driting lessons

[hacman1508]

i know it has been explained many times but i am new so give me a break i would like to know how to get my 240sx to drift properly and how to hold the drift for a good distance. the e brake way is not bad but it gets boring i want to know how to do it the correct way. so come on guys how about a little help

[Slappy]

read this....

well, people might make fun of it, but the drift bible does help.here's what i do since i have a low powerd car.

say i'm entering a right hander, i'll swing the car real hard to the left, then as soon as the steering wheel begin's to become near center as i'm steering it back to the right , i give the e brake a tiny tug, then start feathering the throttle, at the same time counter steering.

thats how i got used to throwing the *** out and controlling it.doing that in a empty lot in the rain at low speed's is good also for practise.

[sil beer s13]

get an lsd

[Slappy]

get an lsd

not right away, i did'nt need one when i was first learning.

[sixxdeuce]

haha

[Fenvy]

get an lsd

you shoudl have lsd even if it's not for driftingh

[Slappy]

what begginer has over $800.oo to buy one?

i know i did'nt.

[Joe]

who said you need a fancy 800$ LSD?whats a viscous selling for now? 200$?

[Fenvy]

or even cheaper at the junk yard

[sil beer s13]

its better to start with some kind of LSD then open diff.

You have to re learn the car when you go 2 way.

[240sx2nr]

^ ^ ^ i agree... u need to start with some kind of LSD to do it the "right" way

[yessir240]

I say First learn to spell

[raging panda]

no money for LSD, weld it. LSD, bucket seat, coilovers, thats the basics

[Slappy]

no money for LSD, weld it. LSD, bucket seat, coilovers, thats the basics

welding,..i heard of a guy doing that..

is there any problem's with that?

i mean, how close to an LSD "feel" is it really?

i mean, if it worked fine, why would'nt everyone just save $ and do it that way?

[Joe]

if its welded properly its very safe, to the differential.its the other stuff that you need to worry about.

when turning, the inside wheel always has to travel a shorter distance. hence the need for a differential. something like a kaaz, while it makes noise, isnt fully locked at all times. a welded diff is. so, when turning something have to give. usually its the tire, in a chirping noise while taking tight corners.

there is no substitute for a real limited slip differential.

[Slappy]

cool, thank you.

so, what other brand of lsd do you recommend, i have no $ for a kaaz etc.

there was this one that everybody on the "lookoutdrift" forum was poking fun at, but a few said it was decent for the money, it cost like $200.

i forget the name tho...damn, it's 4am!!

[seyath]

You do not "have to" get an LSD to drift. I've autocrossed and drifted my S13 without an LSD and I can still run circles around the guys with their SR's and fully tuned vehicles. It all goes back to the driver. Get comfortable with your vehicle first. Comfortable enough that you can easily drift, alas not for a really long time, most of the times, then think about upgrading your car. Before I got my hatch I was drifting in my S13 coupe, completely stock, no LSD and no e-brake. Just practice, have fun, and here's a tip: If you are running a stock KA, when approaching a turn at let's say 3500-4000 RPM in third gear, heel and two to second which with the brakind whould send you to about 4500 RPM turn and hit the gas. You should easily loose traction and you will have performed a power drift. Get comfortable doing that and then start worrying about shifting weight correctlly and stuff. But remember, it's a lot easier if you keep your revs up, so don't be scared to step on it in the turn. Just my $.02

[Slappy]

i found it!!!

it's called the Phantom Grip LSD, that's the one i was saying people poke fun at but some were saying it's worth it for $200.

so, what would you guy's recommend?

1. Phantom Grip 2. Quaife3. good weld job

oh and seyath, thank's for the tip's bro but i'm just a 'lil past that now..thank's anyway.

[bendychicken]

Going back to the welded diff. Seems like a goood cheap alternative for a beginner(like me) would be to get a spar open diff for like 50 bucks and weld it. That way you could just swap diffs when its time to practice. It only takes like 15-20 min to swap diffs, that is the entire carrier.

[Slappy]

here's the link for info on the phantom lsd.

if any body has experience with one of these or know's if its good or not, please reply..thank you.

http://www.phantomgrip.com/how_it_works.htm

[Joe]

Going back to the welded diff. Seems like a goood cheap alternative for a beginner(like me) would be to get a spar open diff for like 50 bucks and weld it. That way you could just swap diffs when its time to practice. It only takes like 15-20 min to swap diffs, that is the entire carrier.

holy ****the only way thats possible is if you are swapping ring gears along with the carriers. and doing that is NOT SMART. it changes all the specs on backlash, turning turque and contact patch of the pinion and ring gear. you can destroy your rear end like that!!!

[raging panda]

Oh man, there is nothing wrong with a welded diff, what does an LSD do when you are drifting? It locks, guess what a welded diff does when youre drifting? Its locked. Only diff is that its locked all the time. The only thing is that around corners, you get a chirp and maybe some hop. Otherwise, same as driving a 2 way around. I've said it multiple times, i dont worry about the diff, i worry about the guy driving, thats what makes it safe/unsafe. Why everyone doesn't do it, because they've heard that it will break axles, its dangerous, its this, its blah blah.....whatever. I've had one for around 6 months now, no problems, great for drifting. I don't know why people without real LSD don't do it, but to each his own. You're going to get a similar experience with clutch type, it will clunk around turns, and will lock a lot of the time, since thats what its supposed to do.

Phantom LSD, no personal experience with it, but apparently theyre easy to break and will destroy your diff when they do, and they don't lock fully when they're supposed to, might as well get vlsd.

Seyath, i have a hard time believing you run circles around anyone with an open diff, its hard to do donuts with an open diff, I know, thats how i started. I could do huge drifts with speed, but in tight corners, its impossible since the dead wheel just drags and kills your speed. You're right, a good driver can make up for a lot of short comings, but its just giving yourself a handicap, fighting with one hand behind your back. Its unnecessary, and ultimately doesn't translate into much other than getting used to sliding, since you have much more control on angles and breakaways with LSD than without.

As for swapping diffs, I think he means the whole pumpkin, which is why I have a spare just in case I break my welded. Its 50 bux for a spare, 50 bux for the welding. Good investment unless you can afford real LSD.

my vote goes clutch/quaife (if thats what you want)weldwhatever else
Modified by raging panda at 2:28 PM 7/19/2005

[raging panda]

For the original post, you can ebrake to start the drift, then countersteer and floor it, there isn't any magical potion. If you dont use the ebrake, then use whatever you want, clutch kick, feint are my favorites with ebrake. I just force the car to rotate using one of those techniques or a combination. Right now im exclusive ebrake since I killed my clutch though. Once I get a heavier duty clutch, its back to kick kick kick kick while flooring it the whole time, and then spin out.

[Slappy]

cool, you seem to know a few thing's, so i'll prolly llean towards your advice, and from what you said, and some other member's said in gen chat, i'm gonna stay away from that phantom "thing".

thank you.

[Juujai]

quaife if im not mistaking is an hlsd and if im right those don't like to drift. lsd i recommend. 2-way clutch type specifically if you want to drift. a lot of people say you can drift on an open differential but its no fun at all and you won't know if you are improving because either way it looks and feels like crap. if you're making minimum wage you can still afford a 2-way clutch type lol. drifting is not cheap... arms break, tires...., lsd, clutch discs, etc if you can't afford it don't do it.

theres basically 2 main types of drifts. weight shifting and non-weight shifting. usually all the ricers that think they are cool are not weight shifting because it's more advanced. typically ebrake, romping on the clutch pedal or downshifting/upshifting +turn hard left or right hahaha.

the more advanced styles would be like braking for weight shifting to the front and breaking traction or like the feint style mentioned above: tossing the car towards the opposite direction and using the weight of the rebound to start a drift. theres more but you can figure them out on your own or someone else can chime in.

most drifts are actually mixes of different moves or styles. not everyone is 100% godly at drifting so they can't just toss a feint and hold a drift for a long period of time. you may need to mix in other stuff like ebrake, or hit the clutch pedal etc to hold on to a nice long drift.

initiating a drift is not too hard but holding it is the hardest. to hold a nice drift you'd need to learn how to balance the weight of the car pretty well and learn how to shift weight around a lot. lucky the 240 is a neutral balanced lightweight car so it should be fairly one of the easiest to learn on. steering wheel, gas, brake, almost everything contributes to shifting weight pretty hard siet to learn not something everyone can learn =/

[Liquidus]

I would say don't get a 2-way, but thats just my personal advice. A 2-way is too much like a solid rear axle and makes for a lot of understeer. Whenever the two rear wheels are forced to move at the same speed you will get more understeer. So with a 2 way they lock with the power on and with the power off.

I have a nismo 1.5 way and love it, but even with it i noticed more understeer than before. I could adjust my suspension somewhat to adapt, but still for beginner i recommend not getting a 2-way. Plus, you can get the nismo one online for like $750, and if you tell your dealership you found one online for that price, they might match it. Mine did.

[Slappy]

dude, your sig, do you mean thee Peter Solberg ??????

anyway, so, if i get a 2 way, your saying it will create understeer.

i wonder if having a low powerd engine like i got would make it worse, since i prolly won't be able to break both tires loose.

that also would create understeer unless i e-brake the hell out of it.

plus, my KA hit's the rev limiter @ 5k for some gay reason.
Modified by Slappy at 3:02 PM 7/25/2005

[Liquidus]

I of course mean Petter Solberg. Note the two T's. Yep, rode with him around the oval at Indianapolis Raceway Park in the new 06 sti. Luckily he cut in through an S-curve for some drift action. Got it all on video, a bunch of pics, his autograph. That sig is a small cut out of a giant size picture i bought there (they have proffesional photographers there, then sell you pics of yourself doing whatever). It was for car and drivers 50th anniversary party. Also autocrossed a viper, 4 laps.

http://www.ccrtc.com/members/l...g.jpg

http://www.ccrtc.com/members/l...e.jpg

Any clutch type will create understeer because it locks the wheels very strong and hard. You do want this though because when the wheels break loose it is easier to drift. But the 2 way will make it worse than i 1 or 1.5 way. I recommend the 1.5 way because it still hooks the wheels together somewhat when off the gas, but you get less understeer.

I can drift fine with my nismo one and i have a stock KA.

[Slappy]

damn dude, what are you 7' or something??..christ your tall!!!!

anyway, that's soooo cool you got to meet him and do a ride along.

oh, and thank's for the info mate!.

[Liquidus]

6'9" LOL, good guess.