Backup mirror modification

[svard75]

[*]Mirrors would move as the signals changed, might not be noticeable to most humans, but could be tough on the equipment.

Shouldn't be a problem. Because the BCM is not what makes the mirrors move down and in it's the automatic drivers positioner module which connects to the mirrors directly. We would only be using the turn signal lines pre-BCM to activate a low voltage relay which grounds either 2 or 18 depending on which turn signal used.

[*]Above could prevent mirrors from ever actually going all the way down.

This of course is my concern as well since the turn signal indicator actually shuts off when you are turning your wheel after a certain point so it could be a problem.

[*]Both mirrors might also move when the headlights were on.
[*]Driver mirror would also move when the fog lights were on.
[*]Passenger mirror would also move when the high beams were on.
[*]Each mirror would have one other trigger I don't know (PASSING and LIGHTING)

Again because it's not the BCM that controls this movement but the automatic driver positioning system it wouldn't. Unless you've got a finger pushing the mirror direction switch then yes the mirrors would move in that direction. The TCM sends a signal to the Driver positioning system when in Reverse plus either terminal 2 or 18 are grounded which triggers the ADPS to position the mirror down.

The schematic might look like this.

[TDot]

That's seems to be how the schematic should look. It shouldn't cause the suggested issues. Remember, all it is is adding a secondary switch, nothing more. And that switch won't activate unless the car is in reverse.

This of course is my concern as well since the turn signal indicator actually shuts off when you are turning your wheel after a certain point so it could be a problem.

Damn, this would be a huge problem that I didn't even think about. When you turn the wheel the opposite way it cancels out the turn signal and then the mirror goes back. It's possible to bypass that by taking a relay and wiring the signal from the reverse position to prevent that automatic function from kindling in, but I don't even want to think about that.

Edit: I changed my mind, I'm going to look how the automatic return of the turn signal works.

[The00Dustin]

The schematic might look like this.

That shows the wiring TO the combination switches. The schematic on BCS-7 shows the wiring IN the combination switches. BCM input 4 is connected to BCM outputs 5, 3, 2, and 1 in the switch. BCM input 5 is connected to BCM outputs 4, 3, 2, and 1 in the switch. I don't understand how this can not be a problem. I don't see anything in your diagram that would magically ignore activity from those sources. Even IF that wasn't a problem, the timing diagram on BCS-8 shows that EACH output on the BCM is active less than 20% of the time in a 10 or 60 ms cycle. So really you would need to wire something in to trigger an output from a constant source only in the following circumstances:
LH: Output 1 and Input 4 are active
RH: Output 1 and Input 5 are active
Then you would need to keep that triggered output active until Output 1 was active without the relevant input being active. This could certainly be done with an IC, and presumably with the right other electrical components, but this assumes the turn signal is mechanical like my 06 or the wheel still mechanically turns it off with a digital signal.

Regarding my comments on the schematics and diagrams in BCS-7, please explain how I am reading them wrong if that is the case.

EDIT: Removed comment about signal while switching lanes due to TDot's comment that switch won't activate mirrors unless in reverse (forgot the car already did this).

EDIT2: If a relay could require input from three sources at once trigger, on that short of a signal, and be held triggered by the reverse signal (assuming it is constant), this would make the signal turning off moot until the car was taken out of reverse, thus eliminating the need to worry about when/if/how the turn signal is canceled.

[svard75]

Pay attention to the arrow indicating the signal flow (or any of the diodes) of the diagram in BCS-8. Output of BCM is indicated as pins 1-5 in the BCM diag. This is the transistor diagram as shown in BCS-7 right? I know what's confusing. The BCM states COMBI SW OUTPUT but if you ignore that are take a look at the chart in LT-187, notice the wire color column? 2 and 3 are L/R and O/L which is the ones I am connecting to.

You may be correct on the signal pulses since reading this comment in BCS-8.

"NOTE: Each OUTPUT terminal transistor is activated at 10 ms intervals. Therefore after switch is turned ON, electrical
loads are activated with time delay. But this time delay is so short that it cannot be detected by human
senses"

Perhaps if you introduced a capacitor to the circuit with the correct voltage and uF it may give you sufficient charge to change the signal from pulse to constant.

[The00Dustin]

Pay attention to the arrow indicating the signal flow (or any of the diodes) of the diagram in BCS-8. Output of BCM is indicated as pins 1-5 in the BCM diag. This is the transistor diagram as shown in BCS-7 right? I know what's confusing. The BCM states COMBI SW OUTPUT but if you ignore that are take a look at the chart in LT-187, notice the wire color column? 2 and 3 are L/R and O/L which is the ones I am connecting to.

OK, so are you saying that the row on LT-187 with terminal 3 indicates that the Leftt Turn Signal will give the desired but somehow, magically perhaps, LT-16 terminal 2 will NOT give an undesired result in the same scenario?

I am suggesting that (operating under the assumption that wiring as you state will work to make the driver mirror go down when the left turn signal is active and the car is in reverse) having the high beams on will also make the driver mirror go down when the car is in reverse (I don 't know whether the high beams actually have to be on, or the switch only in the on position).

Further, are you also saying that the row on LT-187 with terminal 3 indicates that the Right Turn Signal will give the desired but somehow, magically perhaps, LT-169 terminal 3 will NOT give an undesired result in the same scenario?

I am suggesting that (operating under the assumption that wiring as you state will work to make the passenger mirror go down when the right turn signal is active and the care is in reverse) having the fog lights on will also make the passenger mirror go down when the car is in reverse (I don't know if the fog lights actually have to be on, or the switch only in the on position).

I don't think there are any more ways I can explain this, but the more you try to explain why I am wrong, the more my research makes me think I am right.

ETA additional points of interest:
LT-10 wiring diagram regarding LT-16 terminals
LT-165 wiring diagram regarding LT-169 terminals

[TDot]

Damn there goes the second monkey wrench, I hate to admit that you may be right lol. How many wrenches before someone should give up? I understand what you've been saying now that the wire transmits multiple signals and the bcm deciphers it and decides what to do, probably by ways of frequency range which may explain the oscilloscope. I'm going to look at this a little more, because even if that is the case, as complicated as it seems, there has to be a simple way that the bcm breaks it down. Now I have to read through the whole thing instead of looking for harnesses, wires, and voltages smh. If it is frequency based that's an easy fix with an inline filter and testing with an oscilloscope. Although I would like to know if that's the case before I begin.

See, this is why I made the topic before I started.

Any counter svard75 while I look into this? But I think he has us lol.

[svard75]

You're right Dustin. I didn't see the entire picture and typically skim posts so apologies if I have offended you.

What if you did something simple. For example if you find a toggle switch with a long throw lever. Mount it in the steering column and attach the lever to the turn signal switch body from the rear so you can't see it. That might just do the trick.

[Six_Legs]

You gentleman lost me a long time ago, this is WAY over my head!

Would you encounter the same/similar issues if the high beam controller was used instead?

[DeanM45]

Pretty confident that you guys are WAY over-thinking this.

You need a DPDT switch.
The common, center poles of the switch go to pins 2 (violet) and 18 (orange) of the automatic drive position control unit.
The top poles go to pins 2 and 3 (2 to 18, and 3 to 2) of the mirror switch. the bottom two poles go to ground.

Sorry for the crude drawing:


You get the idea. You just need to supply ground to pins 2 and 18 of the auto drive position control unit to make both mirrors go down when put in reverse.
Put the switch "up" and both mirrors go down when in reverse. Put the switch "down" and everything works stock.

[DeanM45]

I had my engineer hat on too tight from work, common sense kicked in -- much simpler solution.
On the back of the stock mirror switch, pins 2 and 3, orange and violet---You just need to tap in a wire to each one and run it to a SPST switch. When the switch is on is causes the car to see both the L and R mirror switch as "selected". When the switch is off everything is stock. Again, you just need to TAP into the violet and orange wires from the mirror switch -- no cutting of the wires.
Verified by putting a jumper wire between pins 2 and 3 on the mirror switch (so like switch on). Any adjustment works both mirrors at the same time and when put into reverse, both mirrors go down. Pulled the wire out (so like switch off) and everything back to normal.

[The00Dustin]

I understand what you've been saying now that the wire transmits multiple signals and the bcm deciphers it and decides what to do, probably by ways of frequency range which may explain the oscilloscope. I'm going to look at this a little more, because even if that is the case, as complicated as it seems, there has to be a simple way that the bcm breaks it down. Now I have to read through the whole thing instead of looking for harnesses, wires, and voltages smh. If it is frequency based that's an easy fix with an inline filter and testing with an oscilloscope. Although I would like to know if that's the case before I begin.

It's NOT frequency based, it's cyclical. You only need to understand BCS, which is a short document. When BCM output 1 is on, BCM outputs 2-5 are off. When BCM output 2 is on, BCM outputs 1,3-5 are off. When BCM output 3 is on BCM outputs 1-2,4-5 are off. I hope you see the pattern by now.

For what you want, we only care about BCM output 1. BCM output 1 can signal up to 4 actions by way of BCM inputs 2-5. So, when BCM output 1 is on and BCM input 4 sees voltage, the LH turn signal comes on, and it stays on until BCM output 1 comes on again and BCM input 4 does not see voltage. To repeat the same thing for the RH turn signal, when BCM output 1 is on and BCM input 5 sees voltage, the RH turn signal comes on, and it stays on until BCM output 1 comes on again and BCM input 5 does not see voltage.

The problem is BCM input 4 can also see voltage from BCM outputs 2-3,5 and BCM input 5 can also see voltage from BCM outputs 2-4, so you need to eliminate those potential false signals (two of which I showed to exist in LT, the rest all shown along with those two in BCS).

If you really want to use the turn signal...

That shows the wiring TO the combination switches. The schematic on BCS-7 shows the wiring IN the combination switches. BCM input 4 is connected to BCM outputs 5, 3, 2, and 1 in the switch. BCM input 5 is connected to BCM outputs 4, 3, 2, and 1 in the switch. I don't understand how this can not be a problem. I don't see anything in your diagram that would magically ignore activity from those sources. Even IF that wasn't a problem, the timing diagram on BCS-8 shows that EACH output on the BCM is active less than 20% of the time in a 10 or 60 ms cycle. So really you would need to wire something in to trigger an output from a constant source only in the following circumstances:
LH: Output 1 and Input 4 are active
RH: Output 1 and Input 5 are active
Then you would need to keep that triggered output active until Output 1 was active without the relevant input being active. This could certainly be done with an IC, and presumably with the right other electrical components, but this assumes the turn signal is mechanical like my 06 or the wheel still mechanically turns it off with a digital signal.

Regarding my comments on the schematics and diagrams in BCS-7, please explain how I am reading them wrong if that is the case.

EDIT: Removed comment about signal while switching lanes due to TDot's comment that switch won't activate mirrors unless in reverse (forgot the car already did this).

EDIT2:If a relay could require input from three sources at once, trigger, on that short of a signal, and be held triggered by the reverse signal (assuming it is constant), this would make the signal turning off moot until the car was taken out of reverse, thus eliminating the need to worry about when/if/how the turn signal is canceled.

Relay might not be the right word, and you could always use the actual 12V feed for the reverse bulbs if you can't find any other non pulsing source for the reverse signal (and it now looks to me like the "trigger signal" I mentioned is just ground, but hopefully you already knew that if I'm right).

You're right Dustin. I didn't see the entire picture and typically skim posts so apologies if I have offended you.

Not offended, I wasn't sure I was right until you pointed me to something I could prove I was right with, so I'd say we were helping each other learn, even if not in the most efficient way.

[TDot]

Yeah, I thought of that scenario as soon as I saw the contact schematic, and putting a snow switch in the empty slot down there, but I prefer to have one mirror down and one mirror normal so I can watch the street. That's why I wanted to use the turn signal for easy and quick access with the flip of my finger while I'm turning the wheel. But I think the steering wheel return will be the biggest problem being attached to the afs I don't really want to mess with that. And I started reading the entire LT straight through to see if I missed anything else, but had to go to sleep and didn't get to the steering wheel fsm yet. I think I'll have to shelf this idea, but I'll read on over the weekend. Great input from all, thanks.

[The00Dustin]

Yeah, I thought of that scenario as soon as I saw the contact schematic, and putting a snow switch in the empty slot down there, but I prefer to have one mirror down and one mirror normal so I can watch the street. That's why I wanted to use the turn signal for easy and quick access with the flip of my finger while I'm turning the wheel. But I think the steering wheel return will be the biggest problem being attached to the afs I don't really want to mess with that. And I started reading the entire LT straight through to see if I missed anything else, but had to go to sleep and didn't get to the steering wheel fsm yet. I think I'll have to shelf this idea, but I'll read on over the weekend. Great input from all, thanks.

I assume you didn't see and read my entire lengthy post yet, but just in case you did, to say it another way, I'm suggesting that the reverse bulbs are a constant analog signal that can be used to hold a relay (or something else) in position once the appropriate signal is detected (output 1 PLUS input 4 OR 5), then the turn signal doesn't need to stay on at all, it only needs to be on briefly to trigger the "relay (or something else)".

EDIT: corrected input, output, and numbers RE: appropriate signal

[svard75]

Dustin, we could use a normally open timed open relay? I'm still not following how we could tap into the combination switch to isolate just the LH and RH turn switches. If the bcm interprets based on signal pulse frequency then one would have to simulate a bcm running at the same frequency.

Dean we've already suggested switches a few times but TDot doesn't want to add any new switches.

Tbh TDot the ROI and ROE are not there. It would have been cool if infiniti built that in but going through this effort isn't worth it IMO. However the fact that we all jumped at a cool new idea is neat. Perhaps if we turned our effort one other ideas and manage to think it through we could potentially come up with something innovative that we can sell back to an auto manufacturer.

[TDot]

I'm still not following how we could tap into the combination switch to isolate just the LH and RH turn switches.

+1.

Tbh TDot the ROI and ROE are not there. It would have been cool if infiniti built that in but going through this effort isn't worth it IMO. However the fact that we all jumped at a cool new idea is neat. Perhaps if we turned our effort one other ideas and manage to think it through we could potentially come up with something innovative that we can sell back to an auto manufacturer.

Starting to agree.

[DeanM45]

Dean we've already suggested switches a few times but TDot doesn't want to add any new switches.

LOL, that's what I get for fumbling through a thread when tired.

Since all of the switches in the car are used for "something else" already there will always be at least one other action that happens. The turn signals are a neat idea but integrating that would be difficult at best. A super simple solution would be to use a switched item at the end.
ie use a relay wired to the foglight. Foglights on trips the relay and sends a ground signal to which ever output of the mirror switch you want. Foglights off no signal would be sent and the mirrors would function as normal (dependent solely on how the mirror switch is "switched".

Of course for this to work you would have to have the headlights on all the time (unless you have the fog bypass set up) but that would be a down and dirty way to do it. Otherwise you will have to integrate with the CAN BUS system (like UpRev does with the cruise control buttons but again, two things happen --hit the cancel button to switch maps and cruise cancels).

[The00Dustin]

Dustin, we could use a normally open timed open relay? I'm still not following how we could tap into the combination switch to isolate just the LH and RH turn switches. If the bcm interprets based on signal pulse frequency then one would have to simulate a bcm running at the same frequency.

When I said cyclical earlier, I should have said timing based. I could certainly be wrong, but it looks to me like each each input does up to four things, but only one thing at a time based on which output is active. IOW, the outputs are dumb, and the inputs know what to do based on which output is active. We can tell if an input is active, and we can tell if an output is active, so all we need is something to trigger a contact when that happens and then hold that contact until something else happens. This would be easy if you had PLC or IC knowledge, but without it, something dumb (relay?) that is fast enough and can trigger a contact on one condition but hold it on another will work.

Output 1 happens to be the trigger for both turn signals, and you guys already knew about inputs 4 and 5 being the other half of the equation. Logically, what you originally planned is this:

Code: Select all

if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 4 = +1V
then GROUND(?) LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18,O)
while LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18) IS GROUNDED(?)
if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 4 = 0V
then UNGROUND(?) LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18,O)

Code: Select all

if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 5 = +1V
then GROUND(?) RH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (2,Y)
while LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18) IS GROUNDED(?)
if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 5 = 0V
then UNGROUND(?) RH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (2,Y)

However, I don't see how you can do that without some sort a PLC or IC (I'm not saying it can't be done, I just don't know how). Also, as TDot pointed out, doing it that way means that when the turn signal is cancelled, the mirror goes back up, and if that is undesired, the turn signal cancel must be finagled with as well. What I am suggesting logically looks more like this:

Code: Select all

if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 4 = +1V and REVERSE LIGHTS = +12V
then GROUND(?) LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18,O)
while LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18) IS GROUNDED(?)
if REVERSE LIGHTS = 0V
then UNGROUND(?) LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18,O)

Code: Select all

if OUTPUT 1 = +1V and INPUT 5 = +1V and REVERSE LIGHTS = +12V
then GROUND(?) RH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (2,Y)
while LH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (18) IS GROUNDED(?)
if REVERSE LIGHTS = 0V
then UNGROUND(?) RH MIRROR SELECT SWITCH (2,Y)

This way the turn signal only activates the mirrors and then is no longer involved. Also, it seems to me like it might be possible to do that with a relay or some other dumb contact since there is a constant signal to lock on to after the contact is triggered, but I'm not certain. Whatever is used would need to trigger on a very short pulse.

Another option, barring the ability for a relay or other dumb contact to do that, some type of very simple AND gate IC could potentially be used to make a connection that triggers a relay when the output and relevant input are both +1V. I was previously referring to programmable ICs, but if an AND gate IC exists that will connect 12V from one pin to another (to trigger a relay) when two other pins equal 1V, programming still wouldn't be necessary.

I believe it is possible to "make" an AND gate with non-digital electronic components, so that might be an option as well, but I don't know how to do that, and much like I put a (?) next to GROUND because I don't want to be responsible for saying grounding those pins is all that is necessary or even that it's OK to ground them (maybe a resistor should be used to protect the equipment even though that isn't shown in the diagram?), I don't want to search for and provide instructions that could be wrong for creating an AND gate.

[DeanM45]

Hold gate (variation of a flip flop circuit) - same concept I used for the paddle shifters on my M45. -- you'll need 2, one for each side.
Put in reverse - initiate circuit (you can use the reverse lights)
Wait for a turn signal signal (using the turn signal light) - this will serve as a trigger signal - constant not needed.
Send ground signal to which ever side of the switch is needed and hold.
Wait for reverse signal (reverse light) to go out and then end circuit.

Downside to this is the only way to get the mirror to return to normal is to take the car out of reverse. Also, each side would operate independently -- meaning if you used the left ts and then the right ts both mirrors would be down until taken out of reverse.

Upside to this is that there is no CAN-BUS integration.

[TDot]

I only know how to do multiple conditional operations when it comes to software, when it comes to hardware after one "'if' relay" it's over my head. But it's intriguing to me and willing to learn for this.

Downside to this is the only way to get the mirror to return to normal is to take the car out of reverse.

I don't understand, isn't that how it already works? Although I have personally seen this as a downside tbh. I never liked that as I park and put the car in R D R D...maybe one more R, the mirror goes up and down and up and...you get the point.

Also, each side would operate independently -- meaning if you used the left ts and then the right ts both mirrors would be down until taken out of reverse.

I don't really see this as a problem because as it is, I don't really think people use the TS for parking, so the chances of them flipping the other side is probably unlikely. Besides, why would someone need to use both sides in parallel parking...at least ice never come across that issue.

I'm going to ask someone about this idea.

[DeanM45]

I only know how to do multiple conditional operations when it comes to software, when it comes to hardware after one "'if' relay" it's over my head. But it's intriguing to me and willing to learn for this.

Downside to this is the only way to get the mirror to return to normal is to take the car out of reverse.

I don't understand, isn't that how it already works? Although I have personally seen this as a downside tbh. I never liked that as I park and put the car in R D R D...maybe one more R, the mirror goes up and down and up and...you get the point.

Well, no, you can move the window switch to the middle and the mirror will return to normal.

Also, each side would operate independently -- meaning if you used the left ts and then the right ts both mirrors would be down until taken out of reverse.

I don't really see this as a problem because as it is, I don't really think people use the TS for parking, so the chances of them flipping the other side is probably unlikely. Besides, why would someone need to use both sides in parallel parking...at least ice never come across that issue.

I'm going to ask someone about this idea.

If you want to avoid circuit design you could do the same thing with a pair of latching relays, and a couple of normal relays (to isolate the blinker and reverse lights). You'd also need a DPDT relay for the latching relay reset. If I get some time over Turkey day I'll see what I can put together.

[svard75]

I'm wondering if there would be any adverse effects from adding a circuit (additional resistance) to the combo switch circuit. If I were to do this mod I would simplify it similar to what Dustin suggested but just add a relay to the output of the rear lights to the relay for both mirrors and a switch somewhere hidden to de-activate the relay. Using this may be a greater load on the driver positioning system. I think Dustin already mentioned this.

[The00Dustin]

I can't believe I didn't think about actually using the turn signals instead of trying to use outputs and inputs from the BCM. Both are intermittent, and the turn signal bulbs are on for long enough for just about any system to detect them. I'm thinking Dean has the right idea with actually using the circuits that go to the bulbs for both turn signal detection and reverse. I suppose svard's suggestion to use a switch to deactivate the relay (instead of involving reverse at all) wouldn't be terrible since then the mirror wouldn't have to go up and down (and/or you wouldn't have to signal repeatedly) when doing the R,D,R,D,R shuffle.

ETA: No, the mirrors would still go up and down by design in the car. Plus you need to use reverse to trigger the relays so the circuit isn't set on both mirrors from normal driving before you ever try to park. May as well have the relays handle the release of your setting when you take it out of reverse. Otherwise several things can go wrong if you forgot to do the manual release:
1) You bump the mirror adjustment and the mirror moves even though the switch is in the neutral position.
2) You bumy the mirror adjustment and both mirrors move (don't know if this is really possible) even though the switch is in the neutral position.
3) When you put it in reverse, both mirrors go down because both relay sets were previously triggered and the reset hasn't been manually performed.
4) When both mirror selector switch points are set, it causes some odd problem(s) and you don't know what is going on until you happen to reset it.

[TDot]

The latching relay is perfect. I thought of using the blinkers, but figured I'd have to use capacitors to compensate for the intermittent signal and I know nothing about capacitors. I never heard about latching relays before, seems perfect. Off the top of my head I'm thinking a small hole can be drilled and a nice button with a light indicator can be placed right beside the cigarette lighter hole (in the corner of the surrounding square), that way as you put the car in park your hand can just slide down and hit the button...convenient...to deactivate the latching mechanism (I just browsed through the whole mechanics of latch relays, so hopefully I'm understanding it). The latching should also be set up to deactivate when the car shuts down. I personally can easily do this by tapping into the shutdown mechanism of my carputer, but I'm going to look into a different way for others.

So to line this up and understand it.
1/ the factory switch stays centered.
2/ the car is put in reverse, nothing happens.
3/ the TS is flipped, the corresponding latch activates which passes the reverse signal through.
4/ the reverse signal holds the ground for the factory switch to the corresponding side for the mirror and it goes down
5/ the latch stays locked until the momentary button is pressed (or the car is shut off).

If that is the case, I looked at these buttons....still looking.

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/CK- ... fMiAClw%3d

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Wel ... UPQVlc8%3d

http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/E-S ... tvHYegE%3d

[The00Dustin]

In gradeschool, I made an alarm for a science fair project. The alarm had a key switch that activated the alarm and a SPST switch that triggered it. The only other things attached to the circuit were the wiring, a relay, the power adapter (pretty sure it was 12VDC), and the horn for the alarm. I don't remember exactly how it was wired because it was decades ago, but when the key switch was in the active position, the alarm would go off when the SPST switch completed a circuit and continue going off until the key switch was moved to the inactive position (or the power source removed).

I've got to believe you could tap into the reverse lights for your latching instead of installing a switch in the dash for manual turn-off. If you like the switch idea, that's great, but if you want it to turn-off automatically, it seems like that would be the way to do it. The relay had several open terminals with that configuration, so it may have been possible to latch on hot or ground depending on how it was wired (or it may latch on broken/completed circuit), and/or it may have been able to trigger on hot or ground (vs completed circuit). Even if it wasn't, worse case you'd need a couple inductive switches or whatever Svard mentioned earlier (to complete or break circuits when the turn signals or reverse lights have power), and I'm sure those come in both normally opened and normally closed varieties.

[TDot]

The problem with using the reverse to turn off the latch is while parallel parking you're constantly activating and deactivating the reverse lights...D, R, D, R remember. So the latch will constantly turn off just like if I were to simply use the TS. Unless there's something I'm not seeing with the reverse signal.

[svard75]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQ37vljpHKs

[The00Dustin]

The problem with using the reverse to turn off the latch is while parallel parking you're constantly activating and deactivating the reverse lights...D, R, D, R remember. So the latch will constantly turn off just like if I were to simply use the TS. Unless there's something I'm not seeing with the reverse signal.

No, you're not missing anything, I'm constantly forgetting the same thing over and over. That's three times in this thread. If you can reset the relay with a button, maybe you could reset it with the park signal, although that leads back to figuring out another potentially complicated mechanism within the BCM.

[svard75]

Use the circuit from the youtube vid and the reverse light as the energizer. Find the right resistor/capacitor combination that will give you enough time to complete parking. You may be able to setup a double relay where the reverse activates one relay then reverse activates the second which then powered the timer circuit from the youtube video. That relay then ground the appropriate mirror. I'm just not sure of the double relay part. You would want to activate the timer circuit only after both conditions are met reverse and turn signal and only then to activate the timer relay. This way when the turn signal stops the double relay breaks but the capacitor continues to power the relay that grounds the mirror.

[svard75]

Actually I have an idea. As soon as the capacitor is grounded it looses it's charge so if you use a double relay where one is grounded after the car is taken out of reverse then the mirror would go up immediately.

[svard75]

I forgot to add a ground symbol to both second SPST relays at the ends of the coil. There should be enough voltage to charge up the capacitor during the 500ms pulses using the LH/RH turn signals.

If you go through with this, test it outside of the vehicle.