300Z or Q45

Post by **Fred D.** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 2:59 pm

I thinking of trading my '94 Q45 w/129k, for a '90 300z w/160k. The reason is better gas mileage, and a more sporty feel on the road. Is it a fair trade straight across, or should I expect to pay more than my trade in? The 300z is a dealership car, priced at 3200$, in good condition. Thanks for any insight.

Post by **elwesso** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 4:51 pm

I dont think that fuel mileage is a good reason to trade a Z32 for a Q45, as it will probably only get 1-2 MPG different.....

besides you could spend a little money on your Q and you can make it feel really nice.

Post by **zinkie13** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:13 pm

I say go for the Z. If you think of it from an investment perspective, you can dump as much money into a Q45 as you want, make it showroom condition, and it still is valueless in the used car market. However, if you really wanted to fix up your 300zx it would hold its value a little better and be more fun.

Post by **louiegz** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:10 pm

I dont think mileage should be the reason to change but if you want something more fun to drive, and something you could get stick, go for the Z. I dont know how wise is it to get a car that's older with more miles. I'd look for a newer one and not the 2x2s. I always thought they looked too long. Don't screw up and get it stick.

Post by **gniknave** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:00 pm

If you're not looking at a twin turbo, you might be pretty darn disappointed. Before I sold my 240sx, I had the chance to trade it for a '92 300zx (n/a). I had been wanting a Z for quite a while. So I decided to take it for a drive. I was very disappointed. It drove really heavy, and didn't handle like I expected (of course it was stock). I also had a sort of raggedy 90 Q45 that I was about to sell, but the power difference between my Q and the Z was tremendous.

I instead opted to sell my 240, and buy the prestine Q45 I have now. I'd take a 240sx over an n/a 300zx. But I'd take a twin turbo 300zx over a 240sx and a Q45.

Post by **Fred D.** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:44 pm

I would like the twin turbo model of cours, I also looked the price diffrence up, and the 300ZX is a higher valued car, even with more miles and older year. Dont get me wrong I love my Q and it has a ton of power, and is a very comfortable ride. I think the 300 would have better gearing and be lighter.

Post by **Jeff Williams** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:05 am

Fred, a Yugo has better gearing and is lighter, but I doublt you want one.

The dealership will give you about $750 for your car, in trade. After a few weeks of driving the 300, you will wish you had the Q back.

The ride is horrible, and all the mods you will start doing will only make it worse. My friend Shawn has a hot 1990 tt, but I can't ride in the thing very long without back pain. My 2000 Corvette has a WAY BETTER RIDE.

I think my Q will out run a n/a automatic 300ZX. And I know I would rather drive 2,600 miles in my Q over a 300ZX any day. BUT, I still want a pristine 300ZX tt just for kicks.

It's kinda like comparing a touring bike to a sport bike. You gotta get what makes you feel best, and not worry what we say.

Post by **Rex** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:27 am

A Z32 is lighter and has better "off the line" gearing, ubt unless you can get a TT Z32 you will be disappointed performance-wise. Not in every category, but overall.

A TT Z32 is a whole nother ball of wax. Great sports car, but it's not as light as you'd think. Ball park is 3450lbs, that's not as much lighter than a Q as you'd think, givent he lower TQ figures.

If you want a sporty feeling car, find an S13 or S14 with an RB25DET swapped in it and have a blast ... but for what it would cost to sell/trade your Q and get one of those, you could (almost) get your Q to "like new" specs and SC it.

As Jeff said, in the end get what you want, but I think you should know a N/A Z32 will not be (noticeably) faster than a Q.

YouTube · Post by **Jesda** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 2:58 am

Washington state is a great place to own a sports car. I loved driving through the orchards in Leavenworth and along winding lakeside pathways. Too bad the place sucks otherwise!

Looking at the market in general, it is not an even trade. Resale on the early Z32s is dropping (within Gulati range, even) and 94-96 Qs with reasonable mileage are still worth a decent amount of money. Ask for $700 to $900.

Personally, if I moved back to the northwest and wanted to trade the Q for a coupe or roadster, I'd skip the offerings from Nissan. For the many steep hills and mountain passes, its nice to have a slick shifter and feather-light package. I find Nissan's shifters to be terribly notchy and high on effort. Having a manual is nice, but with a Nissan, it gets old and starts to feel like work.

What I'm saying is, get a Miata or keep the Q. If the Z32 you're looking at is an automatic, you're wasting your time.

Post by **Q45tech** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 4:57 am

http://www.sportcompactcarweb....300zx/

Article on buying used 300zxtt. 13.7/102 is certainly faster than 14.8/98 in a ecued Q

3533 pounds vs 3956 pounds [90Q]

Consider that the gearing results in 25% more rpms at 60 mph so the 3.0 liter acts like a 3.75 liter consumming fuel. vs the 2.45 economy 4th gear in Q.

Post by **Q_SHIP** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:16 am

Q45tech wrote:http://www.sportcompactcarweb....300zx/

Article on buying used 300zxtt. 13.7/102 is certainly faster than 14.8/98 in a ecued Q

3533 pounds vs 3956 pounds [90Q]

Consider that the gearing results in 25% more rpms at 60 mph so the 3.0 liter acts like a 3.75 liter consumming fuel. vs the 2.45 economy 4th gear in Q.

There is no way a stock 300Ztt is good for 13.7. I have put the smack down on many TTZ cars with the GTP. Ofcourse they were stock or very close to it.

Anyways, I don't see what all the hype is about with those 300Z's. They don't do much for me personally. I would keep the Q and be happy with it.

Post by **Rex** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:25 am

Q45tech wrote:http://www.sportcompactcarweb....300zx/

Article on buying used 300zxtt. 13.7/102 is certainly faster than 14.8/98 in a ecued Q

3533 pounds vs 3956 pounds [90Q]

Consider that the gearing results in 25% more rpms at 60 mph so the 3.0 liter acts like a 3.75 liter consumming fuel. vs the 2.45 economy 4th gear in Q.

Exactly, a TT Z32 is worth looking at, a N/A one (especially if an AT) isn't worth it.

Post by **irax** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:27 am

if your seriously want to get rid of your Q45 for something that gets a magical 2~mpg more? its cheaper to get narrower tires. I notice about a 4-6~mpg improvement when going from 225/245 to a 195/205 on my 240sx

Post by **EQwhipD** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:40 am

As noted before, please don't trade in an effort to save on gas. My brother has a Z32 N/A, and the gas mileage is very similar to my Q (G50). You have to remember that the car weighs about 3300 lbs, and it is running on what is essentially a J30 engine.If you like a car that appreciates or just even maintains it's value, then go ahead and buy it. A Z32 in good condition and low mileage can easily go for $10k in the Spring market. A lot of baby boomers love the Z32, and realize that the car is somewhat affordable now (as compared to the 350Z or G35 coupe). Please note that the maintenance costs are comparable to the Q45.Also please do not get car if you have plans to change it into a JDM TT. The costs entailed in that is far higher than the eventual value of the end product, where you could have just bought a TT in the first place for thousands cheaper. Also TT Z32s are EXTREMELY expensive to maintain, because rehabing turbos can run you over $1000 easily.I disagree witht he people who only believe in the TT Z32s though. If you want a Sunday cruiser for Summer and Spring, go ahead and get the N/A auto. You will get your money's worth just by the amount of heads you turn with the t-tops down cruising through town. If you want speeding tickets and eventual suspended licenses, then save up for a TT! Just my two cents.

-EQwhipD

Post by **Fred D.** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:55 pm

Ok the gas mpg is not the main reason for getting a 300ZX. Thanks Q45 tech for info, the Z car is faster, and lighter and smaller. The only other things the Q has going for it is comfort and its quite. If the Z is a stiff ride, it probaly can corner better. I see the geometry of the Z is a sport design, the Q looks nice feels good and has power, but is not made on a foundation of performance. I guess I will have to go test drive Wed. and I'll report back!

YouTube · Post by **Jesda** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:18 am

Its a manual, right?

Post by **BadQ45t** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:40 am

I agree, you have to get a manny, Jesda not going to agree with your assessment of Nissan manuals. I have a 84' 300ZX (not a turbo, but still very fun to drive) in a 5 speed and a 05' X-Terra, both a quite smooth shifing IMHO. The X-Terra while geared really how in 1-2 is smooth as silk, they have triple syncros in 1-2-3 for smoother downshifing and I love it, and having the magic 6th rocks.

If this car is an auto, do NOT do it. Also you should find a Z mechanic to look it over, there are lots of high dollar repairs on a 90' that could hurt you big time.

Post by **Rex** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 2:00 am

Fred D. wrote:Ok the gas mpg is not the main reason for getting a 300ZX. Thanks Q45 tech for info, the Z car is faster, and lighter and smaller. The only other things the Q has going for it is comfort and its quite. If the Z is a stiff ride, it probaly can corner better. I see the geometry of the Z is a sport design, the Q looks nice feels good and has power, but is not made on a foundation of performance. I guess I will have to go test drive Wed. and I'll report back!

The Twin Turbo is faster, is this a TT? You've never mentioned TT, and I would be VERY surprised if they considered a TT to be a straight trade.

Post by **Q45tech** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:00 am

http://z-lab.twinturbo.net/http://www.z ... se....html

Since we cannot retool custom parts to redo the Z's body, we figured that this would be an excellent, low-cost way of greatly increasing chassis stiffness. Injecting foam is not a new technique for chassis stiffening. The Infiniti Q45 uses this sort of foam in some of its chassis members to increase stiffness, as do a few other premium cars. In fact, the foam we chose is the foam recommended to repair damaged Q45s.

http://www.sportcompactcarweb....300zx/

Post by **elwesso** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:12 am

as you should know, the Z32 suspension is basically identical to the Q45... its the same idea, but the parts may not be exactly the same (some are)..

I personally think that if you had a set of tokico blues and cali custom springs youd be really happy with the handling of the Q.

Post by **Q45denver** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 4:33 am

I actually did that with my 240Z back in the early 1970's. I remember it being a two-part structural foam of German manufacture specifically made for automotive applications. I also installed Konis, rear sway bar and polyurethane bushing around the same time. It was probably the best handling car I've ever driven. Found out latter that the foam was not a good idea as it traps moisture and greatly accelerates rust which was already a problem area on the 240Z. One of the reasons I like Q 45's is the comprehensive rust treatment. Notice they didn't use the foam in areas that are exposed to moisture.

Post by **EQwhipD** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:03 am

Just to add to what Wes said. If you drive a Q with an active rear anti-sway bar, + a Jeff Williams strut bar, and staggered wheels, the Q will handle better than the Z32. You have to remember that alot of Z32s have HICAs steering and need have lower centers of gravity. This means that there will definately be a compromise in comfort. Another two cents.

-EQwhipD

Post by **Q45tech** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:11 am

And tires of the appropriate strength and category 255+ and higher load index.

To equal a stock 300zx DRY you would need tires ~~ 100+ load index and very soft then suspension work

http://www.hoosiertire.com/

Post by **maxnix** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:11 am

EQwhipD wrote: If you drive a Q with ... staggered wheels,...-EQwhipD

Which isn't going to help the rotational balance unless you run polyurethane bushings in the rear to take up some of the play inherent in the stock rubber bushings.

Post by **gniknave** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 6:50 am

Q_SHIP wrote:Anyways, I don't see what all the hype is about with those 300Z's. They don't do much for me personally.

The hype is that the Z car is legendary.

Post by **gniknave** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:13 am

The one thing about Z32's that bothers me is that in all the research I did on them when I was considering one I only heard of one that ever hit 200k on the original engine. For that reason, I didn't want to have Z32 as my primary car. I'd suggest a couple of things to you.

- Keep the Q45, and save for a Z32 to go along with it. I think the odds are that since the Z32 is a sports car, it likely has been driven pretty hard throughout it's life. No matter how good the car looks, something is bound to fail at any time. With Q's you can find some that haven't been maintained up to standards, but haven't been driven hard. These can be easier to deal with than an abused Z32.

- If a Z32 N/A 5 speed is what you're looking at, I'd suggest finding a 240sx 5 speed and taking a spin in it. Now, you're probably not even a fan of 240sx's. But niether was I, this was the suggestion a friend of mine gave me, and damn he was right. They're loads of fun to drive, they can be easily made to handle just simply with a nice set of Eibachs, and you can easily make them faster (though mine was stock other than an intake). Not to mention it WILL be wayyy better on gas. The car also is extremely easy to work on - especially if you've already done work on your Q45.

I'm not suggesting to trade your Q for a 240sx however...

My overall suggestion though, if it's not a Z32tt (with a 5 speed), keep your Q45. You might like the N/A at first, but it'll grow old really quick. For me, all it took was one test drive...

Post by **elwesso** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:16 am

i dont really think thats fair evan... the VG30 goes forever, youll see tons of maximas and J30s with a ton of miles..... I think that Z32s just arent driven a ton of miles

Post by **Fred D.** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:09 pm

Looks like the '90 already sold, the day I went to look at it. Im talking now to another dealer, he says they will trade straight across. I sent pics of my Q. I have a pic of the 300, should I trade?, it has a lot of miles on it. My Q has 129k but is 60k less than the 300, but the z car still has a higher value? Can the 300z go more than 200 or is it needing rebuild at 200+. This is a hard choice. Thank for all the help, It good information

(Price: $3995 Stock #: 1587 Year: 1986 Make: Nissan Model: 300ZX Turbo Vin #: JN1CZ14S7GX104221 Mileage: 190,984 Engine: 3.0L V6 Turbo Transmission: 5 Speed Exterior Color: Red Interior Color: Black)

Post by **szh** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:32 pm

Well ... all I can say is that in March of 1991, I sold my 1985 300ZX Turbo and bought a 1991 Infiniti Q45. The plan had been to get a 1991 300ZX Twin Turbo, but the Q45 simply bowled me over.

Would I have been happy with the 1991 Z? Sure! But the luxury and V-8 in the Q45 could not be passed up. And, even with the benefit of hindsight, my decision was right!

So, in my shoes, the answer to your question is totally clear! But, it is certainly your choice for sure and you are not likely to go wrong with either car, I think!

Z

P.S. As a side note, I sold my 1985 300ZX Turbo for about $7500 back in 1991. Your price shown of 3995 for a 1986, fifteen years later now in 2006, seems high to me!

Post by **Fred D.** » Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:58 pm

A 1991 Q has diffrent gearing than my 1994. The '91 is a lot faster off the line, than my granny gears. I completly agree the Q cars have comfort downand they look very nice inside. I dont have a priority for luxury or how many compliments I get on my car, or if the design looks more modern than it is. To me a car is about four thing: weight, steering, engine design, braking. Then after those four things come comfort and style. I think a lot of people get Q's for the luxury, and thats what sells the car. When people drive the Q's they find a lot of horse power and ok handeling. So to me it seems easy to improve a Q with a few thousand, but it isnt a sports car, and it was never designed to be one. Sports car or luxury car? Oh ya, dont forget I love my '94 Q, and all the other cars Ive owned.

300Z or Q45

300Z or Q45

Re: 300Z or Q45 (Fred D.)

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