Group buy for Espilir Lowering Springs for G50s?

[maxnix]

No specification data yet?

[qship96]

No specification data yet?

I remember an old post by Wes with the spring rates listed{they were super high} and Qtech following up with a post saying they were way too stiff for the Q-search and repost if you find it.

Modified by qship96 at 2:39 PM 1/29/2008
Modified by qship96 at 3:00 PM 1/29/2008

[elwesso]

I just dont know if the specs are right, because according to my friend they work great with the tokico shocks... Remember we never really had data on eibachs or cali-customs and we know those work great. I think that the espilir's are probably better quality engineering and design than the eibachs or cali customs, IMO

Let me say that this guy has had lowered cars before, and he said its not stiff or harsh at all..

As hard as it is for anyone like Q45tech to want to run numbers, sometimes the numbers dont mean anything until you try it... IMO, if you're worried about crunching numbers you probably shouldnt buy them... The bottom line is the ROAD TEST REVIEW I received is **Very** positive. Take that with whatever grain of salt you wish.

BTW on the spring rates, I seem to recall the units being iffy... It was all in metric of course and I believe it only listed KG or N.. Which of course we all know the proper unit for a spring is Force/Distance.. I seem to recall that if you calculated them in N/mm they were way off, but N/cm was pretty close to an accepted value, converted to LBf/in

[qship96]

I found the old thread on these springs and bumped it up-

zerothread/279168

[elwesso]

thank you sir.

[maxnix]

Remember we never really had data on eibachs ...

I believe Dennis has posted that data a couple of times.

[maxnix]

....according to my friend they work great with the tokico shocks...

Obviously we need to get a cross section of NICO owners to go drive this car to subjectively evaluate it accurately.

Is "friend" not a NICO member? Does he live in a currently snow free state?

[Haitian_King]

Random question.

How easy are these springs to install? I take it the tire must come off? Anyone with pictures/write-up of spring replacement/install?

[elwesso]

honestly for most people i recommend taking it to a suspension shop, but I dont like using spring compressors..

Actually, that might be kind of a fun challenge to do a strut R/R without taking the wheel off.

[mxr662]

Like Wes, I too have always been afraid of the spring compressor. But not wanting to deal with trying to find a place to do the work on my car, and the fact that last years Q repairs have drained my bank account, I did it my self.

Local discount auto parts store had a spring compressor to lend for 40 dollar deposit.

1. Put front of car on jack stands. (securely)2. Remove front wheels.3. Place something under lower control arm as it will drop when shock is removed4. Remove 1 nut that attaches shock to the third link5. Remove the 2 nuts from the top of strut. (under hood) Not the middle one.6. Remove shock and spring as an assembly7. Note the orientation of the spring. 8. Compress spring.9. Remove middle nut from top when the top feels loose due to spring being compressed.10 Remove spring and uncompress.

Reassemble in opposite order.

This was way easier than the chain guides or the under plenum stuff.

[Haitian_King]

These springs only go in the front? Or are there 4 springs? For the $385 or whatever, do you get 2 springs or 4?

[elwesso]

set of 4..

[Haitian_King]

Ok. Thanks. I'm sure that my question sounded a little stupid, but I was confused because I'd only seen 2 springs in the pictures.

[Q45tech]

It is critical that the relative stiffness ratio of front to rear springs match the body weight ratio front rear............then the amount of excess on the front creates the understeer ratio.

On stock Q springs 146/123= 1.187 while the weight ratio is 54/46 = 1.174Perfectly NEUTRAL [+- 1.3%] springs so the front sway bar is all that creates understeer and that is muted in the first 1 inch of body roll by the sway bar rubber bushings.

What one wants is progressive increases in understeer as the body rolls [trys to roll] more and more.

Another more complicated spring parameter is the body pitch frequency and tuned speed which involves the wheelbase distance vs speed.MUST READS:http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_108167/a ... ticle.html

[Q45tech]

Many don't contemplate that the front seats are at the center of gravity, so driver or a passenger doesn't affect the fore/aft weight balance ratio, just the side to side balnce - why a car handles better turning in one direction vs the other.Even gas tank is over rear springs and rear passengers are inside rear springs towards C of G.

Only trunk weight varies the rear polar moment of interia [weight OUTSIDE the rear springs].................oversteering heaven in more ways than one!GET THE SPRING RATIO RIGHT and the rest is easy!

[one ton garage]

Can you please tell everyone EXACTLY what ways any of that will be a negative impact on their daily driving? In what ways EXACTLY will it be detrimental and unlivable with the sort of driving 99% of the Q owners will be doing 99% of the time?

[qship96]

The Espilir springs are almost DOUBLE the stiffness of the factory springs, ride will deteriorate tremendously over bumps or uneven pavement, extra shock transmitted to structure of vehicle will accelerate squeaks/rattles/destruction of every electronic module, shocks will not be able to handle the increased workload,wheels and tires will be subject to increased risk of damage/failure.....the list goes on and on....but it will look good without all that wheel gap.

[Haitian_King]

The Espilir springs are almost DOUBLE the stiffness of the factory springs, ride will deteriorate tremendously over bumps or uneven pavement, extra shock transmitted to structure of vehicle will accelerate squeaks/rattles/destruction of every electronic module, shocks will not be able to handle the increased workload,wheels and tires will be subject to increased risk of damage/failure.....the list goes on and on....but it will look good without all that wheel gap.

Wow. Gee whiz. Something that bad should have a warning label.

Would getting better shocks help?

[qship96]

Nobody has found anything better than the Tokikos for the 90-96q-maybe some company in japan makes something to fit our cars,but we have been unable to find anything.

[Haitian_King]

So the Tokiko blues still aren't the best thing to resist damage from the Espilir springs?

[maxnix]

....but it will look good without all that wheel gap.

Do you mean that variable gap between the wheel and the fender opening that I can't see while I am driving on real world roads?

Gosh, I just don't know how to cope with that! What to do?

I do so want to look kewl.

[ddrumman]

[newtoQ]

I don't care about the diminished ride quality that much. My Q is mostly my wife's grocery getter, I just tell her thats the way its supposed to ride.

[Haitian_King]

I don't care about the diminished ride quality that much. My Q is mostly my wife's grocery getter, I just tell her thats the way its supposed to ride.

*Gasp*

You just opened the door to the canned comment "Member's standards vary". While seemingly innocent, when I see it posted, it makes me feel that the oster is insulting or belittling your devotion to your Q.

I think I'll be able to make my decision about the springs after driving/riding in one and comparing it to the stock ride. I really haven't had anything to complain about in regards to handling performance in my Q. I've taken some turns at speeds of 60+ MPH and I barely feel it. And I'm fairly certain that my suspension isn't close to high-performance. I'm at 90.8k miles now on what I believe are stock springs and shocks. If the mileage hasn't diminished the performance, I'm sure the years have. After the drivetrain and such are in perfect condition, I'll focus on suspension and body. I'm thinking about getting some tires for the rear as well. They're low on tread but I don't want to just buy 2 new tires now when I plan on getting larger wheels/tires when the warmer weather comes. Would it be best to just get 2 used ones with 70%+ tread left to hold me over for the next couple of months? I'm thinking that the obvious answer is yes, but I've been wrong before and I'd like to get the opinions of the experts.

[qship96]

I don't care about the diminished ride quality that much. My Q is mostly my wife's grocery getter, I just tell her thats the way its supposed to ride.

She may enjoy it,as it will then handle bumps about the same as the grocery cart!

Just think,you could tell her the Q is a limited edition grocery cart model!

[maxnix]

Damn, that dreaded static fender gap again!

Does the President know about this? How about Cheney?

[DoinkMobb]

While some of you think the stiffness of XYZ suspension components would be unbearable, others may deem the ride tolerable or even enjoyable. My Q rocks and rolls like a damn cruise ship, so something stiffer than the stock (and decidely beat) struts/springs would be a welcome replacement.

I used to drive a completely stock 2006 STI and people on ye olde Subaru forums used to complain that it was too stiff for daily use. Kidney killer? I think not, I thought the ride was near perfect for a daily driver.

I don't want the Q to feel like Grandpa's Caddy, ultraplush luxobarges actually make me feel kinda carsick...and less fender gap would be an added bonus, but not a reason to get lower, stiffer springs.

[ddrumman]

Does the President know about this? How about Cheney?

Those guys have so much $$$$$ from the last two turns, that they can just go out and buy fleets of McClarens, Bugattis, and SLRs and not have to worry about that dreaded gap