FGY33 (1997-2001 Q45) rear shock tower bar installation on a

[maxnix]

Quote »Therefore a strut tower bar tends to be in tension, not compression as is often believed.

What a strut bar does is tie the two strut towers together so that they share the load applied at the outer tower. This gives you twice as much material to deal with the same cornering force and helps reduce fatigue stress in this area.[/quote]I think someone tested a Porsche front end and found this to be true most of the time. compression is the more frequent vector of cornering forces.

I like this link http://www.e30m3project.com/e3...2.htm about why loweering a MacPherson strut front suspension too much can actually reduce tire grip.

Think I should post it in the Very Impaired Perfromance section?

[Infinitiguy19]

Does the 97+ Q45 come stock with a RSTB? If so wouldn't that be a better candidate for this mod rather than the shorter Maxima bar?

The 1997 Q45 came with a RSTB and whats what I got from Andy to start this project, Its whats this project is based on. I am not sure if the Maxima came with a RSTB but I remember hearing that Jeff Williams had to cut them down.

Once you weld on a hardened part it loses its tensile strength. Is the butt weld in the center of the bar going to hold up to the lateral forces the first time you drive over a speed bump a little fast? Unless I'm not seeing the big picture I think the weld may snap the first time it sees a hard jolt.

I THINK I came up with a way to fix that and it doesn't involve a butt weld like I previously wanted to go with.

If you're going to use a machine shop, ask if they can make you up an opposite threaded bolt on a lathe and get it hardened. Probably a bit more cost but better to start with the correct part.

How much clearance between the bar and the gas tank? Can you show a close up of the bar attached to the bracket? Looks like a fun project and you're paving the way for future NICOnauts.

I asked a place in an industrial park I frequently pass by and the guy said ~$100 when its all set and done for the parts shown bellow: http://picasaweb.google.com/lh...tlink

There is plenty of clearance for a straight bar to go across the tank. But my main concern is that if the metal snaps then there goes the tank. So thats my FIRST priority.

Does the 97+ Q45 come stock with a RSTB? If so wouldn't that be a better candidate for this mod rather than the shorter Maxima bar?

Once you weld on a hardened part it loses its tensile strength. Is the butt weld in the center of the bar going to hold up to the lateral forces the first time you drive over a speed bump a little fast? Unless I'm not seeing the big picture I think the weld may snap the first time it sees a hard jolt.

If you're going to use a machine shop, ask if they can make you up an opposite threaded bolt on a lathe and get it hardened. Probably a bit more cost but better to start with the correct part.

How much clearance between the bar and the gas tank? Can you show a close up of the bar attached to the bracket? Looks like a fun project and you're paving the way for future NICOnauts.

Like I said the shop wants ~$100 for 2 solid bars one with right and another with left threads. Of course 2 holes for 10 MM studs to fit though for the Rear Shock Tower hats.

Well we have you Mike with the rare cup holder (No joke), Wes with the NICO ECU's, Jeff with the FSTB and me with the RSTB, But thanks Mike.

But for now I am looking for a shop with a fair price (no more than $30). But I need to know who is defiantly interested? I mean seriously interested!!! (Can't stress that). I also will do this for the price the shop charges plus $5 for some pocket change for me to fund my future projects.

And to all who wish to know: Nearly all my current projects would be done if I had the parts (money) to finish them. But I have all the plans that are needed to make them a reality.

Also you will need:

The bar (What ever the final cost)

The FGY33 rear shock tower hats: RH: 554A6-6P000- LH: 554A7-6P000- Both $12.04 from Infiniti Of Scottsdale (or you can buy used).

The nuts: 4X: 08918-1081A- ($0.60 each) 4X: 01225-00102- ($0.82 each) ( 8 all together and they are really 10MM nuts same as the ECU/TCU kick panel cover).

And of course the center stud to adjust the RSTB only found on a FGY33 (1997-2001 Q45).


Modified by Paul Wall at 7:58 PM 12/21/2009

[elwesso]

sounds like overall its going to be easier to make something from scratch.. You could still use the hats from the Y33, but i think it might be easier to custom make a bar..

hell, just take some black pipe and some fittings and make one!

[Infinitiguy19]

Yes I plan to use the FGY33 hats no matter what. But I don't know how else to make the rear bar be adjustable without using a left and right threaded rods.

I am perplexed because the front bar is very light yet produces results. But Infiniti used some really thick metal for the rear bar as well as super thick welds. Aren't the front shock towers under more stress than the rear?

Wes can I put you down for one?

[qship96]

Wonder if the bar will produce any real benefits?

[Infinitiguy19]

Does the front shock tower bar produce results?

Does the Q45a rear sway bar produce results?

[bullittandy]

Yes I plan to use the FGY33 hats no matter what. But I don't know how else to make the rear bar be adjustable without using a left and right threaded rods.

I am perplexed because the front bar is very light yet produces results. But Infiniti used some really thick metal for the rear bar as well as super thick welds. Aren't the front shock towers under more stress than the rear?

Wes can I put you down for one?

I would not recommend changing anything in the middle of the bar or the adjusting bolts.

If the bar is too short then simply lengthen one side. How? By sleeving it. Take one half of the bar and cut it in half and then slide a round tube over the cut pieces and weld them together.

It seems like you're making this a lot harder than it needs to be.

(Also, previous post needs to be deleted.)

[elwesso]

paul, have you looked at what member squeefoo did back in the day? He made a pretty cool rear strut bar, you might check it out if you havent already.

[NightRiderQ45]

clean up the mess huh...

[Infinitiguy19]

paul, have you looked at what member squeefoo did back in the day? He made a pretty cool rear strut bar, you might check it out if you havent already.

Well it sucks that I am not the first to do this but I will get over it some day. But I am the first to use the OEM FGY33 hats and a straight solid bar.

But I am working with some machine shops to see what i can come up with for a price...But again HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE INTERESTED?

I know I don't have all my eggs in a basket yet, but I would like to know if this thing goes through for say $50 plus shipping at the most.

[bullittandy]

Paul, you're agitating me.

Answer me as to why you cant lengthen one side with a sleeve.

[Infinitiguy19]

Well I really did think about it, but I don't want to take any risks what with the fuel tank being about inch away. With my straight bar the only weak part is the threads or the studs on the hats.

[elwesso]

technically a welded joint should be stronger than the actual metal surrounding it... the area around it called the "heat affected zone", and it essentially is the same thing as annealing it, where you will end up with a lower strength, higher ductility material..

in other words, if you did that the bar would most likely bend and crack rather than explode with a really brittle failure...

I dont really see any negatives to using a sleeve.. besides, the bar is primarily going to be in compression which is much better than it being in tension.. I think the bar will just bend like crazy before it would actually break.

[Infinitiguy19]

Okay well I forgot to add that if I choose to sleeve the OEM FGY33 bar then it will stick out and the trunk trim/wall will need to be cut accordingly. Now who want a black RSTB sticking out in there trunk? I want to make something clean looking (Even though it won't be seen).

I measured the space between the shock towers and its roughly 3 feet. I am going to get a broom Saturday and make my prototype for all to see.

Is there any truth to whats said here though: http://www.rogueengineering.co...RE_RB

[Infinitiguy19]

Okay I have been going back and forth on this trying to find the best solution as to whats the strongest, most inexpensive to make and best quality.

I will use 3/4" hollow steel pipe with threaded ends (The end will be cut anyways). The ends will be compressed and have two holes drilled for the $12 FGY33 Rear Shock Tower mounting hats. The pipe costs $15 but is 10 feet long so I can make two bars, So it will be $7 for just the bar. I need to look into either compressing the ends myself or find a nice shop to do it for me, as well as drill holes in the ends.

So $7 for the bar, $12 for each mounting hat from Infiniti Of Scottsdale (Price will change) and shipping which I will find out and of course donations for my time are always welcome. And of course the big thing is find a shop to cut, compress and drill on the ends of the bars. So when I find a person for this

The optional items are:

Paint- I plan to use POR-15 which is about the toughest stuff known to man is pretty much overkill "But thats how I roll". (Price depends on people interested)
http://www.por15.com/SUPER-STARTER-KIT/ ... info/SSKB/

Signature-if desired (Free)

NICO sticker-if wanted (Free if NICO staff can send me some, I have a couple myself)

I did also consider using foam on the inside of the bar but where its next to a fuel tank and the foam (At least the ones I find) are all flammable I will not use anything on the inside for added support.
http://www.americanchemistry.com/s_plas ... 0&DID=6590
http://www.lowes.com/pd_176477-68-11671 ... dentifier=
http://www.dap.com/docs/tech/00077006001.pdf
http://www.chemcas.com/msds_archive/par ... nglish.asp

Credit for the idea of using pipe goes to: http://www.carforums.net/showthread.php?t=17932

And what also scares me is that according to what Q45Tech posted: http://www.e30m3project.com/e30m3perfor ... theory.htm

The tension the bar will be under is: 480.000001 pounds
The compression the bar will be under is the weight of the car (Depends).
But thats assuming that the BMW shares the same suspension as the Q which it does't. And the Q already has a tiny Rear Shock Tower Bar which would help a little to relieve any stress off the new bar, But its so low and so think that I doubt it does much.

Oh yes I almost forgot about the washers between the bar and the mounting brackets. The washers are required to space the bar from the fuel lines, the amount of washers required I will find out.

[Infinitiguy19]

Okay I found a place that will let me use there 12 ton press and drill press for $5-$10 each bar. So $10 to make the bar, $7 to buy the bar (10 foot steel) and I will cut it to shave money.

So the line starts here or would you rather see it installed in my car and wait for the results?

I make no promises and I will not like for the little money if any really that I make from this. And trust me the less I make the better because its tough cutting 3/4" steel.

So all you have to say is "I am interested" so I can estimate my supplies needed. And I need at least TWO people per order because the steel is 10 feet long but I may seek steel elsewhere if the cost is lower and if cut...

Like I said I assume Wes, maxnix, MInister of Doom, Lino and maybe some others may be interested.