Got pulled over. Cop gave me some advice.

[Bubba1]

Then the cop says to me, "What you should do in that situation is wait in the middle of the intersection for an opportunity to turn, or wait for the light to change and turn when the cars stop." I thought to myself, then I'd still be running the red since the yellow lasted all of the blink of an eye. I say out loud that I've always been taught to never enter an intersection unless you can see that you can leave it quickly and safely.

I've always thought I'm a pretty attentive and logical driver, and it really irks me when people sit their fat asses in the middle of the intersection waiting to turn. It irks me further to hear a cop supporting this behavior. What do you guys think?

tl;dr "Ran" a red light, cop says I should sit in the middle of the intersection waiting to turn rather than staying in the turning lane watching for the opportunity.

In PA, I believe the officer is correct, as long as you're in the intersection under green or yellow. It's similar to driving straight thru a traffic light, if you enter it under green/ yellow, you are legal even if it turns red before you leave the intersection.

I believe it's the same in NJ, but in NJ, you're dealing with aggressive, time-obsessive fellow drivers. So if you don't move to the middle of the intersection under green/yellow tomake a left turn, the drivers behind you are gonna honk, curse, and flip you the bird for being a weenie and preventing them from making that light. And if you don't make the turn instntly when you see a one car length gap in oncoming traffic, well, those behind you are gonna honk, curse, and flip you the bird for being a wuss also causing them to miss the light. And, of course, if you crowd the interesection a bit to oncoming traffic before turning, oncoming traffic is going to honk, curse, and flip you the bird for your intruding on their "space". There are also even angrier people (like Oatmealman above, in fact) that will attempt to punish your intrusion themselves by driving thisclose to your front bumper to show you that you were in their precious "space".Of course, that's in addition to honking, cursing, and flipping you the bird. Kinda silly. Sky is right that you have to drive accordingly to the area you're in. In the northeast, you must be more assertive.

<NJ Native

[DJ_B_Easy]

Bubba just hit the nail on the head...*honk* you bastard!*bird*

[Ajax]

Here in Minneapolis, people tend to push the red light when coming through, thereby making it impossible to turn left without an arrow unless you're prepped and ready to go. (I'm sure its similar in other cities) If I'm 2nd in line to turn, I will not pull into the middle unless I see that I'll be able to make it through; but if I'm 1st, I will pull forward (unless the road I'm turning onto would not have room for me). We also have quite a few dedicated turn arrows as well, because MN doesn't really trust its drivers (rightfully so- most people forget how to drive in snow every year in April and October)

[Dattebayo]

You know, I used to get really angry at the way people drive around here, and I've been around most of the east-coast cities and dealt with crazy driving of almost all types.

Something as silly as someone waiting in the middle of the road to turn isn't a big deal when you consider those who run lights and stop signs outright, people who crowd and deliberately ram those who are in the way; the folks who think it's their right to own the road rather than share it with everyone else who drives on it.

Whatever these people do, you can't control it. So give up already, it's not like it helps anything when you act like an As$ too...

[s0m3th1ngAZ]

The cop is wrong.


In Creve Coeur MO, they use a blinking yellow to indicate a left turn yield, and when that flashing yellow light turns red ONCOMING TRAFFIC IS STILL GREEN and if you use that as an opportunity to make a left, you will get t-boned and you will be 100% at fault.

That's what I am mainly worried about. That's exactly how it is here in WA/OR. That and blocking the intersection on busy streets, which happens a lot here and causes many a raised finger.

[Loki]

Here in Minneapolis, people tend to push the red light when coming through, thereby making it impossible to turn left without an arrow unless you're prepped and ready to go. (I'm sure its similar in other cities) If I'm 2nd in line to turn, I will not pull into the middle unless I see that I'll be able to make it through; but if I'm 1st, I will pull forward (unless the road I'm turning onto would not have room for me). We also have quite a few dedicated turn arrows as well, because MN doesn't really trust its drivers (rightfully so- most people forget how to drive in snow every year in April and October)

That is how it is here. I've seen MANY people just slowly breeze through red lights that changed easily 2-3 seconds before they even GOT to the intersection. It's also very difficult to judge who is going to push the light or stop, since most people either do push it, or slam on the brakes at the last moment.

Bubba -> I've heard stories from people in this are that have gotten pulled over for "running" a red light because they entered the intersection under yellow, and the red appeared while they were about halfway through.

I've noticed the lights around here are very, very inconsistent. One intersection takes approximately 6 seconds to shift east-west traffic to green after shifting the north-south traffic to red. That means there is about 6 second when all lights read red. On the opposite end, when the east-west shifts to red, the north-south lights turn green within a split second of the change, which is very hazardous considering the amount of people who breeze through lights. Also, I've noticed several lights where the yellow is on for less than a second and really doesn't give you fair enough warning to stop safely. I have never understood the inconsistencies.

[frapjap]

Then the cop says to me, "What you should do in that situation is wait in the middle of the intersection for an opportunity to turn, or wait for the light to change and turn when the cars stop." I thought to myself, then I'd still be running the red since the yellow lasted all of the blink of an eye. I say out loud that I've always been taught to never enter an intersection unless you can see that you can leave it quickly and safely.

I've always thought I'm a pretty attentive and logical driver, and it really irks me when people sit their fat asses in the middle of the intersection waiting to turn. It irks me further to hear a cop supporting this behavior. What do you guys think?

tl;dr "Ran" a red light, cop says I should sit in the middle of the intersection waiting to turn rather than staying in the turning lane watching for the opportunity.

In PA, I believe the officer is correct, as long as you're in the intersection under green or yellow. It's similar to driving straight thru a traffic light, if you enter it under green/ yellow, you are legal even if it turns red before you leave the intersection.

I believe it's the same in NJ, but in NJ, you're dealing with aggressive, time-obsessive fellow drivers. So if you don't move to the middle of the intersection under green/yellow tomake a left turn, the drivers behind you are gonna honk, curse, and flip you the bird for being a weenie and preventing them from making that light. And if you don't make the turn instntly when you see a one car length gap in oncoming traffic, well, those behind you are gonna honk, curse, and flip you the bird for being a wuss also causing them to miss the light. And, of course, if you crowd the interesection a bit to oncoming traffic before turning, oncoming traffic is going to honk, curse, and flip you the bird for your intruding on their "space". There are also even angrier people (like Oatmealman above, in fact) that will attempt to punish your intrusion themselves by driving thisclose to your front bumper to show you that you were in their precious "space".Of course, that's in addition to honking, cursing, and flipping you the bird. Kinda silly. Sky is right that you have to drive accordingly to the area you're in. In the northeast, you must be more assertive.

<NJ Native

What about red light cameras? Are you guys not worried about being pinched by one of those because of your illegal-ish left?

[DJ_B_Easy]

If you entered the intersection when the light is yellow, then you should receive a ticket. Yellow means stop, unless you cannot do so safely.

[alms24sebring]

The Michigan Left is so far my favorite:

The thing that pisses me of is that people still turn left!! People that turn left when there is clearly a no turn left sign deserve to die. It happens all the time here and cause so much congestion.

One of the greatest invetions is the middle lane where you can turn left from either direction of traffic. It saves alot of grief and stoplights.

[Dattebayo]

One of the greatest invetions is the middle lane where you can turn left from either direction of traffic. It saves alot of grief and stoplights.

In Philly, people use those for parking. Legally.

[Oatmealman]

I love to about take the front end off of cars in the jeep of cars that do that crap.afaik being in the intersection waiting for a turn is illegal in Colorado so i'' get within a couple inches of ripping some ones front end off,and the "holyshitwtfbbq" look i see on their face is priceless as a massive jeep about takes them out.

It must feel good to be so righteous that you'd endanger others for the sake of being right.

It's illegal here and i'll do what the f*** i want.i still have yet to get close enough to worry myself.and damn straight.I do that kind of s*** to everyone.If you wanna do illegal s*** do it away from me and we won't have a problem dumbass.

[Dattebayo]

You're under the assumption that what you're doing isn't endangerment tho, which would be incorrect. You would get a ticket for your brand of tomfoolery faster than someone just being in the intersection.

[Oatmealman]

you're right i could,but im willing to risk that to make someone s*** their pants and realize what they are doing is endangerment as well.

[Dattebayo]

That's just silly. Your vindictiveness is totally unfounded.

All they are doing is waiting to turn, you're the one careening toward them because they invaded your sovereign space. You don't even know how they will react to your encroachment. You launching off the line is going to cause a bad accident one time and they'll be the ones to suffer bodily harm, not you. You'll enjoy the fruits of a lengthy lawsuit and jailtime because of driving like a fool when that happens.

[Oatmealman]

lollerskates.They would be in the wrong because what they are doing is ILLEGAL and I never go out of my way to get close to them.If they have their nose in my lane I will get close.I'll enjoy that lawsuit because i'll win no problem.

[Dattebayo]

I never go out of my way to get close to them.

I love to about take the front end off of cars in the jeep of cars that do that crap.afaik being in the intersection waiting for a turn is illegal in Colorado so i'' get within a couple inches of ripping some ones front end off,and the "holyshitwtfbbq" look i see on their face is priceless as a massive jeep about takes them out.

[MinisterofDOOM]

I park my big ol' sedan a** out in the intersection. This is for a couple of reasons:

1: It's a left turn, not a right turn. I'm not turning into the nearest lanes. I'm turning into the far lanes. Depending on the road that could be a good deal farther ahead than the stop line or crosswalk. Starting in the intersection means the turn takes less time and the opening needed is smaller.

2: That's what is taught here in drivers' ed. Pull forward a reasonable amount and wait for traffic. Traffic REMAINING in the intersection after a red has the right-of-way and cross-traffic is legally supposed to wait for the intersection to CLEAR before proceeding. That green doesn't mean floor it, it means go if things are clear. If I didn't get a chance to turn, you wait. If you didn't get a chance to turn, I wait. Traffic ALREADY in the intersection when the light turns red is not running a red, and is actually SUPPOSED to continue through, clearing the intersection. You get occasional morons who pull forward to turn and then panic when the red comes and they haven't turned yet who simply stop in the middle of the damn intersection and expect cross-traffic to just work around them. Lots of particularly busy intersections have signs saying "DO NOT BLOCK INTERSECTION" which most idiots misinterpret to mean "don't pull forward to turn left" when it really means "get the hell out of the way when your light turns red."

The Michigan Left is so far my favorite:


Its possible though that my enjoyment of this left turn is because half of Detroit got shot and died, significantly reducing traffic congestion.

[/quote]

I don't like the way that design requires traffic to immediately cross to the far lane. It's a bad habit to develop in your average inattentive driver, especially when it's a change to the left, where there's a nice big blindspot ready to cause accidents. It also means you need openings in BOTH lanes rather than just one in order to make your left turn. The roads I live on would simply not work with that setup. Traffic is too consistently heavy. You'd end up stuck going straight, or circling around waiting for an opening. It also requires a lot of extra space. Lots of downsides for very little real benefit. Well-timed lights with protected turn arrows work best. You spend more time waiting at the light but less time waiting for traffic to open once the light's in your favor. You end up getting a lot more cars through the intersection at once. Combine that with a double turn lane (since there's no opposing- or cross-traffic to worry about and right turns do NOT have right-of-way against the protected left) and you're moving a lot of cars quickly with no dependency on merging through traffic.

The thing that really pisses me off is people who make right turns on red against protected left turns. If opposing traffic is turning left but you have a red light, CLEARLY they have a protected turn arrow. The right-of-way is theirs. Do NOT try to seize an opening, don't try to beat them through the light, don't try to "make it fit." WAIT. This happens to me frequently on freeway onramps. I'll get a nice left-turn arrow and start to turn. Then some douche woman in her husband's diesel F250 which does 0-60 in about 3 hours makes a last-second right turn and I'm stuck waiting behind her as she ambles her way on up to a sub-65mph merge. It's not your light. GTFO. I don't pull that s*** when I'm the one making a right turn. I expect the same courtesy from other drivers. Though it's worth noting that if I WERE to do that, I'd FIND MY GORRAM THROTTLE and make sure I'm not in the way. But I don't do that, so I don't have to worry about the latter part.

[ADDirishboy]

The thing that really pisses me off is people who make right turns on red against protected left turns. If opposing traffic is turning left but you have a red light, CLEARLY they have a protected turn arrow.

Actually, that's not true in a lot of places. Even if you have a green left arrow, you're still responsible to yield to those turning right. A lot of times there will be fault placed on both parties though. A big factor in that is which lane you turn into also. If you're turning onto a 3 lane road, you should both be able to turn if you each turn into the closest lane.

[Oatmealman]

are you retarded datte? it never said anywhere in that post i GO OUT OF MY WAY.If they have a nose stuck in my lane i won't move and it will be their fault.You never swerve in a lifted truck,just hit what your gonna hit and let it be.

[ADDirishboy]

are you retarded datte? it never said anywhere in that post i GO OUT OF MY WAY.If they have a nose stuck in my lane i won't move and it will be their fault.You never swerve in a lifted truck,just hit what your gonna hit and let it be.

And then be partially at fault. Smart.

[Oatmealman]

meh,don't get in my way.Most people don't so I don't have a problem.

[Bubba1]

What about red light cameras? Are you guys not worried about being pinched by one of those because of your illegal-ish left?

Good question, but no, I'm not worried as long as my car entered the intersection
before it turned red. I've done that a few times on red camera light intersections. I have yet to get a ticket.

[Jesda]

The thing that really pisses me off is people who make right turns on red against protected left turns. If opposing traffic is turning left but you have a red light, CLEARLY they have a protected turn arrow.

Actually, that's not true in a lot of places. Even if you have a green left arrow, you're still responsible to yield to those turning right. A lot of times there will be fault placed on both parties though. A big factor in that is which lane you turn into also. If you're turning onto a 3 lane road, you should both be able to turn if you each turn into the closest lane.

Ahh yes, another rule lacking consistency! Always worries me when I'm driving in a new town, which is often.

[MinisterofDOOM]

What about red light cameras? Are you guys not worried about being pinched by one of those because of your illegal-ish left?

Red light cameras are not legal in Utah, so that's not an issue for me most of the time.

[s0m3th1ngAZ]

meh,don't get in my way.Most people don't so I don't have a problem.

You are hardcore bro. Life gives you lemons... scream, yell, and threaten to kick the asses of the people who sold you the damn lemons.
Wait...didn't you used to go under a different screen-name?
Also...red light cameras only trigger if you pass a certain point when the light hits red...like the white lines. At least here in Oregon they do.

[Bubba1]

What about red light cameras? Are you guys not worried about being pinched by one of those because of your illegal-ish left?

Red light cameras are not legal in Utah, so that's not an issue for me most of the time.

Unfortunately they are actively being used at some of the busiest intersections in Philadelphia.

[Loki]

The thing that really pisses me off is people who make right turns on red against protected left turns. If opposing traffic is turning left but you have a red light, CLEARLY they have a protected turn arrow.

Actually, that's not true in a lot of places. Even if you have a green left arrow, you're still responsible to yield to those turning right. A lot of times there will be fault placed on both parties though. A big factor in that is which lane you turn into also. If you're turning onto a 3 lane road, you should both be able to turn if you each turn into the closest lane.

Out here a lot of lights are labels "No Right on Red", and a lot of others aren't labeled but have such incredibly poor visibility that it would be foolish to do so. I've just adopted a principle of just yielding to everyone when I turn right on red and I can see who is coming. It helps, cause I know no one else is paying enough attention to yield to me.