Custom came cores right here in the USA

[T45]

I think someone posted a while back about an almost drop in dual spring upgrade from a honda prelude? that had substantial pressure. I think it was Mettler.

[defrag010]

Not getting anything done? You wouldn't believe the amount of work I've done on this. I don't post much progress up publicly because well... what would be the point of giving away all my hard work? I just haven't moved forward with getting the machining and grinding done because I have no money left for it, due to wanting my actual car finished first. When I do get onto manufacturing them, I should be able to supply a set of cams for around the same price as yours, except mine will come with the upgrade springs required.

Good things come to those with patience m8.

It doesn't take rocket science to make a set of cams. Whatever hard work that has taken over a year is stuff you don't need to do, you don't need to reverse engineer anything or make all these cad drawings. I'd expect an amateur to think that you have to do all of this stuff, but in reality making cams isn't that big of a deal. Why are you upset anyway? Did you really want to be the first one to offer cams for the VH? Does the glory mean that much to you? No one told you that you had to do whatever you did. If you're in it for everyone, then why is it so important that you keep all of this important information to yourself? Everytime anyone posts cams, you come in and act like you have a patent for VH45 cams and that it's your responsibility or something and that no one else has the right to make cams. When I made this thread, you sent me that little whining e-mail begging me not to get these made because it would steal your thunder. It took me about 30 minutes on the phone to design the cam profile I wanted and get things started..... all of which has supposedly taken you a year to do, but that's just what an amateur has to do when venturing into the unknown. You admitted that you don't have the money to get them done, and also admitted that you aren't even going to work on them!! what do you want everyone to do?.. sit around and suck your d!ck while you make more cad drawings of stuff you don't need to and talk about your top secret progress information while not getting anything made? Just be real and admit that they aren't ever going to get done.. it would make you alot less annoying when you whine everytime someone else mentions cams. Just look at your first two replies in this thread. You have the right recipe to be a good forum hero and a good theorist that has everyone on the edge of their seats, but you obviously aren't good at getting anything done and seeing results from this cam project.

If you can get four billet core cams ground and provide 32 springs for less than 1100 dollars, then I bid you serious luck, because that will be very hard to do without making any profit. Plus, how many people on here do you think will plop down a grand for a set of cams? Most VH'ers would rather pay 700 bucks for a used jdm engine than any real money into VH internals.... that's why John Dixon is the only one who has something special yet, because he's obviously spent alot of money on it.

So please, get over yourself and either make some cams or don't get mad when other people make them.
Modified by defrag010 at 6:07 PM 2/2/2008

[defrag010]

Well, I was quoted 1600 for a set of hard welded reground stock cams (with factory base circle) from webcams... so your price for a set of new cams seems pretty good to me.

130# of seat pressure is pretty substantial, isn't it? I mean, I was able to find a set of drop in aftermnarket singles with 60# of pressure and aftermarket drop in duals with 89# of pressure... I don't know if I can find a spring with 130#...

you don't want web cams to weld and re-grind your cores, they have problems with their welded cams lasting long because of their lack of heat treating. There was a web cam epidemic that went around a couple of years ago with all 4g63 cams, and the lobes were wearing out left and right.

That spring pressure was what was reccomended to me when we were going over the profile. It uses a 28 degree ramp, and has Very fast acceleration and deceleration profiles so it needs alot of spring pressure. If you search my old posts, I put pictures up of a VH head that I enlarged and lenghened the spring pockets in a VH head to fit a SBC 1.25" OD spring with capability for up to .500" lift with stock valve stem height.

[defrag010]

I think someone posted a while back about an almost drop in dual spring upgrade from a honda prelude? that had substantial pressure. I think it was Mettler.

It was the guy who posted above you, he even mentioned them in the post right above yours. Mettler found out that you can put gti-r inner springs inside stock vh outer springs.

[Mettler]

Not me man. I followed up on it though and found out that 2 sets of prelude upgrade springs was gonna be a bunch of wallet rape, and gave up on the idea.

[Mettler]

It doesn't take rocket science to make a set of cams. Whatever hard work that has taken over a year is stuff you don't need to do, you don't need to reverse engineer anything or make all these cad drawings. I'd expect an amateur to think that you have to do all of this stuff, but in reality making cams isn't that big of a deal.

Listen here, I find it necessary to reverse engineer the valvetrain when you consider we're dealing with an engine that has VTC, and a finger rocker design prone to failure if ramp rates are too steep & valvetrain geometry has changed. Is your beloved cam grinder even designing the cams to work with VTC, for a street motor? And if so, is he designing them to the absolute limit, and to achieve the highest possible Dynamic Compression Ratio, whilst remaining reliable on pump gas?

Oh wait, no, all he's doing is making a generic profile that gives you big overlap at the highest RPM, at the expense of decent cylinder pressure at the lower revs. Sure, this is fine for a guy like you who wants to drag race, who could theoretically slap his VH45DE in a sports car, thrash the crap out of it and blow it up, then just rebuild it at a whim since you work at a reconditioner.

What about guys with Q45s who just want a bit of extra power throughout the powerband, as well as significantly increased peak HP, but not at the expense of driveability? Your huge cams are not going to be good for cars like that at all.

Had you even considered the engineering complexities involved too? For example, having to drill a straight 6mm hole more than 250mm deep through the middle of a billet of high carbon 4140 steel roundbar for the oil gallery inside the cam? Planning the methods, making the right enquiries, and collecting the tools to make it happen, all takes good time. Time that's being well spent to ensure it's done right.

Why are you upset anyway? Did you really want to be the first one to offer cams for the VH? Does the glory mean that much to you? No one told you that you had to do whatever you did. If you're in it for everyone, then why is it so important that you keep all of this important information to yourself? Everytime anyone posts cams, you come in and act like you have a patent for VH45 cams and that it's your responsibility or something and that no one else has the right to make cams. When I made this thread, you sent me that little whining e-mail begging me not to get these made because it would steal your thunder.

Begging? Don't talk bull****. Way to be a colossal douchebag about it... like a typical aarogant ****wit, you didn't even reply or discuss things. Do not, for even a second, think I'm gonna take this from you. You can't appreciate anyone else's hard work and efforts but your own. It has nothing to do with glory, thunder, whatever... way to go and create a strawman argument. You're the ****ing glory whore here.

I'm pissed off because rather than communicating, helping me, offering suggestions & working with me to make it happen, you're doing the exact opposite. I've had a passion about doing this for ages... but for your cam grinder, to him it's just another set of cams to add to his catalogue. That's what annoys me.

It took me about 30 minutes on the phone to design the cam profile I wanted and get things started..... all of which has supposedly taken you a year to do

That's fine, no doubt they're going to be good for your very narrow focus application. Don't forget to update us all when you blow your motor up. At least you can bet that when I produce my set I'll have before & after dyno proof of results, as well as being able to say that a year's worth of R&D has gone into them, rather than just slapping a generic grind on.

You admitted that you don't have the money to get them done, and also admitted that you aren't even going to work on them!! what do you want everyone to do?.. sit around and suck your d!ck while you make more cad drawings of stuff you don't need to and talk about your top secret progress information while not getting anything made? Just be real and admit that they aren't ever going to get done.. it would make you alot less annoying when you whine everytime someone else mentions cams. Just look at your first two replies in this thread. You have the right recipe to be a good forum hero and a good theorist that has everyone on the edge of their seats, but you obviously aren't good at getting anything done and seeing results from this cam project.

Hook me up with some money then, critic. I've already bought the material for the cams & have it sitting in my office at work, and I have the machining drawings done. Our CNC lathe operator has left the company and gone overseas, and I don't have the cash to pay another engineering company to machine up the blanks for me. So saying that I'm never going to get them done.... pffft, don't make me bitchslap you. If you're on the edge of your seat and want to see some hard results from this, why don't you lay down some cash?

You're not productive whatsoever, you have offered nothing to contribute to the project, but you're all too happy to sit there and bash me for not being able to make progress due to factors out of my control. Another way to describe that is 'being a bastard.'

If you can get four billet core cams ground and provide 32 springs for less than 1100 dollars, then I bid you serious luck, because that will be very hard to do without making any profit. Plus, how many people on here do you think will plop down a grand for a set of cams? Most VH'ers would rather pay 700 bucks for a used jdm engine than any real money into VH internals.... that's why John Dixon is the only one who has something special yet, because he's obviously spent alot of money on it.

So please, get over yourself and either make some cams or don't get mad when other people make them.

I intend to do so this year, and what will get the price down will be a group buy. e.g. upgrade valvesprings that allow 1/2" lift, I can get 64 made at a price of $11NZ each (that's around US$8 each). So imagine if I was to get say, 5 sets done at a time.

Finally, this is not the place to argue, do it over e-mail. It stops now.

[defrag010]

Listen here, I find it necessary to reverse engineer the valvetrain when you consider we're dealing with an engine that has VTC, and a finger rocker design prone to failure if ramp rates are too steep & valvetrain geometry has changed. Is your beloved cam grinder even designing the cams to work with VTC, for a street motor? And if so, is he designing them to the absolute limit, and to achieve the highest possible Dynamic Compression Ratio, whilst remaining reliable on pump gas?

Oh wait, no, all he's doing is making a generic profile that gives you big overlap at the highest RPM, at the expense of decent cylinder pressure at the lower revs. Sure, this is fine for a guy like you who wants to drag race, who could theoretically slap his VH45DE in a sports car, thrash the crap out of it and blow it up, then just rebuild it at a whim since you work at a reconditioner.

You might find it neccessary, but you new to engines and you are no cam grinder or valvetrain engineer... maybe if you weren't just learning about how cams affect engines when I was cutting up VH heads, you would have a little more credibility. Everything that has come from you is purely speculation. I'm designing my cams without VTC, but also it's not rocket science to implement a cam design to work with a VTC system. My cam grinder grinds cams for all kinds of racing sanctions and OEM's that you've never even heard of, I'm going to listen to him about what he reccomends based on the specs of the engine and the heads, not some kiwi who has just learned about doing it but hasn't ever done anything. The guy who's grinding my cams did the cams for the beloved supercar nissan v8 engines, I think he knows a thing or two about the application. You're no expert, mate, and I build engines that last under high power and stress.... you??Quote »

What about guys with Q45s who just want a bit of extra power throughout the powerband, as well as significantly increased peak HP, but not at the expense of driveability? Your huge cams are not going to be good for cars like that at all.[/quote] Grinding an economical profile isn't as hard as you are making it out to seem, have you even talked with a reputable cam grinder or are you just making these assumptions based on things you read and come up with on your own?

Quote »Had you even considered the engineering complexities involved too? For example, having to drill a straight 6mm hole more than 250mm deep through the middle of a billet of high carbon 4140 steel roundbar for the oil gallery inside the cam? Planning the methods, making the right enquiries, and collecting the tools to make it happen, all takes good time. Time that's being well spent to ensure it's done right.[/quote]There are no complexities with the engineering, as long as you have a good machinist, gun drilling a cam is NOT hard. You are making it out like it's really rocket science.

Quote »Begging? Don't talk bull****. Way to be a colossal douchebag about it... like a typical aarogant ****wit, you didn't even reply or discuss things. Do not, for even a second, think I'm gonna take this from you. You can't appreciate anyone else's hard work and efforts but your own. It has nothing to do with glory, thunder, whatever... way to go and create a strawman argument. You're the ****ing glory whore here.[/quote[]Yeah, I'm the one who is all up in everyone's cam threads always making replies and threats about them putting me under.. get real man, look at your first posts in this thread... you are just trying to hog all the glory about making cams. I appreciate hard work when people have results, I don't appreciate all this talk about nothing and keeping everyting secret. Notice in my threads that I make, I not only have pictures but detailed explanations of everything I've been doing.. If it's not about having glory, then why on earth did you get so butthurt and lock your thread at even the mere mention of getting Brian Crower to come up with a set?? don't lie to yourself man, you're just upset that all this effort you're putting out for nothing is going in vain because you are too stuck on yourself to realize that you aren't the king **** of engines and camshafts.

I'm pissed off because rather than communicating, helping me, offering suggestions & working with me to make it happen, you're doing the exact opposite. I've had a passion about doing this for ages... but for your cam grinder, to him it's just another set of cams to add to his catalogue. That's what annoys me.

You keep everything secret, and you just expect me to hand out all of this information to you so you can milk it? double standard? you're a complete forum tool "m8". You might have had passion for doing this for ages, but by reading your posts when the vh forum was made you were a pretty green newb and had to read everything you know now. You think you know more than cam grinders that have setup a name and reputation for themselves, and who are actually established in what they do... that's what annoys ME.

Quote »That's fine, no doubt they're going to be good for your very narrow focus application. Don't forget to update us all when you blow your motor up. At least you can bet that when I produce my set I'll have before & after dyno proof of results, as well as being able to say that a year's worth of R&D has gone into them, rather than just slapping a generic grind on.[/quote]Yeah, you're one to talk about blowing motors up... how's that stock motor going by the way? Like I said, I have a reputation and actually have alot of engines out there that are making power and not breaking... Who are you kidding, you're not going to get the cams (let alone dyno charts) anytime soon, don't kid yourself or any of us anymore. It's easy to talk all this smack, but to back it up you actually have to have results... and have accomplished something.... which apart from putting a stock motor in an old car and blowing it up, you haven't done.

Quote »Hook me up with some money then, critic. I've already bought the material for the cams & have it sitting in my office at work, and I have the machining drawings done. Our CNC lathe operator has left the company and gone overseas, and I don't have the cash to pay another engineering company to machine up the blanks for me. So saying that I'm never going to get them done.... pffft, don't make me bitchslap you. If you're on the edge of your seat and want to see some hard results from this, why don't you lay down some cash?[/quote]yeah, big e-tough guy... I've seen videos of you mate, and I'd smash you into the ground before you even knew what happened. I lay cash down into people who are established and who give results, not an amateur kiwi who isn't established and is just learning about engines.

Quote »You're not productive whatsoever, you have offered nothing to contribute to the project, but you're all too happy to sit there and bash me for not being able to make progress due to factors out of my control. Another way to describe that is 'being a bastard.'[/quote]listen mother****er, I've done alot more with VH's than you can even dream about, all you have to do is look at my threads and pictures.. I've done all kinds of boring, cross section cutting, all kinds of headwork, and I have everything in pictures and notes... It won't take a genius to look at all of my previous posts and see that I've done alot of research and experimental work on VH's.... when's the last time you cut up a head, block, and crank?Quote »I intend to do so this year, and what will get the price down will be a group buy. e.g. upgrade valvesprings that allow 1/2" lift, I can get 64 made at a price of $11NZ each (that's around US$8 each). So imagine if I was to get say, 5 sets done at a time.[/quote]That's great, I hope for the rest of the people on here that you are able to do that.. Quote »Finally, this is not the place to argue, do it over e-mail. It stops now.[/quote]**** that, I'll argue where I want to..

[Mettler]

WTF are you on about defrag, you have no idea of who in the industry I've been dealing directly with, whatsoever. FYI I have been collaborating with a professional cam grinder and a race engine builder throughout the period of this development, so it's more than just 'my speculation' as you insultingly put it.

You run your mouth about how awesome you are, how much credibility you have, and all this amazing stuff you've done. WHERE ARE THE RESULTS? Providing a bunch of measurements and pictures of VH heads you've mutilated doesn't lend you as much credibility as you think it does. You haven't even got a VH converted car, nor have you shown a single running engine you've worked on, so what the hell are you talking about credibility for?

As for saying you'd smash me into the ground... yeah real mature, as if you have any idea of the outcome of such a scenario in the first place. As it stands m8 you're full of ****.

[Q45tech]

Now BOYS, be nice.Anyone under 60 is a BOY to me.