Fresh KA-T Running Super Rich

Your premier source for information on the Turbo KA: KA24E-T and KA24DE-T (KA with aftermarket turbo kit)!
User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

Quick list of mods:

96 Block
Arias 8.7:1 Pistons (stock bore)
Eagle Rods
Clevite Rod & Main Bearings
ARP Head & Main Studs
New timing chain, distributor cap & rotor, all new sensors
Accell Thundersport wires
NGK BKR7Es
MSD 6A, Blaster 3 coil
96 Head
BC Stage 3 cams
BC .5mm oversized valves
BC dual springs, titanium retainers, seats, seals
JWT Adjustable Cam Gears
S13 intake manifold with emissions removed
JGY Top Feed fuel rail
JGY 72# Injectors, with JWT injector resistors wired in
Walbro 255
Nismo Type B FPR
N62 MAF
Enthalpy tuned ECU
Innovate LC1 wideband
Precision 6031E turbo
tial 38mm 10psi external wastegate

There is more, but I figured that is mostly all anyone would question to try and troubleshoot this problem. Here is a link to my build thread if you would like to see the whole build documented and pictures of everything: ken-s-91-fastback-resto-ka-t-build-t535618.html

I recently got it together and ready to start. Got it fired up for the first time but did not have a fuel pressure gauge. It was running rough, and I just adjusted the FPR and got the timing where it needed to be. The next week I got the gauge, hooked it up and was getting 55psi at the rail, too much. I started it up and it ran, although smoking, and when I gave it gas it was choppy and eventually stalled. Tried to start it again and it would crank free but not fire off. Pulled the plugs and they were wet with fuel. Drained the oil and had a lot of gas in my oil pan... :facepalm:

After changing the oil and plugs then letting it sit and air out overnight, I started it up and adjusted the fuel pressure down to 43psi without vacuum, and got the timing set at about 20* BTDC. It will crank fine and fire up with little effort. It idles smooth right around 1000rpm, and with it idleing I am getting 20psi on my oil pressure gauge and 40psi at the fuel rail. But at idle the wideband is telling me 10.1...SUPER rich. If I rev it it leans out to about 12.5 at roughly 3k but I have not taken it any higher. It only ran maybe 2 minutes before I shut it down and pulled the plugs. Once again all 4 are wet.

Pulled the injectors out of the manifold and there is a little fuel on top the rubber washers that sit in the manifold. With the injectors out I switched the key on, heard the pump run, but they did not leak any fuel. This is where I stopped to come seek help, I do not want to keep messing with it and risk grenading the new engine I just spend countless hours and dollars building.

I am kind of at a loss. The MAF sits at damn near 12" exactly from the turbo, and the pipe is a 45* piece. My gauge is telling me 40psi at idle which if anything is a little low. I am thinking bad tune, but is it common that an Enthalpy ECU is that far out that it would be flooding my engine? I need to head in to work so can't do any more today, I was going to extend the intake pipe to get the MAF atleast 16-18" or so away from the turbo and see if that made any difference. I also have a SAFCII but have not yet installed it and do not know how to make adjustments using one, so I haven't messed with it.

Please help me figure out where I should go from here fellas. Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks in advance...

EDIT: Two questions- I am not using an o2 sensor, I replaced it with a wideband. Would this throw off the ECU and make it dump fuel? Also, when I wired my n62 maf I spliced the two ground wired from the plug together and soldered to the engine harness. I read people doing this and having fine results but could it be that I need to ground one to chassis and the other to the harness?


User avatar
biggie
Moderator
Posts: 10330
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2002 2:31 am
Car: '16 Q70L/'14 Q60S Vert/'19 Armada/'09 FX35
Location: Clemmons, NC

Post

You answered my question already

You have to have a narrowband O2 sensor for the Enthalpy ECU.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

Thank you. I don't know how I overlooked that, shame on me. I just went out on my lunch break and picked up a sensor, I'll add that and let you know how it goes.

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

normally tuners use o2 feedback to keep the afr close to stoich at low load as it make finds a 'perfect' k value easier. Basically leave it on the rich side let the o2 handle trimming it.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

Alright. I just want to get it running safely, which I'm thinking it should be fine with the Enthalpy tune once I get these bugs worked out. Then I'm going to hook up the safc2 and take it to a local shop to have it dynoed and let their tuner adjust the safc accordingly.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

Today I added the brand new Bosch o2 sensor. There was a bung in my downpipe that had been capped off about 3-4 inches from the turbo, so I put it in there. Cleared the codes from the ecu, started it up, and now my wideband is saying 7.0 at idle. So apparently adding the narrowband made it run even richer. Is the o2 sensor too close to my turbo? My wideband is about 18-24 inches from the turbo. Stock the o2 is in the manifold, so I figured where I put it shouldn't be too close?

I am thinking maybe something is wrong with my wideband. It was already installed on the car when I bought it but I checked the wiring, recalibrated it, and figured it would be okay. I am thinking about ditching the Innovate and buying an AEM eugo.

It still holds idle pretty good, needs a little throttle to start but will settle at about 800rpm and only puts out a little smoke. I also rechecked the timing and it's still good.

Any ideas?

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

boost leak?
maybe enthalpy missed on the tune(doubtful)

Oh and before anything else fix your maf wiring one of them goes to ground IDGAF what anyone told you or says, thats the only issue I ever had with a n62, mine is missing mounting tabs, is 6~8" from the turbo and has a filter thrown over the missing tabs(ie most uni-deal setup)..

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

Alright Im going to redo that ground, check the signal wire with a multimeter, and go over a couple other things in the morning. Thanks man!

User avatar
quiksilver20004
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 1:23 pm
Car: 2001 Nissan Maxima Se 20th Anniversary 5spd
96 240sx 5spd

Post

If you do go with a new wideband there are brands that provide a signal for both wideband and narrowband so that you can use one o2 sensor but provide narrow signal to ecu and wide signal so gauge etc. If you are wanting to take a route like that, that is haha

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

cough plx is the s*** cough cough.

User avatar
WDRacing
Moderator
Posts: 23925
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 2:00 am
Car: 95 240SX, 99 BMW 540i, 01 Chevy Express, 14 Ford Escape
Location: MFFO
Contact:

Post

I ran my grounds together. In fact, I had my MAF wiring twisted together and exposed and it still ran great during the initial start up. Wiring the SAFC grounds wrong will cause issues though, for the record.

Anyway, sounds like a intercooler coupler is loose or off.

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

thats cant be it wd I already asked if it was a boost leak.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

I have been doing some research and this is something I can't seem to find a straight answer on...

I have my valve cover breather vented to the atmosphere, currently it does not go back to the intake, and there isnt a filter on it or anything. Some people say this doesn't have any ill effects, but others say it is letting unmetered air into the motor. Could this be an issue and causing the leak you guys are pointing me to?

User avatar
WDRacing
Moderator
Posts: 23925
Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2002 2:00 am
Car: 95 240SX, 99 BMW 540i, 01 Chevy Express, 14 Ford Escape
Location: MFFO
Contact:

Post

Is the PCV system blocked off? If it is, then no air is getting in.

Open the ECU and visually confirm that all the chips are seated in place like they're supposed to be. If the chip came loose you'll have all sorts of problems. Just something to easily verify real quick.

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

my first daughterboard was whacked the car would run, just full rich all the time. Called moates.net and they swapped me out no charge, they said it was working for them IDK new board same tune fired up and worked right.

I'd go as far as removing the ecu plug, the duaghterboard and the chips, then set em all back in,lets face it electronics can be gay.

Well look at it this way, put your finger over the vc vent with motor running ,do you feel air? However I am referring to a loose hose clamp or split coupler type leak.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

WDRacing wrote:Is the PCV system blocked off? If it is, then no air is getting in
I left the whole PCV system the way it was when I removed the emissions junk. I followed the write up in the articles section that said to leave it all in tact, so I did. The little box is still bolted on the block, it connects to the vacuum tube under the intake runners, and that tubes vacuum ports are connected to the manifold.

Neverlift, yes I do feel air from the VC breather when the motor is idling. I ran it with the VCB open and with it capped and it did not change a thing.

As far as the boost leak I have checked and checked again. All couplers are completely on the piping and the clamps are tight. One thing that concerns me is the couplers are 3", my throttle body OD is about 2 7/8"...1/8th too big. I tightened the clamp as much as I could hoping it would seal. It feels snug, but to be safe I ordered a 3 to 2.75 reducer coupling to squeeze over it and see if that makes a difference.

my1993nissan240sx
Posts: 43
Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 1:22 am
Car: 1993 nissan 240sx

Post

im having the exact same issue

wideband isnt hooked up yet

SAFC ii will be installed tonight

i still have the stock 02 so i will install the safc and let you know if that fixes it

User avatar
neverlift
Posts: 3700
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 6:26 am

Post

blindly install an safc will probably land your motor in a pile of ringland pieces in you r pan. Get the wideband then play with the afc.

User avatar
Jabberwocky
Posts: 159
Joined: Mon May 23, 2011 9:42 pm
Car: 08 Subaru WRX
Location: Taneytown, MD

Post

When mine would reach normal temp my oil pressure would severely drop, keeping me from figuring out the fuel issue, so I pulled the motor to investigate. Pretty sure It was the oring seal between the timing cover and block. None of my gasket kits came with one, so I reused the old. After comparing with a new one, there's no way the old one was sealing.

I just need to find time to put it back together, then i can get back to troubleshooting this problem.


Return to “KA24ET / KA24DET Forum”