beef with FWD

Post by **89240sx** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Ok I dont hate FWD but what the hell is with them putting spoilers on them?!?

Doesnt a spoiler put downward pressure on the back? wouldnt that hinder the performance? ... everytime i see one with a spoiler it drives me nuts.... "i'm thinking WHY?!?"

or is this just a rice thing?

or am i just plane wrong?

Post by **LaureltheQueen** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

FWD spoilers are pretty much rice. The only time they come into effect is if the car is going in excess of 80 mph around corners, then it keeps the back end from getting squirrely.

Post by **lessthanjakejohn** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

it can still hold the back down during a turn or anything else for that matter, it improves high speed stability. Just because the power is coming through the front, doesn't mean that the back half of the car is unimportant.

Spoilers on a street car are just retarded no matter how fast you think you are going.

Post by **Eklectrick** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

it is a style thing. 99% of the cars you see with wings have them to make the car look better to the person who drives it. Many people say it is a "rice" thing. whatever. It has nothing to do with downforce at all. Most of the people who have big wings, if you ask them, will tell you it's just for looks.

Post by **TrueSlide** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Wings you see on street cars do nothing. I was just watching a Formula one feature on TechTV, and to get their wings and aerodynamics right, they spend months in a wind tunnel(they said around 2000tests!!!!), I know them APC wings have NEVER seen a wind tunnel and NEVER experience any type of tuning.

Post by **89240sx** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

allright thanks for the info so far... i just think it looks pretty silly ... i've only seen one wing i like so far.... and that is in this thread http://www.nissaninfiniticlub....23512 that whole car in my opinion is really nice.(and the NSX wing)

Post by **TrueSlide** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

I still think wings are dumb and ricey.

Post by **lessthanjakejohn** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

89240sx wrote:allright thanks for the info so far... i just think it looks pretty silly ... i've only seen one wing i like so far.... and that is in this thread http://www.nissaninfiniticlub....23512 that whole car in my opinion is really nice.(and the NSX wing)

nicely done

Post by **SmithSR** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Does anybody notice how a trend will be pushed and publicized so hard, only to then have the target demographic ignore it??

What I mean is, so much hype is given for useless aero kits/body kits/spoilers, and so much press and coverage on national tv shows, then, as it turns out, the trend is kicking back towards clean OEM styling. I'm quite happy about this, even if there are still thousands of kids who think that big wings are cool. I guess everybody has their own idea of what is stylish, but the cool thing is IMO, the push is getting back to where it should be with clean body lines, with an emphasis on OEM styling.

Post by **Eklectrick** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

I think its cuz people started getting bodykits and wings to stand out from the crowd, but since every one is doing it, that only makes you less origonal and more a part of the crowd. I expect to see more modest looking cars and a larger JDM trend in the future.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Everyone is so anti wing. I used to be. But i think that certain wings look really good on the 240/180. Like the wing on Agasthiya's Flagship car.

You dont have to agree. Its just my .02

Post by **89240sx** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

I'm not saying wings dont look good , i'm just saying wings on a FWD are kindof pointless.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

I would have to agree, afterall the functional use of a wing is to create downforce.

In a FWD car you wont exceed the tractional limits of rear tires as easily as a RWD car. Example, 80mph highway, quick change of lanes, staying on the throttle.

Post by **skydragoness** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

generally i would think that a fwd car would never need a *functional* wing unless it sees serious speed. (read: not on public roads) as they are used on fwd cars in the USTCC.

i like wings. mostly whale-tail type wings, or wangan-type wings.

regarding what Smith SR said, i totally agree. so instead of us complaining about ricers we should all be glad they don't want to be tasteful in their' car's aesthetic-department like the rest of us. because soon the new hype will be the clean/oem/jdm/--look.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

the hype will go anywhere the media points the thousands of import 'tuners' that cant figure out what to like on their own.

After the new F&F and with all the coverage "drift" has been getting i am sure thats what we will see next. Civics and accords hand brakeing around corners and in parking lots. I saw an accord to a handbrake turn in traffic not 2 days ago.

Edit: thats a little off topic, i side tracked myself. My original point was that I know what I like, and what I want on/in my car. And i wish there was originality and acceptance, instead of a majority of punks doing what everyone else is doing.

Post by **LaureltheQueen** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

JDM is the new rice.

You get more little sluts at car shows putting their black wheels on cars, they DONT LOOK GOOD! But since drag races use them, having black wheels automatically makes their car that much cooler looking. Bah. I'll stick with my version of cool.

Post by **MainEvent212** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

lol i like black wheels :'(

but yeah...i wanna find an OEM ish kit for my zenki S14...i got a knockoff veilside and i'm hateing it more and more every time i see it...

*car's unpainted and ugly right now cuz it's being "rebuilt"*

i dub it...save the silvias

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

i too like black rims. But i have a black car. so i can claim blackout-sleek. That isnt too popular.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Post by **LaureltheQueen** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

give it 6 months.

Post by **wpg240** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

89240sx wrote:I'm not saying wings dont look good , i'm just saying wings on a FWD are kindof pointless.

FWD or RWD makes no difference to the functionality of the wing. The usefulness of a wing on a RWD car is no more important that that of a FWD car. Wings ar designed to create downforce at high speed. (keeping the car glued to the road) A properly tuned wing would prove to be beneficial if your car was going FAST (significantly faster than the speed limit to be of any use) whether it's RWD or FWD.

The drive configuration makes no difference.

Post by **slw240sx** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

speaking of car sluts, anyone else get kinda annoyed with them when they are flocking around? , i dont know but when im surrounded by skanky looking girls that are flocking around cars and start to stare at me or my car i get the uncontrolable urge to give them the single finger wave and yell cruel profane things to them, or other various degrading stuff! is this just me am i weird?

Post by **forsaken** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

My friend had a ~$2000 wing on his RSX and he (and other people who drove his car with and without it) said that there is a big difference in how the car stays planted on the highway at 80+. Then again it is a $2000 wing...

Post by **JJ240** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Id doesnt take near as much speed as you seem to think for a wing to function. As soon as there is any airflow around it downforce is being created. The amount of airflow around it that is needed to make significant amounts of downforce completely depends on the wing. Most OEM wings do function, and many aftermarket wings are functional as well. Most of the people who put them on their cars dont do it because of what the wing can do, but because of how it looks. That is why everyone says it does nothing. FWD JGTC300 cars have wings and their cars have no more than 300 HP.

Post by **MainEvent212** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

the difference is the type of function...

most JGTC and likewise type of wings are 2000+ dollars

those kinda wings create downforce

OEM wings are made to steady turbulence...not to give downforce

Post by **JJ240** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

Its not the price of the wing that matters. Its the design of the wing. I didnt say that OEM wings created downforce. I said they are functional. There are plenty of wings that work for decently modded FWD imports. A turbo civic can hit 100 in the 1/4. With acceleration and speed like that a wing that creates some downforce and stabilizes is very valuable.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

JJ240 Stabilization is the use of the wing on an FWD in the quarter, not Down force.

Post by **JJ240** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

its still creating downforce though, thats part of what is stabilizing it.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

wpg240 wrote:FWD or RWD makes no difference to the functionality of the wing. The usefulness of a wing on a RWD car is no more important that that of a FWD car. /B]

This statement is wrong.

As a matter of fact, I dont think it could possibly be more wrong.

It has to do with traction. A tire can only provide X amount of traction at any given point, lets use for example 100% (the most traction the tire could possibly give, as when it is sitting at a stop)

Now, you have to devide that traction between three forces, Acceleration, Handling and Deceleration. On a RWD car, entering a corner at high speed and applying throttle you are using that tire for two things. Following the front tires, and propelling the car. Run out of traction, and suddnely you are a drifter. The use of a downforce wing in this situation is to keep your rear end planted and following the front of the car.

A FWD car does not work in this way. Enter a corner at high speed uses the rear tires in one way, to follow the front. Where as the front tires are being used in two ways. Too much throttle will break the tires grip and the car will 'nose' or slide in the direction of its momentum. (not around the corner.

)

Sorry for the long post. But i wasnt gonna say that you were wrong without a good explanation.

Post by **Cyberkreig** » Sat May 31, 2003 1:28 pm

JJ240 wrote:its still creating downforce though, thats part of what is stabilizing it.

Streamlining the airflow off of the car is the other half of the stability improvement. a FWD on the quarter mile has nothing to cause loss of traction on the back tires.

EDIT: unless you are talking about aiflow under the car and lift, but that is a different topic.

beef with FWD

beef with FWD

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