAOR]

Actually I just found out that Brian crower is about to come out with a stroker kit and I could have a KA2.65de. That would be wicked and as the saying goes there is no replacement for displacement. Besides Torque > Horsepower.

[redtop91]

It is already out actually IIRC. But the compression ratio is more conducive to FI setups. Nothing a piston swap can't fix. They are pricey though.

[nismofly]

youll want itb's, not a regular intake

also instead of getting 17x7s which you cant fit any tire on get like 16x8's or 16x8.5's, theyll be a tad lighter and youll be able to run more tire

[Bigvinnie]

Actually I just found out that Brian crower is about to come out with a stroker kit and I could have a KA2.65de. That would be wicked and as the saying goes there is no replacement for displacement. Besides Torque > Horsepower.

O.K so your willing to spend $3500 in bottom end parts and a crank with a 91mm stroke, not including a build from a shop for warrantee???AMS fullycounterweighted crank with 96mm (stock) stroke capable of using stock internals (rods and pistons) $1500....You do the math.........

[Brandon93240]

u should just sell ur car to someone and buy a yaris. I think everyone is tired of seeing the all motor threads on here, it f$cking pointless. Either spray it or boost it, because if ur willing to waste that kind of money on a little bit of power ur either a tard or a dreamer and it will never happen. But let me guess you want to be different than everyone else and do something no one else has. 240's are like civics now, theres not much that hasn't been done. Since u seem like a bandwagoner why don't u swap an ls1 in, hell what ur wanting to spend on parts and labor just to build ur engine that way for will pay for the drivetrain and swap parts.

[240sxRAOR]

First off I don't pay for labor, I'm not trying to bew different either. I have a f#cking goal not everyone wants 500hp car. I also have a very crazy idea of which I haven't mentioned because when I meet an ******* like you I can bet you good money. Seriously the beauty of the 240sx and the reason everyone wants one now is because FR, cheap and THE OPTIONS of what you can do with it. I would never put the f#cking LS1 in a 240, chevy belongs in a chevy! Now the VQ35de now thats promising. I'd do that but thats going into my convertable. Go back to were you belong and quit wasting my time.

[240sxRAOR]

O.K so your willing to spend $3500 in bottom end parts and a crank with a 91mm stroke, not including a build from a shop for warrantee???AMS fullycounterweighted crank with 96mm (stock) stroke capable of using stock internals (rods and pistons) $1500....You do the math.........

Well I didn't know it cost that much, I just found it and looked at it for a few minutes. I thought it was a stroker kit but it looks more like a bore kit which I don't want. Thanks for pointing it out.

[redtop91]

There isn't a stroker on the planet that is under 3 grand. You should be glad about that price. My SR22 is going to cost almost five grand. Anyways most people that do NA KA's run ITB's from the GSX-R or get some custom fabbed. My Honda friends swear by TWM induction. http://www.twminduction.com/Th....html Set aside another 2 grand for the ITB's, if not more. Irregardless you'd better add a standalone to that list because you're not running ITB's without it.

[Bigvinnie]

FYI a KA24de is not worth a full motor build unless...

The half weighted crank is modified as the GT3 cranks are with use of a $700 dampener.

You buy a fully counterweighed crank that would accept the additional rev.

Or go with the Brian Crowers internal stroker kit.

BTW the Brian Crower kit is more than a bore kit it is as advertised, "a stroker kit".The reduced 91mm stroke reduces dwell time at TDC, raised piston dish heigth's compensate for compression ratio, not to mention on a KA block a bore won't be exceeding 92mm. After looking at the specifics of this kit it put's it's rod stroke ratio very similar if not almost identical to a FJ24 which made over 270Crank HP (it would be close to identical at a 2.5 litre displacement), and the KA gets increased cc's compared to the FJ. Not to mention since the dwell time has decreased it can utilize stock cams better with the enhanced rod/stroke ratio producing more POWER!!!!Personally I can't afford a brian crower kit so I'll just buy a fully counterweighed crank from AMS, and run a junkyard build off of that.

[240sxRAOR]

There isn't a stroker on the planet that is under 3 grand. You should be glad about that price. My SR22 is going to cost almost five grand. Anyways most people that do NA KA's run ITB's from the GSX-R or get some custom fabbed. My Honda friends swear by TWM induction. http://www.twminduction.com/Th....html Set aside another 2 grand for the ITB's, if not more. Irregardless you'd better add a standalone to that list because you're not running ITB's without it.

I would run ITB's but I have something better in mind and its a very unproven idea which I will release when I get the results.

[240sxRAOR]

[QUOTE=Bigvinnie]FYI a KA24de is not worth a full motor build unless...

The half weighted crank is modified as the GT3 cranks are with use of a $700 dampener.

You buy a fully counterweighed crank that would accept the additional rev.

Or go with the Brian Crowers internal stroker kit.[QUOTE]

Hey man I looked for the AMS fully counterweighted crank and couldn't find the one your talking about. I also did a bunch more research and I see what your saying. This is the reason I made this post because I knew there were some things I'd over look.

[Philsnotfalling]

not another gay all motor thread, look at ajax, what a looser. it doesn't matter if ur labor is free, parts alone will break the bank for what ur wanting to make power wise, I guess some people have money to waste.

[redtop91]

The thread is about making all motor suggestions. If you aren't making a suggestion then there is no reason for you to post in it.

[Bigvinnie]

Hey man I looked for the AMS fully counterweighted crank and couldn't find the one your talking about. I also did a bunch more research and I see what your saying. This is the reason I made this post because I knew there were some things I'd over look.

Talk to Chris at AMS he is the vendor at my forum at club 240. Due to the fact I respect Greg, I can't give out my entire forum address ( i cannot advertise my forum for sake of arguement). Chris is the sales rep at AMS is infact as he stated "making them" they are not advertised. But they are there and available. Please talk to Chris, my forums vendor.

[240sxRAOR]

thanks

[dickie]

here's a suggestion:

look into why its not a good idea to stroke the ka.

research the fully built ka motors that run on carbs and itb's that rebello builds.

fyi, there has not been a member yet to achieve a VERIFIED 200chp on an all-motor dohc build. the reasons behind that aren't mysterious or anything; a search will yield all the info youll need.

the reason why many members are jaded when it comes to people popping in and stating their na ka mission goals is because more often than not its more a result of "dont want to spend the money to boost" or "dont know enough about my car to boost it." a good na build will easily cost you much more than a fi setup able to put twice the power to the wheels. getting your motor to reach your goals without a power adder will require a lot more research and collaboration with other members too... they just dont seem to understand that and get very upset when they realize that.

before you look into making your own manifold, check out DJpantsspecR's thread regarding his product. why are you hesitant to do an itb setup? are you wanting to retain the MAFS for simplicity's sake?

some members who can provide you with a lot of the info you will need if you remain seriously attached to this method:

deviouskaDJPantsSpecRAjaxBigVinnie

[nismofly]

Talk to Chris at AMS he is the vendor at my forum at club 240. Due to the fact I respect Greg, I can't give out my entire forum address ( i cannot advertise my forum for sake of arguement). Chris is the sales rep at AMS is infact as he stated "making them" they are not advertised. But they are there and available. Please talk to Chris, my forums vendor.

hes the vendor here too

him and ivan both post all the time

[Shift_Kouki]

I can understand why people get upset at people who cut corners, in budget or elsewhere and become upset at reality... But why do we all of a sudden see bashing of all-motor KA talk in the all-motor KA section, in a thread that seemed rather mature, and helpful to the OP? Perhaps I missed something.

And... realising I am likley to get flammed for that, I'm gonna grab some and

[nismofly]

i moderate the suspension section, i dont hate people who cut corners here, i hate people who cut corners in my section, thinking its "all the same"

i heart all motor KA, anyone whos ever seen a nissan GT3 car run with a 10k rpm 280 rwhp NA KA will agree theyre ****ing nasty, they just dont make the power per dollar im looking for

[240sxRAOR]

before you look into making your own manifold, check out DJpantsspecR's thread regarding his product. why are you hesitant to do an itb setup? are you wanting to retain the MAFS for simplicity's sake?

Thanks for the advise. I have done alot of research but anyone can overlook something important, thats why I started this post. My reasons for going NA with this 240sx is because I don't need alot of horsepower for autocross. I am much more intrested in torque and am not trying to make a motor that revs past 9k which is why I don't mind keeping the stroke. I have seen ITBS and I like the concept but I like I said earlier I have a idea I do not wish to disclose to everyone and it definetly won't work with ITBS. One last reason I would like to make this 240sx NA is because I am intrested in circuit, autocross and drifting and as much as I like turbo and superchargers, I'd rather be an underdog with this 240sx. The KA24de is an underdog engine and alot of people think its crap, it makes me want to beat them with it and I think having less power in a circuit race can be more challenging.

[Bigvinnie]

hes the vendor here too

him and ivan both post all the time

I guess Ivan and Chris are running big time business. Ivan as far as I know never leaves a post. Chris leaves a few posts once a week. The fact that they are vendors at more than one forum means that they are deep into the after market performance business. Last I checked there website lists that they have shop locations through out the U.K, Europe, and the U.S. I think AMS has blown up BIG TIME.

[Bigvinnie]

I am much more intrested in torque and am not trying to make a motor that revs past 9k which is why I don't mind keeping the stroke.

What is missed here is that there are strokers that deliver up to a good 8500RPM redline for 4 banger engines. What people fail to comprehend is the difference between a fully counterweighted crank, and a half or what people call a partial crank. The harmonics and differences in similarities between the 2 are obvious, but to most builders that just look at the stroke can't compare the differences.

[2.240s]

I understand you bro, I just got done building a s13 sr20det ,s15 turbo , fmic,toda fly wheel ,etc..bell and whistles....This thing was fast as sh!!t great power band like a 2 stroke motorcycle, This thing is so great i am selling it and sticking with my KA s14 its something about the power curve of the KA that won me over, intake , hotshot header,pulleys,2.5 exhaust,ngk plugs,wires,coilovers,sitting on 17x9+15 and 17x10+25 this thing is a blast thru canyons and streets. If i just could squeeze 50 more horses it would have it all.