Hey telco - Here's your plane crash information

[wingFeather]

I bet she has more experience bearing children than BHO, too, but that doesn't make any of this any more relevant. I wanted to head off a misunderstanding, but don't misunderstand me that your "wife" tangent is not applicable at all.

I DO thank you for clearing up the misunderstanding, but IMHO it is relevant when a rival's wife is better suited for President than BHO (not to mention comical)

[Encryptshun]

I DO thank you for clearing up the misunderstanding, but IMHO it is relevant when a rival's wife is better suited for President than BHO (not to mention comical)

So knowing how to fly a plane somehow makes one more qualified to be President?

[wingFeather]

So knowing how to fly a plane somehow makes one more qualified to be President?

You could argue it both ways, but in case you missed it - the door was opened to link flight records with Presidential competency... and I brought up factual data that people may not have known. I didn't start a thread about it, so chill out

[The Wicker Man]

Edit by Mod: Personal attacks on other members is not acceptable. His username is his username ... please do not take issue with that.

[Encryptshun]

I was wondering when someone would notice the spelling of my username.

It's intentional. Encrypt - shun. It was a nickname given to me because I was a cyber-luddite who hated technology working for a technology company at the time. It stuck.

Thanks for playing. And thanks for letting me know I won the debate by resorting to making light of my name. (read Aristotle's "Topoi")

[szh]

I was wondering when someone would notice the spelling of my username.

Actually, it was not against you ... but not relevant anyway.

Let's move along ...

Z

[rn79870]

So knowing how to fly a plane somehow makes one more qualified to be President?

No, apparently someone's wife knowing how to fly a plane makes them more qualified. I don't understand it either.

[wingFeather]

I know that you're pretending not to comprehend it... because you cannot stand to admit that Obama has less experience at life in general than some wifey.

[Encryptshun]

I know that you're pretending not to comprehend it... because you cannot stand to admit that Obama has less experience at life in general than some wifey.

Okay, I know you directed this at Bob, but I'm gonna sound off anyway.

1) You don't get me excited enough that I need to "chill out" 2) I'd like to see this formula you have for assigning a composite score for life experience -- believe me, I'd like to send it to my mom to show her that living in Chicago *IS* better than living on a farm in Missouri.3) Comparing the experience of a wife of one of the candidates to the life experience of the candidate himself is really reaching. I mean, would you like to see a list of the things that Michelle Obama has done that John McCain hasn't? Probably not, right? Why? Because it has NO bearing on which would make a better President.4) If you want to debate John McCain with Barack Obama, then, sir, I look forward to what you have to say -- and we already have threads for those topics

This was about whether or not the rumor the John McCain crashed 4 or 5 planes during his time as a Naval aviator was true or false. It's false, that has been asserted and agreed-to.

[szh]

This was about whether or not the rumor the John McCain crashed 4 or 5 planes during his time as a Naval aviator was true or false. It's false, that has been asserted and agreed-to.

I agree ... time to lock this thread. Nothing more to be said that is on point.

Z

[rn79870]

Actually, it's not false. What is not established is whether he is at fault. And he clearly isn't at fault for all of them.

Here, from the Vietnam Vets Agains McCain site is the history.

McCain III lost jet number one in 1958 when he plunged into Corpus Christi Bay while practicing landings. He was knocked unconscious by the impact coming to as the plane settled to the bottom.

McCain's second crash occurred while he was deployed in the Mediterranean. "Flying too low over the Iberian Peninsula," Timberg wrote, "he took out some power lines [reminiscent of the 1998 incident in which a Marine Corps jet sliced through the cables of a gondola at an Italian ski resort, killing 20] which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral."

McCain's third crash three occurred when he was returning from flying a Navy trainer solo to Philadelphia for an Army-Navy football game.

Timberg reported that McCain radioed, "I've got a flameout" and went through standard relight procedures three times before ejecting at one thousand feet. McCain landed on a deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees.

McCain's fourth aircraft loss occurred July 29, 1967, soon after he was assigned to the USS Forrestal as an A-4 Skyhawk pilot. While seated in the cockpit of his aircraft waiting his turn for takeoff, an accidently fired rocket slammed into McCain's plane. He escaped from the burning aircraft, but the explosions that followed killed 134 sailors, destroyed at least 20 aircraft, and threatened to sink the ship.

McCain's fifth loss happened during his 23rd mission over North Vietnam on Oct. 26, 1967, when McCain's A-4 Skyhawk was shot down by a surface-to-air missile. McCain ejected from the plane breaking both arms and a leg in the process and subsequently parachuted into Truc Bach Lake near Hanoi.

[AZhitman]

Actually, it's not false.

Really?

So, now we're putting a clearly biased source up against a non-biased one?

Plane #1 - Sources seem to agree, engine failure blamed.

Plane #2 - Apparently didn't happen at all.

Those who claim McCain lost five planes – when they bother to give specific citations at all – point to an incident described in Timberg's book as happening on one of McCain's deployments to the Mediterranean between 1960 and 1964:

Timberg (p. 94) His professional growth, though reasonably steady, had its troubled moments. Flying low over the Iberian Peninsula, he took out some power lines, which led to a spate of newspaper stories in which he was predictably identified as the son of an admiral. The tale has gotten better with age. These days they talk about the day McCain turned the lights out in Spain.

But Timberg's book makes no mention of any plane being lost or of McCain bailing out. We called Timberg, just to be sure. "My clear recollection is that this plane did not crash," he told us. McCain's detractors should scratch that one off their list.

Plane #3 - Sources seem to agree, engine failure blamed.

Second crash, December 1965: By this time Lt. McCain was stationed at Meridian, Mississippi, and was newly married to his first wife, Carol. McCain had flown to Philadelphia to attend an Army-Navy football game with his parents and was bringing back Christmas presents for the family in the baggage compartment of his plane. His jet engine quit over the Chesapeake Bay.

McCain (p. 172): Somewhere between the Eastern Shore of Maryland and Norfolk, Virginia, as I was preparing to come in and refuel, my engine flamed out, and I had to eject at a thousand feet. The Christmas gifts were lost with my airplane. Biographer Timberg gives additional details: Timberg: (pp 95-96) [He] had just begun his descent over unpopulated tidal terrain when the engine died. "I've got a flame-out," he radioed. He went through the standard relight procedures three times. At one thousand feet, he ejected, landing on the deserted beach moments before the plane slammed into a clump of trees. ... The Navy classified it as a "routine ejection."

Plane #4 - Forrestal disaster. Sources seem to agree. Freak accident, huge tragedy.

Plane #5 - Shot down, pilot captured.

So, where's the issue? Why is this even being discussed?

Oh, I remember. Some Democrat thinks they're onto something that will create doubts among potential voters as to the man's judgment.... Fail.