APPLEBONKER.. I'm stepping up my game a bit...

[rjdmmfl1]

OK, so I'm following your lead a bit and moving to an active crossover setup for my front stage.... I heard a car setup like yours with no rear fill and a hella good front sound stage and it blew my car out of the water SQ-wise (probably just like yours would)

I'm going with the audio control DQXS didgital EQ/crossover system

I'm moving my Boston Acoustics to my rear fill, and going with some MB Quart (the old ones that were really made in Germany, not the new ones made in china) component tweeter and 4" midrange and a set of dynaudio 8" woofers for my midbass

we're setting the staging up via custom A pillars and the midbass woofers will be put into custom kickplates and floorboard boxes.

The dynaudio rep at my local install shop was there the other day, and I almost blew my load in his car it sounded so good (only another audiophile junkie would understand)

Anyway, hopefully this meets your approval, but I would love any comments, critiques, words of wisdom from my audio brother from another mother...

[AppleBonker]

Excellent. Running active is so much fun. I'm still tuning mine to this day, so you'll have your work cut out for you, but you can get to much better sound with an active crossover setup (I'm more or less just tuning for different sources).

I thought about running a 3-way setup up front, but I didn't want to make custom A-Pillars and I definitely would have a hard time fitting kick panels in having a manual transmission and all.

Which dynaudio midbass are you looking at? My next upgrade to my stereo will probably be into some dynaudio stuff, but I'm looking at the esotar2 tweets and midranges (so insanely expensive - no money for this right now). I wonder if this is what the rep was running in his car?

Why the MB selection for tweets/midranges? Not that I'm disagreeing with you on this, just wondering if you could swing a deal putting more dynaudio stuff in your car.

Either way, this upgrade is going to sound phenomenal. You'll be able to pull some bass away from your sub (since 8" dynaudio midbass drivers should reach down near 30Hz fairly effectively - down to 45 Hz will be no problem at all) which will clean up the substage as well.

It's funny how excited I am about this. It's not even my car! I can't wait to hear reviews from you once you get this going. Your system upgrade is going to be

[rjdmmfl1]

Excellent. Running active is so much fun. I'm still tuning mine to this day, so you'll have your work cut out for you, but you can get to much better sound with an active crossover setup (I'm more or less just tuning for different sources).

I thought about running a 3-way setup up front, but I didn't want to make custom A-Pillars and I definitely would have a hard time fitting kick panels in having a manual transmission and all.

Which dynaudio midbass are you looking at? My next upgrade to my stereo will probably be into some dynaudio stuff, but I'm looking at the esotar2 tweets and midranges (so insanely expensive - no money for this right now). I wonder if this is what the rep was running in his car?

Why the MB selection for tweets/midranges? Not that I'm disagreeing with you on this, just wondering if you could swing a deal putting more dynaudio stuff in your car.

Either way, this upgrade is going to sound phenomenal. You'll be able to pull some bass away from your sub (since 8" dynaudio midbass drivers should reach down near 30Hz fairly effectively - down to 45 Hz will be no problem at all) which will clean up the substage as well.

It's funny how excited I am about this. It's not even my car! I can't wait to hear reviews from you once you get this going. Your system upgrade is going to be

well this is the thing, my audio shop isn't a dynaudio dealer, but my custom guys has a pair of hardly used 8" midbass drivers that he wasn';t using... the dynaudio rep was there trying to convine the shop to start carrying dynaudio and diamond audio also...

I know there are better options for the tweeter and midrange, but the old MB quart stuff that was made in Germany is pretty decent, much better than the china made stuff right now! And its literally the last of the German made MB Quart they have in the shop, everything else is the new stuff

and yeah, those ecostar2 tweetes and midranges are def out of my bugest fo this upgrade..I'm alrerady mad at how much all of this is gnna run me... but for everyday listening purposes, I think I'll be happy with it!!!

[AppleBonker]

well this is the thing, my audio shop isn't a dynaudio dealer, but my custom guys has a pair of hardly used 8" midbass drivers that he wasn';t using... the dynaudio rep was there trying to convine the shop to start carrying dynaudio and diamond audio also...

I know there are better options for the tweeter and midrange, but the old MB quart stuff that was made in Germany is pretty decent, much better than the china made stuff right now! And its literally the last of the German made MB Quart they have in the shop, everything else is the new stuff

and yeah, those ecostar2 tweetes and midranges are def out of my bugest fo this upgrade..I'm alrerady mad at how much all of this is gnna run me... but for everyday listening purposes, I think I'll be happy with it!!!

Gotcha. Like I said, the MB stuff will sound great. I didn't realize the shop wasn't a dynaudio dealer. If that were the case you might've been able to swing a deal. But, if the midbass were lightly used, I'm sure you're getting a bit of a deal there. It's definitely gonna sound a ton better, no offense to the BA stuff you've got now.

I think the esotar2 stuff is out of nearly everyone's budget. I know a good rep that can probably get a decent deal, but when I saw an MSRP of $800 per tweeter, I nearly crapped myself. I'm still in search of the elusive "orgasmic" audio quality setup. My substage is there, but my tweets leave something to be desired at this point. Maybe someday I'll have the money to step up to the esotars. For now, gotta get the performance/styling upgrades going.

[banshee08]

Hey Doc and Apple,

I have not posted here much but am looking into installing a set of Dynaudio Esotec 2 way with a 7" woofer and 1.1" tweeter in the door of my Altima Hybrid but I don't really know what amp to use? Or even if it is possible. I love Dynaudio Home Audio and been using them for the last 10 years but have not hear them in a car for quite a while.

Was wondering what the Doc was using for amps. I got this set from my friends for cheap.....

Thanks,

Chan

[rjdmmfl1]

Hey Doc and Apple,

I have not posted here much but am looking into installing a set of Dynaudio Esotec 2 way with a 7" woofer and 1.1" tweeter in the door of my Altima Hybrid but I don't really know what amp to use? Or even if it is possible. I love Dynaudio Home Audio and been using them for the last 10 years but have not hear them in a car for quite a while.

Was wondering what the Doc was using for amps. I got this set from my friends for cheap.....

Thanks,

Chan

Well, its a 3 way component setup, and I'm using rear fill...

so I'll be running the front tweeters and mid range components off of a Rockford Fosgate Power T400-2 Class A/B amp, and I'll run the midbass and rear components off of the Rockford Power T600-4 Class A/B amp.

With this setup, I will not use the passive crossovers that come with the components, but rather an active crossover setup from the audio control DQXS http://www.mobileaudiocontrol....=5247

[banshee08]

Wow are you mounting the your 8" midbass in the rear deck or still going with the kick panels?

[rjdmmfl1]

midbass are going in custom kickpanels

[AppleBonker]

Hey Doc and Apple,

I have not posted here much but am looking into installing a set of Dynaudio Esotec 2 way with a 7" woofer and 1.1" tweeter in the door of my Altima Hybrid but I don't really know what amp to use? Or even if it is possible. I love Dynaudio Home Audio and been using them for the last 10 years but have not hear them in a car for quite a while.

Was wondering what the Doc was using for amps. I got this set from my friends for cheap.....

Thanks,

Chan

You can use a number of amps to power this well. What kind of budget are you thinking?

I've been a fan of dynaudio stuff as well, so I'm sure you'll be happy with that choice. Which actual speaker models are you talking about?

[banshee08]

Doc, Wow I would love to see the finish product ont he custom kick panels. If I could get custom kickpanels for a three way that would be great.

Apple,

They are the Dynaudio Esotec System 242 ( MV 170 mid bass and MD 102 tweeters). I am looking to put a pair of 8" on the rear deck as there is no way to put a sub box in the Altima Hybrid. I don't have much a trunk as it is. I was looking into a pair of Dynaudio MW-180 to use as my sub. I don't listen to much booming bass nor do I listen really loud. My budget on amplifiers (one or two) would be about $1000. I was looking at the JL Audio HD600 but not many reviews on the amp yet. Need efficient amps because of space and power issues (engine cuts off when in EV mode).

Doc's amp choice looks good but I am trying to find size specs on them. I think I will need to have or build a custom amp rack in the trunk in place of the spare tire. Again I don't have much space to work with. Also trying to keep a stock look.

[rjdmmfl1]

They are the Dynaudio Esotec System 242. I am looking to put a pair of 8" on the rear deck as there is no way to put a sub box in the Altima Hybrid. I don't have much a trunk as it is. I was looking into a pair of Dynaudio MW-180 to use as my sub. I don't listen to much booming bass nor do I listen really loud. My budget on amplifiers (one or two) would be about $1500 to $1800. Need efficient amps because of space and power issues.

Doc's amp choice looks good but I am trying to find size specs on them. I think I will need to have or build a custom amp rack in the trunk in place of the spare tire. Again I don't have much space to work with. Also trying to keep a stock look.

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com...tatus=

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com...tatus=

http://www.rockfordfosgate.com...tatus=

these are my three amps, but the specs are always VERY underratd on Rockford Amps.... for example, my T600-4 does 126 watts RMS, and 200 watts RMS @ 4 ohms and 2 ohms respectfully, not 100 and 150 as stated....

also, my T1500-1bd does about 750, 1100 and 1650 watts @ 4, 2, and 1 ohm respectively....

Of all Rockford amps, the T1500-1bd is the closest rated amp to its specs, slightly LESS powewrful than the lower rated T1000-1bd amp

[rjdmmfl1]

Doc, Wow I would love to see the finish product ont he custom kick panels. If I could get custom kickpanels for a three way that would be great.

we're gonna have one final SOCAL meet before Blake leaves us in January (he's headed back to the East coast, and I should be joining him later next year)

[AppleBonker]

banshee,

In addition to the rockfords, check out these:

Alpine PDX-4.150Alpine PDX-2.150

You can find those cheaper at some places. If you're going to run 8's in the rear deck, you'll need at least a four channel amp (I'm assuming you're running the dynaudio passive crossover with that system). If you're running active, you'll need two amps (one four channel for the front, and a two channel for the eights in the rear deck). I chose the Alpines due to their small footprint and large output.

Also, the manufacturer of my sub amp makes a solid multichannel amp as well:

Sundown Audio SAX-100.4

This is slightly less powerful, but still a beast. Any of these amps I've recommended or Doc has recommended should pair wonderfully with the dynaudio system.

[LongBeachCoupe]

I'm alrerady mad at how much all of this is gnna run me... but for everyday listening purposes, I think I'll be happy with it!!!

You are a riot, (im no audiophile) when i sat in your car and you told me apples was 2x as loud, i felt like... ... Then i realized with that bass, after a coffee, your going to... any minute lol!

The few that are skilled enough (and rubberband'n enough $) to make their cars look like yours are enough... its weird to think that you wanted to 1up your system...

Like when someone says "jessica alba is SMOKING, but her nails are too long" +1 for pushing the envelope doc!

I feel bad for when you come back, and have to deal with EAST coast issues.... Cali rules.

[AppleBonker]

Then i realized with that bass, after a coffee, your going to... any minute lol!

Its weird to think that you wanted to 1up your system...

Haha. I doubt my stereo is twice as loud as Doc's. Hopefully it sounds a bit cleaner at volume (no offense to Doc's setup), but it shouldn't be much louder.

I've had a few people in my back seat since I've purchased this car. Most of them have complained that they may have an involuntary bowel movement. Definitely makes the system worth while.

Also, everyone always wants to improve what they have. That's the beauty of spending money. You can never get rid of the upgrade bug. I want to upgrade my setup too, but the jump to leap past my current setup will be exceptionally pricey.

[xXxCrumpsCoupexXx]

hope you've got space to hide the huge mb x-over...also on rockford fosgate(i've got t2000-1bd with stage 2 12" to match & t800-4...not installed in my a/c...a little overkill)

[Infantry1327]

When

we're gonna have one final SOCAL meet before Blake leaves us in January (he's headed back to the East coast, and I should be joining him later next year)

When is this meet going to be, I will be there, and I will have alot of questions about my system. depending on how far away it is, I might have my box done.

[AppleBonker]

hope you've got space to hide the huge mb x-over...also on rockford fosgate(i've got t2000-1bd with stage 2 12" to match & t800-4...not installed in my a/c...a little overkill)

He's going active. No passive crossovers will be used. Each speaker in front will have one channel of an amp dedicated to it with power running directly from the amp to the speaker.

Yeah, Doc loves his RF stuff. He definitely knows more about that brand than anyone on these boards. BTW, isn't that amp a bit too strong for your sub? You planning on upgrading the sub later?

[rjdmmfl1]

hope you've got space to hide the huge mb x-over...also on rockford fosgate(i've got t2000-1bd with stage 2 12" to match & t800-4...not installed in my a/c...a little overkill)

Applebonker hit the nail on the head, you my friend have obviously never done active crossovers before, but its cool, that's how we all learn....

the passive crossovers do the job, but very poorly SQ wise... in order to optimize sound, active crossovers are the way to go... I won't get too much in depth regarding this, but basicly, with passive crossover, you try to filter out the complete spectrum of frequencies AFTER they leave the amp... almost impossible to do cleanly

with active crossovers, the filtering, EQ, and crossover freq. occurs BEFORE the signal gets to the amp... thus, only the exact frequencies you want will go to each individual speaker... this cleans up the music and prodices more "studio quality" sound... that is what I was missing

So again, when going with an active crossover setup, you don't use the passive crosovers at all (neither the ones from the MB quart or the ones from the Boston Pro 60's)

Also, you will blow your stage 2 subs sky high with the T2000-1bd... that's WAAAYYYYY too much power for that sub... did you mean the T2 subwoofer or the P2 subwoofer.... most folks don't refer to the T2 as a stage 2, that terminology is reserved for the Punch line of subs... and no offense, but the punch line is not a very good line of sub! Not just regarding power handling, but the build , basket, spider, frame, are all sub par IMO... I've taken all of the Rockford punch subs apart and examined every last detail!

[Infantry1327]

Damn doc, it's to bad you are going to be heading out to the east coast. I could really use some of your hands on help when it comes time to do my speakers and wireing.

[rjdmmfl1]

Damn doc, it's to bad you are going to be heading out to the east coast. I could really use some of your hands on help when it comes time to do my speakers and wireing.

I'm not headed out to the east coast until next year some time... like in November of next year... I'll be here for another year or so!

Hey Applebonker, I changed the design up again....

after going over thing with my custom guy, I decided to scratch the dynaudio 8" midbass, and MB Quart component... and now I'm goin with the dynaudio esotec system 342 3 way component...

these have the 3" soft dome midrange, the MD 101 soft dome tweeter, and the 7" (instead of 8" midbass)

by doing this, I actually come out about even, or hjust a little over what I would have spent on the pther setup... now, I don';t have to create a custom kickplate box for the 8", I can just mount the 7" in the do0r( with a custom bracket) and still use the custom A pillars to house the tweeters and the soft dome midrange....

[AppleBonker]

Man, that's gonna sound awesome. You're in for a real treat. Now I gotta plan on upgrading at some point here, just to keep up with you getting bit by the upgrade bug. Joining NICO was the worst possible decision I could've made for my bank account.

[Infantry1327]

thats great (well for me) I will defenetly haft to head out to SD once i get my box built and get all my needed equipment.

You know I wouldnt be aposed to your speaker hook up, hooking me up as well.

And I can't wait to hear this system once you are done. It allready sounded amazing, now its going to be heaven on wheels.

[AppleBonker]

thats great (well for me) I will defenetly haft to head out to SD once i get my box built and get all my needed equipment.

You know I wouldnt be aposed to your speaker hook up, hooking me up as well.

And I can't wait to hear this system once you are done. It allready sounded amazing, now its going to be heaven on wheels.

Making me want to take a trip out to the west coast once you both have your stuff together. I'd love to hear and see both installs. I also really want to check out Blake's car in person. Very tempting... If only I had the money and vacation time to just up and head out there!

[banshee08]

Doc,

Nice setup. With the addition of the 3" Mids that should sound really nice. Do you think the tweeter and Mids can be mounted on the doors??? I don't really want to go with custom pillars myself but would love to do a three way also. I can get the Mids used also from my friend... I think he maybe putting on ebay soon.

Also would your installer be interested in selling the two 8" midbass if they are the mv 170???


Modified by banshee08 at 10:13 PM 9/17/2008

[rjdmmfl1]

I'm pretty suire the 8" midbass are the MV 170's... they came out of his volvo... remember, Volvo uses dynaudio as their sound system in their vehicles ( that's a beautiful thing)... I can askl him about selling them, this would have been a favor for me, if he sells them to someone else, he's gonna raise the price (cause face it, they are worth a pretty penny) but I'll ask him

also, regardinmg puting them in the doors, yes, this could work, but say you evr decide to sell the car... it cheaper to replace the A pillars than it is those door panels.... also, for staging purposes, I'm setting up the front stage to be optimum for ME (phuck the passengers ) so we are aiming the tweets and misbass directly at me

[AppleBonker]

I'm pretty suire the 8" midbass are the MV 170's... they came out of his volvo... remember, Volvo uses dynaudio as their sound system in their vehicles ( that's a beautiful thing)... I can askl him about selling them, this would have been a favor for me, if he sells them to someone else, he's gonna raise the price (cause face it, they are worth a pretty penny) but I'll ask him

also, regardinmg puting them in the doors, yes, this could work, but say you evr decide to sell the car... it cheaper to replace the A pillars than it is those door panels.... also, for staging purposes, I'm setting up the front stage to be optimum for ME (phuck the passengers ) so we are aiming the tweets and misbass directly at me

Doc is right on about this one. A quick look at Nissan parts shows replacement A-pillar trim at about $30 each. If you have leather interior, the interior door panel trim is about $370 each.

So as Doc said, if/when he sells his car, it will cost him about $60 (or less if he finds a deal) to get the pillars back to stock. Also, imaging is better from the pillars (however, I've heard cars that had perfect imaging with the tweets and midranges mounted in kicks below the driver's knees - not sure how, but it worked). Right on with setting up the speakers for you, too. I've always said, if it's my money being spent, I need to reap the benefits. If the passengers get some improvement too, excellent. If not, oh well. Although, in all honesty, how many of your passengers are going to notice how excellent the stereo sounds? I bet most wouldn't be able to tell the difference between what you're getting and what you have now (although you will and that's all that matters).

On a side note, I almost wish I was that ignorant to audio quality (and I'm not saying ignorant in a bad way). Then, I'd never have to spend the money I do on A/V setups. Ignorance truly is bliss...

[banshee08]

You have a point on the A-pillars. But I have resigned to keep this car for at least 10 years. I have had my Q45 for almost 10 years (and still own it) also but that is just how I am with cars. Long term investments for me. I don't want to do the A-pillar mostly due to people see them and exposure to the sun. Also I want to be able to tackle the work myself. I am also thinking about making kick panels for the tweeter and mids and leave the 7" in the doors.

If your installer would like to sell and the price is right I would not hesitate. I know how much these things are new and I am just trying to save a few bucks here and there. I love getting stuff like this from the Pros since they are more prone to taking care of them. I could be wrong.

Just got my order of b-quiet ultimate and not looking forware to a long weekend of back breaking work ahead of me.

[AppleBonker]

Gotcha. Custom A-pillars will almost certainly require some fiberglass work to make them look reasonable. The doors are probably easier to fabricate into. If you're ok with the cost of new door panels when you sell the car, this wouldn't be a horrible option.

Like I said, I've heard a setup where the tweets sounded good in kicks. I'm not sure how this was done, but it is possible. However, it will be a bunch more difficult to tune to get the soundstage at ear-level. Maybe that would be the fun in it.

I know what you mean about sound deadener too. It's a tough job (really beats on your body trying to warp it to get into the tight spaces), but it is totally worth what you will gain. How much are you planning on deadening? Do you have the service manual? The service manual was a lifesaver for me when it came to taking the car apart. When I did my civic, it was really simple to get body panels off. For the Altima, much more difficult since everything is pieced together better (probably cause the civic was a '99 and many improvements have been made since then). Take pics so we can all see your work! I'm very interested.

Sorry if we're completely derailing your thread Doc!

[banshee08]

Sorry Doc. Hijacking your thread and all.