Dealer trying to screw me over?

[Bubs daddy]

Quote »I know that this is how almost every trade-in goes. I understand that is a "free market system"... but how some people on here can be so blindly trusting to act like these sort of tactics aren't the least bit slimy absolutely astounds me. He BOLD FACED LIED to me - it was only my knowledge that saved me from being one more sucker.

Call it what you like, but they try to give people the worst deal possible on trades, expecting most people to be clueless. It isn't an honest procedure. Plus - his KBB "appraisal" that "proved" the value of my car was a LIE...it wasn't my car at all.

So why are you so bent on proving salesmen and dealerships to be saints and prove these accusations to be falsehoods made up for a good "story"? Get over it. Car sales revolve around deception. Educating one's self about financing terms and common salesmen tactics eliminates the "power" of said deception - but to act like it's a minor occurrence is being quite naive.

[/quote]I've already read that article. Good stuff.

And you're right, they do try to give the customer the lowest trade possible. That's how they make more money.

And you're putting words into my mouth. You're making inferences of things I've never stated. I'm not making out salesmen to be saints. And I'm far from naive. I know plenty well what goes on in the showroom. I've bought and traded my share of cars over the years.

I would not understand how people could be so blindingly trusting, either. Obviously you did your homework. But KBB and NADA are just guides. The car is worth what someone will pay. You point to the KBB value as if that's the gold standard and somehow the dealer is compelled to give you that figure. He's not.

Do car salesmen use deceit? Sure. But so so football coaches. They try to deceive the other team for the edge to win the game. Sales in general takes negotiating, patience, and knowledge. Are those $400 "doc fees" bogus? Sure. It's just a tacked on made up figure. Anyone can refuse to pay that. The dealer also has the right to refuse to sell you the car without paying it. Or negoatiate it down.

Look at the junk fees when getting a mortgage. Or the ARM's that people are struggling with. No one made them take that deal. They know they are adjustable-up or down.

No one is saying car dealers and car salesmen are saints. But the value of a car is negoiable. Even if KBB states that the car is worth $6000, that doesn't mean the dealer will give you that. He can give you anything he wants. There is no universal "fair deal." No one is forcing you to trade your car in.

[matt_a]

... But KBB and NADA are just guides. The car is worth what someone will pay. You point to the KBB value as if that's the gold standard and somehow the dealer is compelled to give you that figure. He's not.

That is so true. When we were "working the deal" to buy our Versa a few months ago, we went to several different dealerships. Every time I would mention what KBB said was the value of our trade, they would look at me and say something like, "Is KBB willing to buy your car for that?" We did end up getting a great deal, but they do not put a lot of stock in KBB or NADA.

[srellim234]

.... No one is forcing you to trade your car in.

Exactly. We didn't like what we were offered for our Buick in trade so we bought the Versa without a trade-in. We might keep the Buick or try trading it in when we get our next vehicle. We didn't HAVE to trade it, so we didn't.

[Rockhound]

I would not understand how people could be so blindingly trusting, either. Obviously you did your homework. But KBB and NADA are just guides. The car is worth what someone will pay. You point to the KBB value as if that's the gold standard and somehow the dealer is compelled to give you that figure. He's not.

Now you're putting words in my mouth. I understand that KBB, NADA, Edmunds, et al are just guides. My point in bringing that up was that they filled out and printed up their own KBB appraisal of our car that was a falsehood. They didn't add in any of the options on our car and then tried to tell me that was the value of my car. I understand I'm not forced to trade-in and that I can walk away.

It's one thing to go up to someone selling their car and offer thousands well below value. Heck, they might take you up on it, or they may laugh at you. It's another thing entirely to back up your offer with a falsified appraisal. That's when it transitions from being a "free market" to a lie.

We didn't HAVE to trade it, so we didn't.

I normally sell my cars outright - with great success. But our Camry was showing signs of the infamous Toyota oil "sludge" buildup, and I decided that I couldn't sell it outright in good conscience. But I figured that it was up to the dealer to be aware of this issue, and if they were none-the-wiser, then it was their fault. So I played their game - and they bit.


Modified by Rockhound at 2:14 PM 10/17/2007

[BillyBeaneBall]

I also read that "confessions of a car salesman" article...but didn't do it until AFTER I bought my 2 Versa's. It's a GREAT read and educational to someone who has never been educated before in how a salesman works at a car dealership. Most of what was in that article I knew (or thought I knew with no real proof..this just confirmed it) I recommend it to anyone that is going to buy a car now.

The biggest bargaining chip any buyer has is to WALK AWAY and actually mean it when you tell the salesman...then DO IT if you don;t get what you want. Alot of people (including me) lack this kind of backbone...but I found it when buying my second V But I'd bet alot of salesmen will call the "threatening to walk out" bluff and win because people don;t follow through on thier threat...