hero

[RMiller]

Braveheart >> Gladiator >> Kill Bill >> Battlefield Earth >> Ballistic: Ecks vs. Sever >> Hero

Well, maybe it wasn't that bad. The colors were brilliant, and I liked the movie for that reason, but for that reason only.

[180fan]

The talents/abilities in the fight scenes are just way too far out there. Are they supposed to be able to fly? Or can they just jump really high and get lots of hang time? People in the theatre were laughing, especially at the part where Nameless and Broken Sword were fighting and dipping their swords in the water like french fries in ketchup over and over and over again, supposedly to keep them airborne.

It's part of the movie culture in alot of Chinese movies. It's pretty sad to see how people can be so ignorant of peoples cultures and then to disrepect them by thinking it funny or strange. A good example of this is Bobby Flay. Total flagrant disrepect to the respect that Japanese chef's have to the cutting board as it plays such an integral part of their profession, then to stand on it after getting his pity victory against Iron Chef Sakai. Then to go back and battle again, this time knowing that it's very disrepectful to stand on the cutting board, only to toss it aside when he gets his victory that shouldn't have been his but was setup for the big push for Iron Chef America. What a jerk.

[Sopdadope]

I don't see why you guys liked it so much. Maybe if I was Asian I would appreciate it more for it's historical significance (however true that may be, I have no idea). The best aspect and the only thing I liked about the movie was the use of colors, which was amazing. Everything else was, well, blah. I almost fell asleep.

The talents/abilities in the fight scenes are just way too far out there. Are they supposed to be able to fly? Or can they just jump really high and get lots of hang time? People in the theatre were laughing, especially at the part where Nameless and Broken Sword were fighting and dipping their swords in the water like french fries in ketchup over and over and over again, supposedly to keep them airborne.

I'd have to say that many of the Eastern concepts, symbolism and ideas prevalent will not resonate with American audiences as they would with someone of/familiar with Asian culture.

Judging from your post, I'll assume you're neither.

For starters, Hero is an example of a "Wuxia Pien" film genre which include films like Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, Peking Opera Blues, Bride with White Hair and other classics. Wuxia Pien is a narrative genre that draws heavily from Chinese mythology and the more esoteric aspects of martial arts and thus comparable to Greek, Roman mythology. Wuxia films are derivative of their stage ancestors, where they were thematically dramatized in Chinese opera's with perfomers employing martial arts and performing acrobatics on-stage. These stories are China's superhero tales and I find it ironic how Americans would lampoon this movie yet a movie with a guy in spider suit, soaring through the NY skyline is one of the biggest box office smashes ever. Suspension of disbelief people!

Hero isn't without its flaws, but there's a lot to like/respect/admire. The magnitude of the actors in this film will probably be lost on those unfamiliar with Asian cinema. In the States, Jet Li is just another chopsocky Chinese guy relegated to the hip-hop heavy B-movies. But in Asia, this man's regarded as a living-legend and rightfully so, a martial arts champion in real life he's starred in some of the greatest martial arts films of our era - the immortal Once Upon a Time in China series, Shaolin Temple, Fist of Legend (which is a superior remake of Bruce Lee's Chinese Connection), etc. And the significance of of the Nameless/Sky (Jet Li/Donnie Yen) fight is that it's a reprisal of their legendary battle in Once Upon a Time in China II which some consider one of the greatest onscreen fights, ever. This is something on the scale of a John Wayne/Clint Eastwood gunfight.

And again, the cinematography was brilliant. There's the effective use of colors and chromatic shifts in rendering the characters emotional/psychological states. The colors themselves themselves bear great significance to anyone familiar with chromatic symbolism of fuedal China. The culmination of dazzling cinematography, the fluidity of the choreography and effortless performances by the actors results in IMO a beautiful, operatic ballet of blades, a moving painting if you will.

Hero's rife with postmodernist nods to classic films of the Wuxia genre (Dragonn Inn, Ashes of Time, Swordsmen) as well as the works of Akira Kurosawa (the arrows sequence was a nice nod to Ran, the suggestion that the nature of truth is something less than an absolute echoes Rashomon) to the classic Westerns of John Ford and Sergio Leone. Also love the slick editing - the story unfolding in non-linear, flashback sequences.

Americans gut the watered down 90-minute version while most in Asia have seen the superior 120-minute director's cut.

Regardless, one need not be a dyed-in-the-wool cinephile to appreciate this film, it flat out kicks ***. Glad I saw both Hero and Collateral in theatres this summer since they're probably two of the artsiest movies to hit American theatres in a looong time.

[Sopdadope]

Braveheart >> Gladiator >> Kill Bill >> Battlefield Earth >> Ballistic: Ecks vs. Sever >> Hero

Well, maybe it wasn't that bad. The colors were brilliant, and I liked the movie for that reason, but for that reason only.

With the possible exception of Kill Bill, none of those films deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Hero. If you actually think Battlefield Earth and Ballistic is better than Hero, you're either a heretic or you need professional help.

[w1ngzer0]

[quote=" Sircnay Hero is ridiculously good. I remember seeing it 2 years ago (A perk for being asian, we get all the movies you see 2-3 years before you folks do.). It's artistic fighting scenes are to freaking DIE for. It's at times like an opium induced dream where you want to just immerse yourself in the colors and in the end you wind up with withdrawls wanting more. (joke: get it? opium... chinese people... hehehe.) [/quote]

wow, so that meens you saw "The wizard of Oz" staring judie garland before we did? man... i wish i was asian. :rolleyes

[RMiller]

With the possible exception of Kill Bill, none of those films deserve to be mentioned in the same sentence as Hero. If you actually think Battlefield Earth and Ballistic is better than Hero, you're either a heretic or you need professional help.

I meant to list the worst movies I've ever seen, but I was exaggerating. Ballistic is the worst movie I've ever seen, followed by Battlefield Earth. Kill Bill sucks also, but I don't know exactly where to rank it. Well, none of the people I saw it with liked it, and people in the theatre were laughing. And about not respecting Chinese culture, give me a break. I don't like unrealistic aerial stunts, unless there's some kind of explanation, e.g. The Matrix. How do they fly in Hero? There's nothing disrespectful about choosing what I like or not.

Not everyone likes Mr. Bean but it's not like those who don't lack respect for the British. They just don't like British humor, which I might add is at least as much part of British culture as crazy floating martial arts is part of Chinese culture.

Don't preach to me about disrespect, because everyone does it. Most of the people on here would bash Nascar any day, including me, so are you disrespecting American culture? Sheesh.

[prigo]

Hero owned, but the original ending is better.

[jdmfreak]

Damn I havent seen it yet, but why does all the stuff overseas come to the US with so many alterations?

[prigo]

Because the US sucks.

[jdmfreak]

Yes it does. We get jipped every time.

Cars, movies, and cool dancing robots. Whats next?

[Sircnay]

Quote »wow, so that meens you saw "The wizard of Oz" staring judie garland before we did? man... i wish i was asian. [/quote]Who DOESN'T wish they weren't asian?

[Sircnay]

Oh and the US gets jipped because 80 percent of the people are ADD jerkheads who can't sit for more than 90 minutes at a time with people who don't speak english.

[jdmfreak]

Me. But I do wish I had a residency there. Id buy so many cars.

[Phax]

This thread r0x! 42 posts already. :ylsuper

longrunQ asked about the period of Chinese history in which the movie takes place, and for some sources on it. The period of time is referred to as the Warring States period. Basically as the movie says, there were a bunch of states all at war with each other. During that period of time, much of the Chinese culture and philosophy was cultivated and codified. If you've heard of Sun Tzu and the Art of Warfare, that was being compiled around that time. I've read Lao Tzu's, Te-Tao Ching and I believe that work was also compiled around that period of time. Also another great book which although not solely about the period, is the 48 Laws of Power. The author takes some examples from the period as well.

I agree with some of the people who thought the style of the movie was a bit over the top. I'm not a big fan of wire work. I prefer the old school Bruce Lee - Fists of Fury, Jackie Chan - Drunken Master, just straight up brawling kung fu. I commented on the wire working being a little over the top at a screening of the movie, a lot of people looked at me like I was a moron. The woman there with me was nice enough to condescendingly explain to me, "It's a STYLE of film making..." Well, you know what? Old Skool Fu Style > Floating around fu

That being said, Hero was trying to portray the intense physical abilities possessed by some of the warriors of that age. The Warring States period was a period in time when the numerous styles of kung fu were developed, and held closely as state secrets. A style getting out to an enemy state was as bad as nuclear weapons reaching 'terrorists' these days. The movie was a bit exadurated <sp?> with the super high jumps, and the 2 people killing 3000 guards. Yet, there are tales of people who could regularly fight through groups of 20-30 people that though might be still slightly inflated, aren't too far from the reality of it.

I've seen good examples of Jet Li kung fu. Hero wasn't one of them. Don't get me wrong, he's a bad *** and he has great weapons forms. I just prefer the older, non-wire style.

I liked the mental kung fu of the movie, where the king and Jet Li are going back and forth over the story, each convincing the other of their claim to the legitimacy of it.

[UncleBen]

I really want to see Hero, I didn't read all of this thread for fear of someone giving it away. From what I *have* read, I want to see it even more than I did.

[Sopdadope]

I meant to list the worst movies I've ever seen, but I was exaggerating. Ballistic is the worst movie I've ever seen, followed by Battlefield Earth. Kill Bill sucks also, but I don't know exactly where to rank it. Well, none of the people I saw it with liked it, and people in the theatre were laughing. And about not respecting Chinese culture, give me a break. I don't like unrealistic aerial stunts, unless there's some kind of explanation, e.g. The Matrix. How do they fly in Hero? There's nothing disrespectful about choosing what I like or not.

Not everyone likes Mr. Bean but it's not like those who don't lack respect for the British. They just don't like British humor, which I might add is at least as much part of British culture as crazy floating martial arts is part of Chinese culture.

Don't preach to me about disrespect, because everyone does it. Most of the people on here would bash Nascar any day, including me, so are you disrespecting American culture? Sheesh.

LOL This is funny. You ask questions about why they have supernatural abilities and why other appreciate the movie as much as they do. And when someone actually takes the time to offer reasons why and writes up a defense of these sort of movies, you get defensive?

Point out exactly where I accused you of being disrespectful to Chinese culture? Over-the-top fights scenes or not, there's a lot to like about it, but if you can't overlook the wire-work, oh well. No worries here, you're entitled to your opinion so I'm not gonna knock heads with you on that or lose any sleep over the opinions of some joe schmoe behind a keyboard.

[Jesda]

.........I like Zoolander.

[krazy skwerel]

I reallyy enjoyed the movie. I want to see this longer version though.

[cys19]

I'm Chinese so I know about this kinda stuff: That fighting scene at the lake, I don't remember exactly cuz I saw it like...some years ago, but anyway, it took them forever to shoot that scene cuz the water is still only during a certain hour of the day.

Edit: Which means if someone messed up, like if someone accidently spit in the water and made ripples, they'd have to wait till maybe the next day or the day after that or whenever the water is perfectly still to retake that scene. Yeah I had to clarify what I typed above.
Modified by cys19 at 10:00 PM 9/1/2004

[MainEvent212]

Oh and the US gets jipped because 80 percent of the people are ADD jerkheads who can't sit for more than 90 minutes at a time with people who don't speak english.

being that i have ADD i seriously resent that comment. i in fact can very well sit for more hten 90 minutes when my attention is in fact captured by something interesting. Whether or not you think it's funny to make comments like that, it is a serious issue to some people, myself included and it's somethign i struggle with every day of my life.

[Sircnay]

^no offense intended. I deal with bipolarism everyday and I don't get mad when someon jokes about it...

NOW WHERE'S MY MEDS DAMN IT!?

Seriously. I am bipolar I'm not making fun of you. If you're offended I'm sorry. But I dunno, if you learn to laugh at it, it makes it 10x easier to deal with trust me.

[I30T]

yeah, dont read this if you haven't seen it\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

i thought there was another ending.. the trailer had the scene with the arrows in the wall but with jet li standing there.

should i just obtain the chinese version to see it?

[jdmfreak]

Maybe they'll put it on DVD with both the US and Chinese versions?

[senioritis]

w00t w00t! movie was awesome!! too bad it took so long to finally get to the big screens.

[w1ngzer0]

yes, im bringing up a old topic becuase i saw the movie today. it was a cool movie. I always liked chinese movies.

I like the fairy tail or whatever its called. Just like journey to the west; thats an awsome series.

Sometimes i wish i was chinese or any other race to really understand the culture,history,pation and love for their country. Being white you feel lost being a cultureless.

I have heavy hispanic and german background. But that doesn't matter becuase your so mixed you are just another white face in the world.

[l2andom]

I didn't really like the movie much. And I'm asian, so yeah I saw it a year or so back lol. But I didn't think it was that great.. I liked other jet li movies a lot more.

[w1ngzer0]

I didn't really like the movie much. And I'm asian, so yeah I saw it a year or so back lol. But I didn't think it was that great.. I liked other jet li movies a lot more.

*shrug* has nothing to do with being asian black white whatever. If you didn't like its because "you" didn't like it

I was just saying all that as a realization for me

[TrunkMonkey]

i'm a big fan of martial arts movies, but imo, hero sucked.

-demetrius

[MinisterofDOOM]

I just got back from seeing Hero about 20 minutes ago. First thing I do, as always, is log into to NICO. And there is a thread about Hero. Kool!!

Hero was great. Excellent storytelling. Great swordfights. Incredible cinematography. The symbolosm in the film was really, really deep. Everything from the characters' names to the color of the dirt and leaves held some sort of symbolism. And best of all, it had none of that senseless dribble that is spoken english!!!

[w1ngzer0]

glade you liked it too. lol.... know what i was thinking through the whole movie?2 things....

i wonder how my fencing still is.and damn Ziyi Zhang is looking fine as always.

also the hero website was hacked also ....http://www.pix8.net/pro/pic/741JzD2S/113307.jpg

this picture was found all over the place

very slow loading even for DSL/cable due to the fact there are 6 pictures and they are 1.4mb each............