Brand new alt belt snaps 2.8 minutes after leaving dealership

[johngalt]

OK, first of all, warning to everyone cause this is going to be a long post. Also, Elwesso / Mods, if this is not technically in the correct place please don't beat me up - just move me where I need to go....

OK, so I found out that a friend of mine is getting married in Chicago some time ago, and decided that I might want to go. Well, the rentals units also wanted to go, so I compromised - they pay the gas and I get t0 drive. Good deal for me!

So, I haven't performed any serious maintenance on it other than a couple of oil changes since I got the car, and it just broke 150K - which means I have put 13k in 5 months. Furthermore, I knew i needed a rotate / balance job and an oil change, so I decided to take it to the local Nissan dealership where my parents live, called Jeff Smith Nissan.

My dad has been going there for years, and he knew the (former) Service Manager, Tommy. Well, Tommy is no longer with the company, and the lady who was there tried to push the full tune-up / service - which i thought was a good idea - but i already had the injection service performed, so they discounted that and my store-bought Mobile 1 Extended performance. Good deal. I was there by 10:30 AM and she said around 2:30 PM I should b ready. I got a ride from the courtesy vehicle driver back to the rentals units' domicile, then took Mom's '92 Max to run errands and get my house keys from my car - meaning I went right back to the dealership.

When I got there the Service Manager, another employee, the parts guy and the guy who runs the Service Dept (above the manager) were all in a discussion about the belts - specifically, that they could not get a hold of Nissan made belts (something about Infiniti being a PITA) and that 3rd party after market belts were known to cause problems in Nissan in general, and Infiniti's in particular. I said, look, I can't run to Chicago and back on the belts I got - local driving is one thing but I am gonna be cruising 80-90+ for prolonged intervals - and the *last* time I was here you said I needed it done and I had no money to get it done, so I better get it done now - but please call me and let me know if you can get the belts or if you have to go 3rd party so I can make a decision. She took my number, and I left to run errands.

2:30 rolls around - no call.3:00 rolls around - no call.

at 3:15 I call her, and she puts me on hold for well over 5 minutes, saying she had to go out to the shop and check and that they were finishing the 150K service and were waiting on the belts. I said OK, can I have the car by 4:00, she said maybe she'd let me know. I call back at 3:45 and she said that she found the belts at the Nissan warehouse in Macon, GA and her driver was on the way back with them - but that the car will probably be delayed until 5:00. No big deal, since we really didn't plan on leaving until around 6 PM anyway.

I call at 4:30 and ask for their courtesy driver to come get me from the house and take me back to the dealership - Mom and Dad had to get some X-rays made and decided that they would do that since we were still waiting on the car. I get back to the dealership, and goes ahead and pulls my ticket and runs it in the computer, then runs out to the service floor and starts talking to the mechanic working on my car. In the meantime, I see the driver again, and mention that I got lucky on the belts being in the Nissan warehouse, and he said "If she told you that then she lied to you. Cause I'm the one who went to get them belts and I got them from Bumper to Bumper." Needless to say I was riled - that she never called me and made a decision on her own *and* that she lied about it. But the story gets worse.

At 5:45 they finally finish putting the belts on and then they take it out back for the courtesy wash. At 5:57 the Service Manager's boss asks me if I am still here and if my car was out or not and I told him that it was being washed, at which point he said that he would make sure that they brought the keys to me directly - by which time there was a guy standing behind him with my key. I said thanks, got in my car and noticed it was idling roughly - but it did that last two times I got an oil change for a minute or so, so I was like "OK, whatever". I get off the lot, and start driving down the road, and I hear this noise that sounds like a sheet of paper or plastic flapping rapidly in the wind - and not thinking about it, I said, OK, they left a sheet in my car somewhere. Being at a red light and a major intersection, I decided to go down the road a bit so I could turn around. Before I made it another 100 yards the break light and the battery light came on. Now, those of you with more experience than I have with a car know *exactly* what happened - my alt. bet shredded - hence the topic title. Only problem is that *I* didn't know it at the time - I just knew the lights were on and I had to haul *** back to the dealership. So, I turned it around and hightailed it back to the dealership - Took me all of 10 minutes from cranking my car to getting back in the parking lot - and *everyone* from service was gone. I spoke with a Sales leader, Lon Rutledge, and he said there was not a thing he could do for me - even though I had to go the Chicago that night. I was pretty much SOL, in not so many words, is what he was saying - all about me leaving the car there and him having the Service Manager look at it in the morning. That I could not do since I was going to Chicago that very night, within an hour, so I left in a huff, saying they would hear from me.

So, I drove it home, *still* not knowing what was the matter, and then loaded it up to get on my way- I figured I'd stay overnight in Atlanta and have I of Gwinnet look at it - yeah, right.

I stopped at Wal-Mart for some new shades, and thank god I did - cause the damn thing sputtered out on me right there in the parking lot - and when it wouldn't crank, I put 2 + 2 and got 4 - the light in my *head* went off explaining to me why the other lights had come on - the batter lost it's charge, meaning it wasn't getting charged, which meant that alt was not connected - so I looked - oh, it's connected all right, but the belt is shredded to hell and back.

So, I called the dealership, and spoke to Lon again - this time I was hot - my parents are in my car feeling completely helpless, and beginning to burn up as the power is dead in the car, hence no AC, and no windows to open, *and* now I had to drive my ailing parents on a 12 hour jaunt to Chicago *and* miss the Groom's dinner Friday night - because there is no way to get there before 6PM leaving anytime after 8 AM, unless I truly hauled ***.

So, the dealership ended up sending a tow truck for the car and a salesman in a used Highlander to take us and our stuff back to the rental units' domicile. What was supposed to have been a relaxing day of minimal driving has turned into the vacation from hell - and it hasn't even started yet.

Needless to say, that Becky lady has her butt in a sling - and I am gonna nail her on 2 counts - 1) for not following the Service Manager's advice that those belts cause problems and 2) for straight up flat out lying to me to my face about where the belts came from.

I have learned my lesson - take the friggin day off and go to the Infiniti dealership 100 miles away - or T3, which is the same friggin distance (cause they're both in Atlanta).

Am I being petty?

(If you made it this far, thanks for sticking to the story and I appreciate any and all feedback - and I can take it so dish on me if you feel the need to - I am already steamed about the whole incident and am ***seriously*** considering suing the dealership.

[irax]

that severice manager owes you dinner, a movie, and a more then friendly handshake if you ask me... if you cant trust your sales rep or maneger even why the hell are they working there? Out of all the belts I have sold Q owners tend to stay twards the OEM stuff, a few every once in a while will buy bondo or conti... but they never called back complaining about how the belt broke or wanted me to pay labor (inwhich is not part of my warrenty anyways) a few actualy call back saying how they cant tell the difference between the two and order other parts.

[Q451990]

I would seriously consider renting a car for your trip... then insisting that the dealership pay for it.

Good luck!

Heath

[louiegz]

Yea, that's bull$hit. I'd make those aholes give you a loaner for the weekend. That's what I did the last time my dealer messed up my service.

[ddrumman]

Yea, that's bull$hit. I'd make those aholes give you a loaner for the weekend. That's what I did the last time my dealer messed up my service.

Wow!!! I always get a loaner.

[maxnix]

So this whole post is about why your car should be serviced by T-3 with parts from them or from Joe?

Q45 are unique cars and should never be serviced by non-Infiniti technicians, especially in such a rich Infiniti service environment as Atlanta.

Insert some Q45tech warning here about more Q45 being damaged by incompetent mechanics, except for outright owner abuse.

[BlackBirdVQ]

I feel your pain man, I would deff take some reprocautions as far as getting things resolved.

2 weeks ago my Maxima got robbed and was undrivable, last nite I got my NICO ecu and was trying it out on my way to work today. Next weekend being memorial day weekend, my fiancee and I are going to Wisconsin to relax over the few days. Durring my 7200RPM (indicated 7500RPM) on the tach the engine decided to go.... more specifically it spun a rod bearing. Here I am at work looking at my choices- repleace the rod bearings (done that before on my SR20 powered Sentra), pour some 90 weight oil in the motor and sell the car, or get a used engine from a local engine importer here in Chicago.

As many of you know I have rebuilt the engine from cylinder heads up, but I have never touched the lower end. Is it just a coincidence that the ECU that I just put in last nite spun my bearing ? Is it just not safe to take these old engines up that far ? Needless to say if I get a new motor I am going to swap out all the stuff from my original motor onto the new one.

I have a 91 Legend I will drive in the mean time, and my fiancee will drive the knocking Q till I figure out what I wanna do. My Maxima won't be done for another 2 weeks as the body shop and car stereo shop have to finish things on it. This makes for a wonderfull weekend for me

[jamesmost]

I feel your pain man, I would deff take some reprocautions as far as getting things resolved.

2 weeks ago my Maxima got robbed and was undrivable, last nite I got my NICO ecu and was trying it out on my way to work today. Next weekend being memorial day weekend, my fiancee and I are going to Wisconsin to relax over the few days. Durring my 7200RPM (indicated 7500RPM) on the tach the engine decided to go.... more specifically it spun a rod bearing. Here I am at work looking at my choices- repleace the rod bearings (done that before on my SR20 powered Sentra), pour some 90 weight oil in the motor and sell the car, or get a used engine from a local engine importer here in Chicago.

As many of you know I have rebuilt the engine from cylinder heads up, but I have never touched the lower end. Is it just a coincidence that the ECU that I just put in last nite spun my bearing ? Is it just not safe to take these old engines up that far ? Needless to say if I get a new motor I am going to swap out all the stuff from my original motor onto the new one.

I have a 91 Legend I will drive in the mean time, and my fiancee will drive the knocking Q till I figure out what I wanna do. My Maxima won't be done for another 2 weeks as the body shop and car stereo shop have to finish things on it. This makes for a wonderfull weekend for me

Thats horrible - sorry to hear that

[elwesso]

Yikes... I was sort of afraid of that because your engine was abused.., all I can say though is that my engine has been hitting 7300-7500 for the last 2-3 years and there have been no problmes, as many others.

[BlackBirdVQ]

Oil pump took a dump on me. I never repleaced it but at 7000RPM I felt like the engine lost a lil bit of power as it wouldn't climb RPMs. That was when the oil pump took a dump. I drove it like that without knowing for approx 10-15 min with no oil pump.... spun what it sounds like 1 rod bearing. I parked the car and will tear the lower end apart next week. Its going to take me approx 2 weeks to finish it, and I am just going to put a new oil pump in and new rod bearings. I was going to do a new oil pan on the car sooner or later, but I guess I get to do it soon. On a side note I get a AMG C32 to drive around in the mean time. My dealership is pulling some strings for me to get me a beater to drive around if this takes some time.

Reason for the oil pump to go bad- high RPMs, I've seen this happen on VQs quite alot from people pushing it past 7500RPMs. I don't wanna point fingers at Robs ECU, but if it wasn't for it I doubt my oil pump would go bad as I've ran up to stock redline many times. Oh well another rebuild...... and this time around I'm putting gauges in my car to monitor oil pressure, the stock IDIOT light is just plain stupid, I didn't even kick on and its not clearly vissible cause its soo small.

[elwesso]

Your engine is the ONLY one failed under JWT or Robert ECU... Its not the ECU's problem.... Sorry to be so blunt, but the engine must have been screwed regardless...

[BlackBirdVQ]

I'm not pointing fingers at the ECU, like I already said. I didn't know the oil pump was going to go bad under high RPM, and frankly I didn't even want the higher rev limiter as I find that VH45 doesn't make much power past 6500RPMs. Engine ran great, but the oil pump just lived a short life. It had nothing to do with the engine being overheated, rebuilt etc.... stuff just sorta happens and I really don't care- like I said before its just money.

I am just hopping the mains didn't go bad, and its just the rod bearings. I thought bout pulling the motor out of the car to do this.... but I do not want anyone messing with my engine while its out of the car. I even thought bout doing a LS1 swap, but I want this car drivable throught the summer and don't wanna take on another huge conversion project.

ECU did feel good throught the whole time, it got rid of alot of my hesitation issues, so I am not unhappy with it, I am glad I have it. But my motor will never see over 7K RPMs anymore even with the NICO ECU.

[Q45tech]

I've had a 7300 rpm redline since 1994 at 55,000 miles and today at 306,500 miles [90Q45] still going strong............engine failure is caused by lack of every 90 day oil changes and overheats from owner ABUSE..........I guessimate I've exceeded a real 7,000 rpms at least 1200 times [twice per week, 100 times per year x 13 years minimum. Hit rev limiter at least 100 times probably more.

[BlackBirdVQ]

I seriously doubt overheated engine has anything to do with MY oil pump failure. I work on ALOT of Acura Legends and RLs which come in smoking head gaskets out the tail pipe. Yet I have never seen a Honda need a oil pump.

I dont know the history of my cars maintenance, but I can tell you in the 3K miles I've put on the car so far since the engine rebuild- I changed the oil 4 times. Its got Mobil 1 in it currently, its a lil over the full mark.

I've only seen oil pumps fail from lack of oil changes, and those where VW/Audi engines. Especially the POS 1.8T.

[Q45tech]

Buyers should sign document that their engine has been maintained to oem severe standards since brand new or they should not be allowed to purchase ecu............but in a qausi REPUBLIC you cannot limit customers to protect themselves from themselves!

When you remove a portion of oem built in safety, sometimes unpleasant things happen................the old JWT price of $600 separated the wheat from the chaff..................at $125 every jabeep

."D. said that the Pennsylvanians had their own slang. A few of the younger soldiers called some of the old-timers "jabeeps". Note: modern translation of a "jabeep" is a knucklehead, numbnuts, or doofus."http://www.jefferson.k12.wi.us/jms/Libr ... ersJD.html

I am using the word as in the oldtimers version

[DrewQ45]

I seriously doubt overheated engine has anything to do with MY oil pump failure. I work on ALOT of Acura Legends and RLs which come in smoking head gaskets out the tail pipe. Yet I have never seen a Honda need a oil pump.

I dont know the history of my cars maintenance, but I can tell you in the 3K miles I've put on the car so far since the engine rebuild- I changed the oil 4 times. Its got Mobil 1 in it currently, its a lil over the full mark.

I've only seen oil pumps fail from lack of oil changes, and those where VW/Audi engines. Especially the POS 1.8T.

Blackbird, I'm so sorry to hear this man! This would be the first oil pump failure I've heard of on a Q45. Are you sure it's the pump that caused this? I spool my Q quite often now and it feels like the car purrs better now than she did a few months ago. What did the crank case and inside the oil cap look like when you first got the car?

...Drew..

[BlackBirdVQ]

That statement is very stupid. Do you own your Q since new ? How many people on this forum are the original owners of their car ? I only know of few.

I'm not suing Rob or even saying anything bad bout it, or am I ? I just simply said that high RPMs causes my engine to grenade the oil pump. People know what they are buying, and if you ask me 600 dollars for JWT is not worth it- I mean VH doesn't make any power past 6K RPM from looking at the dynos, your top speed limiter is not causing you to be late to work or something- we don't live in Autobahn-Germany. And gains from their ECU tuning are neglible, I have owned a few Nissans with their ECUs, I would never pay the price for their name. JWT is a piss poor excusse for someone who says "its the best ECU out there", its because they can't figure out how to set up and tune their stand alone or piggy back systems.

If I was REALLY serious about making my Q fast, I would pull the Emanage Ultimate out of my Maxima and use it on the Q. It offers everything the ECU does + its user adjustable. I'm serious about making my Maxima fast, my Q is just my daily hoopty.

[BlackBirdVQ]

Blackbird, I'm so sorry to hear this man! This would be the first oil pump failure I've heard of on a Q45. Are you sure it's the pump that caused this? I spool my Q quite often now and it feels like the car purrs better now than she did a few months ago. What did the crank case and inside the oil cap look like when you first got the car?

...Drew..

I've put on my oil pressure gauge on the port where the oil pressure sending unit is- I have 0psi at idle. I'm pretty sure the oil pump is done, as there is no way the chain could have jumped off the sprocket- I would hear a loud clanking noise.

Crankcase looked ok, so did the heads when I took them off. It looked like every other 10+ year old engine pretty much. There was no sludge in the motor anywhere. I have pictures of it, and they are on the forum here also.

I will fully assess the damages after the weekend when I take the motor apart. I am in a pretty sad mood as I do not have a car to drive with my Maxima being in the body shop. I have a used AMG to drive from work, but since it aint mine it just doesn't feel right.

My Q was always warmed up by me before I would take off, seeing how my Maxima has 155K trouble free miles on the odo and the engine looks like new- I think I know how to maintain my vehicles, so thanks Dennis.

[Falkdesigns]

Damn John, that sucks man. I had all my belts done at OMG *NOT* an Infiniti dealer or service center, but they were all genuine OEM parts. My Q hasn't been to the dealer for service since I bought it. It's not a freakin' exotic like a Ferrari, it's a high-end NISSAN and that's all it is.

Blackbird, sorry to hear about your woes. I have no idea what he's talking about most of the time and never got any help from him when I joined and actually had questions, so I just skip on past. Buyers should sign document?? What the heck does that mean? How would a Buyer know if the engine had been maintained?? Seller should sign document? Meh.

[DrewQ45]

I've put on my oil pressure gauge on the port where the oil pressure sending unit is- I have 0psi at idle. I'm pretty sure the oil pump is done, as there is no way the chain could have jumped off the sprocket- I would hear a loud clanking noise.

Yeah... sounds like the pump then. Don't think your GF could be driving it around if the chain jumped off the sprocket (unless it jumped a few teeth) cause it wouldn't run. I'm grieving your loss cuz you worked the sh*t outa that engine and am very curious as to what you will find. Keep us posted.

*Edit*... may I also suggest not rebuilding that engine as you don't know what else might be at the breaking point. Just the thought that the oil pump was gradually failing all along (reduced oil flow) is reason for you to pack it in. Just get a JDM unit , transfer all the bling over to it and be done with it. Good thing you got the tools and means at your disposal.
Modified by DrewQ45 at 3:07 PM 5/19/2006

[superuber]

Like others have said.....sorry to hear that! Question, did your motor have all those pretty colors on it when you got it? Who did you buy from? If you buy your car from grandma chances are it never saw much...buy your car from joey, well you get the picture! I have taken my Q to redline alot, with the 100 shot! Chances are if you bought it all pretty the guy was like me! Thanks for the info on the nico ecu, think I'll keep my JWT!

http://community.webshots.com/user/neheadsuperuber

[BlackBirdVQ]

Like others have said.....sorry to hear that! Question, did your motor have all those pretty colors on it when you got it? Who did you buy from? If you buy your car from grandma chances are it never saw much...buy your car from joey, well you get the picture! I have taken my Q to redline alot, with the 100 shot! Chances are if you bought it all pretty the guy was like me! Thanks for the info on the nico ecu, think I'll keep my JWT!

http://community.webshots.com/user/neheadsuperuber

No the engine looked nasty when I got it, it was severely overheated when I got it so I rebuild it 100% back to OEM using all new sensors, hardware, wires etc. Only thing untouched was the lower end- meaning the oil pan, block etc. If I end up buying a new motor everything will get swapped over. I dont like buying used motors thou, so this one will get a 3rd chance on life.

[superuber]

wish you the best. Make sure you bolt that plenum back on! I love that shine! What about the pulleys? I guess you can't try them. Maybe one of us can buy and try?

http://community.webshots.com/user/neheadsuperuber

[BlackBirdVQ]

By the time the pulleys will be done my VH will be purring away. I'm ordering up rod bearings next week along with the rest of the items. 2 weeks tops is my down time.

[elwesso]

I cant say I agree with many of your assessments Mike, but thats OK...

You really ought to drive a known good Q!

[louiegz]

No the engine looked nasty when I got it, it was severely overheated when I got it so I rebuild it 100% back to OEM using all new sensors, hardware, wires etc. Only thing untouched was the lower end- meaning the oil pan, block etc.

I don't know much about this, but I do have a question. Is it possible that since the engine was overheated before, could there have been something wrong with the lower end of the engine since you didn't work on it and you wouldn't have known? By the way, sorry to hear what happened to your engine. You did a lot of nice work to that old engine. It was nice.

[maxnix]

Is it possible that since the engine was overheated before, could there have been something wrong with the lower end of the engine since you didn't work on it and you wouldn't have known?

I think that is the bottom line; when one has an abused engine, don't for a second think all the ill effects were confined to one part of it.

I think the rebuild will go a long way to making it stronger than it was be fore. I would do the same if I had those his skills and resources.

[BlackBirdVQ]

Well I finally took the old crusty oil pan off the motor today, to my supprise someone was already in there, the rear bolts where almost hand tight- why I had a big oil leak from the rear of the engine ! I thought it was my rear main seal that started to leak right after I switched to Mobil 1 5W30 but it was just the oil pan leaking.

Oil pump is good, reason for the low to no oil pressure ? Clogged up oil screen. Looks like blue RTV or something that looks similar to blue was in my pickup screen. I used black Mopar ATF rebuild RTV as it holds up good to very thin oils like AFT for instance, so that RTV is not from me putting the motor togheter.

Engine looks super clean on the bottom end, no varnish or sludge anywhere, just nice golden color. I didn't take off the caps off the rods yet to figure out which rod is making the noise, I ran out of time to do this. Tomorrow I wanna take the plugs out and then take the caps off the rods to inspect the crank and bearings. If the crank is in perfect shape- which I think it will be as I haven't been driving the car since this happened, I will just reorder the same grade bearings as the ones that where in the car originally. I really do not have the time to plastigauge everything with the motor in the car.

I've fixed a few SR20s in the past with just some fresh rod bearings, the crank looked like new still and OE sized bearings where a success.

I wanna put in a aluminum VH41 oil pan on, but I am affraid that it will not clear the cross member. So I will be ordering up a new VH45 oil pan, new pick up screen, and new torque converter access plates- mine are all rusted out nasty looking. At the same time since the subframe is lowered I might just swap out the PS rack with a new reman one + Z32 PS computer.

I hope to see her runing by Tuesday or Wednesday if everything goes well. I'm stuck driving beaters from work which is not making me happy at all, as they sold the AMG and I got a POS 03 Grand Prix GT with a bad coil pack that does 0-60 in approx 25 seconds and tops out at 80MPH after like 3-5 min of accelerating it slowly.... I want my bloody cars back, I almost bought a BMW for a daily driver today as I was sooo pissed off at my lack of transportation.

[FarFetched]

If you knw that you are going on a trip, then you should have done it some time before the trip. A week or so before!That is what you are paying to have it done at the last minute.I am sorry, I am being rude but this is true!Seriously, never procrastinate things you can do on time!Cheers!P.S IMHO those pin-heads should compensate you for all your troubles. Servicing a car for 8 hrs call for opening of a can of whoopa$$!

[maxnix]

I really do not have the time to plastigauge everything with the motor in the car.

What else do you have that is so cheap? Take your time, do it right, and only do it once. Even if it costs you a week, it may save you years.